#Comicsgate - The Culture Wars Hit The Funny Books!

[damian]

https://twitter.com/KielPhegley/status/1007410366777823232 https://archive.li/05tsi

 

[Jetpack Himmler]

https://twitter.com/KielPhegley/status/1007410366777823232 https://archive.li/05tsi
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According to his twitter bio, he worked for CBR so it comes as no surprise that he would side with the journos. He also got shitcanned from Wizard Magazine from what I gather, which almost makes me lament the death of the publication. For all its faults, the journalism in Wizard during its heyday was much better than what we have today.

 

[RockVolnutt]

https://twitter.com/KielPhegley/status/1007410366777823232 https://archive.li/05tsi
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The representation thing is really overblown and he's working off the assumption people would only dislike the replacements because they can't make the effort to "relate" to "people who don't look like them". That is a bad faith argument. Secondly if we're tossing opinions out there, relatability is not really something you should aim for in itself more then writing compelling characters. I like them but most Marvel heroes are damaged people and you should probably seek help if you ever go "Das Me!" about the Hulk. I've only heard "new movie actors!" and "otherwise it wouldn't sell!" as justifications for replacing the core which would create conflict no matter what.


Lastly, if you want to complain about "it's always irrational men" and act above stereotypes, please don't look like this, Kiel. Buy duct tape if you're incapable of closing your jaw.

 

[Tor Lugosi]

Didn't Robbi Rodriguez retire from drawing comics due to going blind? Perhaps they teamed him up with Zoe on Goddess Mode because they knew it'd never go anywhere or that the issues would come out so far apart that even a blind man could finish the art for them.

 

[damian]

Didn't Robbi Rodriguez retire from drawing comics due to going blind? Perhaps they teamed him up with Zoe on Goddess Mode because they knew it'd never go anywhere or that the issues would come out so far apart that even a blind man could finish the art for them.

The virtue signaling hiring has finally moved from the mentally disabled to the physically disabled, neat.

 

[Feline Darkmage]

"Nobody thinks like this" is never a good rebuttal to anything. There is always somebody stupid enough to think literally exactly like that.

I eyerolled throughout that entire twitter ramble and just kept thinking about how this dude's never met the people on tumblr who compulsively change every character into fat black trannies instead of making their own fat black tranny characters.

This Kiel dude is ignorant and has no idea the "strawmen" are actually real people.

Either that or he know they're real people and realizes they make "his side" look like the awful humans they truly are and this is the only way he can reconcile this with knowing how fucking dumb the idiots he's surrounded by are.

 

[WaltherPPGAY]

The purposeful inversion of Poe's law, by which all extreme views are simply mistaken examples of parody.

(so long as they make my side look bad.)

It reminds me of people deriding insane posts on the tumblrinaction subreddit as mere parody or the views of the tiniest of extremes years ago. Now such views are becoming national policy.

 

[Secret Asshole]

Every time I catch up on this thread I have a terrible vision of the world SJWs want for us all.

It's a bunch of Mr. Potato Head like humans wearing cult jumpsuits sitting in a giant theater watching a screen that flashes "You Are Special" in every color while sipping unsweetened tea full of vitamins and nutrients.

SJWs are the comics code authority, the parents council on music, the league of decency, fundamentalist Christians. But they're all worse. Why? Because they're based on secular morality, which has no set system of rules. The rules change daily and are whatever they want them to be for whoever they want them to be. Defeating SJWs will come eventually, as all previous censors were defeated. Because social order changes, and unless that social order is enforced by the government (like hate speech laws in the UK), it can be changed. The right wing died and lost their hold on censorship, and it is inevitable that the left eventually will fall too.

Since their mandates are not written into law, they can be changed. This is why we can't ever let them be in government or elected officials. Luckily, outside of a few areas (California and to a lesser extent Oregon), they have no real influence. Most of America I would say is more of a center-right, libertarian country. Its reflected in our parties as our Democrats here would be conservatives elsewhere.

Colleges promoting these garbage ideas will eventually collapse. The academic treadmill has gone on for far too long, the disciplines are rife with major reproducibility issues and outdated theories. Nobody outside of academia puts much credence in them.

