Russian Invasion of Ukraine Megathread - Episode III - Revenge of the Ruski (now unlocked with new skins and gameplay modes!!!)

[Oxous]

The New York Times released a new article claiming that the Ukrainian government assassinated Daria Dugina and that they got told off by the U.S. government for it afterwards. I tried to read it from a neutral point of view but for some reason I just couldn't shake this feeling that the CIA proofread it for the NYT editors and that they're still mad about it.

 

[Smity Werbenjagermanjensen]

I feel bad for the 300k mobilized for Russia, even assuming they all have actual combat experience (which I doubt) the bulk of that combat experience is going to come from either Syria, Georgia, or the second Chechnya war.

For Syria vets the problem is obvious, they were fighting jihadists who primarily had AKs and Technicals, which can hardly be called actual war experience.

For Georgian War vets the war didn't even last two weeks, so that any experience was minimal in length.

For Second Chechnya war vets, they'd be at the very least in their late 30s by now. The phrase "Getting too old for this shit" applies to frontline combat at that point.

 

[Ponzo]

any "deal" that boils down to "do what i say or i will kill you" is a meme my man
how retarded do you think people are that you try to pass off these blackmail attempts as some sort of generous diplomatic opportunity?

Sounds way too American and EU right? Comply with our way or be labeled a dictator and a threat to democracy. How about this, don't try to join a pact that wants to put missiles on a countries border that they deem their opponent and it would have never escalated in the first place.

I feel bad for the 300k mobilized for Russia, even assuming they all have actual combat experience (which I doubt) the bulk of that combat experience is going to come from either Syria, Georgia, or the second Chechnya war.

For Syria vets the problem is obvious, they were fighting jihadists who primarily had AKs and Technicals, which can hardly be called actual war experience.

For Georgian War vets the war didn't even last two weeks, so that any experience was minimal in length.

For Second Chechnya war vets, they'd be at the very least in their late 30s by now. The phrase "Getting too old for this shit" applies to frontline combat at that point.

You can watch them train in the new PL video

 

[Hell on Earth]

I feel bad for the 300k mobilized for Russia, even assuming they all have actual combat experience (which I doubt) the bulk of that combat experience is going to come from either Syria, Georgia, or the second Chechnya war.

For Syria vets the problem is obvious, they were fighting jihadists who primarily had AKs and Technicals, which can hardly be called actual war experience.

For Georgian War vets the war didn't even last two weeks, so that any experience was minimal in length.

For Second Chechnya war vets, they'd be at the very least in their late 30s by now. The phrase "Getting too old for this shit" applies to frontline combat at that point.

Don't feel bad. Vatniks felt bad for Ukre conscripts back in June when they were losing hundreds of men a day. Now, they're experienced soldiers that are plugging gaps on the front and are letting more experienced soldiers to participate in offensive actions. Those same experienced soldiers pass on knowledge to green hornets in their units and increases the effectiveness of offensive units and this same dinamic will also happen in the Russian army in a couple of months from now.

This war is just starting.

 

[Smity Werbenjagermanjensen]

You can watch them train in the new PL video

Basic training is just that, basic.

Even if you're told to crawl under machine gun fire or something, the back your mind knows that this is all just scripted, all fake, and ultimately very little in the way of danger.

Training does help, but it doesn't actually prepare you for the reality of frontline combat against an actually capable opponent.

Russia sent it's actually capable units in first, and is now trying to plug the gaps with soldiers that might as well only have training under their belt, or are entering their 40s.

They're know how to fire a gun, they're know orders and how to follow orders, but at the end of the day a ton of Ukrainians have been at this for over half a year, and these mobilized Russians haven't seen an actual battlefield.

 

[Mr E. Grifter]

You can watch them train in the new PL video

There is something a little sketchy about this video, I'm not saying it isn't real - but I doubt this is the standard experience of DPR conscripts.

The claim is these guys have been training for three months? Yet, they are practicing very basic fire and manoeuvre. This might make sense if they were in a larger formation, say a platoon size or company. Learning combat tactics in larger formations is difficult, so this would make sense to do here before doing so under fire. However, three months of training and repeating this would suggest either their training is terrible or the fact that this is just all for propaganda purposes.

What's more is that this sort of training is probably of little use to them, basic assault and break contact drills might be of some use but probably not for old mobilised men with little actual military experience - but it wouldn't be as good as trench digging, or fieldcraft so your penis doesn't turn green and fall off. Maybe they could teach them harbour routine so they don't get spotted by drones because they've left their rubbish or pet sheep out for all to see.

