General transgender discussion thread - Take the tranny related debates here.

It's not that they're mentally ill and deranged, but that they need life saving gender affirming care!
Saving their lives from what though? There's nothing wrong with them, so they say. They'll just keel over dead without getting radical cock chop surgery and shooting up horse piss for life? Then there's something seriously wrong with them.
 
I hate transgendered people and related subgroups of gendespecials. I used to accept them long ago, but over time I grew to despise them. Especially how in recent years they've basically become what I see as a privileged astroturfed minority. They're modern America's eunuch class.

It doesn't help that my coworkers blindly accept them. One coworker in particular unironically believes all the propaganda about transgenderism. He's a massive liberal asshole in other ways too, but those are other stories for another time. Because I love my job and don't want to get fired for being anti-trans, I just listen to him ramble about how amazing trannies are and how they're so totally the opposite sex like they insist they are. I almost wonder if he's going to troon out. He has been married three times and sees a therapist, so I wouldn't be surprised.

But yeah, I can't stand trannies and their enablers.
 
in an effort to reduce stigma.
in which this diagnostic category pathologized identity
This proves that theyre delusional. GD is a symptom of transsexualism but can also be caused by other shit, which is why they changed it to GD - to include agp fetishists (following newer less restrictive diagnostic criteria). Go off oomfie.
Troonyism by any other name is still gender dysphoria, this social contagion we're all being subjected to.
except it literally isnt, its an entirely different condition. go compare the diagnostic criteria for transsexualism and gd
So why the fuck would you need surgery and to be medicated for life if nothing's wrong?
because the people the retards pandered to dont really need those things, they just want to jerk off <3
 
