Russian Invasion of Ukraine (2022): Thread 1 - Ukrainian Liars vs Russian Liars with Air and Artillery Superiority

[Walrus and Carpenter]

Yeah, but who believes it or is willing to go right now?

With trust in government and legacy media at an all-time low, and the Biden regime treating literally half the country (the half that usually is first to enlist) as Kulaks, they'd need a 9/11-style crisis that would make Putin the next Bin Laden/Saddam to get Americans to give a shit.

...*gulp*...

"No Russian."

 

[Titos]

We've already watched this episode a million times. Nothing exciting is gonna happen.

 

[Meat Target]

Russia might invade Ukraine, but I doubt that NATO or the US would do anything about it. Russia has a massive nuclear arsenal and nobody is stupid enough to start a nuke fight.

Don't underestimate the Cathedral's willingness to not only be kings of Mount Shitpile, but also convince themselves that said shitpile is the greatest thing since anime girl spit, all because they rule over it.

 

[AnimeGirlConnoisseur]

X to doubt. Russia doesn't want Ukraine. Who would? They already took the only viable thing there is there which was the port. Put in doesn't want the headache.

What's missing from the article is the president of Ukraine saying, recently mind you, the Western powers should invest millions into conquering Russia and separating it into 18 separate countries and how profitable it would be for the West to do so. My money would be on this being defensive in nature.

Why invade when you can starve them to death? Russia's not going to renew their contract with Ukraine over gas lines to Europe. Which means their one source of major income is gone next year and they're will be Ukrainian famine 2: Electric Boogalo

Actually, Ukraine does have one thing that Russia could want: breathing room.

Eastern Europe is very flat and easy to move an army across. As a result of this, the Russian state (whether that be the Empire, the USSR, or the Federation) has always wanted to keep the Russian heartland safe from an invasion from the west by having as much buffer space as possible. This is why the Soviet satellite states were created. The more space between Moscow and the west, the safer Russian leadership feels.

 

[DumbDude42]

China is the real threat. Russia should join our team.

You're right about China, but I don't think Russia has anything to gain by joining us.

china is not a military threat to anybody except maybe the philippines (lol)
it is an economic rival to america, yes, but 90% of the economic damage done to america through china is the result of traitorous american elites selling out their countrys future for personal gain. if it wasn't china it would be someone else - india, mexico, brazil, nigeria, plenty of poor countries would be lining up to take over chinas place as the primary target of western outsourcing and industrial transfer in case china was eliminated.

 

[Sped Xing]

Russia might invade Ukraine, but I doubt that NATO or the US would do anything about it. Russia has a massive nuclear arsenal and nobody is stupid enough to start a nuke fight.

NATO will bomb Russia.

I mean, review bomb Russia on yelp.

 

[Getting tard comed]

Not happening when China literally owns us. How else are we gonna get affordable iPhones and Funko Pops?

This was/is my feeling to, but Razor brought up a lot of good points in his latest vid that gave me food for thought. Yes, we owe China a shit ton of money. China also has(according to Razor) at least 5x our debt, their borth rate sucks major ass, and they buy a lot of their food from the US. While America is in no position to fight any wars over seas(or otherwise imo) I don't think China is in a position to fight WW3. The good news for China is they won't need to. The West is detained to commit seppuko and Russia + China will be there to pick up the pieces.

Side note, China isnt interested in world domination. They just announced this yo the world, they just don't want globohomo telling them what to do.

The issue with Ukraine is control over the gas pipelines (which Russia wants to control, not necessarily own) and the naval port in Crimea (the Russian lust for warm water ports is part of what makes the entire country a lolcow in my eyes), which Russia used to be content with merely controlling - but after the Euromaiden protests in Ukraine, Russia decided that it was to risky to just rent the port and invaded Crimea to secure its dominion over it permanently.
The ultimate outcome of a war in Ukraine would be the creation of one or more client states, not full annexation.

This isn't all random on Russia's part, this is a direct reaction to the slow creep of NATO and the EU eastward. In the 90's and 00's, Russia didn't really care about Ukraine at all because it wasn't an issue. You can't say they will just sit back and do nothing while Ukraine seeks to join the EU, that's just retarded on Russia's part. An invasion makes sense.

Actually, Ukraine does have one thing that Russia could want: breathing room.

Eastern Europe is very flat and easy to move an army across. As a result of this, the Russian state (whether that be the Empire, the USSR, or the Federation) has always wanted to keep the Russian heartland safe from an invasion from the west by having as much buffer space as possible. This is why the Soviet satellite states were created. The more space between Moscow and the west, the safer Russian leadership feels.

We are all saying similar things. Russia already has the warm water port, any interest in the rest of Ukraine is purely defensive in nature. Ukraine will never be a part of Nato. Russia is prepared to invade Ukraine if they join Nato, but I don't think Putin wants to do it and I don't see it happening unless the EU + US does something completely idiotic like accepting Ukraine into Nato which for all intents and purposes is a declaration of war with Russia.