The reason they target jobs is because otherwise they have no power. Because they can't affect change. They aren't elected officials. They're a secular religious movement. And like all others before it, it will fall. Not to mention the progressives themselves are bleeding members, losing local elections left and right and alienating people by CONSTANT bitching about Trump, even to those who dislike him are tired of it. Once enough normal people get fed up with their infestation, they'll be left isolated.

Many of them are disgusting, despicable individuals. Eventually, they'll all end up with each other. The modern left is getting massacred in local elections. If November is a Republican win, they only have to blame themselves.

 

[knightlautrec]

The representation thing is really overblown and he's working off the assumption people would only dislike the replacements because they can't make the effort to "relate" to "people who don't look like them". That is a bad faith argument. Secondly if we're tossing opinions out there, relatability is not really something you should aim for in itself more then writing compelling characters. I like them but most Marvel heroes are damaged people and you should probably seek help if you ever go "Das Me!" about the Hulk. I've only heard "new movie actors!" and "otherwise it wouldn't sell!" as justifications for replacing the core which would create conflict no matter what.


Lastly, if you want to complain about "it's always irrational men" and act above stereotypes, please don't look like this, Kiel. Buy duct tape if you're incapable of closing your jaw.

Another pudgy woke white dude hilariously speaking over a black guy who has A RIGHT to his opinion. But is immediately dismissed because his views aren't in line.

If you can't relate to character because you don't LOOK like them then I don't know what to tell you. Superman is the most beloved Superhero of all time not because he's white and a man, because he embodies the best values we want to see inside ourselves. Give anyone All Star Superman to read even the non comic types, I can guarantee they'll admire and empathise with Clark at the end because he is a well written character.

 

[RockVolnutt]

Another pudgy woke white dude hilariously speaking over a black guy who has A RIGHT to his opinion. But is immediately dismissed because his views aren't in line.

If you can't relate to character because you don't LOOK like them then I don't know what to tell you. Superman is the most beloved Superhero of all time not because he's white and a man, because he embodies the best values we want to see inside ourselves. Give anyone All Star Superman to read even the non comic types, I can guarantee they'll admire and empathise with Clark at the end because he is a well written character.

If I'm not white, you think he'd accept the duct tape to hold up his jaw? I've only come across like one photo where I can't see the inside of his mouth. I don't want to silence him or anything, I'm only concerned about his jaw falling off.

 

[Emperor Julian]

Well he just blocked everyone who his arguement might relate to so it's irrelivant if his arguement is good or not since no one he needs to persuade (and he does need to persuade people despite his delusions) of it will respect him now and he can no longer effectively rebuke counters to it.

 

[IAmNotAlpharius]

Well he just blocked everyone who his arguement might relate to so it's irrelivant if his arguement is good or not since no one he needs to persuade (and he does need to persuade people despite his delusions) of it will respect him now and he can no longer effectively rebuke counters to it.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=Zd9muK2M36c

That is why much of the left struggles online. Although there are conservatives who block people, progressives are more likely to. Consequently, conservatives are more likely to know about progressive talking points and how to dismantle them since they see them. Not knowing what others are saying also makes it easier to strawman which is ok with people 100% in the SJW camp. However, if anyone can see both sides or even if someone in the fringes of their camp takes a look at what the "others" are saying, they can realize the left is BSing. Consequently, normies and even center-leftists can be won over.

Then there is the whole purity cleanse thing. SJWs in particular are more likely to try to "cleanse" their friends or followers for disagreeing over petty issues. This increases animosity and also pushes people away. This is the opposite of what any rational being would want to do in a representative system.

*Edit*
Left is not equivalent to being SJW.

 

[Emperor Julian]

That is why much of the left struggles online. Although there are conservatives who block people, progressives are more likely to. Consequently, conservatives are more likely to know about progressive talking points and how to dismantle them since they see them. Not knowing what others are saying also makes it easier to strawman which is ok with people 100% in the SJW camp. However, if anyone can see both sides or even if someone in the fringes of their camp takes a look at what the "others" are saying, they can realize the left is BSing. Consequently, normies and even center-leftists can be won over.

Then there is the whole purity cleanse thing. SJWs in particular are more likely to try to "cleanse" their friends or followers for disagreeing over petty issues. This increases animosity and also pushes people away. This is the opposite of what any rational being would want to do in a representative system.