So I have some thoughts on how a couple of different phenomena developed. I'm going to sperg a lot so I'll spoiler each section to avoid shitting up the thread.
I hate using this term but it feels socially gaslighting dealing with “no such thing as biological sex”.
"There's no such thing as biological sex" feels like it came out of nowhere, but I have a theory on how it developed. Trying to unpick it might help understanding it a bit better.
Scientific research into sex
So if you find old scientific papers, they'll sometimes specifically use phrases like "chromosomal sex". I'm going with this example of a case study from the January 1994 edition of the Journal of the American Veterinary Medical Association, because Tranch, but you'll find examples going back to the 1950s:
A 5-month-old llama was examined for evaluation of sexually ambiguous external genitalia. To determine the phenotypic, chromosomal, and gonadal sex of the llama, transrectal palpation and ultrasonography, contrast cystography, karyotype evaluation, laparoscopy, and necropsy were performed. A karyotype of 74,XX and finding of components of the müllerian duct system were suggestive of a female phenotype and chromosomal sex. On histologic evaluation, however, components of the wolffian duct system also were found, and the gonads were composed entirely of testicular tissue. The diagnosis was XX sex reversal, with a XX male phenotype.
So basically there was a fucked up hermaphrodite llama and they unpicked that it had XX chromosomes but testicular tissue and some other male genital elements, so the diagnosis was that it was an XX male and the male determining region from a Y chromosome had ended up on the X chromosome.
Likewise if we look at this paper from the September 1995 edition of Minerva Endocrinology:
The authors of the present paper have reviewed the literature data yielded by biological and hormonal studies on homosexuality and transsexualism. These data seem to support the hypothesis that androgens may be deficient in the CNS of male homosexuals. Morphological or functional (neurotransmitter) anomalies in androgen actions at the CNS level could also favor radical dissociation between psychological sex and gonadal, hormonal and phenotypic sex in transsexualism. In conclusion, the present review seems to indicate that hormonal factors (gonadal and adrenal hormones, hormone receptors, transduction mechanism of the hormonal signal, neurosteroids, neurotransmitters etc.) play a determining role in the formation of gender identity.
They're trying to split out "psychological sex" (aka gender identity) from the other forms of sex determinators (gonadal sex, hormonal sex, phenotypic sex) to work out why trans woman are trans (and also separately why gay men are gay). These specific twists of terminology are relevant when looking at complex edge cases.
Legal treatment of intersex people
While this didn't necessarily have much impact at the time, one case that would later be dredged up by sociologists was John A.C Forbes-Sempill v The Hon. Ewan Forbes-Sempill.
In 1965, the Baronet Forbes of Craigievar died without heirs. So the baronetcy, under primogeniture, would go to his nearest living male relative - his brother Dr. Ewan Forbes-Sempill.
93129dc473a6a6906f86cb05bd6fcd05.jpg
Thing is though, this brother was born as his sister.
ewan.png
Effectively, he was born a woman, but after visiting Europe for consultations with medical experts (and being given what was probably testosterone treatment) he began presenting as a man. By the time he was 40, he had changed his birth certificate, based on the expert witness of three doctors that at birth (and biopsies indicating internal testicular tissue), an error had been made, and he was indeed a man. He even took out an advert in the local paper to say he was Ewan now; people didn't actually mind it seems.
Except for his cousin, who was now second in line for the baronetcy, so took him to court. Biopsies of Ewan were taken that proved he had testicular tissue inside of him. The court's position was that you're either one sex or the other and if it's not obvious, it was down to the court to work out. And so -
Lord Hunter. then moved beyond all of the other authorities and held that he would follow the advice of Professor C N Armstrong of Newcastle Royal Infirmary and consider four criteria of sex; chromosomal, gonadal, phenotypical (the appearance of the genitals) and psychological. He admitted that the evidence of the first two was problematic, but with regard to the third: phenotypical he prioritised the evidence of Ewan's wife. He held that although the evidence was clear that Ewan's genitals were predominately female in appearance, the fact that his wife asserted that he was able to penetrate her satisfactorily and that she was able to reach orgasm was of far greater importance (ibid page 27, para:B). Supporting this was the fact that no evidence had been raised that Ewan could function as a female in intercourse. Finally as regards psychological sex, he held that there was overwhelming evidence that in Ewan's case he was male and along with the other features it was an "adminicle of evidence of some importance." (ibid page 28, para E). Thus Lord Hunter was able to find that Ewan was a "true hermaphrodite in whom the male characteristics predominate." Consequently, after referral to the then Home Secretary, Roy Jenkins, Ewan's succession to the baronetcy was confirmed.
Important to note here that under Scottish law it had already been established a couple years prior that a transgender person could not amend their birth certificate or legal sex, because their birth certificate was a legal document and their sex had been correctly identified. However, this created the legal concepts of criteria of sex.

Interesting this case actually strengthened the precedent - a couple of years later in Corbett v Corbett a man wanted to annul his marriage to his wife instead of have a divorce because she was trans, so the marriage didn't count because men can't get married, and the court upheld that on the basis of chromosomal, gonadal and genital sex, the wife was a man and so they were never married (they even ragged on the amhole - "When such a cavity has been constructed in a male, the difference between sexual intercourse using it, and anal or intra-crural intercourse is, in my judgment, to be measured in centimetres.") There are some suggestions that Dr Ewan might have collaborated with some of his friends in the medical profession to create some subterfuge and was actually just a plain ole trans man, but if that was the case, then his ascension to the Baronetcy would have been overturned if he'd been found out.