 

[Foltest]

any "deal" that boils down to "do what i say or i will kill you" is a meme my man
how retarded do you think people are that you try to pass off these blackmail attempts as some sort of generous diplomatic opportunity?

Based from his writing, I expect him to think that everyone is as stupid as he is.
Because jesus christ, the cope I see from this fucking moron is incredible.

 

[Local Fed]

A lot of posts in this thread are reading more like Twitteresque "My team is better than you team [team flag in bio]" bullshit. Stop fighting and come together against your common enemy: Greenland.

Jigaboos.

 

[AgendaPoster]

The New York Times released a new article claiming that the Ukrainian government assassinated Daria Dugina and that they got told off by the U.S. government for it afterwards. I tried to read it from a neutral point of view but for some reason I just couldn't shake this feeling that the CIA proofread it for the NYT editors and that they're still mad about it.

“We have other targets on the territory of Ukraine,” he said, “I mean collaborationists and representatives of the Russian command, who might have value for members of our special services working in this program, but certainly not Dugina.”

Yeah, I probably disagree here with the Ukrainian official, probably he just sold a more tame version for Western human rights audiences.
IMO (so just personal speculation) Dugina was killed by unfortunate mistake instead of her dad. But she was a rabid propagandist for Russia and her father's ideology, which is a severe threat for any state that's supposed to be included under the Eurasian Empire crap.
So Dugin is a very high value target, he's not military, he's even more important than 5 generals though, he's a source of intellectual, moral and spiritual justification for imperial conquest and war. This sort of stuff is well tolerated as just "free speech" when you're some online rando talking to 50 people like here, but as you start having international connections and a very large state that is basically putting your agenda in practice, it starts to become serious for the opposition.
When the assassination happened, the situation was far more dire for Ukraine and I made some analogies between partisan and hajduk fighting in East Europe against other invaders, which were all dirty wars where once you were an important foreign official in occupied territory, be it from Nazi Germany, Austria-Hungary, Ottomans or Russia, you were a target and always in danger.
If things go really bad for Ukraine, this is what will happen, there won't be some official surrender and peace treaties, it will just be a protracted decades long conflict where Russians won't find any safe place in the country, their officers will get assassinated by whores, their food poisoned, and their military attacked regularly with bombings and sniper fire, comparable with Iraq and Afghanistan.
I mean, the entire planet watched as a bunch of devoted sheep herders slowly took over their land while the mighty US forces were demoralized into a hasty retreat. it's not that they could not crush the Taliban yet again, the US could've obviously do that. But it lacked the purpose, desire and will to fight, as it no longer was about revenge for 9/11, Osama was dead, Omar dead, ISIS defeated, so the question of "why are we here" no longer had answers that could provide motivation.
Obviously every military force learned a lesson.

 

[draggs]

A lot of posts in this thread are reading more like Twitteresque "My team is better than you team [team flag in bio]" bullshit. Stop fighting and come together against your common enemy: Greenland.

Jigaboos.

Jokes on you, Trump tried to solve the Greenland Question but everybody reee'd about it

And the second half worked so great.

It did for everyone who wasnt a dirty Red

 

[Hell on Earth]

Basic training is just that, basic.

Even if you're told to crawl under machine gun fire or something, the back your mind knows that this is all just scripted, all fake, and ultimately very little in the way of danger.

Training does help, but it doesn't actually prepare you for the reality of frontline combat against an actually capable opponent.

Russia sent it's actually capable units in first, and is now trying to plug the gaps with soldiers that might as well only have training under their belt, or are entering their 40s.

They're know how to fire a gun, they're know orders and how to follow orders, but at the end of the day a ton of Ukrainians have been at this for over half a year, and these mobilized Russians haven't seen an actual battlefield.

Pretty much this post could have been written by a Vatnigger back in May and June, I remember reading that Ukre conscripts had only a couple of day's training before being sent to the front. (they were also poorly equipped)

And now look at the current situation, Ukraine managed to plug the gaps and it seems that having spare manpower was very useful during those hellish months and it was also vital in isolating the disaster that started with the Popasna breakthrough.

