Opinion Perspective: Where have all the good men gone? - Young men who are ready for committed relationships are in short supply compared to women

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Illustration by Zoë Petersen, Deseret News

It’s a recurring lament we hear from women at the University of Virginia:

Where are the good guys? The guys interested in commitment, and the guys who have drive, ambition and purpose?


This is not to say that such men are entirely absent at U.Va., where we teach and attend school; they are just in short supply relative to the women with a clear focus on their future and interested in a serious relationship.


Take Cece, a rising senior: “The majority of the guys I’ve encountered at U.Va. don’t want to commit to an actual relationship. They haven’t grown up. They want to hook up with girls, but that’s it. Many of my friends and I are frustrated with the lack of maturity our guy friends exemplify. My parents met in college, which was common among their generation, and are about to celebrate their 30th anniversary. Meanwhile, I have one year left at U.Va. and don’t foresee myself dating anyone.”

The relationship frustrations of women like these are rooted in a broader problem: They do not have a ready pool of good young men to date, partly because many of our nation’s young men are floundering as they make the transition from adolescence to young adulthood. This problem is visible in our schools, colleges and universities, and today’s marketplace. Young men are increasingly less likely than women to enroll in college and less likely than women to apply themselves even if they land in college; a growing number of them are also idle or underemployed as they move through their 20s.

Our “young men problem” is rooted in a range of factors — the rise of electronic opiates, which distract young men from education and work and have come to replace traditional avenues of social relations; the absence of models of pro-social masculinity that furnish norms for male engagement in school, work and relationships as they move into adulthood; a culture that discounts commitment; and biological differences in rates of male and female maturation.


But a new report from the Institute for Family Studies, “Life Without Father,” suggests that another issue is in play. Too many boys have grown up in homes without engaged or present fathers, which has left them especially unprepared to navigate school, work and relationships successfully.

Too few good men​


Here at U.Va., one of the signs of the young man problem is that they are, simply, absent from “Grounds,” our word for campus. At our university, women outnumber men 56 to 44. Nationally, it is worse: there are almost 60 women for every 40 men. Across the country, this means that a large minority of heterosexual women cannot find any men to date on their college campuses.


And even when it comes to the men who are in college, female students are often disappointed with the quality of the guys they find, even at the University of Virginia. “Sometimes it is just very frustrating to me when I want to tell a guy I know who is living his life in some sort of unsatisfactory way,” said Isabela, a junior. “I have to hold myself back from being like, ‘What are you doing? The way that you’re living is contributing to your unhappiness.’”


“I would say the qualities of guys I generally come across are not necessarily guys I would date,” said Claire, also a junior. Claire has noticed, at least in the School of Architecture, that “the girls seem to be driven and just focused on academics … a little more serious about it (than guys).”

Tommy, a rising senior, attests that “girls are much more focused and deliberate and sincere about their work than most of the guys that I know.” He sees a kind of “prolonged adolescence” in many of the men at U.Va.

This notion of prolonged adolescence is not simply anecdotal, but a central concern of researchers who study young men. In his book “Guyland”, sociologist Michael Kimmel described it this way:

“In another era, these guys would undoubtedly be poised to take their place in the adult world, taking the first steps toward becoming the nation’s future professional, entrepreneurs and business leaders. They would be engaged to be married, thinking about settling down with a family, preparing for futures as civic leaders and Little League dads. Not today. Today, many of these young men, poised between adolescence and adulthood, are more likely to feel anxious and uncertain. In college, they party hard but are soft on studying. … After graduation, they drift aimlessly from one dead-end job to another, spend more time online playing video games and gambling than they do on dates. …”

These observations are borne out by trends in academic performance and on-time graduation. Women have attained consistently higher GPAs than their male peers, per a study examining the GPAs of students at select Florida and Texas universities which showed average GPAs of 2.67 and 2.85 for men and women respectively. Fewer of the men who attend college end up graduating than women — with 50% of women graduating “on time” compared to just 40% of men, according to a recent report in The Wall Street Journal.

This pattern extends beyond college into the 20-something years. “I would say they’re not as serious about their work as men were several decades ago,” observed Holly, a recent U.Va. graduate. This was one part of her frustration with dating prospects, along with their “lack of relational skills.” In line with her comment, a growing share of young men are out of the labor force. Between 1999 and 2018, the employment rate for young men fell by 10.4 percentage points — almost double that of young women.


Fathers and friends​


Part of this problem is attributable to the shifting character of family life in America. We know that children with absent fathers are less likely to thrive on a variety of measures of academic, professional and social success. Even for those with present fathers, like many here at U.Va., many young men have not been given clear guidance from their dads about how to navigate relationships and develop a clear identity as a man. While today’s fathers are better equipped to help their children navigate school and work, they are less adept when it comes to preparing young men for dating, relationships and marriage.

