Russian Invasion of Ukraine Megathread

[Spicey McHaggis]

Indeed. You can have all the equipment you want. You can have your sailors march in choreographed time on the deck of your aircraft carriers. But one thing money cannot buy is real-world combined-arms operational experience. The Chinese have no combined-arms combat experience later than 1979. Not sure the PLA Navy played any role. And while officers buy and sell commissions, they cannot buy combat experience. Bunch of corrupt motherfuckers. Let's also not forget the vast majority of Chinese troops/officers come from one-child families. That child is expected to be the parents' primary support in their old age, per the Confucian model. China has no US-style Social Security/SSI system. This very likely makes the Chinese military rather casualty-averse. Suggest the internal reverberations within China to large numbers of sons coming home in boxes or not at all could dwarf what might come out of Russia.

The PLA navy has had a few skirmishes with Vietnam. They have some experience, just very limited experience.

 

[Mr Bunny]

To me it describes the worst case scenario alongside brave new world. Trying to judge it based on how accurate it predicts things isnt the point. To me it predicts what could be, not what will be. Its totally relevant to a war nond of us can see and are told to take sides with.
"We've always been at war with russia" and "support ukrainian nationalism" are completely at odds with things that people said less than a decade ago. Jewish funded nazis and an open borders multicultural united states of europe vs Putin's soviet esque tsardom with hyper capitalist yet communist china makes no sense except through the lens of nonstop alteration of history and the manipulation of people through propaganda.

Man remember when we were giving weapons to Saddam, then next minute we're stringing him up. Times are wild.

 

[Rezza]

"At least 7,000 Russian soldiers killed in Ukraine and more than 14,000 injured, according to U.S. estimates - NYT"

My trust in U.S. officials plumeted after the Afghanistan fiasco, specially when they mistaken children for terrorists (and then killed them) in the last fucking days of the evacuation.

My own estimate is 3000 KIA and 10.000 wounded

That NYT estimate is actually similar to mine. I halved the claim by Ukraine, and doubled the claim by Russia. So I'm thinking 5000-7000 KIA, with injured/captured/etc as 3-4 times that

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Some dump from Telegram
Ukraine arillery strike on a Russian position on the outskirt of Kyiv

Russian helicopters stationed on a base in Belarus

Ukrainian artillery strike on Russian position in Chernihiv

 

[Puff]

People get 1984 wrong because they don't understand the context that it was written in. It's more of a stab at the Soviet Union when it was written than it was speculation about its future. The rape themes can especially throw readers off because back in the day, it was common knowledge that Beria, Stalin's right hand man, was a prolific rapist. But now you have to have more than a cursory knowledge of the Stalinist era or watch Death of Stalin to know that little detail. The work was also shaped by Orwell's experience in the Spanish Civil War living amongst the various leftist factions. But now people read it and are like "lol anyone I don't like is big brother".
Which is actually ok because the surveillance state themes are applicable to today's society. The KGB/Stasi/Gestapo/FBI used to keep files on people. Now people write their own files on Facebook and LinkedIn.

I mean, I think the bigger takeaway is the use of media manipulation over the surveillance.
Maybe it's just cause the current surveillance state is already far worse than in 1984. You can just go outside and they're essentially blind.
The fight against propaganda seemed to be more winnable up until this conflict. We're now getting people tricking themselves into thinking the Ukraine is winning somehow.

 

[Captain Wetbeard]

Faggots detected

 

[Meat Target]

It has a shoulder stock but also a bipod, so it's not totally exceptional. A shoulder stock + bipod combo makes sense.

Still, I would expect it to be bouncy af. I don't know any .50 cal machine guns with bipods and shoulder stocks from the factory.

Not a .50, but a Marine who fought on Iwo Jima jimmy-rigged a stock and a bipod onto a Browning M1919 and used it as an LMG.

 

[Spicey McHaggis]

"At least 7,000 Russian soldiers killed in Ukraine and more than 14,000 injured, according to U.S. estimates - NYT"

My trust in U.S. officials plumeted after the Afghanistan fiasco, specially when they mistaken children for terrorists (and then killed them) in the last fucking days of the evacuation.

My own estimate is 3000 KIA and 10.000 wounded

Personally, I could buy those numbers. Honestly I'm surprised they're not higher. When two near peers go to war, bodies get stacked fast. I'm also assuming somewhat similar numbers for the ukies

 

[Meat Target]

Personally, I could buy those numbers. Honestly I'm surprised they're not higher. When two near peers go to war, bodies get stacked fast. I'm also assuming somewhat similar numbers for the ukies

I will assume any statistic is a damned lie until this is all over and the dust has settled.

