Baldur's Gate III Announced - ...and it's coming to Google Stadia and PC

[PaladinBoo]

You know, for someone that claims they're a woman, you sure hold grudges like a man.

Don't worry. I called a truce so this thread can stop being derailed. Plus I do like what @Mega Black has to say about Larian and find his posts on them informative.

 

[Harvey Danger]

I played through them fairly recently. They're classics but on the writing front they aren't as good as you might be expecting. They were the first games of their kind and have some good moments but also some pretty bad ones.

They have the writing style and humor level I am (was) used to in a D&D setting. It's never been amazing literature, but it fit the purpose and the setting. I haven't played D&D in years, so I don't know what its modern style is; from what little I've seen, I don't want to know.

If someone thinks it's time to update classic D&D writing, then they better have a damn good style to replace it with. Marvel/Whedon/Reddit Lite does not cut it, both because it doesn't fit and because it's overplayed in 2023.

Also, BG1&2 are barely video games, they're basically D&D simulators. That's why they had the hybrid "real time with pauses" system; you customize the console and pauses to simulate playing out a D&D scenario, however you personally prefer it. I spent 5 minutes tweaking auto-pauses and messages at the start of my game, and all the rough edges of D&D melt away so I can focus on the fun.

Turn based is different, and it's what put me off this game from the start. I'm sure they've put work into rules mapping to make that fit, but the old system was already a good translation. I don't see how slowing it down is an upgrade. D&D is not Final Fantasy.

I was interested in the story when the mindflayer intro demo came out years ago, but it's not compelling enough to make me overlook both a lesser gameplay system and all this deviant crap they're piling on top of their recycled system.

 

[hawkisnight]

Call me a prude but everything I saw from BG3 humor is in bad taste or out right cringe. Maybe it's Larian style and I didn't play enough of their games but I don't remember it being that bad in Divine Divinity or DOS1.
If they made BG2 today they would let you fuck Edwin in his 'troubled' state. I am sure there are mods for it but that should stay there. In mods.

 

[ZMOT]

these guys play as Literally Me characters.

but how can I identify with this character if it doesn't look like me? stop discriminating me reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!

 

[PaladinBoo]

If the absence of face sliders isn't due to laziness I think it's a sign of the directions all big RPGs will follow.
These freakshows don't think of RPGs the way you or I might. Whereas we might make characters to roleplay like a whoremongering degenerate wizard or a racist drunk ranger, these guys play as Literally Me characters.

A while back when the Zelda TOTK came out an interesting thing happened. There's a village in the game ran by women. Men aren't allowed in and when Link shows up they disparage him for being a male. Transwomen were posting about how dysphoric and anxious this made them feel, while transmen were posting stuff like pic related.
View attachment 5225691
They play these games as if the main character is really them isekai'd to a fantasy world. There's no need for a face slider because everyone will choose Attractive Masculine Face or Attractive Feminine Face. They still need a dick slider though because of course they do. No one will want to make a unique fictional character with a personality and play out their story; someone else's story. They're too busy playing an idealized version of themselves, so every story goes "and then I defeat the dark lord and say a clever quip and then I meet the princess and we FUCK".
And I think these type of games will increasingly become glorified adult daycare sims while the writing devolves into pothead daydreams because none of these people will buy a game marketed on build complexity or tactical variety, but you better believe they'll pre-order if they hear you get a handjob from a dragon or whatever.

I think you are close to a problem that is plaguing both entertainment and the millennials and zoomers and that is the constant need for validation. Every activity they engage in has to validate them. Watching a tv show or movie? That show or movie needs to validate them. Playing a video game? That video game needs to validate them. Reading a book? That books needs to validate them. You don't validate them and you will get nothing but hell. A good example of this would be the emperor Nero. Nero was well known to constantly fish for validation both as emperor and as an artist. You didn't give him the validation he thought he deserved and you wound up as a torch lit up in his palace lawn. I think this maybe a consequence of the self-esteem movement. You tell people they should be proud of who they are instead of their accomplishments and you wind up with a large amount of mentally ill people seeking validation just for being who they are.

 

[Male Idiot]

So can you make a cute drow girl and have an all black merc team, renamed Ooga, Booga and Wunga?

Just put neon and teal hair on her and watch twitter melt down!

 

[Estate]

It's good that this thread is back on track. One of the reasons I prefer kiwi threads is that I can both speak my mind freely and the fact that sperging is usually kept to a minimum so there's room for engaging discussion.

Turn based is different, and it's what put me off this game from the start. I'm sure they've put work into rules mapping to make that fit, but the old system was already a good translation. I don't see how slowing it down is an upgrade. D&D is not Final Fantasy.

I've seen plenty of shit flinging about this, but I don't really understand why. It doesn't matter to me personally, since I played and enjoyed games that offered both TBS and RTwP.
As for why they chose turn based, I'm guessing is because their DOS engine was designed for it and that the 5e rules work better with it. I think even Solasta, which is said to have the best 1:1 implementation of the tabletop rules, is using turn based system.
That being said, in the end it's up to you to decide if you like the game and want to play it, or even if you want to fork over the shekels for it.

