Mega Rad Gun Thread

[Club Sandwich]

Under that, and you've basically got a flashbang garbage rod that beats itself to death due to the amount of gas being pumped back into the upper to make sure the gun cycles reliably.

as you mentioned, once you get under 10" (really a bit more than that depending on your ammunition and position of the gas port vs the muzzle), the carbine buffer and BCG will beat it itself to death. however, something that short with a rifle buffer and stock will work more or less without trouble until you get to really excessive gas pressures where you end up with hard extractors, rim tear, excessive port erosion, even "blasting" and peening around the FP.

i think a lot of builders just aren't taking the time to measure things out when they spec a gas port. it's not super hard but it is tedious.

 

[Friedrich Hayek's Ghost]

I get the hogged out gas port for dissipator barrels, but it's confusing as fuck when regular barrels have them. It's not that hard to just drill a hole to the proper size.

 

[Ravier Xavenblood]

Wanted to buy another revolver, but spent the money on gear for my existing guns instead. Proud of myself today.

 

[Samhain]

as you mentioned, once you get under 10" (really a bit more than that depending on your ammunition and position of the gas port vs the muzzle), the carbine buffer and BCG will beat it itself to death. however, something that short with a rifle buffer and stock will work more or less without trouble until you get to really excessive gas pressures where you end up with hard extractors, rim tear, excessive port erosion, even "blasting" and peening around the FP.

i think a lot of builders just aren't taking the time to measure things out when they spec a gas port. it's not super hard but it is tedious.

Rifle length buffers and springs aren't necessary, but with gaped ports, stepping up to a stronger spring and/or heavier buffer can definitely help alleviate excessive recoil. The first AR upper I ever bought had a 16" Ballistic Advantage barrel in it. It was over-gassed, but with an H1 buffer and blue Sprinco buffer spring, it cycled much more smoothly than with a standard carbine buffer and spring.

I get the hogged out gas port for dissipator barrels, but it's confusing as fuck when regular barrels have them. It's not that hard to just drill a hole to the proper size.

They gape them for a couple reasons. Primarily, because people buying cheap ARs are going to run dirt cheap under-powered steel case ammo through them. Also, because extra gas helps the gun push through all the crude that accumulates over time in the upper, since most people never bother to clean their guns. Gaping the gas port is the simplest way to make sure the gun will keep cycling for as long as possible. On the other hand, gas rings and whatnot get destroyed fast.

 

[Devious Dave]

The worrying about Level 4 body armor is kinda dumb, not gonna lie. Just get an AR-10 with a nice bipod and optic.

I would be much more worried about creating vehicle barriers and choke points. Concrete planter boxes are good at stopping cars. Lots of government buildings use these to create discreet barricades.

I can't wait for the analog vs digital night vision arguments to kick off

Something I absolutely would be worried about is signal jammers these are being used in South Africa right now

 

[Friedrich Hayek's Ghost]

They gape them for a couple reasons...

I get that. I guess I'm just a troglodyte or something, but I generally would prefer if everyone made things to spec, and the ammo manufacturers downloading their ammo got bullied into either fixing it or run out of business. I understand this is a very optimistic perspective.

 

[|o|]

Holy shit I’m drunk and rocked off my ass. It took me so long to find this thread again LMAO but I just wanted to say. @Null don’t fuck around with 50 Caliber BMG for close range. That’s literally exceptional. Dump some slugs in to them with a 12ga shotty that’s all you need close range nigga Get some “firearm” sawed off shotguns if you really want. I agree with the semi auto. Pump action is too slow

 

[|o|]

Binary triggers AND bump stocks are still legal too, for all your 5.56/223 OR 7.62 needs. If you have enough money to get a Daniel defense 5.56 you have enough for
A binary trigger too which is as fast as full auto. You would be a retard not to if you can afford it. Fuck bump stocks. Binary triggers are much more accurate. Ive also enjoyed short barreled rifles pistols but bullpups like the Springfield Hellion (more attachment and replacement options than the Israeli Tavor x95) are really good for close range AND medium to long distance. The SBR x95 at 13” IIRC is short enough to walk thought doorways aiming down sights.

*edit* mixed up gun names cause I’m a tard and there are so many.