The legal implications of trying to categorise intersex people were previously a lot more wide ranging (e.g. implications on pensions, or who they can marry, or things like military service). From the June 2003 copy of The Endocrinologist
The birth of an intersex child presents difficult medical and ethical issues to the attending physicians. Recently, these issues have become the subject of a debate among doctors, psychiatrists, ethicists, sociologists, historians, and intersex activists. Largely absent in these debates, however, is any discussion of the legal ramifications of the medical and psychological treatment of intersex infants. This paper explores the legal implications of early surgical intervention in the treatment of intersexuality. It provides a summary of the history of the management of intersexuality, describes the current approaches and premises underlying them that are being advocated for the treatment of intersex infants, and explores the legal implications of the dominant treatment model for the intersex child and for the medical treatment team. This paper concludes with a note of caution: the current dominant treatment protocol may impair the legal rights of the intersex child as well as lead to legal liability for the treating physicians.
This is where terminology like "assigned female at birth" come from. If we can see there's an idea that an infant may have been classified incorrectly (and indeed, subjected to genital-altering surgery to make them "conform" to their sex) it becomes necessary to develop language to discuss how they were assigned one sex while biologically being ambiguous and closer to the other sex, although a fair few intersex activists would argue that they are neither male or female, and should not be classified as either. Sometime they'll use terminology like "CAMAB" (coercively assigned male at birth).
Effectively for the above sections - trying to classify intersex people or talk about edge cases around biological sex is tricky. But how is that relevant to trans people?
"Sex is bimodal"
You might have seen this graph before.
bimod.png
Basically, a binary means females are x and male are y and there is no overlap. This graph is saying that for a given "morphological trait", males and females overlap quite a bit - there's two distinct peaks (the average male and average female are markedly different) but a lot of inbetweens. This is what is meant by bimodal - two averages.
It probably won't shock you to learn that this is not a very scientific graph, but it derives in part from an article from the March 2000 edition of the American Journal of Human Biology.
bimodelsexspectrumblackwell_thumb.png
Now the X axis is a sort of merged variety of traits and it's pretty hard to unpick exactly what it means, but this is where the "intersex are as common as gingers!" stuff comes from (this paper actually included a lot of things that are not considered intersex conditions, like Turner syndrome where a girl is born with only one X chromosome). It's not a very good graph, and is mostly supposed to be a heuristic device to illustrate what they're talking about, rather than an actual chart of plottable data.
That's not to say some things aren't bimodal;
bimodal.png
ETkUzN0WAAEsRC2.jpg
but these are traits that are influenced by sex, they are not sex. Some women will have unusually high testosterone for a woman, but that does not mean they are not a woman. Some men will be very short, but outside of manlet memes that does not mean they are less of a man.
However, if you willfully misinterpret some of the language used about studying sex, or about intersex people, you might draw the conclusion that "hormonal sex" is bimodally distributed, and therefore that "form of sex" can be bimodal.
Transgender healthcare
It doesn't help it used to be called "transsexual".

There's obviously a range of medical interventions available for trans people. Without going into them, let's have a quick look at these discussions of hormone targets.
A practical target for hormone therapy for transgender men (FTM) is to increase testosterone levels to the normal male physiological range (300–1000 ng/dl) by administering testosterone.

A practical target for hormone therapy for transgender women (MTF) is to decrease testosterone levels to the normal female range (30–100 ng/dl) without supra- physiological levels of estradiol (<200 pg/ml) by administering an antiandrogen and estrogen.
If you're working under the idea that your hormone levels are your "hormonal sex" and your oestrogen levels are now in the normal female range, you might start thinking your "hormonal sex" has now changed. If you're seeing hormonal sex as one of many forms of sex (rather than sex being a holistic state with associated states) you might think that one of your sexes is now female.

From there we see other assumptions about these "sexes" - gonadal sex? Well, you've cut your balls off, so you don't produce sperm, therefore your "gonadal sex" is no longer male. Your "phenotypic sex" (this is often misunderstood to mean literal phenotype, as in how you look)? Well you have some breast tissue growth so that's a female secondary sex characteristic, right? Anatomical sex - well, you've got a "vagina" now, so that's a female sex! Socially you present as female, so your "social sex" is female. You changed your birth certificate to say female so now your "legal sex" is female!

Really, there's so many different sexes an individual has, and the only one of yours that is still male is your chromosomes. But given all the other forms of sex are female, isn't it silly how TERFs still try to call you male? Not to mention you can't tell your chromosomes from looking - you might be XX female chromosomes with an unfortunate intersex condition, and then all your forms of sex will be female!