Call me a prude but everything I saw from BG3 humor is in bad taste or out right cringe. Maybe it's Larian style and I didn't play enough of their games but I don't remember it being that bad in Divine Divinity or DOS1.
If they made BG2 today they would let you fuck Edwin in his 'troubled' state. I am sure there are mods for it but that should stay there. In mods.

It was.
Remember the cheese vendor?
Remember the cat mage who wanted to mate with other cat?
Remember Bellegar?
They were always fans of shitposting like this and you probably tuned it out and only remember the overall feel of the game.
Like other posters have said, the reddit crap and marvel quips that have over saturated the media have left a bad taste and people reflexively lash out.
But if you cool a bit and think about it, DOS2 and BG3(so far) have a rather impressive array of dark tones and themes. Them peppering their little shitpost here and there, while a bit cringe sometimes, are ment to act as a form of gallows humor, to lighten up what would otherwise be some rather bleak gaming sessions. And do note, while marvel quips are during the serious scenes, Larian's is set between them, as a form of rest stop.
Anyway, these are my thoughts on this topic.

 

[Slav Power]

Gee, I wonder who you are talking about? LOL! Eat dick faggots! I was right. Cope and seethe.

You know who faggot. Surprised you still come here instead of hiding in shame for defending a pack of degenerates. I'll be sure to shame you for it every chance I get from now on.

Just to be clear, you also acted like a massive faggot, constantly saying shit like "LMAO mad cope seethe rent free", posting on other user's profiles over this argument and putting users on ignore because of it. You could've stated your case without looking like a retard.

That argument has shat up a bunch of pages of this thread, with one of them being just that argument. So I've stated my opinion on it and I'll end it here to not derail the thread even further.

Unless someone writes a TTS thread to move it to Mass Debates so it can continue there, if you find entertainment in talking about bear sex.

 

[Spud]

Unless you're too stupid to unzip a rar file you'll be able to coom.

Directions unclear. Dick is now stuck in .rar file

 

[The Ugly One]

Turn based is different, and it's what put me off this game from the start. I'm sure they've put work into rules mapping to make that fit, but the old system was already a good translation. I don't see how slowing it down is an upgrade. D&D is not Final Fantasy.

D&D has been turn-based for over 20 years. Side-based initiative went away in 3rd edition.

Call me a prude but everything I saw from BG3 humor is in bad taste or out right cringe. Maybe it's Larian style and I didn't play enough of their games but I don't remember it being that bad in Divine Divinity or DOS1.

I just beat DOS2 last night, and while the plot is full of holes to the point of incoherence, and the ending is one of those, "So, you know everything you did in the game? Forget that. Choose one of four endings from this menu," they don't go over the top with reddit humor. Except for that dumb squirrel on the skeleton cat. The Great Acorn! LOL so random! Monkey tacos!

 

[gay]

and putting users on ignore because of it.

faggot hasn't put anyone on ignore, that's why he's still replying to the people he claimed he put on ignore.

Maybe it's Larian style and I didn't play enough of their games but I don't remember it being that bad in Divine Divinity or DOS1.

the writing direction in DOS and DOSII were very camp at times and the bear sex scene proves that it'll still be present in BG3.

humorous writing is hard to pull off so i generally don't trust writers whose only foray into writing is exclusive to the gaming industry because they're usually beholden to tropes such as cancerously interjecting dialogue with MCU quipshit or have to go with shock humor (i.e. bear sex) because they're cheap and easy laughs for the lowest common denominator.

the core market audience is comprised largely out of tards who have all their dopamine receptors fried off by frivolous pop culture and infantile TikTok shorts so any incentive these developers would have to develop a game with high brow concepts and nuances for smelly autists goes out the window (shit it is evident in this thread that people have rot in their brain due to being terminally online because concepts either have to be black or white) because it will go over everyone's heads, the market that would be receptive to such a game catering to their interests and sensibilities are simply too niche to warrant developing an AAA title for.

 

[The Ugly One]

I think everyone, especially Larian, is overestimating how much the core market loves constant ass sex and tranny dick everywhere. Deep in the heart of the RPG industry, meaning the people who write and produce the games, yes, everything's all rainbow flags and tranny bathrooms. One step away, at RPG conventions, sure, the Alphabet People crap is prominent, but it's mostly the fat weirdos you expect. Get another step away, to the game stores, and you've got the "LGBTQ SAFE SPACE" sticker on the door, a bit of rainbow shit here and there, but the average table is full of people who just want to stab orcs in the face and steal their gold. There are always a couple troons around, but you'll notice most people give them a wide berth. Most people just aren't into gay-focused entertainment.

 

[Mega Black]

So can you make a cute drow girl and have an all black merc team, renamed Ooga, Booga and Wunga?

Mercs are not customizable in this so no. Apparently, the only way to play with a custom party is to open multiple instances of the game and join via multiplayer. Yes, really.

