War Invasion of Ukraine News Megathread - Thread is only for articles and discussion of articles, general discussion thread is still in Happenings.

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President Joe Biden on Tuesday said that the United States will impose sanctions “far beyond” the ones that the United States imposed in 2014 following the annexation of the Crimean peninsula.

“This is the beginning of a Russian invasion of Ukraine,” Biden said in a White House speech, signaling a shift in his administration’s position. “We will continue to escalate sanctions if Russia escalates,” he added.

Russian elites and their family members will also soon face sanctions, Biden said, adding that “Russia will pay an even steeper price” if Moscow decides to push forward into Ukraine. Two Russian banks and Russian sovereign debt will also be sanctioned, he said.

Also in his speech, Biden said he would send more U.S. troops to the Baltic states as a defensive measure to strengthen NATO’s position in the area.

Russia shares a border with Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania.

A day earlier, Russian President Vladimir Putin ordered troops to go into the separatist Donetsk and Lugansk regions in eastern Ukraine after a lengthy speech in which he recognized the two regions’ independence.

Western powers decried the move and began to slap sanctions on certain Russian individuals, while Germany announced it would halt plans to go ahead with the Russia-to-Germany Nord Stream 2 pipeline.

At home, Biden is facing bipartisan pressure to take more extensive actions against Russia following Putin’s decision. However, a recent poll showed that a majority of Americans believe that sending troops to Ukraine is a “bad idea,” and a slim minority believes it’s a good one.

All 27 European Union countries unanimously agreed on an initial list of sanctions targeting Russian authorities, said French Foreign Minister Jean-Yves Le Drian, and EU foreign affairs head Josep Borell claimed the package “will hurt Russia … a lot.”

Earlier Tuesday, Borell asserted that Russian troops have already entered the Donbas region, which comprises Donetsk and Lugansk, which are under the control of pro-Russia groups since 2014.

And on Tuesday, the Russian Parliament approved a Putin-back plan to use military force outside of Russia’s borders as Putin further said that Russia confirmed it would recognize the expanded borders of Lugansk and Donetsk.

“We recognized the states,” the Russian president said. “That means we recognized all of their fundamental documents, including the constitution, where it is written that their [borders] are the territories at the time the two regions were part of Ukraine.”

Speaking to reporters on Tuesday, Putin said that Ukraine is “not interested in peaceful solutions” and that “every day, they are amassing troops in the Donbas.”

Meanwhile, Ukraine President Volodymyr Zelensky on Tuesday morning again downplayed the prospect of a Russian invasion and proclaimed: “There will be no war.”

“There will not be an all-out war against Ukraine, and there will not be a broad escalation from Russia. If there is, then we will put Ukraine on a war footing,” he said in a televised address.

The White House began to signal that they would shift their own position on whether it’s the start of an invasion.

“We think this is, yes, the beginning of an invasion, Russia’s latest invasion into Ukraine,” said Jon Finer, the White House deputy national security adviser in public remarks. “An invasion is an invasion and that is what is underway.”

For weeks, Western governments have been claiming Moscow would invade its neighbor after Russia gathered some 150,000 troops along the countries’ borders. They alleged that the Kremlin would attempt to come up with a pretext to attack, while some officials on Monday said Putin’s speech recognizing the two regions was just that.

But Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin told reporters Tuesday that Russia’s “latest invasion” of Ukraine is threatening stability in the region, but he asserted that Putin can “still avoid a full blown, tragic war of choice.”

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it's not, 100% inline with memoirs from war in Finland and Germany

One account was that Finns had enameled chamber pots with printed designs on them, so Red Army peasants seeing those legit thought that it was fancy dinnerware and used them to cook food and eat out of them.

During WWII liberating rampage through Europe, many Red Army soldiers thought of silk nightgowns to be fancy dresses for wives back home.

Statistics for rural Russia isn't great. Running water, gas and per house indoor plumbing is both expensive and not too common. Pipes alone cost a lot. I remember talking to a Russian about American homes and he would not believe me that water pipes are made out of pure copper. That did not compute, because it was outrageously expensive, like telling an American that pipes in your house are made out of silver. It's possible, but WTF would anyone do such a thing? Plain steel pipes are very common, they are welded together, not sweated like copper piping in US.


Somewhat semi-unrelated, Cheboksary Russia, theater of opera and ballet ... something you'd find on Giedi Prime:

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Anyone who knows about the "Glorious" traditions of the Russian Navy won't be surprised that they got their flagship ship turned into a submarine.

I'm actually surprised they didn't sink it themselves somehow. Their sailors have typically been whatever conscripts the other armed forces didn't want, their leadership constantly infights, and their equipment is almost always terrible due to cutting corners.

Someone posted some stuff about the Russia vs Japan naval war in another topic that describes how much Russia fucked up just GETTING their ships to Japan, let alone trying to fight:

 
And that's why I don't trust the far right when they tell us to stay out of the Ukraine/Russia war.

It sounds so much like those weenies back in the early 2000s and the Vietnam War who were one step away from being apologists for the enemy.