*edit edit* flamethrowers are unregulated and legal in the US

*edit edit edit* here is a firearm 12 gauge, semi auto shotty. There are versions with a stock but those are short barreled shotguns, which like short barreled rifles, are illegal. Unlike pistols with braces….. https://kalashnikov-usa.com/product/khaos-12ga-firearm/
Kalashnikov USA is proud to introduce the KHAOS 12GA semi-automatic firearm. The KHAOS is a non-NFA firearm and is not a shotgun as it is not designed to be fired from the shoulder. This compact, 12 gauge semi-automatic, smoothbore firearm is based on the Izhmash Saiga series. The KHAOS has a barrel length of 13.125” with an overall length of 27.625″ inches. It features our version of a semi-pistol grip that allows this smoothbore firearm to exceed the 26” in length. For US citizens this firearm is NOT considered “Any Other Weapon” (AOW) under the National Firearms Act (NFA). This firearm will transfer on a 4473 form like a regular firearm purchase

 

[Bassomatic]

Wanted to buy another revolver, but spent the money on gear for my existing guns instead. Proud of myself today.

Don't be a faggot 20 projects stored all over the house shows your wife you're a planner and clearly breeding material.

jokes aside, So my bday is coming soon (send 7.7) Mrs Basso has set a budget aside getting me replacement sun glasses. I don't mean to be a spoil sport but I'm looking into a mirco hi cap like say a hellcat. So I said, maybe a cool ass comp. So what I was thinking my LaRue and my PTRmp5 have same thread.... what comp/brake could work on both? If anything?

If not I'll ask for a REAL/repo monopod for my type 99. Either way I'm spoiled mrs buys me gun shit.

 

[Club Sandwich]

Don't be a faggot 20 projects stored all over the house shows your wife you're a planner and clearly breeding material.

jokes aside, So my bday is coming soon (send 7.7) Mrs Basso has set a budget aside getting me replacement sun glasses. I don't mean to be a spoil sport but I'm looking into a mirco hi cap like say a hellcat. So I said, maybe a cool ass comp. So what I was thinking my LaRue and my PTRmp5 have same thread.... what comp/brake could work on both? If anything?

If not I'll ask for a REAL/repo monopod for my type 99. Either way I'm spoiled mrs buys me gun shit.

makes neat fireballs with short barrels:

https://tacfunusa.com/products/glock-9mm-tanker-style-short-muzzle-brake-1-2x28-tpi-compensator

 

[Ravier Xavenblood]

Don't be a faggot 20 projects stored all over the house shows your wife you're a planner and clearly breeding material.

jokes aside, So my bday is coming soon (send 7.7) Mrs Basso has set a budget aside getting me replacement sun glasses. I don't mean to be a spoil sport but I'm looking into a mirco hi cap like say a hellcat. So I said, maybe a cool ass comp. So what I was thinking my LaRue and my PTRmp5 have same thread.... what comp/brake could work on both? If anything?

If not I'll ask for a REAL/repo monopod for my type 99. Either way I'm spoiled mrs buys me gun shit.

It's all fun and games until you get caught with your pants down with no gear. At least I got a holster and mag pouches on the way so I can do draw/reload drills at the range.

 

[TETRABAX]

This is something I'd expect to see on YouTube shorts being fired at an indoor range by a swarthy gentleman as he puts multiple rounds into the range's ceiling (except for the suppressor because those people can't pass background checks).

ARs chambered in 5.56 should really have barrels no shorter than 10.3" long. Under that, and you've basically got a flashbang garbage rod that beats itself to death due to the amount of gas being pumped back into the upper to make sure the gun cycles reliably. Even 10.3"/10.5" isn't great. The Mk18 was always a compromise. 11.5" is the best shorty 5.56 length, imho. 11.5" has ~40% more dwell time than 10.3", which results in slower internal parts wear and lower likelihood of malfunctions.

A big problem with all the cheap AR "pistols" out there is that they all use utterly gaped gas ports. The CRANE spec gas port size for a 10.3" barrel is .070. I've seen PSA and Aero 10.5" barrels' gas ports pin gauged everywhere from .078 to .086! Those guns will obliterate gas rings and extractor and ejector springs insanely fast. Never mind that these cheapo shorty ARs usually ship with a standard carbine buffer spring and buffer, making them ridiculously harsh recoiling for 5.56.

AR barrels under 10.3" should only ever be chambered in .300 BLK, quite frankly.

So I got the upper like a decade ago but the lower was custom built by yours truly in my early 20's so it's using a buffer spring specifically for AR pistols. As far as the gas system, I haven't had any problems yet but I clean after every usage and keep a few spare short gas tubes in the gun bag

 

[LemonParty]

Apologies for the laziness not combing the thread, but has any told @Null about the AR-10 platform? It's versatile and suits all needs from home defense, hunting, and even long range compition shooting with multiple calibers able to be shot from one single gun.