 

[Liber Pater]

Ukraine's government really fucked up getting rid of their nukes. If the country wasn't run by oligarchs and globohomo parasites, that would be a top priority right now.

No Russian ever called me Nazi/racist/white supremacist/terrorist/extremist.

Unless you're Ukrainian and not pro-separatist/pro-Russia, in which case you can expect to be called all of those things.

Putin doesn't want Ukraine. Who would? They already took the only viable thing there is there which was the port. Putin doesn't want the headache.

This is correct. Russia doesn't care about Ukraine or Belarus or their people that much, he just doesn't want the West to have them. With that kind of attitude, it's no wonder so many people in Belarus and Western Ukraine don't want to be ruled by his lackeys. Not that the EU/NATO is any different in that respect, though.

 

[Chongqing]

You're right about China, but I don't think Russia has anything to gain by joining us.

The trade would be good, for starters. No sanctions. It would also have a lot of upside for the US, economically and militarily.

The problems is that tens of millions of boomer leftists would have to be able to accept us not being enemies with Russia anymore, not that we had a lot of reasons in the first place.

When you look clearly at what the media is demonizing Russia for it's usually:

1. Steroids / HRT in the winter Olympics (who cares?)
2. Homophobia in the country
3. One homophobic candidate isn't allowed to run for office
4. Helped Trump on social media

That's it. That's why we should hate them.

Meanwhile, look at some of our "allies," and their human rights abuses. It's completely inconsistent.

 

[Personal Jesus]

Is it really an invasion if you are invading something you own?

 

[HumanHive]

Is it really an invasion if you are invading something you own?

We're not talking about Crimea, though.

 

[Meat Target]

The problems is that tens of millions of boomer leftists would have to be able to accept us not being enemies with Russia anymore, not that we had a lot of reasons in the first place.

The feeling is mutual in Russia. Since the Iron Curtain fell, Russia has been adamant about not becoming a US vassal state. And Putin is KGB; like him, many Russians reject Communism philosophically but still miss the days of being a superpower.

 

[RodgerDodger]

Actually, Ukraine does have one thing that Russia could want: breathing room.

Eastern Europe is very flat and easy to move an army across. As a result of this, the Russian state (whether that be the Empire, the USSR, or the Federation) has always wanted to keep the Russian heartland safe from an invasion from the west by having as much buffer space as possible. This is why the Soviet satellite states were created. The more space between Moscow and the west, the safer Russian leadership feels.

In their defense, their worries about invasion from the west are not without merit. We do all remember Hitler’s Eastern Front, right? Napoleon anybody? The first thing any European petty dictator does is drive East to Moscow with delusions of Supreme Grandeur. Nobody knows why, not even Russian’s actually like Moscow.

 

[HumanHive]

The feeling is mutual in Russia. Since the Iron Curtain fell, Russia has been adamant about not becoming a US vassal state. And Putin is KGB; like him, many Russians reject Communism philosophically but still miss the days of Russia being a superpower.

Russians need to get used to being the sick man of Europe. The post-WW2 ideology and desire to never be invaded by fascists again which united the Warsaw Pact was the entire reason Russia was a superpower at all - it effectively had an entire quarter of the world in an economic zone, and a huge wealth of loot from German tech to put it decades ahead of everyone else in Eurasia - and once it was found out that the Soviets were complicit in the invasion of Poland, that was it. Nobody in Eastern Europe will ever trust Russia again. The entire premise of the USSR and Warsaw Pact was built on a lie; and Europe would much rather align itself with China than indulge any more Russian delusions that it is the guardian of anyone or anything.

 

[iNEEDthatMoney]

As tensions mount between Washington and Moscow over a potential Russian invasion of Ukraine, U.S. intelligence has found the Kremlin is planning a multi-front offensive as soon as early next year involving up to 175,000 troops, according to U.S. officials and an intelligence document obtained by The Washington Post.

I believe that as much as I believed the U.S. intelligence when they said the Taliban are months if not years away from taking Kabul, that Saddam has weapons of mass destruction & Osama Bin Laden is in in Iraq.

 

[DumbDude42]

We are all saying similar things. Russia already has the warm water port, any interest in the rest of Ukraine is purely defensive in nature.

This is correct. Russia doesn't care about Ukraine or Belarus or their people that much, he just doesn't want the West to have them.

i disagree with this. ukraine has been part of russian imperial rule for a very long time, both in the time of the tsar and in the soviet era. lots of russians view ukraine (and belarus) as rightful russian clay, and have a strong desire to restore russian rule over the country. it seems they were mostly content with having ukraine as a nominally independent country as long as its ruler is strongly pro russia, which was the case with yanukovich, but then euromaidan happened and replaced the pro russian government with a bunch of anti russians who are not even trying to hide their desires to align the country with EU and NATO. this is a big slap in the face for those who want ukraine in the russian sphere of influence, one they are not just going to accept.

call it irredentism, imperialism, revanchism, whatever, but it is very real. many in russia view the idea of losing ukraine to the west like americans would view losing alaska to china, hawaii to japan or texas to mexico.