Obviously, someone's sex hasn't changed from that. Pumping someone full of exogenous oestrogen is not the same as someone who produces it endogenously, it's a continual product of medical intervention. Surgically altering a body does not change how that body would have developed (or what gametes it would have produced) if that surgery had not happened. But there are differences in trans people's medical needs compared to if they weren't trans. A trans woman with breast tissue needs a mammogram. Increased levels of estrogen will alter hepatic enzyme activity, which will have knock on impacts to things like medication dosages (and also alcohol elimination - some of our sideshows are not joking when they say they get drunk easier, they just misattribute it to being a ditzy bimbo). There will be some scenarios where a trans woman may need to be considered more in line with female treatment approaches than male (although truth be told, a scenario where "male taking female hormones" was a treatment approach would be a better fit, but I doubt there's enough research on that, especially since a lot of sex-specific medication research is still in itself a growing field).

Nevertheless this line of thinking would boil down to "sex(es) can be changed", not "sex doesn't exist". So...
Science is magic! But also evil

There's a bunch of traits that can't be changed. For example, musculoskeletal structure. While they can be handwaved with the previous "bimodal distribution" (i.e. "lots of women have size 12 feet, so I'm fine!"), we do frequently see people claiming their shoe size has shrunk, their height has dropped, their pelvis has widened etc. etc. as a result of HRT (or for the more fringe cases, just magical thinking. We laughed at Chris claiming his un-clit was opening into a vagina, but as the crazy train has rumbled on, we see people on twitter insisting that accepting they're a woman has caused breasts to grow despite them being pre-HRT). While they might have lost some height as a result of osteoperosis, there's a sincere belief that HRT is causing these changes.

Part of it might be self gaslighting. Wanting it to be true, and then fucking around with camera angles and measuring wrong to convince yourself it's true (like a guy trying to measure his dick and "pressing to the bone" and then rounding up) and then getting angry that people don't believe you because so many trans people have reported this. I don't think this used to be a common thing, but it's become a social contagion across twitter, kinda like "trans women get periods". There's an insistence that there's no scientific research on this because of institutional transphobia and y'all should just believe trans folx.

Likewise, you'll see people sincerely claiming that the science to turn sperm into eggs or to implant a uterus into a trans woman and have it be fully functional is already possible and easy, and it's just transphobia that's stopping trans women being mothers. This is a long post so I'll just post a diagram to highlight what a bad idea it would be to shove a uterus inside a man
main-qimg-a18e0faf6f4be3454f633664d71d6183.png
The dark voids are filled with intestines. There's not any space for a uterus in there. The place where the uterus would have gone is the prostatic utricle, which you'll spot as an itty-bitty squiggle in the prostate;
utricle.png
That's without getting into the complex support structure around the uterus
Gray1161.png
(there's no homologue in males for the broad ligament) or the complex cycle of hormones required to bring a baby to term, or just any of the million other reasons that jump out to you about why "putting a uterus inside a male and trying to get it to work" is likely to fail
but it's sincerely held that this is already possible or only a couple of years away. Obviously not every trans person thinks like this, but it's not that uncommon with the terminally online crowd.
Feminine penis
That's still basically arguing that science will make it easier to fully change sex. But we come round to another point here.
If it was fully possible to make a male into a biological female, would they still be a male in any meaningful way?
Well, yes. Because they grew up as a male. They're still "them", just in a biologically constructed meat suit.
What if you could rebuild their brain with false memories of being raised as a girl so they had female socialisation?
Well then you've basically just killed them and used their corpse to build a woman.

But! This is not something everyone would agree on, just like the old teleporter question about destroying a person in point A and recreating them at point B, or if uploading someone to a supercomputer would be uploading them or just creating a perfect digital imitation of them, and frankly that gets tedious to discuss.

The wider point is more about what is "female". If you are accepting the central conceits that
- There is no one "sex" but actually there are a variety of different things that are "sex" (hormonal, psychological, phenotypic etc etc)
- It is possible to change some of these sexes through medical interventions
- Sex is bimodal, not binary
- Therefore in some or many aspects, a trans woman is female
then that leads onto the next point.

