War Invasion of Ukraine News Megathread - Thread is only for articles and discussion of articles, general discussion thread is still in Happenings.

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President Joe Biden on Tuesday said that the United States will impose sanctions “far beyond” the ones that the United States imposed in 2014 following the annexation of the Crimean peninsula.

“This is the beginning of a Russian invasion of Ukraine,” Biden said in a White House speech, signaling a shift in his administration’s position. “We will continue to escalate sanctions if Russia escalates,” he added.

Russian elites and their family members will also soon face sanctions, Biden said, adding that “Russia will pay an even steeper price” if Moscow decides to push forward into Ukraine. Two Russian banks and Russian sovereign debt will also be sanctioned, he said.

Also in his speech, Biden said he would send more U.S. troops to the Baltic states as a defensive measure to strengthen NATO’s position in the area.

Russia shares a border with Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania.

A day earlier, Russian President Vladimir Putin ordered troops to go into the separatist Donetsk and Lugansk regions in eastern Ukraine after a lengthy speech in which he recognized the two regions’ independence.

Western powers decried the move and began to slap sanctions on certain Russian individuals, while Germany announced it would halt plans to go ahead with the Russia-to-Germany Nord Stream 2 pipeline.

At home, Biden is facing bipartisan pressure to take more extensive actions against Russia following Putin’s decision. However, a recent poll showed that a majority of Americans believe that sending troops to Ukraine is a “bad idea,” and a slim minority believes it’s a good one.

All 27 European Union countries unanimously agreed on an initial list of sanctions targeting Russian authorities, said French Foreign Minister Jean-Yves Le Drian, and EU foreign affairs head Josep Borell claimed the package “will hurt Russia … a lot.”

Earlier Tuesday, Borell asserted that Russian troops have already entered the Donbas region, which comprises Donetsk and Lugansk, which are under the control of pro-Russia groups since 2014.

And on Tuesday, the Russian Parliament approved a Putin-back plan to use military force outside of Russia’s borders as Putin further said that Russia confirmed it would recognize the expanded borders of Lugansk and Donetsk.

“We recognized the states,” the Russian president said. “That means we recognized all of their fundamental documents, including the constitution, where it is written that their [borders] are the territories at the time the two regions were part of Ukraine.”

Speaking to reporters on Tuesday, Putin said that Ukraine is “not interested in peaceful solutions” and that “every day, they are amassing troops in the Donbas.”

Meanwhile, Ukraine President Volodymyr Zelensky on Tuesday morning again downplayed the prospect of a Russian invasion and proclaimed: “There will be no war.”

“There will not be an all-out war against Ukraine, and there will not be a broad escalation from Russia. If there is, then we will put Ukraine on a war footing,” he said in a televised address.

The White House began to signal that they would shift their own position on whether it’s the start of an invasion.

“We think this is, yes, the beginning of an invasion, Russia’s latest invasion into Ukraine,” said Jon Finer, the White House deputy national security adviser in public remarks. “An invasion is an invasion and that is what is underway.”

For weeks, Western governments have been claiming Moscow would invade its neighbor after Russia gathered some 150,000 troops along the countries’ borders. They alleged that the Kremlin would attempt to come up with a pretext to attack, while some officials on Monday said Putin’s speech recognizing the two regions was just that.

But Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin told reporters Tuesday that Russia’s “latest invasion” of Ukraine is threatening stability in the region, but he asserted that Putin can “still avoid a full blown, tragic war of choice.”

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I mean does Finland actually need the NATO membership? I mean look at Russias current state and any attack in Finland would anyways escalate into WW3 due to the EU and the security pact with the UK.
I assume that in addition to the West supplying Ukraine but not fighting directly, NATO membership opens the spigot while also allowing, say, Turkey, to close the Bosporus with prejudice.
 
I mean does Finland actually need the NATO membership? I mean look at Russias current state and any attack in Finland would anyways escalate into WW3 due to the EU and the security pact with the UK.

Anything to put a finger in the orcs eyes, I'm fine with. If the Finns and Swedes want to join NATO, more power to them.
 
Apparently Ukraine's military intelligence chief believes that there is a coup that is already underway in Russia, due to Putin's failing health:

Putin coup is underway and 'impossible to stop,' says Ukraine's military intelligence chief

  • A coup to overthrow Russian President Vladimir Putin is underway, according to Ukraine's military intelligence chief.
  • The coup is "impossible to stop," Major General Kyrylo Budanov told Sky News.
  • The Russian leader is in "a very bad psychological and physical condition," Budanov said.
A coup to overthrow Russian President Vladimir Putin is underway and can't be stopped, according to Ukraine's military intelligence chief.

Speaking to Sky News, Major General Kyrylo Budanov said that a Russian military defeat would result in Putin's removal and the country's eventual collapse.

"It will eventually lead to the change of leadership of the Russian Federation," Budanov said, per Sky News. "This process has already been launched."

Budanov said "yes" when pressed by Sky News international affairs editor Dominic Waghorn on if this means that a coup attempt is currently in motion.

"They are moving in this way and it is impossible to stop it," he added.