 

[thejackal]

Yeah, I probably disagree here with the Ukrainian official, probably he just sold a more tame version for Western human rights audiences.
IMO (so just personal speculation) Dugina was killed by unfortunate mistake instead of her dad. But she was a rabid propagandist for Russia and her father's ideology, which is a severe threat for any state that's supposed to be included under the Eurasian Empire crap.
So Dugin is a very high value target, he's not military, he's even more important than 5 generals though, he's a source of intellectual, moral and spiritual justification for imperial conquest and war. This sort of stuff is well tolerated as just "free speech" when you're some online rando talking to 50 people like here, but as you start having international connections and a very large state that is basically putting your agenda in practice, it starts to become serious for the opposition.
When the assassination happened, the situation was far more dire for Ukraine and I made some analogies between partisan and hajduk fighting in East Europe against other invaders, which were all dirty wars where once you were an important foreign official in occupied territory, be it from Nazi Germany, Austria-Hungary, Ottomans or Russia, you were a target and always in danger.
If things go really bad for Ukraine, this is what will happen, there won't be some official surrender and peace treaties, it will just be a protracted decades long conflict where Russians won't find any safe place in the country, their officers will get assassinated by whores, their food poisoned, and their military attacked regularly with bombings and sniper fire, comparable with Iraq and Afghanistan.
I mean, the entire planet watched as a bunch of devoted sheep herders slowly took over their land while the mighty US forces were demoralized into a hasty retreat. it's not that they could not crush the Taliban yet again, the US could've obviously do that. But it lacked the purpose, desire and will to fight, as it no longer was about revenge for 9/11, Osama was dead, Omar dead, ISIS defeated, so the question of "why are we here" no longer had answers that could provide motivation.
Obviously every military force learned a lesson.

Shorter: all is fair in love and war.

Russia wanted to capture and kill Zelensky and his council. They failed, because might makes right here. If Russia can't protect their propagandists in a war of their "existential existence" (lol) that's on them. Don't start shit, won't be no shit sort of thing.

@Hell on Earth the claim that Ukrainians are just hordes of cannon fodder, at any point in the war, is just Russian hyperbole. Ukraine has essentially been a Nation at Arms since 2014 and has received the best training the West can give them for almost a decade now. Yes Ukraine has a manpower advantage but they also have a massive advantage with their NCOs and Western (US) style command. They are flexible, empower their platoon and squad level leaders and in general are capable of much greater combined warfare then the Russians.

 

[draggs]

Basic training is, uh, basic

It's to train a person to do basic things without thinking, because if you have to think before doing basic shit on a battlefield youre probably gonna get hit

But yeah the fact that you arent in real danger in basic unless theres a fuckup means that new soldiers still dont automatically do some of the right things until they get a little real combat under their belt

 

[Shovelbird]

I'm so fucking amused when people say "Durr US lost in Iraq and Afghanistan"

the fucking sandniggers got plowed on day 1 on both and in both they hid behind civilians, tortured, beheaded and enslaved, only emerging like cockroaches when big daddy USA got tired of fucking both countries as they deserved it solely for existing. If you count this as victory of the people or a US defeat, then you are a fucking faggot who should be executed in a Republic of Gilead or rightfully raped to death by invading Chinese or castrated under Globohomo Belgian Caliphate

A lot of posts in this thread are reading more like Twitteresque "My team is better than you team [team flag in bio]" bullshit. Stop fighting and come together against your common enemy: Greenland.

Jigaboos.

It's Belgium, Switzerland, Netherlands and Luxembourg, the leading fortresses of Globohomo and Kalergi Cuckliphate.

 

[thejackal]

I'm so fucking amused when people say "Durr US lost in Iraq and Afghanistan"

the fucking sandniggers got plowed on day 1 on both and in both they hid behind civilians, tortured, beheaded and enslaved, only emerging like cockroaches when big daddy USA got tired of fucking both countries as they deserved it solely for existing. If you count this as victory of the people or a US defeat, then you are a fucking faggot who should be executed in a Republic of Gilead or rightfully raped to death by invading Chinese or castrated under Globohomo Belgian Caliphate

It was a Political defeat, not a battlefield one. There's no there there in either country. Once the US public finally realized that, along with our leaders, we GTFO, thank god. The fucking Northern Alliance in Afghanistan is a sick joke, those guys make some of our lolcows look like honest dealers and straight shooters.

 

[Mr E. Grifter]

Pretty much this post could have been written by a Vatnigger back in May and June, I remember reading that Ukre conscripts had only a couple of day's training before being sent to the front. (they were also poorly equipped)

And now look at the current situation, Ukraine managed to plug the gaps and it seems that having spare manpower was very useful during those hellish months and it was also vital in isolating the disaster that started with the Popasna breakthrough.

No one is saying that civilians with little training and basic weaponry have no value, but context matters.