 

[Ptolemy]

i disagree with this. ukraine has been part of russian imperial rule for a very long time, both in the time of the tsar and in the soviet era. lots of russians view ukraine (and belarus) as rightful russian clay, and have a strong desire to restore russian rule over the country. it seems they were mostly content with having ukraine as a nominally independent country as long as its ruler is strongly pro russia, which was the case with yanukovich, but then euromaidan happened and replaced the pro russian government with a bunch of anti russians who are not even trying to hide their desires to align the country with EU and NATO. this is a big slap in the face for those who want ukraine in the russian sphere of influence, one they are not just going to accept.

call it irredentism, imperialism, revanchism, whatever, but it is very real. many in russia view the idea of losing ukraine to the west like americans would view losing alaska to china, hawaii to japan or texas to mexico.

This is the correct take.

Russia's actions needs to be seen through this lens.

There is a significant divide within Ukraine, but currently, those still left in the rump state care very much about their independence. If they go NATO or get a MAP, it is almost certainly an invasion.

I think NATO would not go to war over Ukraine, but much of it's credibility hinges on it. Putin will try to shake out NATO promises for Ukrainian incorporation while he can. This is a good way to do it without actually invading.

Liberal institutionalism and the unipolar society we live in, means most of what is pushed in the borderlands is ideological. There is this idea within these institutions for a need to spread democracy to Russia's borders, and so NATO and the EU are ideologically expansionist. If you're government doesn't become democratic, no EU, no NATO, no IMF, no nothing. NGOs serve as actors that push for democratic reform, which is why Lukashenko banned them from Belarus. NGOs helped to organize the Euro Maiden protest and the Orange Revolution. Russia is going to grandstand and threaten probably because a weak looking NATO will help bring about multipolarity, ie an international order closer to pre WWII. Of which Russia will benefit.

 

[LeChampion1992]

X to doubt. Russia doesn't want Ukraine. Who would? They already took the only viable thing there is there which was the port. Put in doesn't want the headache.

What's missing from the article is the president of Ukraine saying, recently mind you, the Western powers should invest millions into conquering Russia and separating it into 18 separate countries and how profitable it would be for the West to do so. My money would be on this being defensive in nature.

Why invade when you can starve them to death? Russia's not going to renew their contract with Ukraine over gas lines to Europe. Which means their one source of major income is gone next year and they're will be Ukrainian famine 2: Electric Boogalo

Eastern and southern Ukraine speaks Russian and in fact will be reincorporated into the Russian federation. Plus Russia gaining more of southern Ukraine gaurentees access to year round warm water ports.

 

[Getting tard comed]

Eastern and southern Ukraine speaks Russian and in fact will be reincorporated into the Russian federation. Plus Russia gaining more of southern Ukraine gaurentees access to year round warm water ports.

Russia already has access to warm water ports currently. They annexed it a couple years ago. There is nothing else of value there except having a buffer state between them and globohomo from a Russian pov. Conquering the Ukraine causes way more problems than solutions and that's the cost benefit analysis before factoring in any potential involvement from the West.

 

[Liber Pater]

i disagree with this. ukraine has been part of russian imperial rule for a very long time, both in the time of the tsar and in the soviet era. lots of russians view ukraine (and belarus) as rightful russian clay, and have a strong desire to restore russian rule over the country. it seems they were mostly content with having ukraine as a nominally independent country as long as its ruler is strongly pro russia, which was the case with yanukovich, but then euromaidan happened and replaced the pro russian government with a bunch of anti russians who are not even trying to hide their desires to align the country with EU and NATO. this is a big slap in the face for those who want ukraine in the russian sphere of influence, one they are not just going to accept.

call it irredentism, imperialism, revanchism, whatever, but it is very real. many in russia view the idea of losing ukraine to the west like americans would view losing alaska to china, hawaii to japan or texas to mexico.

In the post you quoted, I typed "Russia" when I meant to type "Putin."
You are correct that many Russians view Belarus and Ukraine as part of their homeland, but the Kremlin doesn't seem interested in unification (annexing Crimea was not its most preferred option and likely wouldn't have happened without the Maidan). It is most interested in maintaining its eastern neighbors as satellite states/imperial vassals, if possible. This was the state of affairs under Yanukovych and still is under Lukashenko. It was extremely unpopular in Western Ukraine and is continually growing more and more unpopular in Belarus because many people don't want to live in a corrupt vassal state.
While being a vassal of the West is far more toxic in many respects, at least the EU, unlike the Putinosphere, can claim to offer integration, prosperity and political representation. Those of us living in the west know that these are all false promises, but I can easily see how young people in a neo-Soviet vassal state like Belarus could fall for them.