s&box - Spiritual successor to Garry's Mod.

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Do you think the game is gonna suck?

  • Trannies will ruin it.

    Votes: 135 40.1%

  • No.

    Votes: 20 5.9%

  • Yes.

    Votes: 71 21.1%

  • Gmod is better.

    Votes: 111 32.9%
  • Total voters
    337
Most Wanted Banana said:
s&box should become F2P by the end of the year.

Full post.

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WE WIN AGAIN!!!!​

Garry Announces S&box as a total FAILURE and plans to go F2P by end of year​

​

Re-coping aka Rethinking post by Garry​

Full post here:
I’ve been rethinking what s&box should look like over the past couple of weeks. The platform is not well liked, it doesn’t have good retention. I’m embarrassed by our reviews, I am ashamed. Listening to all the negative feedback, absorbing, taking it seriously and deciding what we should and shouldn’t be doing. It’s not a big secret that it hasn’t been going well.

Our focus has been on the engine and the development experience. That’s what we love, that’s what turns us on - but we’re not selling an engine, we’re selling a game. So we need to do much much better on the game, we need to shift our focus to what players are experiencing, not developers.

Part of this focus is drawing our attention to the Sandbox Game. Giving it parity with the Garry’s Mod version and surpassing it. Showing everyone what the engine can do, adding more NPCs, adding vehicles, offering a first class multiplayer experience, supporting addons and customization. This is a relatively easy task - but I’ve let everyone down that was expecting that. I accept that, and I’m sorry - we are going to do better.

We’re fully removing the Citizen. We tried to make it work for about a year longer than we should have (see below).

We have been struggling with discovery a lot. Which games to show, which to hide. Then AI came along and made that much much harder, because suddenly it’s very easy to knock out a game. The player is overwhelmed by choice. They’re presented with a few good games surrounded by a ton of shit games. They choose a game, it takes a while to download, and it’s immediately shit. How many times will they try games until they find one they like.

My idea of a Netflix for games doesn’t work. It’s not feasible. It’s not how people discover games. You can’t land people on a menu of 60 games and say have fun. That’s not a good experience. People want to find games through recommendations, through active multiplayer games, through watching streamers, influencers and content creators. We have been coming at it from the wrong direction.

We shouldn’t strive to be a platform with the most games available. We should strive to be a platform with the best, most popular games available. Where good taste and great opinions are valued beyond everything else. This is a very human thing, this isn’t something that can be replaced by AI, ever.

This is why we’re changing the Play Fund to an opinionated approval system instead of something everyone can just enrol themselves in (see below).

We have spent a lot of time making our own backend, our own version of workshop. I’m arriving at the conclusion that this has mostly been a waste of time and resources. It has been fun to make, but we should be shaping everything into fitting into the Steam Workshop as much as possible.

We intend to go free to play towards the end of the year. It’s been pointed out that we are charging for access and also have skins for sale. I don’t think that’s too unusual nowadays, but I can totally understand how combined with everything else that it’s a big turn off. We don’t need the entrance fee, we need players. Our intention always was to go free to play eventually, so fuck it, lets just do it now. Everyone who has paid for the game will automatically get a bunch of exclusive steam inventory items (extra if you bought it at $20 vs $10) that I hope will justify the purchase price.

I love seeing people create things, I love this engine, and I love working on it. The negative reviews hurt me. The disdain for the project hurts me. I don’t like letting people down, especially when they’ve given me money to provide a service. I understand it all and we’re making some big sweeping changes to try to improve things. Please bear with us while we make these changes.

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Tldr Tweet:
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Also confirmed Garry Tattoed his Citizen model on his body. What a retard.
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That post is both sad and hilarious specially the part about the steam workshop: Garry has been developing games for two decades now so he should know better than trying to reinvent the wheel. They have spent close to a decade developing this garbage and just now they realize how retarded of an idea it is to try and compete with roblox and unity. Sorry but that was never gonna happen without at least a mobile port, nevermind the fact this requires a decent PC.
Their goal should have been "gmod but source 2" (or at least as close as you can get to that since Valve is still cagey about giving others full access to the engine) from the very start.
I wonder if they will even manage to salvage this trashfire
 
BlazikenLover said:
without at least a mobile port, nevermind the fact this requires a decent PC.
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Unmolested Source 2 runs incredibly well and supports mobile devices (Dota Underlords). The branch Garry built off was for a VR game so it had to be very optimized, wtf did he do to it.