I can go indepth about the multiple calibers available and how the platform operates if it hasn't been beaten to death already.

 

[Null]

I'm seriously investigating the AR-10. I have read first hand reports of soldiers in Afghanistan being hit in L4s by AKs firing the same round. From what I see, the AK fires a very similar round, but I think the NATO round is longer and should therefore have more grains and speed (??? i am retarded) and should hit harder. But the AK 7.62s will not pierce L4s but two shots placed on core will puncture lungs and break ribs.

 

[LemonParty]

I'm seriously investigating the AR-10 and .308. I have read first hand reports of soldiers in Afghanistan being hit in L4s by AKs firing the same round. From what I see, the AK fires a very similar round, but I think the NATO round is longer and should therefore have more grains and speed (??? i am retarded) and should hit harder. But the AK 7.62s will not pierce L4s but two shots placed on core will puncture lungs and break ribs.

Yes the .308 has more ass behind it. The Nato designation is 7.62x51. The AK shoots a 7.62x39, that last number is the length of the case and therefore more powder. It's also the cheapest large caliber round because nato.

You can also shoot 6.5 Creedmore which is a longer range round with a flatter trajectory. I use it for deer hunting. My buddy has a tricked out Aero Precision AR-10 that he uses for compition shooting.

You can also fire 300 win mag which is armor piercing and uses by military snipers.

The reason you can do this with one gun is you just replace the upper receiver. Only the lower receiver is considered a "gun" by the ATF so you can just buy different uppers online and swap them out (super easy, you can do it blind folded).

The same design feature is in the AR-15.
That's the reason you can shoot a .50 cal from it with the .50 Beowolf. You can also fire an AK 7.62x39 round from an AR-15

 

[The Grognard]

I'm seriously investigating the AR-10. I have read first hand reports of soldiers in Afghanistan being hit in L4s by AKs firing the same round. From what I see, the AK fires a very similar round, but I think the NATO round is longer and should therefore have more grains and speed (??? i am retarded) and should hit harder. But the AK 7.62s will not pierce L4s but two shots placed on core will puncture lungs and break ribs.

7.62x39 and 7.62x51 are pretty different rounds. The nearest Afgan goatfarmer equivalent to it in performance is the 7.62x54r that serves the same role in the post-soviet union as the 7.62x51 as the default general purpose machine gun and marksman rifle round.

 

[50 Calories]

I'm seriously investigating the AR-10. I have read first hand reports of soldiers in Afghanistan being hit in L4s by AKs firing the same round. From what I see, the AK fires a very similar round, but I think the NATO round is longer and should therefore have more grains and speed (??? i am retarded) and should hit harder. But the AK 7.62s will not pierce L4s but two shots placed on core will puncture lungs and break ribs.

As much as I like .308 the case you described on stream of wanting to defeat armor just isn't what it's suited for. Level III NIJ and Military SAPI plates are rated and tested to stop multiple (6 and 3 respectively) rounds of 308. 5.56 does achieve some degree of armor piercing against materials like steel (>16" barrel and 55 grain 5.56 aka m193 can pen it at close range) and UHWPE (polymer, defeated by steel cores like m855 and m855a1). Ceramic will stand up pretty well to 5.56 and IV there's basically nothing except tungsten core ammo which is extremely scarce and even then current issue mil plates (ESAPI Rev G-J, which aren't all that hard to get ahold of) are rated to stop 3 rounds of tungsten core 5.56.

Military plates and truly NIJ certified (check link below) are all rated to be multi hit. There is a chance of pen if it lands on the same exact place but getting that kind of accuracy is incredibly hard to do real world. If you're that accurate, aiming for the much larger exposed areas like the abdomen, pelvic girdle, femoral arteries, or head is much easier and effective than trying to stack rounds on a hole about 3 tenths of an inch big.

If you're still wanting an AR-10 or 308 semi auto: Daniel Defense has the DD5V4 and ~$2.5-3k depending on the sale and vendor. Absolute premium would be something like Knights Armament SR-25, but that's ~$5k and hard to find in stock. LMT has the MARS-H and FN offers the SCAR, which isn't mechanically the same as an AR-10 nor takes the same mags, but it has mostly similar controls and some features AR-10s don't have like a folding stock.