Insider previously reported that all of the grievances that traditionally motivate a coup in Russia are in place, but Putin has spent decades making his regime "coup-proof."

A poor military performance, floundering morale, and a struggling economy make a coup against the Russian dictator more likely, Insider reported, but the existence of the FSB, the FSO, and The Rosgvardia serve to protect him.

In the exclusive Sky News interview, Budanov claimed that Putin is in "a very bad psychological and physical condition and he is very sick."

It follows a report that an unnamed Russian oligarch linked closely to the Kremlin was recorded saying that Putin is "very ill with blood cancer."

There has been a great deal of speculation on whether the Russian leader is unwell. Video footage emerged in late April, showing Putin shaking "uncontrollably," sparking suggestions that he might have Parkinson's disease.

Commentators have also pointed to his unusually puffy face as a sign of steroid use, and possible illness, as well as the use of a blanket to keep warm during Russia's Victory Day military parade last week.
 
Apparently Ukraine's military intelligence chief believes that there is a coup that is already underway in Russia, due to Putin's failing health:

Putin coup is underway and 'impossible to stop,' says Ukraine's military intelligence chief

I legitimately believe all this and like this are propaganda aimed at sowing discord and mistrust among the ruling caste in russia. Whether it's working or not, who knows. Maybe.

It is certainly much easier to run this kind of propaganda against a continent sized state with a single leader surrounded by yes men and have it become a self-fulfilling prophecy, certainly a weak point of authoritarianism.

Though... putin really does look puffy and bloated lately, maybe it's real and he just wanted his names in the history books no matter the cost, idk, I never saw a man get more puffy as he aged into his 70s, people tend to go for a more proana look whether they like it or not at that age.
 
Russian ambition is such, won't settle for anything less than the stars
swallow.jpg
 
I legitimately believe all this and like this are propaganda aimed at sowing discord and mistrust among the ruling caste in russia. Whether it's working or not, who knows. Maybe.

It is certainly much easier to run this kind of propaganda against a continent sized state with a single leader surrounded by yes men and have it become a self-fulfilling prophecy, certainly a weak point of authoritarianism.

Though... putin really does look puffy and bloated lately, maybe it's real and he just wanted his names in the history books no matter the cost, idk, I never saw a man get more puffy as he aged into his 70s, people tend to go for a more proana look whether they like it or not at that age.

Unless you're getting basically no sleep, or not hydrating vaguely properly.

Y'know, like a guy who's launched a folly of a war thats not gone well for them at all.
 
Nothing to worry about, just a boomer doing boomer things.
ftfy

I mean does Finland actually need the NATO membership? I mean look at Russias current state and any attack in Finland would anyways escalate into WW3 due to the EU and the security pact with the UK.
NATO membership offers a lot of advantages that a bilateral security pact doesn't. But that aside, while Russia's current state is laughable, there is always the fear that it will somehow recover in the future and decide to take another bite out of a neighbour, or decide to eliminate a threat on its border. The Russians have a historical grudge against Sweden for the conquest of St Petersburg, even if it was only a brief occupation, and they've never forgiven Finland for declaring independence during the revolution.

Though... putin really does look puffy and bloated lately, maybe it's real and he just wanted his names in the history books no matter the cost, idk, I never saw a man get more puffy as he aged into his 70s, people tend to go for a more proana look whether they like it or not at that age.
My experience of slavs (which is limited, I'll admit) is that they either go really, skeletally thin at 60, or they turn moon-faced. In either case, it's because of all the vodka.
 
Unless you're getting basically no sleep, or not hydrating vaguely properly.

Y'know, like a guy who's launched a folly of a war thats not gone well for them at all.
Idk, when I was a kid one of my neighbors was a really old functional alcoholic guy who shouldn't have been alive even by modern standards, barely ever slept and worked physically well into his 70s until he died and he looked better, if older, than Putin and I'm sure putin had ridiculous amount of work put into his face which might just be it, botox, fillers and cosmetic surgeries.
My experience of slavs (which is limited, I'll admit) is that they either go really, skeletally thin at 60, or they turn moon-faced. In either case, it's because of all the vodka.
Generally men tend to go skelly and women tend to puff up in my experience. Maybe putin just got tired of being a dude in his old age and started his hormones recently...
 
Though... putin really does look puffy and bloated lately, maybe it's real and he just wanted his names in the history books no matter the cost, idk, I never saw a man get more puffy as he aged into his 70s, people tend to go for a more proana look whether they like it or not at that age.
Putin is really vein and hopped on the Botox trains pretty early, his new look seems to be down to excessive use of fillers. I honestly think he and Madonna look very alike nowadays.
 
NATO membership offers a lot of advantages that a bilateral security pact doesn't. But that aside, while Russia's current state is laughable, there is always the fear that it will somehow recover in the future and decide to take another bite out of a neighbour, or decide to eliminate a threat on its border. The Russians have a historical grudge against Sweden for the conquest of St Petersburg, even if it was only a brief occupation, and they've never forgiven Finland for declaring independence during the revolution.
Yeah but comes in way too expensive if Turkey demands a big bribe to fix his inflation. Europe already has to pay a large amount for the new gas bills in the future so Roach King can piss off if you ask me.
 