If you take someone from their home, give them a rusted rifle and get them to fight thousands of miles away somewhere he doesn't care about, with people he doesn't know, for a cause that would be dubious if he even knew what it was - then you're not going to be very effective.

Contrast to people defending their homes, their families and friends, in an area they know well, which they can sustain themselves from and fighting defensively with easy to use weapons against a stupid enemy who just keeps driving vehicles into traps. The results are going to be a lot different.

Unsupported, these Russian units are going to be pretty worthless. Bypassing and enveloping isolated static positions of infantry that lack mobility effectively defeats them. Without leadership, training, comms and transport they wouldn't be able to effectively respond.

 

[DumbDude43]

I'm so fucking amused when people say "Durr US lost in Iraq and Afghanistan"

the fucking sandniggers got plowed on day 1 on both and in both they hid behind civilians, tortured, beheaded and enslaved, only emerging like cockroaches when big daddy USA got tired of fucking both countries as they deserved it solely for existing. If you count this as victory of the people or a US defeat, then you are a fucking faggot who should be executed in a Republic of Gilead or rightfully raped to death by invading Chinese or castrated under Globohomo Belgian Caliphate

people repeat these memes because for some reason the entire period from 2001 to 2021 is referred to as "war in afghanistan" when in reality the actual US-afghan war lasted only two months (from october to december 2001) and ended in total victory for the burger army, followed by 20 years of half assed occupation and counterinsurgency bullshit.

It's Belgium, Switzerland, Netherlands and Luxembourg, the leading fortresses of Globohomo and Kalergi Cuckliphate.

forgot germany and france on the list
although sometimes it does kind of feel like germany and france only exist to add economic weight to the decisions made by the benelux countries

 

[Shovelbird]

Benelux are like the brain leech on Franco-German bodies, acting very similar to Z.O.G model.

 

[draggs]

I'm so fucking amused when people say "Durr US lost in Iraq and Afghanistan"

the fucking sandniggers got plowed on day 1 on both and in both they hid behind civilians, tortured, beheaded and enslaved, only emerging like cockroaches when big daddy USA got tired of fucking both countries as they deserved it solely for existing. If you count this as victory of the people or a US defeat, then you are a fucking faggot who should be executed in a Republic of Gilead or rightfully raped to death by invading Chinese or castrated under Globohomo Belgian Caliphate

Well the US didnt lose in any way in Iraq, the Iraqi government set up by the US in 2004/5 still exists ruling the country to this day. Yeah it's a shitty government that we had to save from ISIS, but it's still there and Iraq is a full participant in the world again

Afghanistan the US certainly lost in the end, its objective of Afghanistan not being ruled by Muslim theocrats didnt happen, but not because it was defeated militarily

 

[Hell on Earth]

@Hell on Earth the claim that Ukrainians are just hordes of cannon fodder, at any point in the war, is just Russian hyperbole. Ukraine has essentially been a Nation at Arms since 2014 and has received the best training the West can give them for almost a decade now. Yes Ukraine has a manpower advantage but they also have a massive advantage with their NCOs and Western (US) style command. They are flexible, empower their platoon and squad level leaders and in general are capable of much greater combined warfare then the Russians.

The only advantages they have is in manpower, intelligence and morale and as far as their victories go, they never managed to encircle or destroy a significant amount of Russian manpower.

Those same tactics didn't work when faced with a wall of artillery and significant Russian resistance back in the first days (maybe the deadliest days for the Ukrainian military) of the Kherson offensive.

The Russians have proven many times that they can deal a bloody nose to Ukrainian offensives when they have sufficient manpower and supplies in the area.

No one is saying that civilians with little training and basic weaponry have no value, but context matters.

If you take someone from their home, give them a rusted rifle and get them to fight thousands of miles away somewhere he doesn't care about, with people he doesn't know, for a cause that would be dubious if he even knew what it was - then you're not going to be very effective.

Contrast to people defending their homes, their families and friends, in an area they know well, which they can sustain themselves from and fighting defensively with easy to use weapons against a stupid enemy who just keeps driving vehicles into traps. The results are going to be a lot different.

Unsupported, these Russian units are going to be pretty worthless. Bypassing and enveloping isolated static positions of infantry that lack mobility effectively defeats them. Without leadership, training, comms and transport they wouldn't be able to effectively respond.

You're only making presumtions, Russia still has tons of equipment and those that are being sent are reservists, not armed civilians.

Morale is difficult to put in a metric and you have to go through 10 filters of propaganda to know what the hell is going on so tell me next year if your presumtions on morale are ultimately correct.