US US Politics General - Discussion of President Biden and other politicians

 

[Amerikaner Teddybär]

You a dumb faggot that's butthurt that everybody is calling you stupid.

Now you know how I felt a few days ago.

How the fuck did Mel Brooks miss this joke?

Good on you!

He should've used that for Spaceballs.

They literally disobeyed and nothing happened. De facto he doesnt. Hawaiian judge will make it de jure.

Trump cant fire most federal employees. It took immense political capital to fire the fbi judge who did illegal wiretaps on him.

Trump is a independent candidate taking advantage that the Gop was too stupid or arrogant to rig their primaries to the degree the Dems do. Both parties want him gone.

Yep, as a wise man once said "No man rules alone."

 

[dustbuster]

They literally disobeyed and nothing happened.

He didn't learn about it until after he was out of office.
He fired quite a few generals after finding out they were undermining him while still in office (and a few who were loyal, because thanks to Ryan optics suddenly mattered.. uugh)

 

[WelperHelper99]

The President can't fire the National Guard or have anyone court-martialed.



The President can't generally fire anyone in the Federal government except the uppermost ranks. You have no idea how the US government works.

I mean, there is martial law... but generally you are right

 

[dustbuster]

I mean, there is martial law... but generally you are right

On what planet is the commander in chief not the commander in chief?
If he issues orders, and the personnel receiving commits insubordination, that is cause for demotion, termination, and court-martial.
There are worse things than being fired, btw, such as being busted down to private and ordered to patrol prudoh bay on foot for the remainder of your tour.

 

[Betonhaus]

What's both stupid and aggravating is that framing the whole shitshow as "not our problem" will be painted like he's the next gigahitler, once again.
The Biden admin is already leaning on Ukraine to work a deal out b/c we literally cannot afford to keep subsidizing this war and they'll still blame the nearest Republican for when that inevitably happens.

I genuinely can't wait to see what that looks like. Ukraine has hardline demands that are outright fantasy and they refuse to even entertain peace talks until they are met. Russia no longer trusts the USA to stick to any of their agreements, so they are very unlikely to accept any agreement where long term promises are a key component. The Democrats likely think that they could negotiate something that is at worst a stalemate - and I genuinely don't believe their expectations are even that side of realistic. I think they will find that getting out of this war will be much more difficult to do then they think, and will cost them more then they ever dreamed.

 

[Amerikaner Teddybär]

On what planet is the commander in chief not the commander in chief?
If he issues orders, and the personnel receiving commits insubordination, that is cause for demotion, termination, and court-martial.
There are worse things than being fired, btw, such as being busted down to private and ordered to patrol prudoh bay on foot for the remainder of your tour.

Yes, in an ideal world, Trump would've been allowed to call in the troops without much in the way of insubordination. However, as we do not live in a perfect world, he had to deal with cowards and traitors in the highest ranks that could've overthrown him if they wanted. Politics is as you said war but one aspect of that Sun Tzu once said is to know when and when not to fight. Trump was fighting a battle he couldn't win at the time.

 

[WelperHelper99]

On what planet is the commander in chief not the commander in chief?
If he issues orders, and the personnel receiving commits insubordination, that is cause for demotion, termination, and court-martial.
There are worse things than being fired, btw, such as being busted down to private and ordered to patrol prudoh bay on foot for the remainder of your tour.

To do what you ask, he would have to become George Washington. As in a active, actual, physical cog in the military machine. He is restrained by bureaucracy otherwise. It's called wartime powers.

 

[dustbuster]

To do what you ask, he would have to become George Washington. As in a active, actual, physical cog in the military machine. He is restrained by bureaucracy otherwise. It's called wartime powers.

Which are always active due to national emergency act.
I guarantee in a situation in which widespread riots are involved he has that level of authority.
When last I checked, there has been at least one declared "national emergency" active for as long as everyone in generation X has been alive.

 

[WelperHelper99]

Which are always active due to national emergency act.
I guarantee in a situation in which widespread riots are involved he has that level of authority.
When last I checked, there has been at least one declared "national emergency" active for as long as everyone in generation X has been alive.

No. You haven't seen martial law. Last one that did that was FDR. At that point the constitution is suspended. The president then can do whatever he needs to resolve the situation. You don't want to see it.

 

[Skeletonized Cow]

Trump couldn't have gunned down all the rioters because the law doesn't matter anymore. What matters is power, and who holds it. Trump, despite legally possessing considerable power, didn't hold power in reality. All his underlings held it.

This doesn't mean we roll over and capitulate. It means we have regroup, reorganize, and start rebuilding from the bottom up. It took the Marxists sixty plus years to get where they're at, it'll take a long time for us to do the same.

 

[Betonhaus]

No. You haven't seen martial law. Last one that did that was FDR. At that point the constitution is suspended. The president then can do whatever he needs to resolve the situation. You don't want to see it.

The only scenario where I want to see that is if it leads to a bloody massacre among the elites with only the people genuinely caring about the country's future left standing. But the odds of that aren't good.

 

[Absolutego]

Today I learned the president is not the commander in chief of the US armed forces.

You are officially retarded.

