Dragon Age: The Veilguard - A woke disaster? Yep!

[Logoden]

The only game where I really remember these context issues being a problem is Fallout 4, and dialogue barely mattered in that game anyway.

Fallout 4 was probably the prime exemple of the problem, I am not even sure another cRPG did it worse. That was true retardation and the game designer whom made it KNEW it very well, he even admited it was stupid some times after the release.

But it also happened in DA:I too, far too much to no be unnoticable for me and to not be a pain in the ass.

I do not say you defend this fucked system. But remember, it took barely a week after release for modders to create a "whole sentence" mod for F4, a WEEK. DA and BG1&2 had full sentences written 15 and 25 years ago respectivly and consequently suffered less from those problems. No excuse for dialog wheel and hacked sentences in any cRPG. It is like using the wrong defectuous tools for the wrong task, it creates moments(not always) where it is ambiguous, inaccurate or flawed.

For romances I do not argue, they were generaly straighforward, I agree. For Cortez I do not remember, I just fraternized with him If I recall right during each of my playthroughs at the time, never ending in beds with him. Honestly he made me laugh a lot, not because he is badly written but because he was such a stereotypical faggot only placed here for good points. I still think we should have had Wrex or Grunt return as companions instead of having another bland human.

 

[SIMIΔN]

bh it wasn't even the biggest issues of DA2, the retarded ending and castrated development time leading to massive reduction in environments etc. was what people annoyed a lot more.

I never got to see the retarded ending because the repetitive environments and the anaemic act 1 dragon fight had already bored me to death.

Shame, I loved DA2's art direction for the elves and Koslith

 

[I'm Really Feeling It]

It's sad that the prospect of remaking an (let's be honest with ourselves) outdated game in many aspects to bring it up to par with new games, especially something like the awful combat, brings cries of "no, they're going to ruin it!!!" nowadays. DAO needs a facelift, needs at least some better combat gameplay (not necessarily overhauling classes), and needs better integration with Inquistion (relying on a website to lock in your choices is so unnatural). But, they will ruin it. Goodbye, blood. Goodbye, nudity. Goodbye, non-PC plot points. Goodbye Oghren, even.

 

[TheAmbiguousLurker]

Yea, you'd have to be a sadist to choose Blue or Green. Having Shep be in control of the Reapers would fuck him/her up, and synthesizing everyone is such a weird option and could honestly lead to danger with a little thought.

Synthesis doesn't work as a choice because the game barely explains what the fuck it even does other than 'Synthetic and Organic as one, man!'. Does it just make us all cyborgs? Are we a hive mind like the Geth now? Did the space magic wave somehow modify the genetic structure of all organic beings?

And why should you even trust anything that space kid had to say about synthetics and humans fighting? He explains that they've been fighting forever when you just recently ended the war with the Geth.

It also just doesn't explain how any of his solutions solve that problem. Humans were killing each other long before they discovered that different ethnicities even existed, they're still gonna find an excuse to murder each other even if everyone's part space cuttlefish now. The only way that making them similar or killing one side stops potential conflicts in the future is if the Starchild's logic is unironically "Synthetics and organics aren't technically fighting if no one identifies as synthetics or organics.".

 

[Crow Money]

I’m sorry but how autistic do you have to be to “accidentally” trigger a romance? What “other stuff” do you think that line refers to? Imagine saying that to a friend IRL. I’ve played all of these games plus BG3 and it is always very, very obvious to a when your character is flirting or being hit on even without the little heart indicating THIS IS A ROMANCE OPTION RETARD.

I’ve seen so many posts along the lines of “I thought we were just good bros and suddenly he’s fucking me in the ass!” meanwhile the dialog option that triggers that scene is *I am gay and want you to fuck me in the ass (stick your tongue down his throat)*.

The only person I’ve ever seen the Accidental Fag Relationship thing happen to is DSP.

If you had a similar game experience to DSP, I don’t really know what to tell you.

 

[Leaf Wage Slave Jr]

It's sad that the prospect of remaking an (let's be honest with ourselves) outdated game in many aspects to bring it up to par with new games, especially something like the awful combat, brings cries of "no, they're going to ruin it!!!" nowadays. DAO needs a facelift, needs at least some better combat gameplay (not necessarily overhauling classes), and needs better integration with Inquistion (relying on a website to lock in your choices is so unnatural). But, they will ruin it. Goodbye, blood. Goodbye, nudity. Goodbye, non-PC plot points. Goodbye Oghren, even.

What makes the prospect of a DAO remake somewhat hilarious is the fact that, well, BG3 exists, and is likely better than anything NuWare could shit out.

