Mega Man General Thread - Mega Man Battle Network Legacy Collection announced

X Prime said:
The Metroid Prime-esque Maverick Hunter reboot back in 2010 or so was intended to be a trilogy ending with Zero killing X. Keep in mind this was MMZ1's original ending.

The card gacha crossover named TEPPEN just had X kill himself to power up Ryu, as an excuse to transition into MMZ card packs.

I hope this reinforces your realization.
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...*sigh*

They just don't love the series, do they?
 
Coldgrip said:
...*sigh*

They just don't love the series, do they?
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Honestly I just don't think any one really cares any more. MM was Inafune's project, it never really made the company a ton of money, and now with him gone no one is really championing the series like it was their own. Any driven person at Capcom would rather create their own series instead of riding on some one else's that has a bit of a bad taste in the higher ups mouth.
 
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Back me up! said:
Honestly I just don't think any one really cares any more. MM was Inafune's project
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It wasn't, he just latched onto it and it's where nearly all of his fame comes from.

IGA of Castlevania fame is the same way, but because he started out as a programmer and didn't just go from artist to suit he actually knows how to make games.
 
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Need to get back into the collection. I got to the Japanese hotel area in 3. But I need to continue it at some point.
 
It really has to be understood just how ridiculous Inafune is, and there is no better way to do that than to show that with my Christmas gift to the thread: A comic he made for his Beastroids NFT project back in October.


You will literally see multiple derivations of Zero's body parts in different combinations on the same panel. What Inafune is doing is almost Sonichu tier.

Enjoy, if ironically.
 
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SSj_Ness said:
MM11 was safe so there's at least a reasonable chance the series won't be ruined.
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Well, Mega Man 11 also had the gigantic advantage that those games barely have anything that could be called a plot. "Something happens, Willy is a cunt (be it obviously or subtlety), kill 8 robot masters" formula that I personally love to pieces and that allows you to dump out an entry without anything too hard outside of having to think of a 12th way to say "Fire Man" or not having to end up digging to deep in the barrel for Tupperware Man.

X is different, X became the super serial series (and yeah, X4 was the one that really went hard into that). 6 is the latest entry I played, but I have done my plot synopsis and the plot is convoluted shit when it hits 8, and that's ignoring what the Zero series establishes AND that 8 ended with a cliffhanger. How the hell are you supposed to follow that up? You are either already shackled by all the random lore floating around or you go "fuck it, reboot" which in this case I'd honestly go for the later, but then there is already a (shitty looking) X1 remake, do you just remake that again or do you reinvent it with 8 new Maverick designs? Maybe spice it up with Sigma not being the big bad? I could honestly get on board for something like that, but then we reach the other sad reality, Mega Man is a great mascot, but the fucker doesn't move units, so this wouldn't be helmed by a vet, it would be helmed by new blood with something to prove and those are basically a coin flip of delivering something great or absolute ass.

I'm starting to meander, but my point is that following up on X is a much taller order than with the standard series due to it's baggage and you are more likely to end up with a "spiritual successor" that plays like X but with a completely different narrative and robot master/maverick gimmick than actual proper X. And that's ignoring that playing like X has that big branch of Megaman or Zero playstyle, since they both have their followers but both require different game design to properly maximize.
 
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X Prime said:
It wasn't, he just latched onto it and it's where nearly all of his fame comes from.

IGA of Castlevania fame is the same way, but because he started out as a programmer and didn't just go from artist to suit he actually knows how to make games.
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Oh, I know. But Inafune latched on and pushed the series as much as possible so he could inserts his own stuff into it. I don't think there is anyone else in Capcom left that has that same sort of drive.

I'm actually a little shocked by that, cause at this point I would a assume some kid that grew up playing the MM /MMX games would join Capcom to make more of the games he loved. Did they all go to Wayforward? Blew there load on MM9 and MM10 and then that was it?
 
Back me up! said:
Oh, I know. But Inafune latched on and pushed the series as much as possible so he could inserts his own stuff into it. I don't think there is anyone else in Capcom left that has that same sort of drive.