If a trans woman is a woman, and she is female (and just incorrectly assigned at birth!), then if she chooses not to have bottom surgery, does she not have a female penis? The penis belongs to a female (in many senses) woman. And traits can be bimodal. So it follows, basically every trait can have some overlap. So a penis is not inherently a male organ. Some women have penises. Some women produce sperm. A sperm is not a male gamete, and an egg is not a female gamete, because a female woman can produce sperm. (That's without getting into "mouthfeel")

Likewise if a woman is 6'3" with big muscles and a big beard and has just fathered a child... does that make her less of a woman? Your assumption that this is "male" is based on an idea that sex is binary and immutable, which SCIENCE has just shown isn't true! Sex is, therefore, just a construct.
So basically, a threaded misunderstanding of niche biological research around sexual development and intersex conditions combined with anecdotal posturing and wishful thinking, tied up in a bow with diluted post-modernist theory is how we ended up at this "sex is a social construct" or "sex isn't real" state.

But it still feels like this came out of nowhere. It does seem to be a crescendo from a lot of different sources, but it's only become widespread recently. And I think it's because of the internet. There was a time where to read all this stuff you'd have to go to university research libraries or buy a subscription, and only a few people who were studying a specific area would even know where to begin on researching these topics. But with the internet, anyone can type some keywords in on Google Scholar and, well, browse the free abstracts without reading the whole paper - and without academic supervision to point out where fallacies have crept in. It also allows for people with a layman's understanding of biology and a layman's understanding of regurgitated half-formed broad stroke ideas about philosophy and sociology to cross-pollinate. And from there, this disparate threads were able to be tied up and then spread across twitter with "SCIENTISTS SAY THIS, YOU JUST HAVE A HIGH SCHOOL UNDERSTANDING OF BIOLOGY".

You can actually kinda track how it developed a bit - if you were involved in social justice a decade or so ago, you'll have seen the genderbread person by Sam Killermann. It went through a few revisions over the years:
genderbread-man.jpeg
1600-Genderbread-Person.jpg
Genderbread-2.1.jpg
2015.jpg
v4.png
and then, seemingly waking up to it, released an article saying "Of Course Biological Sex is Real!" in 2020 and completely dropped off the face of the Earth in 2021 after over a decade of relentlessly being a man who ate, breathed and slept social justice (seriously, try and find anything about him anywhere after 2021).

Anyway, long story short, just saying something is a social construct isn't really a compelling argument to replace it with a completely different social construct, because regardless of how you're labelling things, biological reality is still the same. The core argument behind "biological sex isn't real" is about redefining what the word sex is referring to, it's not actually redefining the thing we're referring to when we talk about sex.
 
Honestly I’m not entirely sure what to make of the this phenomenon anymore, I was somewhat aware of trans people growing up but I initially had little to no opinion on the subject other than feigning mild curiosity at them.

Honestly regardless of what these people can be like I do think the farms has a weird obsession with them to perhaps an unhealthy degree, I get that yeah tons of them are insane and horrible and have done a lot of damage to society and cultures. Some of them are abominable people admittedly but like keep in mind that the farms does specifically focus on the very worst ones like keffals and Liz Dong and any pedo crime on tranny freak shows simply for comedic affect.

Keep in mind the very worst ones like keffals herself is a particularly egregious case and does not really represent the entire trans community as a whole, Just like how Chris chan isn’t an accurate representation of autistic people. I do think people here really allow themselves to be sucked into a cognitive dissonance between the really shitty terminally on internet types of transgenders and deviants and the actual quiet ones IRL who don’t have much power and really want to be quiet and left alone.

Kiwi farms is a place that obviously skewers its views towards particular channy and shitposty vibes and more conservative and unconventional politics. To claim that we don’t have some pretty disturbing views in of ourselves and have biased information is simply ridiculous and farcical. Obviously since we hate trans people and the culture and damage they’ve done to society we are going to filter any of our biases we have against them. It’s simply human nature.