List of their certification and testing of various brands armor. Set filter for "status" active so you know it's up to date.
https://nij.ojp.gov/topics/equipment-and-technology/body-armor/ballistic-resistant-armor

 

[BallsMcLongDong]

I'm seriously investigating the AR-10. I have read first hand reports of soldiers in Afghanistan being hit in L4s by AKs firing the same round. From what I see, the AK fires a very similar round, but I think the NATO round is longer and should therefore have more grains and speed (??? i am retarded) and should hit harder. But the AK 7.62s will not pierce L4s but two shots placed on core will puncture lungs and break ribs.

Yessir. This is what we've been talking about. You're gonna have a really hard time piercing plates with anything you can reasonably get your hands on. However, two shots on those plates will cause a lot of damage, even if they don't pierce it. You can stop penetration, but you can't stop the physics of it hitting you. Not to mention that the spalling will fly up into neck or down into groin, and you also have more rounds and chances to hit the squishy things not covered by armor. Having a gun with a lot of bullets that you can fire on target quickly will almost always be superior. If you can land 3 hits for every one they fire back, you are winning the race.
If you're looking for power, .308 or 7.62 will offer you both the hard hits, and a decent mag capacity. Though I still think you would be perfectly served with hot 5.56 out of a drum. Fight will go smoother if you don't have to reload during.
But first, maybe go to a range and see what you actually like, and can comfortably, shoot. Shit, I am certain someone on the Internet loves you enough to let you use their range and all their toys.
I would love to be a Billy Badass and carry .44 mag every day to use in self defense, but I know my limitations. I do not like shooting .44 and cannot reliably actuate with it like I can 9mm. Worst feeling is buying a gun (or round) that you despise shooting, so you hardly ever practice with it.

 

[Seafarer]

I'm seriously investigating the AR-10. I have read first hand reports of soldiers in Afghanistan being hit in L4s by AKs firing the same round. From what I see, the AK fires a very similar round, but I think the NATO round is longer and should therefore have more grains and speed (??? i am retarded) and should hit harder. But the AK 7.62s will not pierce L4s but two shots placed on core will puncture lungs and break ribs.

Yes, the AR-10 shoots 7.62x51 and the AK shoots 7.62x39. 7.62x51 (aka .308 Winchester) is more powerful by pretty much every metric.

Here are the two cartridges side by side (left = 7.62x51, right = 7.62x39) for comparison:

 

[50 Calories]

Yessir. This is what we've been talking about. You're gonna have a really hard time piercing plates with anything you can reasonably get your hands on. However, two shots on those plates will cause a lot of damage, even if they don't pierce it. You can stop penetration, but you can't stop the physics of it hitting you. Not to mention that the spalling will fly up into neck or down into groin, and you also have more rounds and chances to hit the squishy things not covered by armor. Having a gun with a lot of bullets that you can fire on target quickly will almost always be superior. If you can land 3 hits for every one they fire back, you are winning the race.
If you're looking for power, .308 or 7.62 will offer you both the hard hits, and a decent mag capacity. Though I still think you would be perfectly served with hot 5.56 out of a drum. Fight will go smoother if you don't have to reload during.
But first, maybe go to a range and see what you actually like, and can comfortably, shoot. Shit, I am certain someone on the Internet loves you enough to let you use their range and all their toys.
I would love to be a Billy Badass and carry .44 mag every day to use in self defense, but I know my limitations. I do not like shooting .44 and cannot reliably actuate with it like I can 9mm. Worst feeling is buying a gun (or round) that you despise shooting, so you hardly ever practice with it.

2 shots of 308 won't do much to rifle armor. When NIJ certifies a rifle plate, that means at minimum it can take 6 rounds and that's without significant back face deformation. The force of a bullet is over estimated. Here's someone in armor being shot point blank with a 7.62 nato Rifle. https://youtu.be/o5f1Fo4r4_I?t=126

NIJ and military rifle plates are all tested to be multi hit and have limits on back face deformation. A round that's stopped but creates a 6 inch bulge on the inside face will not pass certification.

Firepower is definitely the way to go, smaller more controllable rounds replaced larger cartridges as primary fighting rounds all over the world for a reason.

Funny you mention handguns. I actually think in Null's case where it's someone seeking him out in particular that he should prepare for an encounter in a public area, away from his home and whatever trenches and alarm systems he's made. Cops do this all the time with violent suspects with arrest warrants. They don't nab them at their home where there could be a standoff, they get them on the roads where they're carrying far less and are more exposed.
For that reason I'd be concerned with practicing with a handgun more than anything.