War Invasion of Ukraine News Megathread - Thread is only for articles and discussion of articles, general discussion thread is still in Happenings.

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President Joe Biden on Tuesday said that the United States will impose sanctions “far beyond” the ones that the United States imposed in 2014 following the annexation of the Crimean peninsula.

“This is the beginning of a Russian invasion of Ukraine,” Biden said in a White House speech, signaling a shift in his administration’s position. “We will continue to escalate sanctions if Russia escalates,” he added.

Russian elites and their family members will also soon face sanctions, Biden said, adding that “Russia will pay an even steeper price” if Moscow decides to push forward into Ukraine. Two Russian banks and Russian sovereign debt will also be sanctioned, he said.

Also in his speech, Biden said he would send more U.S. troops to the Baltic states as a defensive measure to strengthen NATO’s position in the area.

Russia shares a border with Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania.

A day earlier, Russian President Vladimir Putin ordered troops to go into the separatist Donetsk and Lugansk regions in eastern Ukraine after a lengthy speech in which he recognized the two regions’ independence.

Western powers decried the move and began to slap sanctions on certain Russian individuals, while Germany announced it would halt plans to go ahead with the Russia-to-Germany Nord Stream 2 pipeline.

At home, Biden is facing bipartisan pressure to take more extensive actions against Russia following Putin’s decision. However, a recent poll showed that a majority of Americans believe that sending troops to Ukraine is a “bad idea,” and a slim minority believes it’s a good one.

All 27 European Union countries unanimously agreed on an initial list of sanctions targeting Russian authorities, said French Foreign Minister Jean-Yves Le Drian, and EU foreign affairs head Josep Borell claimed the package “will hurt Russia … a lot.”

Earlier Tuesday, Borell asserted that Russian troops have already entered the Donbas region, which comprises Donetsk and Lugansk, which are under the control of pro-Russia groups since 2014.

And on Tuesday, the Russian Parliament approved a Putin-back plan to use military force outside of Russia’s borders as Putin further said that Russia confirmed it would recognize the expanded borders of Lugansk and Donetsk.

“We recognized the states,” the Russian president said. “That means we recognized all of their fundamental documents, including the constitution, where it is written that their [borders] are the territories at the time the two regions were part of Ukraine.”

Speaking to reporters on Tuesday, Putin said that Ukraine is “not interested in peaceful solutions” and that “every day, they are amassing troops in the Donbas.”

Meanwhile, Ukraine President Volodymyr Zelensky on Tuesday morning again downplayed the prospect of a Russian invasion and proclaimed: “There will be no war.”

“There will not be an all-out war against Ukraine, and there will not be a broad escalation from Russia. If there is, then we will put Ukraine on a war footing,” he said in a televised address.

The White House began to signal that they would shift their own position on whether it’s the start of an invasion.

“We think this is, yes, the beginning of an invasion, Russia’s latest invasion into Ukraine,” said Jon Finer, the White House deputy national security adviser in public remarks. “An invasion is an invasion and that is what is underway.”

For weeks, Western governments have been claiming Moscow would invade its neighbor after Russia gathered some 150,000 troops along the countries’ borders. They alleged that the Kremlin would attempt to come up with a pretext to attack, while some officials on Monday said Putin’s speech recognizing the two regions was just that.

But Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin told reporters Tuesday that Russia’s “latest invasion” of Ukraine is threatening stability in the region, but he asserted that Putin can “still avoid a full blown, tragic war of choice.”

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Someone mentioned in one of the threads that Zelinsky was breaking a lot of agreements and generally being a cunt with Crimea the last few years (i.e. cutting off water and power). From what I’ve gathered Putin had enough casus belli to declare war and take Donbass+Eastern territory under the auspices of protecting ethnic Russians after persecution was allowed by the Ukrainian government. But it looks like Putin is just taking all the Black Sea territory and maybe Kiev.

I’m not saying that Russia is blameless for the bad blood. They took Crimea, but from what I remember about that crisis some retard who Obama put in the state department told them not to allow the Russians to renew their lease on a naval base in Crimea. There’s a lot of bullshit from the Soviet Era, but the Ukrainian gov’t seems to be as bad if not worse than Putin. Zelinsky is an open puppet and the Western propaganda for him really drives me up a wall.

The entire thing feels like a corrupt nation being puppeteer’d by corrupt retards against other corrupt retards.I feel bad for ethnic Ukrainians and Russians who feel the brunt of this.
 
That could have been possible before this war, but after it? No way.

Ukraine will never trust Russia after this, they will obviously gun for NATO/EU membership for sure.
I don't think Russia plans to do this with a independent Ukrainian government, i think it is saying pretty much what it will make the puppet government that it is going to install accept this
 
The Winter War
Soviets genuinely believe they would see a popular uprising supporting them, they even sent marching bands at the head of their columns as they entered into Finland.

During the course of this conflict they lost approx 150k men dead, 200k injured. Lost around 2000 tanks and 500 aircraft. Eventually eeking out a win by using the overwhelming force they should have used to begin with.
They also had officer corps purge just before they mobilized for invasion.
This affected their performance greatly.
 