In fact, Valve ported Half Life Alyx to ARM and got it running on a last generation mobile chip in VR
 
Soggy Floppa said:
Unmolested Source 2 runs incredibly well and supports mobile devices (Dota Underlords). The branch Garry built off was for a VR game so it had to be very optimized, wtf did he do to it
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He tried to gut the whole thing and make a Unity 2.0. No, really, that is why it is so bad. He gutted what was there and tacked on tons of replicas of Unity's features.
 
Pinball 2000 said:
TLDR for those who don't want to read the announcement:
-The game goes F2P by the end of the year; people who already bought in get some unique cosmetics
-The sausage model is FUCKING DEAD. He's still in the files (to not break existing games that use them), but it's no longer visible in the menu or the avatar editor.
-Human models are the default going forward. There's also a bunch of work being put in to revamp the models and animations.
-Playfund is changing how it works. Previously, they based the payouts almost entirely on which games had the most playtime, which incentivised devs to make low-effort shit like clicker/idle games.
-Proper Steam Workshop support for maps, so that you can download the maps in advance (instead of the current system of streaming them in every time you want to play).
-A bunch of performance/optimization shit
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Thanks for the TLDR.

I'm just going to copy and paste what I said last time as it applies to this too.
Speaking of which, please do not interpret any of Garry's recent activity as him turning a new leaf or becoming a good guy. It's performative at best. He has realized that he literally has no choice but to give in to at least some of the complaints if he wants to salvage any amount of value from this multimillion dollar project.
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I really don't think these changes are going to make a big difference. It's good that he's finally changing the sausage model, but it was only one of many problems, the biggest of which are still being ignored.
  • Garry is still an authoritarian dictator.
  • FP is still going to ban you whenever they feel like it, even if you've done literally nothing against TOS.
  • There still has yet to be an actually good game to draw interest to this platform.
  • The game still runs like shit.
  • Probably more that I forgot.
 
Cryogonal2 said:
The model isn't very good but it feels like a lot of people just bitch about the hot dog people as if there aren't far larger problems than just the character models
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hot dog discourse was amusing (being something garry went to bat for) but i always figured it to be a scapegoat for people unable to articulate why the game's shit
 
Soggy Floppa said:
Unmolested Source 2 runs incredibly well and supports mobile devices (Dota Underlords). The branch Garry built off was for a VR game so it had to be very optimized, wtf did he do to it.

In fact, Valve ported Half Life Alyx to ARM and got it running on a last generation mobile chip in VR
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Had forgotten about underlords and didn't know about the Alyx port (that's neat), that makes S&Box even more retarded. Imagine if it had just been gmod in source 2 which can run in phones, that would have been a no brainer.
 
Soggy Floppa said:
Unmolested Source 2 runs incredibly well and supports mobile devices (Dota Underlords). The branch Garry built off was for a VR game so it had to be very optimized, wtf did he do to it.
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I think the main issue is that S&box developers have been using dynamic lighting rather than baked, and every game is vibe coded, so every game runs like shit because no one is optimizing anything. When I had my hands on the game for the week or so before launch where it was free to request access, 70% of games ran like hot ass, including the default sandbox mode, but some games looked just as good and ran far better.

Cirno's Feet said:
hot dog discourse was amusing (being something garry went to bat for) but i always figured it to be a scapegoat for people unable to articulate why the game's shit
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First impressions are everything, that was the entire reason garrys mod got successful in the first place, they used half life models so valve fans went to check out the game.
 
FunkTism said:
He tried to gut the whole thing and make a Unity 2.0. No, really, that is why it is so bad. He gutted what was there and tacked on tons of replicas of Unity's features.
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Don't forget that this is the third or fourth engine he hopped around, remember the period of time the game spent on fucking Unreal Engine aka one of the most annoying to mod engines out there?
 
Rust Troony said:
First impressions are everything, that was the entire reason garrys mod got successful in the first place, they used half life models so valve fans went to check out the game.
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given that roblox characters are ugly as sin i think people are willing to forgive a lot when they find purpose in the platform as a whole. s&box lives or dies based on the current core gmod audience who hold no particular allegiance beyond 1000-addon sandbox collections, vanossgaming or (populated) darkrp of which they found none
 
Cirno's Feet said:
s&box lives or dies based on the current core gmod audience who hold no particular allegiance beyond 1000-addon sandbox collections, vanossgaming or (populated) darkrp of which they found none
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i think he expected people to be willing to pay for a more polished version of the same experience with better tools but failed to take into consideration that nobody actually wants that especially not the garrys mod crowd
 
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