I'm actually a little shocked by that, cause at this point I would a assume some kid that grew up playing the MM /MMX games would join Capcom to make more of the games he loved. Did they all go to Wayforward? Blew there load on MM9 and MM10 and then that was it?
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What seems to have happened to get MM9 and 10 made was that Inafune was on a retro obsession at the time and insisted IntiCreates make them.

There's an interview where IntiCreates people basically say that they were working on MMZX3 but then Inafune wanted then to work on MM9, so they did that. They then stopped themselves from saying any more so as not to outright say it's Inafune's fault ZX ended on a cliffhanger like it did.

I wouldn't trust many of the fans to do X sequels right, and I'll explain why: they don't actually play the games. Guys who are active on the X Dive Offline modding scene have admitted only playing X4, X5, and the Inti games, and it shows. They're currently obsessed with stuff like buffing Omega and adding in edgeboy Prometheus. Plus a Beyblade character apparently.
 
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X Prime said:
There's an interview where IntiCreates people basically say that they were working on MMZX3 but then Inafune wanted then to work on MM9, so they did that. They then stopped themselves from saying any more so as not to outright say it's Inafune's fault ZX ended on a cliffhanger like it did.
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I gotta wonder, is this the same kinda thing responsible for X4-X6 having a subplot that seemed to be going somewhere of "Dr. wily is still alive somehow and is helping sigma sometimes because of their mutual hate of X" getting replaced with the "new genreration reploids" shit from x7 and 8 that also ended on a cliffhanger in 8's ending?
Also might've already brought this up but it never stops being kinda funny to me how they write off sigma not showing upint he Zero games by explaining "oh he was killed by the elves".


EDIT: Forgot to mention how weird it was how the "wily is still alive" suplot thing started with some vague implication with serges in X2, but was only made more intense in X4 and then in X5 it was straight up Sigma with Gamma's body going "Oh hey X! I ran into this old guy who really REALLY fucking hates you and he gave me this cool new body haha" And the shit with the final stages literally having distorted TV screens with the Wily logo in them as backgrounds and THIS FUCKER.
And then in X6 it goes and dials it back to nebulous vague wily stuff but the Isoc guy is much more blatantly another "wily puppet robot" of some sort.
 
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The Lawgiver said:
I gotta wonder, is this the same kinda thing responsible for X4-X6 having a subplot that seemed to be going somewhere of "Dr. wily is still alive somehow and is helping sigma sometimes because of their mutual hate of X" getting replaced with the "new genreration reploids" shit from x7 and 8 that also ended on a cliffhanger in 8's ending?
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It has been implied in the past in at least one dev interview that X4 was not something anyone wanted to make. The primary guy who seems to have wanted it was Inafune, who had been somewhat recently promoted and appeared to see it as a chance to kill it and make a Zero series. There is supposedly a claim buried in Rockman Perfect Memories that Inafune inserted all that Wily plot because he saw X4 as "the climax."

While at the same time claiming after the fact that he had minimal involvement with X4 and X5 whenever they are criticized.

Virtually all the X series subplots revolve around Zero and making him important. Once he had his own series that wasn't a driving force anymore and all of those subplots were dropped. It's stupid but that's how it is. Even X Dive's plot revolves around Zero again.

The reason the New Generation stuff was dropped is because nobody wanted to work on the X series anymore. It has too much baggage. Much like Darkstalkers, they just milk it for cameos and fighting game characters, usually Zero.

Oh yes, speaking of. Remember how I warned that you'd probably get stupid bullshit if nu-Capcom worked on an X9? Capcom's Twitter decided to make my point for me in a shipping bait tweet today:


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Ciel is a human minor. For the record, the actual event has the navigator OCs mocking Zero for not telling her how good she looks.
 
X Prime said:
Virtually all the X series subplots revolve around Zero and making him important. Once he had his own series that wasn't a driving force anymore and all of those subplots were dropped. It's stupid but that's how it is. Even X Dive's plot revolves around Zero again.
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I really don't the Megaman X plotlines were meant solely tomake Zero important. He was already Important by virtue of being "Wily's last robot" in the same way X was Lights. The reason Zero's better at fighting compared to X at the start was he was literally just built to beat the shit out of X whenever both of them activated, but instead they ended up becoming friends who didn't even know shit about their creators for the most part. X is extremely important compared to Zero in the grander scope of things because of the fact "Reploids" are called that because they're bootleg replicas of X's design without the several decade processing time to let their personal morals and beliefs bake. Sigma is the way he is due to a combo of that and the fact he stole Zero's weird nebulous "virus" properties after beating him which made him basically immortal as long as he can get a new body. he basically got power and instantly fucking went fully corrupt with it.