 

[Retink]

We're now getting people tricking themselves into thinking the Ukraine is winning somehow.

But they are winning, because I hear the ghost of Klebold is going to Columbine all of Russia.

 

[Kenya Jones]

Not a .50, but a Marine who fought on Iwo Jima jimmy-rigged a stock and a bipod onto a Browning M1919 and used it as an LMG.

It's more than that, it's a airplane mounted M1919 which meant it had a much larger rate of fire.

 

[Mr Bunny]

I will assume any statistic is a damned lie until this is all over and the dust has settled.

I suspect alot MIA, modern weapons and the heavy bombs that the Russians like to use can turn a man into literal red paint on the road.

 

[Richardface]

PROPAGANDA WAR ESCALATES: Two days ago, a woman rushed Russia's Channel One with an anti-Putin sign. Today, a woman stormed onto Ukrainian TV with an anti-Zelensky sign. "Zelensky, capitulate! Stop taking drugs and go back to the stage!"

https://nitter.net/ClintEhrlich/status/1504304946115584000#m

 

[Spicey McHaggis]

I will assume any statistic is a damned lie until this is all over and the dust has settled.

If it's bullshit, it's at least believable bullshit, just based on the sheer quantity of dead bodies we've seen here.

 

[No Batty Boys in Jamaica]

I mean, I think the bigger takeaway is the use of media manipulation over the surveillance.
Maybe it's just cause the current surveillance state is already far worse than in 1984. You can just go outside and they're essentially blind.
The fight against propaganda seemed to be more winnable up until this conflict. We're now getting people tricking themselves into thinking the Ukraine is winning somehow.

Baudrillard wrote that war was dead, and that future wars would all be simulations created by the media.

But when two simulations collide, it turns out that a real war results. Baudrillard nailed it with how propaganda would be used to create wars, but he couldn't have predicted Ukraine, because he (understandably) thought American globohomo would result in only one narrative. Instead there are multiple narratives due to declining American Hegemony.

 

[Retink]

PROPAGANDA WAR ESCALATES: Two days ago, a woman rushed Russia's Channel One with an anti-Putin sign. Today, a woman stormed onto Ukrainian TV with an anti-Zelensky sign. "Zelensky, capitulate! Stop taking drugs and go back to the stage!"

https://nitter.net/ClintEhrlich/status/1504304946115584000#m

That is what the sign says. Don't know what woman is being referred to from two days prior.

 

[MindYourSeabiscuits]

PROPAGANDA WAR ESCALATES: Two days ago, a woman rushed Russia's Channel One with an anti-Putin sign. Today, a woman stormed onto Ukrainian TV with an anti-Zelensky sign. "Zelensky, capitulate! Stop taking drugs and go back to the stage!"

https://nitter.net/ClintEhrlich/status/1504304946115584000#m

We can only pray this doesn't escalate into a global propaganda war. The last thing we need is the Russians sending agents to storm into CNN broadcasts holding anti-American signs. The horror would be unimaginable.

 

[MindYourSeabiscuits]

That is what the sign says. Don't know what woman is being referred to from two days prior.

A couple days ago a woman went behind a news presenter on Russian TV with an anti-war, anti-putin sign.

 

[Optimus Prime]

We can only pray this doesn't escalate into a global propaganda war. The last thing we need is the Russians sending agents to storm into CNN broadcasts holding anti-American signs. The horror would be unimaginable.

Nah I'd rather they do that with Fox News.

It would make Fox News actually entertaining.

 

[Feline Supremacist]

We can only pray this doesn't escalate into a global propaganda war. The last thing we need is the Russians sending agents to storm into CNN broadcasts holding anti-American signs. The horror would be unimaginable.

Maybe more than the same fifty people would watch CNN then.

 

[Spicey McHaggis]

View attachment 3079128
Baudrillard wrote that war was dead, and that future wars would all be simulations created by the media.

But when two simulations collide, it turns out that a real war results. Baudrillard nailed it with how propaganda would be used to create wars, but he couldn't have predicted Ukraine, because he (understandably) thought American globohomo would result in only one narrative. Instead there are multiple narratives due to declining American Hegemony.

Anyone who says war is finished is a delusional moron. War will never, ever be finished until all humans are dead, and then they'd just be fought by whatever species takes our place. People love to say war is done, but they've been consistently wrong generation after generation.