Problems in paradise, a lot of french factories closing temporally for lack of raw materials including 4 Michelin factories:


Screenshot_20220307-161936-510.png
 
That could have been possible before this war, but after it? No way.

Ukraine will never trust Russia after this, they will obviously gun for NATO/EU membership for sure.
The joining NATO/EU part could have but the rest of it couldn't have.

Right now Putin may be able to get Crimea or one of his other demands but it will be partly in return for letting Ukraine join the EU. Ukraine will not just give up shit without being given something even something like that and after Russians killing Syrian civilians, they will be even more unwilling to give anything up. Also, no matter what deal is reached doubt the Ukraine population will be happy with it.

The main issue is nothing is stopping Russia from coming back in 5, 10 or how many years to try and take over Ukraine.
 
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I mean, I believe it. We saw pretty much the same thing with Dem money and the summer of love, so I can see EU doing the same. After all, they pay their media to not disagree with them, and they have laws that punish dissent (see, for example, Germany's fake news(they admit it was designed to combat "fake news") law "Netzwerkdurchsetzungsgesetz" (it punishes people with max of 50 mln euros) )

Edit: Some stuff from Library of Congress about this law:

I need verification on rather or not the EU are backing them. Since my problem with this is that any demonstrations can be considered a covert OP to push propaganda without proof. You could throw that accusation at any gathering. You could also call the pro-Russian demonstrators in Serbia paid off by Moscow which isn't far fetched considering Russia's history of covert operations. I don't think they are but rather or not a gathering is explicitly linked to a government body needs some kind of proof or verification, otherwise you're just dismissing what could be a genuine demonstration based on politics rather than truth.
 
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The joining NATO/EU part could have but the rest of it couldn't have.

Right now Putin may be able to get Crimea or one of his other demands but it will be partly in return for letting Ukraine join the EU. Ukraine will not just give up shit without being given something even something like that and after Russians killing Syrian civilians, they will be even more unwilling to give anything up. Also, no matter what deal is reached doubt the Ukraine population will be happy with it.

The main issue is nothing is stopping Russia from coming back in 5, 10 or how many years to try and take over Ukraine.

On top of this, Zelensky has made a huge fuss about never capitulating to Russian aggression. Crimea happened only eight years ago; it’s still a fresh memory in the eyes of the Ukrainian people. On top of this, Putin’s rhetoric toward Ukraine’s sovereignty in recent months has been outright inflammatory. Combine that type of rhetoric and Russia’s aggression and you have the perfect recipe for occupied peoples to reject any sort of compromise. Zelensky became a national hero overnight but his meteoric rise to nationwide adoration would quickly collapse in on itself if he makes any concessions, even if they are comparatively minor. Giving up Crimea and Donbas wouldn’t be minor in the slightest: it would be compromising on Ukraine’s territorial integrity itself. That would be tantamount to political suicide for him, especially with a riled up, nationalistic support base like Ukraine has.
 
On top of this, Zelensky has made a huge fuss about never capitulating to Russian aggression. Crimea happened only eight years ago; it’s still a fresh memory in the eyes of the Ukrainian people. On top of this, Putin’s rhetoric toward Ukraine’s sovereignty in recent months has been outright inflammatory. Combine that type of rhetoric and Russia’s aggression and you have the perfect recipe for occupied peoples to reject any sort of compromise. Zelensky became a national hero overnight but his meteoric rise to nationwide adoration would quickly collapse in on itself if he makes any concessions, even if they are comparatively minor. Giving up Crimea and Donbas wouldn’t be minor in the slightest: it would be compromising on Ukraine’s territorial integrity itself. That would be tantamount to political suicide for him, especially with a riled up, nationalistic support base like Ukraine has.
I could see him giving up something to end the war and being allowed to join the EU but doing so would be the end of his political career even if it was the right move.

But as long as Putin is the head of Russian any deal is only as good as words so not very good at all and if he invades again I doubt he will make the same mistakes again.
 
WaPo: Poutine or Putin? People are conflating fries and gravy with the Russian president.

By Emily Heil
Today at 3:41 p.m. EST

The proverbial fog of war can result in many misunderstandings, and in the ongoing Russian invasion of Ukraine, misinformation is rampant.

But people concerned about the conflict should at least be clear on one thing: Russian President Vladimir Putin, the architect of this bloody war, has nothing whatsoever to do with poutine, the beloved French Canadian dish of fries topped with gravy and cheese curds. This fact should seem self-evident, but some people have been conflating the two.

The French restaurant Maison de la Poutine, with locations in Paris and Toulouse, this weekend said it had been subjected to insulting calls “and even threats” by people apparently confusing the name of its signature dish — sometimes called the national dish of Canada — with the name of the increasingly isolated Russian leader.

In a message to customers posted on its social media channels, the company noted that its signature dish was invented in Quebec in the 1950s, with various tales surrounding its origins. “But one thing is certain: poutine was created by passionate cooks who wanted to bring joy and comfort to their customers,” the post stated.