Anything to put a finger in the orcs eyes, I'm fine with. If the Finns and Swedes want to join NATO, more power to them.
There is also that when Sweden and Finland join NATO, we have better security and are guaranteed support in war, instead of only being 99% guaranteed ( It would be highly unlikely that NATO would stand aside and watch Russia invade us, but it is an option). That we have already worked together with NATO before ( both Sweden and Finnish troops were in Afghanistan) make it easier for the command structure to adapt.
 
Happens. That said, the Russians have lost a considerable amount of their newer attack choppers and attack aircraft over the course of the invasion. Pretty pathetic for a nation that supposedly destroyed the opposing air defense in the first hour and a half.

They didn't. Russia is just lying. They didn't destroy the air defenses and they didn't destroy the Ukrainian military either. If they did, they would have taken Kiev.

Russia has been lying about the situation this whole time.

The Russians have barely used any of their air power in this war and have instead relied on missiles and artillery. They did launch some cruise missiles from some of their bombers in the early days of the war, but they did this inside Russia. The helicopters were probably lost to MANPADS mostly. I don't know if a stinger can shoot down a jet fighter. I have seen videos of them being launched at SU-25's.
 
They didn't. Russia is just lying. They didn't destroy the air defenses and they didn't destroy the Ukrainian military either. If they did, they would have taken Kiev.

Russia has been lying about the situation this whole time.

The Russians have barely used any of their air power in this war and have instead relied on missiles and artillery. They did launch some cruise missiles from some of their bombers in the early days of the war, but they did this inside Russia. The helicopters were probably lost to MANPADS mostly. I don't know if a stinger can shoot down a jet fighter. I have seen videos of them being launched at SU-25's.
The FIM-92 (as well as other MANPADS) can defeat fighter jets as well as other fixed wing aircraft in the right conditions. If I'm not mistaken a few frogfoots were destroyed by Stingers in Afghanistan and at least 1 A-10 was shot down by a Russian made MANPAD in Gulf I. The British Starstreak missile seems capable of engaging fighters although it is to a Stinger as a TOW missile is to a Javelin (longer set up time, needs a tripod assembly, heavier)
 
They didn't. Russia is just lying. They didn't destroy the air defenses and they didn't destroy the Ukrainian military either. If they did, they would have taken Kiev.
the airdefense was down and the army was pinned at the former contactline in the east.

They were running on fumes for a month or so, till Nato shipped enough rockets to hold any Russian offensive.

Now Nato started shipping all kind of armor, enough for a real counter offensive.
 
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Azov has surrendered has been heroically evacuated from Mariupol to Russian occupied territory

Finally, after 80+ days of non stop assaults, bombing with everything but nukes and leveling a whole city Russia can claim to have destroyed, strategically gotten rid off Azov.

Except its not what the article says at all. Only the critically wounded have been evacuated, around 263 have been taken out to a hospital and a nearby village with a prisoner swap negotiation now under way. Ukraine still estimated around 1,000 soldiers were there last week, so assuming those are all the currently wounded to help eeke out dwingling supplies, they've just handed the Ukranians a bit more time to keep Russians pinned down and fucking around hitting moles popping up around Aztoval.

On top of that, the skillset of people like Commander Redis and his subordinates, if eventually evacuated out to Ukranian held territory would be disasterous long term for Russia which is why they're doing so little to encourage negotiations and allow these particular troops to evacuate.

The skillsets of their EOD guys alone is high and the fighting around the steelworks will have only sharpened many skills in the 12 weeks of constant, daily fighting.

The Russians cannot afford to let that skillset leave. A thousand troops or so have held up the Russians for 12 damn weeks and will likely carry on for a few more yet. These fuckers have proven how to eek out logistics and fighting skills in extremis for 12 weeks, of which they've been cut of from regular supplies for probably half of that if not more.

You send guys back that can teach your men to get by fine enough to fight in the streets like rabid dogs and exist on a can of beans and some sunflower seeds? You've got the basis of one of the finest special forces units in the world.
 
the airdefense was down and the army was pinned at the former contactline in the east.

They were running on fumes for a month or so, till Nato shipped enough rockets to hold any Russian offensive.

Now Nato started shipping all kind of armor, enough for a real counter offensive.

Mate early in this thread we saw the Russians breezily claim they'd downed all air defences in Ukraine before sat images revealed fuck and all of the sort. The Ukranian airfields were unholed (with most of their missiles landing barely near the runways) the Ukranians became steadily desperate for spare parts to keep their birds in the air which rather suggested their skillsets to do both were intact, including the equipment.

Russian assessment had been the Ukranians would simply melt, and this assessment was widely shared by western intelligence agencies and even sent in the VDV unsupported (remember them?) on air assaults in the opening 24 hours before they all mysteriously vanished.

Then the MANPADS and other systems came in and have continued to deny the Russians any ability to control the air.
 
Macron reportedly wanted Zelensky to give putin a face saving "out" and cede some territory to russia.

Article - Standard.co.uk - Archive

I have also seen some claims that other western EU leaders have similar mindset as they're scared that if russia loses hard it will destabilize and there won't be a way back to "business as usual".
 
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