Yes, are large proportion of the time women are drawn to men who turn out to be gay because gay men are far more likely to actually do things like "wash" and "perform basic physical self-care." MtFs are even worse about those things than average hetero males, so it's not going to help them no matter how "queer" they pretend to be.
Younger hetero women in particular do tend to be attracted to men who aren't particularly masculine in some ways (hairless, pretty) but they'll still look like men overall (broad shoulders, low voices) and are not actually feminine.
If you want a good look at male characters that get attention from women (including female coomers) you can look at AO3 stats:
These are all-time stats, so they heavily favor fandoms that are older and more longrunning (like Supernatural and Harry Potter) but you can still get a good idea of which characters women and girls have committed to writing about. I am not familiar with every character on the list, but from what I can see the popular male characters run the gamut from pretty boys (K-Pop stars) to "more masculine but probably still showers daily" (Tony Stark), and there is zero sign of femboys or actually feminized men.
I think most people who normally talk about feminine men are talking about men which have interests more related to being feminine, not being emasculated.
I have seen woman which like dudes who like fashion or cooking for example, the BTS type dudes are a reflection of this, even more because they use makeup, long hair (not always) and other things which would be called feminine, unless we are talking about dudes which look like women (an impossible feat only for fetishists), then no one likes that shit, relating that to feminine men it's like relating tomboys with Abby from TLOU 2 and believing that tomboy lovers like that.
If it's for the MTFs, then yeah, they are totally disgusting and no one would have sex with them, FTM included.
Weirdly I think not so much any more - you get male hambeast landwhales who just don't give a shit, and perhaps super-fit guys, but gender-neutral body shaming has even affected dudes, the average guy is not going to show off his dad-bod with the same joie de vivre as a FTM showing off her mastectomy scars.
Besides, depending on what country you live in, taking off one's shirt means getting irradiated to a cancerous death by the sun so it's just not a thing. Building sites and outdoor work will frown on anyone being SLEEVELESS where I live. All the men are in a Hi-Vis Hijab. (Which coincidentally hasn't been picked up much by Aidens at all)
I know trannies are perpetually delusional and addicted to copium, but my god, that's a whole other level of insanity.
99.99999% pass as their biological sex just by their physical appearance alone. Feminine males still look male, and masculine women still look like women. Even androgynous-looking people still look like their biological sex when you do a double-take. I don't know if I've ever genuinely been stumped as to whether a person was male or female in my entire life--at least when in person.
I've never even paid attention to J.K. Rowling's forehead before, because she looks 100% like a woman because she is a woman. Even if it's larger, it still looks like woman's forehead by the shape of it, not a man's--which is wider on the sides. Trannies are just bitter she isn't totally accommodating their delusions and inane demands 24/7/365.
thats the truth.
every person can recognize if someone is a woman or a man, 99,9% of the time.
thats why its so easy to identify troons: they are so grotesquely deformed that even after all the hormones and the surgeries in the world, they still look like their biological sex.
they will never fool anyone, and many people know that.
and even if a specific troon passes off as a ''woman'', his voice will give him away. no exceptions.
troons should seek out therapy and psychological help, instead of trying to chop off their reproductive organs.
because, you know, if someone came to a doctor and asked them to chop their arm off because they would ''feel better about their own self'', then that person would be deemed insane and they'd be put into a mental asylum because they display psychopathic tendencies due to having a serious mental illness.
in the same spirit, why is a troon declared as ''normal'', when all they want is to chop off their reproductive organs so that they can ''feel better about themselves''?
how is that any different? and why do we have to accept it as ''normal'', when its pure lunacy?
Plenty of women are into feminine straight men. The goth subculture should attest to that, not to mention how wild women got over J-rockers, especially when they dressed up in EGL style. Or hell, let's not forget why glam rock used to be a thing.
No sane woman goes into sex work. And by sex work, I don't mean an OnlyFans, or getting people to pay for your nudes. I'm talking about shit like working in brothels. In the article, I noticed how the brothel refuses to let its hookers leave, take 80% of their earnings, make them pay for their own STD tests they're made to get, sheriff's card, etc. Could you imagine a legit workplace doing this to their employees? They'd be sued and closed down so fast.
And it doesn't even look like this chick did anything except chop off her breasts. I doubt she's even on T. And no doubt, they market her as a freak attraction, and I'm imagining only the most perverted clients request her. She's still getting abused, and no doubt, none of her clients see her as male, though they'll be happy to entertain her delusions so long as they get their dick wet.
Plenty of women are into feminine straight men. The goth subculture should attest to that, not to mention how wild women got over J-rockers, especially when they dressed up in EGL style. Or hell, let's not forget why glam rock used to be a thing.
I must confess that when I was still trying to be straight it was feminine men I focused my attention on. And for what it's worth, sometimes those feminine men are more feminine than some notable, rather terrifying lesbians I've tangled with. I guess you can use my example to extrapolate from there.
In my experience, women who say they like feminine men mean a few specific things by this:
1) A man who cares about his appearance and strives to be groomed and well-dressed.
2) A man who is "pretty" ( e.g. long hair, guyliner, more androgynous facial features)
3) A man who is not macho/steeped in bro culture.