Modern Russia is no better than Saddam or the Viet Cong. In many ways, they're even worse. Especially once you see how Russians live and how they're conditioned to be slaves to the state, especially in the army where conscripts are raped and tortured (dedovschchina) into being loyal patsies of the state.

It's basically a real-world equivalent of Mordor.
Lord of the Rings really is just the W.A.S.P. Golem equivalent of Harry Potter.
 
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Aftermath of FAB-1000 (about 500kg of TNT or 1000#s), for reference Hiroshima got 15'000kg TNT equivalent.
Err... that 1000 is actually one thousand kilos, or a metric ton, which is just over an American one. And Hiroshim was 15 kilotons, as in 15,000 metric tons of TNT, or 15,000,000 kg worth.
Is russian damage control really that bad?
If you need to ask that question about anything Russian-related, have you been paying attention at all in this thread?
 
Some info on Putin's Inner Circle. Rather chilling

And some interesting info from a Military Historian/Inteligence Analyst with ties to Ukraine, and on his way back. He openly admits his bias's and discusses them. But some good info, if a week or so old.


Edit, Honest Answers. What do we think the chances of Putin not using a small Tactical Nuke somewhere in the Donbass. And what is the road formward from there.

And a quick overview of modern Russian and Ukrainian machinations that ked to where we w=are
 
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Why do people keep talking about this?
Because Russia has nukes therefore Russia will use nukes (despite never using nukes in Afghanistan, and despite the US also having nukes and never using them in Vietnam or Afghanistan, and despite the Chinese also having nukes and not using them in Vietnam in 1979).

Because somehow conventional wars become nuclear wars... For uhhh... Reasons...
 
Because Russia has nukes therefore Russia will use nukes (despite never using nukes in Afghanistan, and despite the US also having nukes and never using them in Vietnam or Afghanistan, and despite the Chinese also having nukes and not using them in Vietnam in 1979).

Because somehow conventional wars become nuclear wars... For uhhh... Reasons...
Because there's a non-zero chance Putin is stupid enough to think he can get away with a minor nuclear incursion if he starts losing badly enough.

I'm not saying its high, or even plausible... but it is a possibility, however slight.
 
Why do people keep talking about this?

Because Russia has nukes therefore Russia will use nukes (despite never using nukes in Afghanistan, and despite the US also having nukes and never using them in Vietnam or Afghanistan, and despite the Chinese also having nukes and not using them in Vietnam in 1979).

Because somehow conventional wars become nuclear wars... For uhhh... Reasons...
the idea is that putin is all-in on this ukraine war to the point where admitting defeat might result in his regime getting overthrown by all the rich and influential people who lost a lot of money and power to the war and sanctions.
following this assumption, the situation for putin now is "if this war is lost i will get overthrown and killed, probably my family as well" so now he will use absolutely every option he has to prevent that from happening, including nuclear weapons.
 
Because there's a non-zero chance Putin is stupid enough to think he can get away with a minor nuclear incursion if he starts losing badly enough.

I'm not saying its high, or even plausible... but it is a possibility, however slight.
the idea is that putin is all-in on this ukraine war to the point where admitting defeat might result in his regime getting overthrown by all the rich and influential people who lost a lot of money and power to the war and sanctions.
following this assumption, the situation for putin now is "if this war is lost i will get overthrown and killed, probably my family as well" so now he will use absolutely every option he has to prevent that from happening, including nuclear weapons.
So it's just unfounded fanfic.

Calm down, they have big bombs they can use without going nuclear and guaranteeing western deployment. Thinking they will nuke the Donbas, the region they claim to be liberating is just wacked out nonsense. They'd nuke Lviv before then.
 
So it's just unfounded fanfic.

Calm down, they have big bombs they can use without going nuclear and guaranteeing western deployment. Thinking they will nuke the Donbas, the region they claim to be liberating is just wacked out nonsense. They'd nuke Lviv before then.
if they do decide to use a nuke, they'll probably use it on wherever the largest concentration of ukrainian army forces is located, which currently is in the area west of donetsk i believe
 
So it's just unfounded fanfic.

Calm down, they have big bombs they can use without going nuclear and guaranteeing western deployment. Thinking they will nuke the Donbas, the region they claim to be liberating is just wacked out nonsense. They'd nuke Lviv before then.
Uhhhhh, Popasna, Mariupol, Rubizhne, Severodonetsk are being flattened to the fucking ground right now like Grozny. So much for "liberation".
 
if they do decide to use a nuke, they'll probably use it on wherever the largest concentration of ukrainian army forces is located, which currently is in the area west of donetsk i believe
I only see it likely if Ukraine launches a massive counteroffensive that actually chomps off a fair bit of Russian soil. Which isn't impossible at this point. I doubt public opinion, either in Ukraine or the West, will let the Russians just slink away after leaving a good chunk of Ukraine in ruins.
 
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Uhhhhh, Popasna, Mariupol, Rubizhne, Severodonetsk are being flattened to the fucking ground right now like Grozny. So much for "liberation".
Let's say you thought they were in need of liberation, how would you do it? How do you liberate any city occupied by hostile forces?
How has anyone ever done this?

No need to answer, I think the point is obvious. Plus it's Russia doing the liberation, they're not known for being surgical.
 
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