You're a retard who thinks the commander in chief does not command the US military.

Where exactly do you think the concept of "federalizing the guard" comes from?
It comes from article 2 authority of POTUS

You vastly over-estimate how much the president's title as Commander in Chief isn't just ceremonial.
The Pentagon has been subverting presidents they disliked for close to 200 years now.

 

[dustbuster]

No. You haven't seen martial law. Last one that did that was FDR.

The guard has been nationalized plenty of times since FDR.
Either POTUS has that authority or does not.
Given it's been used copious times in my lifetime, I'll go with "he does"

 

[namelesstacotruck]

You vastly over-estimate how much the president's title as Commander in Chief isn't just ceremonial.
The Pentagon has been subverting presidents they disliked for close to 200 years now.

And killing and deposing ones they really dont like. See what happened to Jfk, and Nixon.

 

[Screamer_2]

I had libs contact me, afraid because of Trumps Gestapo arresting black block rioters out of Scary Unmarked Minivans. They thought that the rioters were genuine good guys and they placed the rosy frame of abolitionists and integrationists right over the top of them. Like you say, they're insane. Completely and totally starved of true information.

The best way I can think of it is that they're just following a story. They're told what the narrative is and where they're at. They aren't actually having an opinion based on what they know or how they understand things. They aren't even looking for any of the information to do so.

It's why I think I managed to not fall into it with friends and family. I also probably just waste more time online. So during BLM I was watching videos of riots and violence. Whereas they were just having productive lives, casually getting some noise of what to think.

 

[Absolutego]

And killing and deposing ones they really dont like. See what happened to Jfk, and Nixon.

Forget those two, just look at how they treated McKinley because he had too much Antietam PTSD to go full-throated in support of invading Cuba.

 

[namelesstacotruck]

The guard has been nationalized plenty of times since FDR.
Either POTUS has that authority or does not.
Given it's been used copious times in my lifetime, I'll go with "he does"

This is what the right has to work with when it comes to understanding how power works.

Millenia of western history (and Eastern too!) that shows that their are turns of history where Prateorians have the power and not the Emperor. And still tards think like this.

Let me break it down for retards.
Trump orders the joint chief to do something. Joint chief refuses or just executes a 5 year study. Trump asks if it got done "we're working on it". He notices it didnt get done. He demands person is fired. Person gets "fired". Immediately sues in venue of choice. Judge grants stay and cites blah blah. Joint chief finds henchmen to fall on their sword and they are the reason it didnt get executed in a timely manner and blah blah. Judge holds you cant discipline because if incompotent subordinate. Subordinate gets cushy contracting gigs and book deals. (See tye fat ukrainian colonel fuck) Joint chief stays, he "retires" to calm down everything. Replacement that will do the same thing (not picked by Trump) comes in.

 

[draggs]

Federalizing the National Guard brings the Posse Comitatus Act into play. If a state governor rejects a presidential request to activate the Nasty Gurlz to go on the streets, the president must invoke the Insurrection Act to remove the governor's exclusive powers to command their state's Nasty Gurlz, placing those units under federal (presidential) control, and use them inside the borders of said state(s). Invoking the Insurrection Act would have led to impeachment and a political crisis of an enormity not seen since 1860

The Insurrection Act can be used for rebellion against state government, a rebellion against federal authority, to ensure the maintenance of federal law where it otherwise could not be maintained, and to maintain civil rights if a state government refuses to do so itself. Outside of CHAZ, Washington, DC, (which does have its own NG units that the president already controls, which effectively makes the president the governor of DC in this context), and Portland, it could not be reasonably argued that there was a rebellion against federal authority or a need for the NG to enforce federal law. There was no argument that the NG was needed to maintain civil rights anywhere

tldr invoking the Insurrection Act would have caused a shitstorm with unforeseeable consequences and was not legally viable except in three places out of the 100+ that saw rioting in 2020

 

[WelperHelper99]

The guard has been nationalized plenty of times since FDR.
Either POTUS has that authority or does not.
Given it's been used copious times in my lifetime, I'll go with "he does"

You are seriously underestimating the scale of the power that would be unleashed. Those times were with GOVERNORS concent. Martial Law is when the President becomes THE GOVERNMENT. And when that happens, you have at that point broken every fucking rule in the book. You are asking for a civil war and half the military jumping ship unless the situation is so dire they need to act NOW. When FDR did it, we thought we were getting bombed. He quickly relinquished control after we realized we weren't. Don't fuck around with this lever, you are asking for nothing but peril

 

[dustbuster]

You are seriously underestimating the scale of the power that would be unleashed. Those times were with GOVERNORS concent. Martial Law is when the President becomes THE GOVERNMENT. And when that happens, you have at that point broken every fucking rule in the book. You are asking for a civil war and half the military jumping ship unless the situation is so dire they need to act NOW. When FDR did it, we thought we were getting bombed. He quickly relinquished control after we realized we weren't. Don't fuck around with this lever, you are asking for nothing but peril

https://www.history.com/news/little-rock-nine-brown-v-board-eisenhower-101-airborne

Simple executive order can nationalize the guard of a state.