Honestly regardless of what you may think about them some I’ve met genuinely can be cool and chill people, not every Trans person is fucking insane to level keffals is just in the same way not every autistic person is a Chris chan obviously. Extremes in every single field and social pariahs exist within their spheres and every individual case is complex. I do think kiwi farms does need to get its head out of its ass claiming that it’s the absolute best place to give the final consensus on the trans question when we do a lot of questionable bullshit ourselves and have some admittedly horrible views that really seem counter productive to wanting people to listen to us.

Honestly I almost feel like siding with Trans people sometimes considering how actively the farms demonise them to a silly degree when it’s not needed thinking they are the worst people on the planet when there are actual fucking murderous dictators and real predators and fucking child murderer out there who are far more reprehensible than most trans men and women. Like how cruel we can be telling people to go 41% themselves and making the same cheap shitty jokes again and again. Transpeople can be horrible but like so can kiwi farmers.

Ultimately If we want to make any meaningful statement about trans peoples problems and the damage they do to themselves sand the rest of society. We really should cut away the more venomous shitposty side of criticism and try to stave off being edgy for the sake of it and opt for a more nuanced and mature but still critical look and transgenderism and it’s failings but also positive attributes. Kiwi farms being schizo and cruel as it is to other trans people whilst trans people still continue to be schizo and cruel and get increasingly more irate due to insults and bigotry is just like fighting fire with fire. It will only lead to a more catastrophic hellish fire that nobody will come out better for.

If we simply leaned back on the really venomous and trolly side of our user base and had more focused and level headed look at the dangers of what transgenderism does to men and women without getting overly vitriolic no matter how much we may hate them, we would absolutely make strides as being taken seriously and perhaps even helping younger Ftm’s and MtF’s who are who are misguided in their identity stave off from making life threatening decisions to their bodies and lifestyles in the future. We can honestly make a good cause to help trans people better themselves, but only if we cut back on the real horrible vitriolic shit which seems very unlikely to happen considering how hostile we’ve become, it’s a real shame.
 
Honestly I’m not entirely sure what to make of the this phenomenon anymore, I was somewhat aware of trans people
If you want to read more of this British pussy's thoughts, you can go to here: Thread 'Are we becoming too arrogant?' https://kiwifarms.pl/threads/are-we-becoming-too-arrogant.112053/
Kiwi farms is a place that obviously skewers its views towards particular channy and shitposty vibes and more conservative and unconventional politics. To claim that we don’t have some pretty disturbing views in of ourselves and have biased information is simply ridiculous and farcical.
Who is "we"? I'm a user of a forum. That doesn't make me into a "we" with anyone. This is liar-speak for "I'm one of you, so listen to me while I say how bad 'we' are and how 'we' 'should do better'". If you check out that thread you'll see a ton of concern trolling from this guy. He was even doxed recently.
 
If you want to read more of this British pussy's thoughts, you can go to here: Thread 'Are we becoming too arrogant?' https://kiwifarms.pl/threads/are-we-becoming-too-arrogant.112053/

Who is "we"? I'm a user of a forum. That doesn't make me into a "we" with anyone. This is liar-speak for "I'm one of you, so listen to me while I say how bad 'we' are and how 'we' 'should do better'". If you check out that thread you'll see a ton of concern trolling from this guy. He was even doxed recently.
So? am I a pussy for not letting kf colour my perception of trans people? my general post isn’t in défense of them, it’s more about the way we approach talking about them and how we often have people who are so blinded by their hatred for one group that they don’t see that obviously not all of these are like this. We are not right about every fucking trans person that exists and this is a website that chooses the worst cases skewered towards humour and e-drama within their associated subgroups, we go after the funniest targets and forgot the vast majority of trans people are not all terminally online deviants like keffails and Liz-No Dong or many of the other Stinkditches.

