DOOM

[Hooked on phobics]

I feel this is worth posting. I know people HATE shorts format, but...

This guy did a test, and it takes 110 punches....TO KILL A FUCKING IMP.
I'm going to be honest, I DROPPED doom eternal after playing the start because of this.

To sum up my experience, I jumped in, first zombie I tried punching to death because, its JUST a zombie, I punched him like 3 dozen times before eventually dying to a stray blow. I shrugged, and chalked this up to tutorial scripting or some shit, I've seen stuff like that, where it says, "kill this enemy with pistol" and you can blow them up, burn them, air strike them, and they survive, because the script says you MUST use a pistol. SO whatever, dumb, but I figured it was temporary.

I then moved onto the first REAL fight room cleared it out besides a single zombie who only had melee, and tried again....same result, DOZENS of blows, and its barely effected.
Dropped the game after... And that video shows just HOW bad that is, 110 for an imp. I have no fucking idea how much the bigger monster would take, but safe to say, that video is pretty damning on how shit melee is, and I can't even fathom why. Would 11 punches, 10 x damage be "too strong" for Bethesda or something?

I probably will play it again sometime, but discovering that the first time is like looking up at fireworks in awe, but then a bird takes a shit in your mouth.

 

[SamTheEagle]

Doom Eternal was one step forward, two steps back from Doom 2016. I really wanted to like it, but shit like the punching and the extremely limited ammo was too annoying. I'm going to wait on reviews for the next Doom before playing it.

 

[Hooked on phobics]

Doom Eternal was one step forward, two steps back from Doom 2016. I really wanted to like it, but shit like the punching and the extremely limited ammo was too annoying. I'm going to wait on reviews for the next Doom before playing it.

Yeah, don't get me wrong, a LOT of stuff in eternal seem cool, better gore, more demons, the meat hook, ect ect, but between ammo scarcity and absolutely gimped melee, you really get the impression the devs were thinking "NO YOU IDIOT, you WILL play exactly as we intended and you will LIKE it!"
And I never like such hamfisted game design. I don;t mind being guided there, but lowering melee damage to 1/50th of what it was (or something like that number) is just stupid.

 

[Snekposter]

Yeah, don't get me wrong, a LOT of stuff in eternal seem cool, better gore, more demons, the meat hook, ect ect, but between ammo scarcity and absolutely gimped melee, you really get the impression the devs were thinking "NO YOU IDIOT, you WILL play exactly as we intended and you will LIKE it!"
And I never like such hamfisted game design. I don;t mind being guided there, but lowering melee damage to 1/50th of what it was (or something like that number) is just stupid.

Don't forget the sheer number of gimmicks you had like the flamethrower, ice bomb, blood punch, etc. They really overcomplicated what had been extremely fun due to its simplicity.

 

[DrearyDoomguy]

And I never like such hamfisted game design. I don;t mind being guided there, but lowering melee damage to 1/50th of what it was (or something like that number) is just stupid.

The idea was to effectively eliminate melee combat. Gunplay carries combat, and all effective melee is confined to prescripted glory kills/chainsaw/crucible/hammer. To be honest melee was borderline irrelevant in Doom 2016 so I can see why they didn't see much of a downside in pruning it as a feature, especially given all the other combat systems they were adding in. If that's a change you disliked then fair enough but personally I didn't really feel its absence very strongly. It never even occurred to me to try and punch an enemy to death, honestly. Doom is just not a game I think of as being melee oriented beyond a last resort when you're completely out of ammo.

That being said, TDA looks like a prime opportunity to bring back and even emphasize a melee system and I wouldn't be surprised if they strip down the overtuned equipment system of Eternal in favor of a simpler, punchier combat loop. That was the vibe I got watching the trailer (granted, not much to go off of).

 

[Snekposter]

That being said, TDA looks like a prime opportunity to bring back and even emphasize a melee system and I wouldn't be surprised if they strip down the overtuned equipment system of Eternal in favor of a simpler, punchier combat loop. That was the vibe I got watching the trailer (granted, not much to go off of).