“These people are ill-fathered,” Tommy observed, “and they don’t have the right moral fiber that would lead them to use that freedom well, so they become idle and complacent, and they don’t really feel challenged, and they feel bored.”

More than anything, this growing body of directionless men indicates that the institutions which used to give shape and meaning to their lives are not as powerful as they once were. Churches, schools and even families are less likely to give clear and compelling guidance to young men as they prepare for adulthood. They’re also competing with influences — from gaming to social media — that push young men away from adulthood and toward prolonged adolescence.


“To me it seems like they’re floundering, but I know there’s more that goes on,” Catherine, a recent graduate, said. “Men are lacking the resources to deal with a lot of other things, and whether they have the strength to reject acting that way probably does come from how they were raised … but what really perpetuates it is their peers, and a society of boys doing the exact same thing.”

The observations of these students are borne out by the new Institute for Family Studies report. Our “young men problem” is especially common among those raised apart from their biological fathers. These young men are disproportionately more likely to flounder in school and less likely to graduate from college. Of those whose fathers were present, 35% graduated from college; this was true for only 14% among young men raised apart from their fathers.


Those with absent fathers were also almost twice as likely to be idle in their 20s.


A considerable 19% of young men with absent fathers are idle in their 20s, neither working or in school, compared to only 11% of those with present fathers. Such men are especially unlikely to be good prospects for dating, mating and marriage for today’s young women.

If we wish to revive the fortunes of today’s young men, we must help fathers teach their sons how to prepare better for adulthood, relationships and marriage. And we must also revive our most fundamental bond, marriage, because it connects men to their sons in a way nothing else does. These steps matter, not just for renewing the fortunes of young men, but also for the sake of the women looking for good partners to love, marry and start families with in the future.

Brad Wilcox is director of the National Marriage Project at the University of Virginia and The Future of Freedom fellow at the Institute for Family Studies. Emma Fuentes is an undergraduate studying English at the University of Virginia. Michael Krieger is a Ph.D. candidate in the Department of Sociology at the University of Virginia.

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These women also have a longlist of desired traits while only bringing BPD, depression, debt, and the inability to cook
Hope that lady likes cats and lots of them.

Who the diddly fuck rejects a fit firefighter? Arguably the one field of public service that can claim to be a net positive to society.
This bitch wants a man that doesn't exist, like Lex Luthor.

Edit: lol it's a negress. Lex Luthor is indeed her best bet at ever getting a date with a billionaire olympia-built sex god with a brain to match.
Lex Luthor is armed to the fucking teeth.
 
Sometimes you've got to settle. The chubby guy is funny and kind and he can provide. The butterface girl is sweet and loving and she'll be a good mother. Take what you can get, fuck an ugly bitch.
Been there, done that. An ugly bitch is still a bitch. Ugliness doesn't improve someone's personality like blind people get better hearing. On the contrary, a lot of ugliness is indicative of personality issues. Unfortunate genes can be overcome, but voluntarily acquired ugliness is a huge red flag. By acquired ugliness I'm thinking of the Roald Dahl quote, but also pathological overeating (beyond "I like food"), permanent or semi-permanent body mods like tattoos and piercings, aposematism, clothing selected to shock or offend, etc.
 
Why would men want to commit to women who fucked dozens of men before them?
Men don't like that. They REALLY, REALLY don't like that.
Just because YOU are "ready" doesn't mean anyone wants you. Well, somebody will want you, but not of the quality you think you are owed.
Have fun either settling for a male feminist you do not find attractive and secretly despise, or staying alone and writing cope articles.
 
Plenty of guys want to get married and want to have a family, problem is they're not good enough. The guys that are good enough would rather date a cute waitress or a hairdresser that won't make their life living hell with constant nagging.

The harsh reality of it is that being educated with a good career is not as attractive to men as it is to women. It's impressive, sure, but relationship-wise it's rarely a consideration.
 
In ten years Claire will be one of those women who moans, "I have a master's degree and work 70 hours a week to make six figures and own my house, why can't I find anyone who will date me?" Your personal measures of success are not necessarily the things other people find attractive.

Why are these chicks whinging about not finding undergrads to marry, anyway? Historically, men don't get married until 24+. There was a short period after WW2 when the median age dipped a couple years but it never fell to 22. The median age for women getting married has been greater than 22 since 1980. The MRS degree hasn't been a thing for decades.

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My grandmother got an Mrs. degree when she met my then cadet grandfather at their alma mater. Mind you gramps fought in the Korean War and they had my dad in the late 1950's. You're right about the Mrs. degree being an old-fashioned concept but here's some perspective for how old.

I can't say my wife and I followed the trend on your graph but we certainly didn't arrange to get married in college.

If college women want men to marry then they need to look outside of their normal collegiate circles (not much on offer with a nationwide 60/40 women to men ratio), drop their standards into the realm of reality, and offer men something that will benefit a marriage more than student loan debt and stunted domestic skills. Most won't do any of those.
 