I have even spoken to other trans people aware of them and they agree they are shitheads and make the community worse. Every trans person is different and the vast majority of them are not in the insane/ pedo/predator furry anime communities and just want to live life in peace. There are trans people that are not evil or predatory as difficult as it is for people to believe. The fucking hyperbole some people go here to convince themselves their all Trans Hitler is ridiculous in of itself.
 
@thegooddoctor has been thirsting after known tranny @PeggieBigCock in DMs today. Don't let him him convince you otherwise.
No I haven’t this is a thread for discussions on transgenderism in general don’t bring our retarded slap fights into it or the jannies will be involved.
 
I'm simply providing context for your statements (which I totally read) so that everyone else will understand the perspective you're arguing from.
But your making things up based on assumptions, never once have I shown to be romantically interested in Peggie or other trans people. And if so who cares? Dating a trans person is not a bad thing if said person is nice, friendly approachable, someone I found love and solidarity in. It would vary from person to person.
 
Felix Lang is afraid of saying wrongthink. He saw how that girl got beat up by a UK dyke cop's goon squad for saying lesbian and he knows he'll fold even faster than that little girl. Then at sentencing he'll repeatedly ask the judge if "we in law enforcement" are "becoming to arrogant." Felix Lang has expanded his worldview to say that trannies are normal and fine, because to not do that would require standing up for something. Having standards too hard, Felix?
 
Felix Lang has expanded his worldview to say that trannies are normal and fine, because to not do that would require standing up for something
I get where you're coming from but - On the KF? Eh, X to doubt on that one, his position is pretty clearly a contrarian one in the current zeitgeist of the site.
 
Felix Lang is afraid of saying wrongthink. He saw how that girl got beat up by a UK dyke cop's goon squad for saying lesbian and he knows he'll fold even faster than that little girl. Then at sentencing he'll repeatedly ask the judge if "we in law enforcement" are "becoming to arrogant." Felix Lang has expanded his worldview to say that trannies are normal and fine, because to not do that would require standing up for something. Having standards too hard, Felix?
Honestly you need to get out more, I have been in online circles with trans people who ar every smart and are capable of making good things like anyone else, I think people really do let their confirmation bias colour your perceptions of what people make. If there was a really chill and popular user here but one day it was revealed they were trans, would you automatically disregard everything good they’ve done based on your predisposition to hating transpeople? Do you hate them that much your going to be vindictive based on pre existing perceptions.

Honestly if that’s the case it seems like you really need to look past certain features and realise that this is a more personal hatred as well here rather than being critical of objectively shitty parts like grooming, pedophila invading womens spaces, getting kids to take Hrt early etc. Those are all bad, but if there is a trans person who seems chill and hasn’t got a criminal history I have no reason to really judge them if I think there being relaxed and cool people.
 
I get where you're coming from but - On the KF? Eh, X to doubt on that one, his position is pretty clearly a contrarian one in the current zeitgeist of the site.
It's only contrarian because it's here. Outside the farms his view is totally mainstream. Anything that looks like strength or a principled stance is just the programming, and knowing that his opposition is only on this website and others like it. His views are totally supported everywhere else.

He's riding a tidal wave of media support which agrees with him and bringing it here, to people who don't. It only looks like strength.
 
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It's only contrarian because it's here. Outside the farms his view is totally mainstream. Anything that looks like strength or a principled stance is just the programming, and knowing that his opposition is only on this website and others like it. His views are totally supported everywhere else.

He's riding a tidal wave of media support which agrees with him and bringing it here, to people who don't. It only looks like strength.
Yeah and that’s a bad thing? I think you seem to forget that we have trans people here on this website that continue to use it and some users here on this very thread that have admitted 99% of their user base is insane yet they’d till wanna push forward with it. @Feline Darkmage and @KatsuKitty were also based and popular users and they were trans and on the farms despite knowing the risks it took? What does that tell you? Separate the art from the artist and you can see they can be just like us when they try.
 
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