It's not too far off from the mindset of men who like tomboys. It's not that men want a woman who looks like a man (edit: or acts like a caricature of a man), it's that they are attracted to women who kind of bridge the psychosocial gap between men and women while still clearly being female.
Cluniac always seemed to me like what Contrapoints would've been like with even the slightest ability to self-reflect and not blame every single thing on society. I do hope he gets help, that much resentment and self-loathing is crushing even without transitioning/detransitioning.
It's a 52 minute long video where a non-binary identifying intersex person (At least, he claims so. Most of the video is about his transitioning, rather than his intersex status.) talks about his life experience so that people can understand the struggles of intersex people, trans people and non-binaries (Because these are closely connected to each other for some reason.).
According to this person, he's born with Gonadal Dysgenesis, a.k.a. intersex (He doesn't tell which type of intersex though, but judging from things he say later on, I'm guessing it's Klinefelter Syndrome. He even says at one point that he has XY chromosomes, but then he says it could be XX too so, I don't know. Troons man. They keep lying and lying.)which he describes as "Ovaries not purely developing as ovaries, but as ovaries and testicles". He says that he has both a prostate and a womb and he can actually have periods when he takes estrogen and progesterone pills (He says very later on the video that he's started having periods after getting a neovagina. So he's not having any periods. He's just losing blood from his open wound and taking hormones to mimic menstruation just like many troons do.)
His life story is something honestly: He was born with a deformed genitalia, parents didn't inform him about his deformed genitalia. Thinks he's a biological male for a time being until he starts playing with girl toys and wearing girly clothes. Develops breasts during teen years and other boys mock him for it. Starts thinking he might be trans and comes out to his mom because his dad is abusive. Mom doesn't accept him of course. He starts experiencing really bad monthly cramps, looks up on the internet to find what it might be and learns about DSDs (I find this one weird honestly. Earlier on, he talks about taking biology lessons. He even makes his teacher mad by saying "What about trans people?". If he knew what "transgender" was at that time, shouldn't he also know what DSDs are?)
He goes to his family doctor to see if he had intersex condition or not. Doctor says he's going to check it with an ultrasound but never does, because he doesn't believe him. He realises he can't trust the doctors so he decides to go to a gender therapist but it takes so long to take an appointment (Because he lives in UK and transitioning doesn't count as a serious health problem there.). He gets sick of waiting and buys hormones online instead (Yup. Always a great idea.). His sister then reveals his trans status to the father because she was upset with him (He never tells why his sister was upset with him. I wonder why?), father disowns him because of that.
Now here's the part where things go wild (If they weren't wild enough). His father later on dies because of leukemia and he finds this as a great opportunity to come out as trans to his family again (Because your family mourning your father's death is the PERFECT time to make it all about yourself.). And suprise suprise, their reactions don't change. At this point even his very progressive brother disowns him because he's sick of his shit.
This causes him to run away to a friend's house in Michigan. He starts doing art online. Gets an abusive boyfriend but then he dumps him. Goes doctor to doctor to prove his intersex status but they still don't believe him because intersex is a very rare condition. So he talks to his online friends instead and he eventually gets a bottom surgery. He feels regret at first but as the time goes on and he starts having his "periods" he realises he has made the right choice. And I gave up on watching the video after this part, because I can't take this much cringe.
Welp, looks like I got to experience being "misgendered" by some dumb American kiddo in VRChat...as a they, no less. How can someone get so triggered over getting misgendered is beyond me. I certainly didn't care. Which reminds me, I wonder if troons are triggered if you misgender them as a they.
No sane woman goes into sex work. And by sex work, I don't mean an OnlyFans, or getting people to pay for your nudes. I'm talking about shit like working in brothels. In the article, I noticed how the brothel refuses to let its hookers leave, take 80% of their earnings, make them pay for their own STD tests they're made to get, sheriff's card, etc. Could you imagine a legit workplace doing this to their employees? They'd be sued and closed down so fast.
And it doesn't even look like this chick did anything except chop off her breasts. I doubt she's even on T. And no doubt, they market her as a freak attraction, and I'm imagining only the most perverted clients request her. She's still getting abused, and no doubt, none of her clients see her as male, though they'll be happy to entertain her delusions so long as they get their dick wet.
1. Clients who figure that because she is a “boy” she’ll let them do anal
2. Clients who surmise that the girl who has the least clients because of her lack of tits and is the most desperate for money is more likely let them do anal (or other unusual stuff)
3. Clients who pick her out because she has clearly committed radical self-harm and has mental health issues, and is therefore less likely to complain or make a fuss if they break the rules
Together they are probably enough to keep her profitable for the brothel, and possibly the other workers even like her for skimming off all of the worst customers. Can't imagine her working life is very pleasant, though.
If this woman is the same woman who runs this instagram (the names seem to match up, although that would make the older kid female...?) then holy shit how does she not have a thread. It is like someone created the perfect lolcow in a lab.
Or is there a thread already and I'm missing it somehow? I tried searching under her real name and couldn't find one, just a post about her in the insane parents thread from December.