Origins was made to be a spiritual successor to BG2, and now there’s an actual sequel to BG2 that blows Origins - hell, any of NuWare’s recent output - out of the water. The amount of work to have an Origins remake reach the bar? It’s a helluva lot more than what I expect NuWare to do (re: a new coat of paint and porting as much as possible from the old games engine/guts)., and it’d probably be less effort to just make a new IP from scratch.

An Origin’s remake, unfortunately, feels like it’s just too late, especially with how the bar’s been raised.

 

[Mr. Zed da Robot Poon Fed]

What makes the prospect of a DAO remake somewhat hilarious is the fact that, well, BG3 exists, and is likely better than anything NuWare could shit out.

Origins was made to be a spiritual successor to BG2, and now there’s an actual sequel to BG2 that blows Origins - hell, any of NuWare’s recent output - out of the water. The amount of work to have an Origins remake reach the bar? It’s a helluva lot more than what I expect NuWare to do (re: a new coat of paint and porting as much as possible from the old games engine/guts)., and it’d probably be less effort to just make a new IP from scratch.

An Origin’s remake, unfortunately, feels like it’s just too late, especially with how the bar’s been raised.

Pretty much. I liked DA when it was still the only thing of its kind out at the time, but now that BG3 is out, the bar has been raised pretty high. And NuWare doesn't seem to be able to reach that height, unfortunately.

 

[Scarlett Johansson]

I miss Kasumi Goto

 

[wtfNeedSignUp]

At this point might as well restart things from scratch since no one even remembers the choices he made... Holy shit, 15 years ago.

The effect of BG3 is pretty big, people will expect far more interactivity than was the norm for the genre. I remember the game's choices being more limited to dialogue than actions.

 

[Takayuki Yagami]

Whatever slop Bioware intends to release, they will be compared against BG3, for good or ill.

That expectation alone will ensure DA4 will be DOA.

It’ll absolutely be for ill. Anything Bioware does going forward, especially if they decide to hew closer to their roots, will be looked at like every open world game that came out in the aftermaths of Witcher 3 and BotW.

 

[Mola Ram]

It’ll absolutely be for ill. Anything Bioware does going forward, especially if they decide to hew closer to their roots, will be looked at like every open world game that came out in the aftermaths of Witcher 3 and BotW.

Sometimes I stop to think that Dragon Age II, an obviously rushed, deeply flawed game set in a claustrophobic little underdeveloped city, came out the same year as fucking Skyrim, and wonder what god is responsible for BioWare still being alive.

 

[ZMOT]

It also just doesn't explain how any of his solutions solve that problem. Humans were killing each other long before they discovered that different ethnicities even existed, they're still gonna find an excuse to murder each other even if everyone's part space cuttlefish now. The only way that making them similar or killing one side stops potential conflicts in the future is if the Starchild's logic is unironically "Synthetics and organics aren't technically fighting if no one identifies as synthetics or organics.".

that's why the ending sucks as a whole (and iirc was shoplifted from another source anyway). it's hack writing to have a "moral dilemma", probably that was supposed to be "deep and profound" which most fart-huffers try to be at the same time.
also why people prefer the dying suns narrative because it does exactly what the traffic light ending does, but actually "good" (not perfect, but good enough).

The effect of BG3 is pretty big, people will expect far more interactivity than was the norm for the genre. I remember the game's choices being more limited to dialogue than actions.

bioware was always pretty shit when it came to interactivity or dialog choices. it basically boils down to +good/bad boy points and completely irrelevant 1 minute later. fucking witcher 1 had more longterm cause and effect, without pulling shit like "muh cloned rachni queen" because bioware was too lazy and cheap to write different paths.

 

[A Sentient Cloud]

that's why the ending sucks as a whole (and iirc was shoplifted from another source anyway). it's hack writing to have a "moral dilemma", probably that was supposed to be "deep and profound" which most fart-huffers try to be at the same time.
also why people prefer the dying suns narrative because it does exactly what the traffic light ending does, but actually "good" (not perfect, but good enough).


bioware was always pretty shit when it came to interactivity or dialog choices. it basically boils down to +good/bad boy points and completely irrelevant 1 minute later. fucking witcher 1 had more longterm cause and effect, without pulling shit like "muh cloned rachni queen" because bioware was too lazy and cheap to write different paths.

The poorly integrated renegade/paragon system aside, I actually do think mid aughts BioWare did moral conundrums better than any other developer. The genophage, the geth, the Templar/Mage conflict, the rachni queen, etc., are really interesting philosophical questions even outside the context of the games and people still talk about them today. Compare that with the choices made throughout the utterly convoluted narrative of BG3, which basically come down to “do you like good things or bad things?”