How Larian missed the point of hirelings so hard I haven't the faintest clue.

because it will go over everyone's heads, the market that would be receptive to such a game catering to their interests and sensibilities are simply too niche to warrant developing an AAA title for.

This is definitely true, or at least marketing thinks it is. You can't make a serious RPG! People can't take elves and dwarves seriously!

 

[Estate]

I think everyone, especially Larian, is overestimating how much the core market loves constant ass sex and tranny dick everywhere. Deep in the heart of the RPG industry, meaning the people who write and produce the games, yes, everything's all rainbow flags and tranny bathrooms. One step away, at RPG conventions, sure, the Alphabet People crap is prominent, but it's mostly the fat weirdos you expect. Get another step away, to the game stores, and you've got the "LGBTQ SAFE SPACE" sticker on the door, a bit of rainbow shit here and there, but the average table is full of people who just want to stab orcs in the face and steal their gold. There are always a couple troons around, but you'll notice most people give them a wide berth. Most people just aren't into gay-focused entertainment.

Considering they have all kinds of metrics and that I've seen news about how the most popular MC was a basic white dude or that 95% of kickstart was male, they know, deep down who their core audience is.
Their studio is in Gent, Belgium and I've spent some considerable time there so I know the city, the people and the vibe and it makes sense that they're trying to push some faggot liberal philosophies. They still are in the honey moon phase and haven't reached San Francisco level yet, so the delusion is still strong. Their worldview is still shaped by their surroundings to some degree.
The saving grace seems to be that the old core crew are old school and still have a semblance of refrain and are trying to tard wrangle all the new generation faggots. I shudder to think what kind of abomination of a game we would've had otherwise.

 

[Harvey Danger]

D&D has been turn-based for over 20 years. Side-based initiative went away in 3rd edition.

As for why they chose turn based, I'm guessing is because their DOS engine was designed for it and that the 5e rules work better with it.

Like I said, I haven't played in years. The last times I did the group stuck to the 3e rules we liked (and had books for).

I fully admit this is my personal bias, and I don't know enough about 5e to say if turn-based matches its ruleset better. I believe you if you say it does, and if Larian already had an engine it makes a lot of sense to reuse it. But if you're going to call your game "Baldur's Gate 3" that means you're aiming for fans of the franchise, not necessarily fans of 5e, and that means you need to convince us the change is better.

All the big D&D video games (other than action arcade stuff with D&D flavor) since BG1 have been RTwP. I mean that literally: look at this list of D&D video games. Since 1998, it's all been Infinity Engine games or its successors, with a few mobile games thrown in. BG3 is trying something different, which is fine, but turn-based isn't exactly new to the world of video games, so it loses the unique feeling that old players associate with the setting and franchise.

I'm willing to be convinced to change, but I'm not willing to dig through reddit brainrot to find a gem. Either nostalgia bomb me or wow me with innovation. So far, Larian has done neither with BG3 previews.

 

[ZMOT]

RTwP is just turn based with automatic execution.

now give me trashcans.

 

[Cheeseknife]

the writing direction in DOS and DOSII were very camp at times

All of it was either derivative or self-referential. I'm really tired of writers constantly telling you about the meta of story-writing rather than telling a fucking story.

Referential humor is only funny when it is used sparingly.

I specifically remember a character saying, "...keeping up with the Joneses" in reference to their finances. That's a real-world idiom that developed from a comic-strip in the 1920s. Why the hell are these medeival fantasy characters making idiomatic references drawn from early 20th-century American comic strips?

Another thing was you randomly find a katana which you can use as a weapon. Now, I know Baldur's Gate I and II also had katanas, but even then there were detractors to that because it clashed with the setting. That isn't the issue with it in DOS, however. When you pick up the katana, the description literally tells you it's not a weapon from that world. No, shit, Larian.

But what this really goes to show me is a lack of dedication in their world-building. They're not making any attempt to create a place that feels organic and lived in or people driven toward goals and desires. Instead, they're just injecting a bunch of meta humor thinking, "Nerds will just eat this up."

 

[Michael Wade]

Either this game will be a success in spite of itself or it will massively crash and burn. I see no other options besides mediocrity.

 

[Kane Lives]

But what this really goes to show me is a lack of dedication in their world-building. They're not making any attempt to create a place that feels organic and lived in or people driven toward goals and desires. Instead, they're just injecting a bunch of meta humor thinking, "Nerds will just eat this up."

If there's one thing Larian is notoriously shit at, it was world-building.

The Divinity series attests to that. (Just try to square DOS1 and DOS2, and with the mainline Divinity series.)

 

[Cheeseknife]

If there's one thing Larian is notoriously shit at, it was world-building.

The Divinity series attests to that. (Just try to square DOS1 and DOS2, and with the mainline Divinity series.)

Oh, and the fucking dice-roll animation for pivitol dialogue choices is obnoxious as hell. Does BG3 even let you turn that off?