Two words: Family Court.

Do you want to be party to a legal system where, regardless of evidence, one side of a relationship will be found to be in the wrong most of the fucking time? Where one party can get away with being a criminal or drug addict and cause nothing but problems in a relationship and yet still have a legal body give them full custody, financial support, and a preferential division in property disputes, even if they're in all ways a worse choice objectively, make 5-6 times what their spouse does, or have no ability to pay for, maintain, or make use of a property?

This isn't to say that occasionally Family Court doesn't get it right, we all know about some dipshit or another getting a legal cornholing that deserved it; but the fact remains that virtually everyone can take stock of people they know IRL who have been victimized by the family court system and can come to perfectly logical conclusions - it's a broken institution where one side has virtually all the power and it amounts to a zero sum game for many.
 
"Where are the good guys? The guys interested in commitment, and the guys who have drive, ambition and purpose?"

All I hear is I want a man to support me. That's what they mean by drive and ambition. Commitment means they want a guy to marry them and make it official. Someone who will work themselves into an early grave to provide them with the pampered lifestyle they believe they deserve.

It reminds me of that video I saw that young girl who said she was 27 and claimed to be making a 6 figure income while whining about how she can't find a good man with a good job. Sweetie you make a 100,000 a year or so. You are making more money than a lot of people. There are plenty of guys out there looking for a chick with money. Just go fucking pick one and STFU.
 
We can easily flip this question around. Where are the good women, what do they have to offer?

Good men are out there cultivating themselves and focusing on their careers, so that when the right person comes along, he can be the protector and provider of his family. While women may be the gatekeepers of sex, we men are the gatekeepers of relationships. Adult women realize all this, way too late in their lives.
 
"I have a master's degree and work 70 hours a week to make six figures and own my house, why can't I find anyone who will date me?" Your personal measures of success are not necessarily the things other people find attractive.
well its very attractive if she isnt total crazy and or fat. just imagine all the cool stuff you could do as a stay at home husband...
build a model train in the garden, have a girlfriend, build a trainnetwork in the basement, learn how to carve statues with a chainsaw, have another girlfriend, etc.
 
We can easily flip this question around. Where are the good women, what do they have to offer?

Good men are out there cultivating themselves and focusing on their careers, so that when the right person comes along, he can be the protector and provider of his family. While women may be the gatekeepers of sex, we men are the gatekeepers of relationships. Adult women realize all this, way too late in their lives.
Yeah. Watching the old Kevin Samuels a lot of those women were realizing that their degree and high standards were working against them. It was funny watching them trying to realize that their PhD was nit gonna make them happy
 
Yeah. Watching the old Kevin Samuels a lot of those women were realizing that their degree and high standards were working against them. It was funny watching them trying to realize that their PhD was nit gonna make them happy
Still, the easiest answer, the bitter truth, is that Feminism has made sure that there really is no place for good men in a modern world. Watch some old John Wayne movies, how the 'love interest' is interacted with, and tell me if a man did half of that today, what is the likelihood that he would be having a conversation with the police about 'domestic abuse'. You can't say you want something, because you want the 'good parts' and all but criminalize the 'parts you don't like'.

Just like everything else in this world, men will adapt to their environment. They'll give up what only sees them exploited. It's one reason 'marriage rates' have been on a steep decline since the 60s.

The flipside is that there are sane and well-adjusted women who are smart enough to not fall for the globohomo agenda and know how to put themselves out there in a way to attract decent dudes, but these are often the exception to the rule.
 
Mrs. degrees still exist. Even at an Ivy League MBA program. I see my alumni groups and most of them are housewives, work part time, or work for a charity/non-profit where nothing is actually expected of them.

I found a good woman but it required a lot of effort to find her. She’s sweet, very feminine, is close with her family, hates feminism and feminists more than I do, no tattoos whatsoever, and is pregnant with our second child. It’s pretty awesome but again, it took a lot of effort to find her because she wasn’t on any dating app or a bar or a club.
 
There are a few reasons.

First is, the man with drive and ambition will either settle for a pretty imported tradwife (replace when expires) or live the chad life.

Second is, those that settle are usually the average guys. The ones who don't have that much ambition, cool and drive and big bucks.

Third, no fault divorces.

Mrs. degrees still exist. Even at an Ivy League MBA program. I see my alumni groups and most of them are housewives, work part time, or work for a charity/non-profit where nothing is actually expected of them.

I found a good woman but it required a lot of effort to find her. She’s sweet, very feminine, is close with her family, hates feminism and feminists more than I do, no tattoos whatsoever, and is pregnant with our second child. It’s pretty awesome but again, it took a lot of effort to find her because she wasn’t on any dating app or a bar or a club.

Good find. Make sure her genes are preserved.
 
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