Weirdly this is a problem all across the board, I was talking with another Labour guy and he was grumbling about how far right (he actually meant right wing politics in general but that's another story) resurgance is an issue and I asked him what the counter-strategy was and his response was to bitch about how bad the mail and media was.
We've lost the working class, we lost them decades ago and left wing politics is just going to keep loosing battles until we grow the fuck up and stop jerking off to shit Guardian articles on vidya games and how people say means things on twitter. and talk about how the infrastructures gone to Hell and their's no fucking jobs.

 

[Jetpack Himmler]

This is entirely speculation on my part, but considering Disney for the most part pays little attention to Marvel's antics outside of rare exceptions like Perlmutter directly effecting the film financially and don't even bother to separate Marvel Comics in their finances, I wouldn't be surprised if Disney execs only have Marvel some vague directions about laying out the groundwork for some new movies after this whole Thanos wraps up, and then didn't really pay much attention to what Marvel was actually doing until they started trying to draft up the Captain Marvel script to compete with Wonder Woman and realized they have nothing to work with.

I think a lot of people have seen Disney/MCU as being this Mobile Organism Designed Only for Profits that has turned making popular franchises into a fine science, but I think in light of the Star Wars fiascos and other failed ventures like A Wrinkle in Time it's becoming clear that a lot of the popularity with the MCU had a lot to do with an insane amount of luck and the right elements coming together at the right time, which is proving to not be easily replicated. The more likely reality is that Disney's higher ups are likely as our if touch as the rest of Hollywood and is just handing these massive projects to anyone who seems tangentially related with nerd shit and assumes they'll make something their demographics want.

I posted this link in the Bob Chipman thread, but I thought I would repost it here because I believe that it would be pertinent to the points made in the quote.

Brie Larson calls for more diverse voices in film criticism, not just 'white dudes'

This is troubling to me because it really does look like Marvel Studios is on the cusp on chugging down the SJW Flavor-Aid like a John Belushi wannabe at a frat party. Marvel is making a big deal about how "progressive" the film is because the main protagonist, one of the directors (Anna Boden), most of the screenwriters, and the composer (Pinar Toprak) are all women. That is all fine and dandy, I get the distinct feeling that Marvel is going to take a page from Lucasfilm and Sony in that they will use "misogyny" as a defence against any and all criticism and blame the "toxic" fanbase if it underperforms (a highly unlikely scenario.) They are effectively using women as human shields.

I find this quote from Larson herself rather portentous, " couldn't deny the fact that this movie is everything I care about, everything that's progressive and important and meaningful, and a symbol I wished I would've had growing up."

Like one could argue that Wonder Woman is an icon of second-wave feminism, I think Marvel is trying to position Carol Danvers as some sort of corporate-sponsored icon of third-wave feminism and identity politics. What's more, the studio is looking to push her to the forefront of MCU and effectively make her the flagship character moving into Phase 4 now that it looks like RDJ and Chris Evans are hanging up the armour and capes. Given that we have heard statements from Kevin Fiege that they want to bring in Kamala Khan, and there is a casting call for a gender non-confirming student in the Spider-Man: Homecoming sequel, I think Avengers 4 is likely the end MCU as we know it.

 

[Sissy Galvez]

Progressive means replacing white men with women who are mediocre at their jobs.

 

[Judge Holden]

Off topic but this panel floated past my tweeter today and it made me realise that even if marvel never went full SJW/tumblr pandering it would still be doomed

I mean...just fucking look at that artwork to start with. Its not every day one sees nose art that manages to be worse than the infamous tumblr nose syndrome shit.

More importantly though look at the writing and dialogue. This shit is more childish and reductive to the whole "wamnen totally love talking about cloths! and hair! and they so kooky too! amirite gal pals?!" than literal BARBIE comics

Dont believe me? here is a page selected by random number generator from a barbie comic selected by random number generator

Spoiler: dont ask for context. it makes even less sense

I mean dont get me wrong, this shit is dumb (if amusingly mindfucky) but its the kind of light hearted and well meaning dumb of "ok this is a kids comic so lets try and make this something a kid might like to read if they are bored!". It almost comes across as being written by a literal child....and its STILL less of a "OH SILLY GIRLS AND THEIR HAIR AND FASHION AND STUFF!" insult to wammenkind than the "OH WE ARE SO WOKE GUIZ! OUR CHARACTERS ARE THE MOST FEMINININININIST WAYMAN EVER TO WAYMAN!" line at marvel