 

[ZMOT]

The poorly integrated renegade/paragon system aside, I actually do think mid aughts BioWare did moral conundrums better than any other developer. The genophage, the geth, the Templar/Mage conflict, the rachni queen, etc., are really interesting philosophical questions even outside the context of the games and people still talk about them today. Compare that with the choices made throughout the utterly convoluted narrative of BG3, which basically come down to “do you like good things or bad things?”

haven't played bg3 yet (and probably never will since nothing really appeals to me), but the problem is that it leads nowhere. did you kill the rachni queen or not? doesn't matter, there will always be a rachni queen. do you side with the templars or the mages? doesn't matter, anders will always go full retard. stuff like the genophage is also only pseudo-deep. you have a race of roided retards breeding like rabbits, which they neither have the brain function to reign in nor the resources anymore to sustain since their planet is a bombed out shithole. what the fuck would anyone expect is gonna happen curing the genophage? is it inhumane? sure, but for a good reason. the alternative is going full total krogan death once they inevitably start chimping out again. bioware also took the easy way out since they conveniently never have to answer that question and we never get to see mass effect 4: krogan wars.

not saying it's all complete shit, there's some good stuff in there too (even DA2), but lot of it feels surface level and cheap, to save time and money. the more divergent paths you have, the more it costs, and players are less likely to see it, especially when they play the game only once. so instead each of them only seeing 60-80% of the game, just make it so everybody sees 98% and thinks there's more. not giving bioware shit for that, that's just the realities of the market, but if they try to make a game like that when they can't (for whatever reason), I can point out it's a shit idea and others have done a better job with arguably less.

 

[DagothUr]

It's sad that the prospect of remaking an (let's be honest with ourselves) outdated game in many aspects to bring it up to par with new games, especially something like the awful combat, brings cries of "no, they're going to ruin it!!!" nowadays. DAO needs a facelift, needs at least some better combat gameplay (not necessarily overhauling classes)

Hard disagree.
The worst thing about new games is the combat, imo, and is why I always go back to Origins or NWN2. I don't like slow turn-based combat in games like Solasta compared to the RTWP stuff that was common at the time.
I see people shit on the combat in Origins quite a bit and I never get it. For me it's easily the best in the series. Minus balance issues with the mage class and how shit and useless archery is in the base game, it feels way better and faster than 2 or Inquisition. The tactics system is very detailed and there's a good amount of customization possible in builds even with the more streamlined system they use over 3.5e
Origins also has a lot of battles that aren't easy by any means, though that depends on your build and party setup.
Maybe it's just cause I'm not a TTRPG guy and this is just what I'm used to, but I would be interested in hearing why people don't like the combat in DAO in more detail.

I think if they did a remaster the best they could do is improve the graphics and fix some of the and bugged content and overall glitches. Maybe add in some of the missing/removed content like the Human Commoner origin.
Realistically though they would fuck it up and all of those things would be worse.

 

[Peaches the Wonder Cat]

Maybe add in some of the missing/removed content like the Human Commoner origin.

(Duncan's voice)
"You began your life as a young man in Redcliffe, apprenticing as a blacksmith at your father's shop. But you never thought this life was for you. You always dreamed of wearing dresses and makeup, and working the glory hole at the local tavern..."

 

[DagothUr]

(Duncan's voice)
"You began your life as a young man in Redcliffe, apprenticing as a blacksmith at your father's shop. But you never thought this life was for you. You always dreamed of wearing dresses and makeup, and working the glory hole at the local tavern..."

Gay warden initiation is very different. It's not darkspawn blood in that chalice.

 

[Gravityqueen4life]

(Duncan's voice)
"You began your life as a young man in Redcliffe, apprenticing as a blacksmith at your father's shop. But you never thought this life was for you. You always dreamed of wearing dresses and makeup, and working the glory hole at the local tavern..."

Gay warden initiation is very different. It's not darkspawn blood in that chalice.

 

[ZMOT]

Maybe it's just cause I'm not a TTRPG guy and this is just what I'm used to, but I would be interested in hearing why people don't like the combat in DAO in more detail.

personally I see no difference, because the only thing RTwP really adds is "default" behavior so characters can act on their own - something you could just as easily do in a normal turn based game with or without grid. it's also why those feel "slow" or tedious because usually you have to confirm everything manually, even menial stuff, hundreds of times.

 

[Snekposter]

personally I see no difference, because the only thing RTwP really adds is "default" behavior so characters can act on their own - something you could just as easily do in a normal turn based game with or without grid. it's also why those feel "slow" or tedious because usually you have to confirm everything manually, even menial stuff, hundreds of times.

And you can queue stuff, unpause, watch the fights, make adjustments... its nowhere near as obsessively clicky as turn-based games are.