The "new generation reploid" plot in X8 was "oh they're immune to the sigmavirus because a copy of Sigma's literally in their base code and Sigma intentionally influenced this somehow so now every new gen reploid is slowly corrupting into a clone of Sigma and going fucking insane as a result of this process" but then last second the edgy prettyboy shows up and is like "AHA NO IT WS MY PLAN THE WHOLE TIME I JUST USED SIGMA IT WAS MY PLAN" even though he was straight up one of the reploids created as a result of Sigma's plan and it's not really framed like he's becoming another sigma though he pretty much did with his mentality about humanity. Anyways he fucking perma dies though it's implied via the ending and the unnamed armor you get when you beathim with Axl that he somehow transferred part of his essence into Axl and it possibly mildly corrupted him in some way we'll never really find out the extent of. The big cliffhanger ending is the fact they start producing the "new generation" reploid chips again despite the knowledge of the sigma shit due to convenience despite concerns, which obviously is meant to set up sigma coming back again anyways, possibly an entire boss roster of sigmas.
We're probably never gonna get an X9 that follows upon X8s cliffhangers but if we do I 100% want all the fucking bosses to just be different sigmas because it'd be funny. Hell, they could even get lazy and just make it the 8 previous phase 1 sigma forms and it'd work! X8 sigma might be a bit odd to do if they did it like that, not because the first sigma phase in that game is just one of the corrupted new gen reploids, but because it's basically meant to be a more intense version of X1 sigma's first phase.

X Prime said:
The reason the New Generation stuff was dropped is because nobody wanted to work on the X series anymore. It has too much baggage
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I don't know how "oh hey neat these guys can change form a bit and are immune to viruses? aw shit here comes sigma again oh shit they're ALL SIGMA OH FUCK" counts as "too much baggage"
IIRC they just stopped making them because X7 was shit and it severely hurt the sales of X8 as a result, on top of the fact of how they were focusing on the GBA megaman stuff mainly at the time.
 
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Reploids are named such not because they're derived from X, but because they successfully replicate human-level intelligence.

As for the baggage, I am referring to the status of the franchise in the company. It has historically always had a lot of weird behind-the-scenes production-related problems, and Inafune pulled a lot of strings to get Mega Man Zero. One of those strings was to hire IntiCreates for it, which was composed of ex-Capcom employees who reportedly acrimoniously split over poor working conditions. You do not generally get away with that in Japan. Part of the reason that platformer MM continues to basically gets nothing but merch, beyond the doesn't make money issue, is that it is tainted by association with Inafune who burned bridges.
 
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The Lawgiver said:
Hell, they could even get lazy and just make it the 8 previous phase 1 sigma forms and it'd work! X8 sigma might be a bit odd to do if they did it like that, not because the first sigma phase in that game is just one of the corrupted new gen reploids, but because it's basically meant to be a more intense version of X1 sigma's first phase.
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Sir, this is an Arby's.

...and even though I'm merely an Arby's employee, I still know the X series is dead and you'll never see X9.

That'll be 16.74, please.
 
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This entire discussion about X reminds me why it's my least favorite of the mega man series

Also has anyone here ever played the Complete Works versions of mega man 1-6? I recently played through 4-6 with it and the remixed music, nice new UI, framerate fixes, and weapon swapping with a button honestly make it the definitive way to play the classics and it puzzles me why the legacy collection didn't have these versions instead when their so much better(especially for 3 with it's framerate problems)
 
Bit out of the loop for this conversation, but I'll just chime in and say that I enjoy both the X and Zero series pretty much equally, though the latter is of a much more consistently good quality. And heck, while I like X as the protagonist, I hate to admit it, but Zero I've always found to be a more interesting character, regardless of how much of that was due to Inafune's antics.

Heck, the connection he had with Ciel in the Zero series I found myself invested in as well.
 
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