And it aint like this is some isolated thing. Just about every female character at marvel speaks and acts like the demented hybrid of stale Joss Whedon cliches and the masturbatory fantasies bitter past-their-prime female writers/bitter troons have about how they would act if they were the alpha-bitches in highschool

EDIT: ok i started reading the whole barbie comic in question and the first page has a pedophile turtle hitting on barbie's underaged sister/cousin/whatever. What the actual fuck have i stumbled accross?!
EDIT 2: and now the pedoturtle is enquiring about how to caulk a boat...and no thats NOT a euphamism
EDIT 3: Ken just complimented the pedoturtle on being "hard as a rock". fuck this im done

 

[Elwood P. Dowd]

Damn. The transformation into Carl Manvers is now complete. I would NEVER have thought I was looking at a female if I didn't already know. Nothing says woke like turning a character into Draco Malfoy. And why did they make Medusa look like a Bratz doll? She was actually pretty kick ass back in the day. (I'm afraid I don't know shit about Starfire, so I'll refrain from comment there.)

 

[Adamska]

This is why you don't dredge NEETs you can pay for peanuts to be your "writers" or "artists"; their work sucks shit and turns off people who might want your overpriced product. This is also why you don't let the unpaid interns direct your company.

Marvel is run like a failing burger stall where the lazy college drop out janitor is also basically in charge due to very weak reasons.

 

[Elwood P. Dowd]

Marvel is run like a failing burger stall where the lazy college drop out janitor is also basically in charge due to very weak reasons.

I've been sick as a dog all day but there's a thread on Twitter today trying to push the Scholastic Book Sale narrative as the path to riches.

 

[damian]

Off topic but this panel floated past my tweeter today and it made me realise that even if marvel never went full SJW/tumblr pandering it would still be doomed

I mean...just fucking look at that artwork to start with. Its not every day one sees nose art that manages to be worse than the infamous tumblr nose syndrome shit.

You’ve been missing out from the horrible crap I’ve had to swallow because of the no return policy of comixology. Here’s what I spent $4.99:

Look how manly the drew Carol, who was once one of the most attractive women in comics. The middle img, where their heads are cut off by the panel, is by far the most masculine I’ve seen her drawn:

Not to mention all the tropes D&C has coined are in the book:

I posted this link in the Bob Chipman thread, but I thought I would repost it here because I believe that it would be pertinent to the points made in the quote.

Brie Larson calls for more diverse voices in film criticism, not just 'white dudes'

This is troubling to me because it really does look like Marvel Studios is on the cusp on chugging down the SJW Flavor-Aid like a John Belushi wannabe at a frat party. Marvel is making a big deal about how "progressive" the film is because the main protagonist, one of the directors (Anna Boden), most of the screenwriters, and the composer (Pinar Toprak) are all women. That is all fine and dandy, I get the distinct feeling that Marvel is going to take a page from Lucasfilm and Sony in that they will use "misogyny" as a defence against any and all criticism and blame the "toxic" fanbase if it underperforms (a highly unlikely scenario.) They are effectively using women as human shields.

I find this quote from Larson herself rather portentous, " couldn't deny the fact that this movie is everything I care about, everything that's progressive and important and meaningful, and a symbol I wished I would've had growing up."

Like one could argue that Wonder Woman is an icon of second-wave feminism, I think Marvel is trying to position Carol Danvers as some sort of corporate-sponsored icon of third-wave feminism and identity politics. What's more, the studio is looking to push her to the forefront of MCU and effectively make her the flagship character moving into Phase 4 now that it looks like RDJ and Chris Evans are hanging up the armour and capes. Given that we have heard statements from Kevin Fiege that they want to bring in Kamala Khan, and there is a casting call for a gender non-confirming student in the Spider-Man: Homecoming sequel, I think Avengers 4 is likely the end MCU as we know it.

Marvel has always tried to make their women into Marvel’s Wonder Woman, just look at how many attempts they’ve made at Superman:

With Wonder Woman’s success in movies, they had to pick from the current crop of Marvel women that was available at the time. They chose Captain Marvel and have been HEAVILY promoting her non-stop for years.