“La Maison de la Poutine has worked since its first day to carry on these values and today brings its most sincere support to the Ukrainian people who are courageously fighting for their freedom, against the tyrannical Russian regime,” it continued.

The mix-up seems to have been prompted by the French spelling of the Russian leader’s name (as in a recent tweet by French President Emmanuel Macron in which he described a conversation with “Président Poutine.”)
Despite any similarities, the two aren’t linked: The origins of the name of the fries-and-gravy dish are murky, with some attributing it to a Quebecois slang word meaning “mess” and others to a riff on “pouding,” the French word for pudding.

The French chain’s missive followed another by a Canadian eatery, Le Roy Jucep, which claims to be the restaurant where the dish was invented. On Feb. 24, the eatery reportedly posted a message on Facebook announcing it was renaming its most famous dish “la frite fromage sauce,” as an “expression of dismay” at the invasion of Ukraine. The post reportedly was soon deleted and replaced with another, now taken down, claiming that the diner had gotten telephone threats.

Some on social media have made fun of the confusion, with one post using images of Canadian rapper Drake to clear up the matter.

In the United States, some bars and restaurants have renamed the Moscow Mule cocktail the “Kyiv Mule” in a gesture of solidarity with the people of Ukraine. Others have started renamed White and Black Russians, calling the cocktails White and Black Ukrainians.

And it isn’t the first time that the name of a food item tripped people up: In the early months of the global pandemic, people were searching online for “beer virus” and “Corona beer virus” — an apparent conflation of the names of the Mexican brew and the deadly bug. (And it’s not food-related, but then there are those poor folks who are actually named “Kovid.”)
 
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Someone mentioned in one of the threads that Zelinsky was breaking a lot of agreements and generally being a cunt with Crimea the last few years (i.e. cutting off water and power). From what I’ve gathered Putin had enough casus belli to declare war and take Donbass+Eastern territory under the auspices of protecting ethnic Russians after persecution was allowed by the Ukrainian government. But it looks like Putin is just taking all the Black Sea territory and maybe Kiev.

I’m not saying that Russia is blameless for the bad blood. They took Crimea, but from what I remember about that crisis some retard who Obama put in the state department told them not to allow the Russians to renew their lease on a naval base in Crimea. There’s a lot of bullshit from the Soviet Era, but the Ukrainian gov’t seems to be as bad if not worse than Putin. Zelinsky is an open puppet and the Western propaganda for him really drives me up a wall.

The entire thing feels like a corrupt nation being puppeteer’d by corrupt retards against other corrupt retards.I feel bad for ethnic Ukrainians and Russians who feel the brunt of this.
That's my stance I feel bad for the Russians and Ukrainians who have no say.
 
The main issue is nothing is stopping Russia from coming back in 5, 10 or how many years to try and take over Ukraine.

Their dying population demographic will. That's probably half the reason Russia is attacking now. They're living on borrowed time. War or no war, the Russian people would eventually fade away due to their lackluster demographics.
 
Someone mentioned in one of the threads that Zelinsky was breaking a lot of agreements and generally being a cunt with Crimea the last few years (i.e. cutting off water and power). From what I’ve gathered Putin had enough casus belli to declare war and take Donbass+Eastern territory under the auspices of protecting ethnic Russians after persecution was allowed by the Ukrainian government. But it looks like Putin is just taking all the Black Sea territory and maybe Kiev.

I’m not saying that Russia is blameless for the bad blood. They took Crimea, but from what I remember about that crisis some retard who Obama put in the state department told them not to allow the Russians to renew their lease on a naval base in Crimea. There’s a lot of bullshit from the Soviet Era, but the Ukrainian gov’t seems to be as bad if not worse than Putin. Zelinsky is an open puppet and the Western propaganda for him really drives me up a wall.

The entire thing feels like a corrupt nation being puppeteer’d by corrupt retards against other corrupt retards.I feel bad for ethnic Ukrainians and Russians who feel the brunt of this.
You don't have any right to do Claire random referendums to steal the parts of people's country be like parts of Texas to claim referendums do join Mexico it's retarded and no one recognized it
Pressure wanted the russian-speaking parts of Ukraine they should have demanded them in the 1990s
There know when they agreed to the borders
 
The main issue is nothing is stopping Russia from coming back in 5, 10 or how many years to try and take over Ukraine.
The deal would have made Ukraine a Soviet puppet state.

First, they cannot join any mutual defence pact, nor build an army capable of defending itself from Russia.

Second, they can't join the EU - while not necessary to align with the West, it has helped a lot of Eastern European nations. Without this, Ukraine will end up with only Russia to choose from.

Ultimately, it results in Ukraine being Belarus.
 
Their dying population demographic will. That's probably half the reason Russia is attacking now. They're living on borrowed time. War or no war, the Russian people would eventually fade away due to their lackluster demographics.
If anything this war will punch up their demographics because people reproduce more often under poverty.
 
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