Considering they showed off a ton of that flail/shield stuff I definitely think they're going that way. Honestly looks nice and brutal. The circular saw that doubles as a shield is pretty much the ideal Doomslayer weapon, especially in a much more "fantasy" setting with the Sentinels. Shit, this is pretty much "What if we added Warhammer to Doom?"

 

[Bear Powers]

you really get the impression the devs were thinking "NO YOU IDIOT, you WILL play exactly as we intended and you will LIKE it!"

This is one of the worst things with modern games, and I truly hate it. Games that give the illusion that you have options, but it turns out no, you MUST play only this specific way. It's absolutely infuriating. One of the first times I remember running face first into this sort of stuff was with with the first Brothers in Arms and shooting enemy soldiers who were behind some terrible cover, almost point blank in their faces, to no effect. I could practically hear the devs yelling "NOOOO BABY INFANT CHILD, you MUST flank them! Only THEN can you actually shoot them!! Enjoy mission failure."

It's why I've really cooled down on GTA (or really, Rockstar overall) after SA. "This is our cinematic presentation! You will ENJOY IT OUR WAY!" Fuck off. Give me Vice City where you could park vehicles in helpful places and make some missions laughably easy and amusing (assuming they didn't de-spawn which happened occasionally). I remember having trouble with the Cabmaggeddon mission for some reason until I had the idea to grab the tank and start the mission with it. All of the enemy taxis kamikaze'd happily and with gusto into the tank, was hysterical.

I didn't dislike Doom Eternal, but it mostly just made me feel old. I knew what to do, I knew the doomdance, but if you missed a step it was bad news. Half of that is on me, because I actually am getting older and slower, and get sort of flustered easily and flub things up because my brain freezes, but it was just so unrelentingly in your face. I felt that 2016 allowed some leeway, some breathing room, in how to take the enemies on, notably more than you got in Eternal, and if you didn't do some variation of the dance, which didn't exist in 2016, you were screwed. I had no desire to play the DLC though I'll probably get to it when I'm feeling masochistic.

 

[Hooked on phobics]

Part of me too was I hate absolutely abritrary removals between sequels when theres REALLY no good excuse, like punching in doom2016 worked fine, so you EXPECT it would work just fine again, but it didnt.

I actually had a similar thing with gta5, I liked the series, and a friend showed me, I was playing and I asked "wait, how do you crouch?". He tried showing me I could crouch behind COVER, but couldn't just crouch in the middle of the sidewalk, and for the life of me, I couldn't just let that go, its a very simple addition, all the animations for crouching were there, but no crouch button because they decided in infinite wisdom to remove it.

I can understand some things being removed, but both cases came off like shit design and saying "screw it, just axe it"
Its also frustrating because annoying stuff like this you EXPECT in a mediocre game, but in a good game, it sticks out so bad.

 

[Vibralldo]

TDA looks promising

There was a lot of fun in the simplicity of 2016's combat that Eternal lost due to its complexity (despite me loving Eternal, but they're practically 2 different genres)

I'm excited for a return to "see those things? Kill it with whatever you want" instead of Eternal's "sure, you can kill most enemies with most guns, but it makes the game 20x harder if you don't memorize each enemy's specific weakness and the quickswap keys and you'll probably die before you can finish them"

I also don't understand why doom eternal had a basic punch animation at all when it does 0 damage. I understand why they made melee useless, it makes farming glory kills far too easy, and getting glory kills is way more important in Eternal due to the blood punch, but t'd have been better if the punch/interact button did nothing at all if you don't have blood punch stored or a button to touch.

 

[DrearyDoomguy]

I also don't understand why doom eternal had a basic punch animation at all when it does 0 damage. I understand why they made melee useless, it makes farming glory kills far too easy, and getting glory kills is way more important in Eternal due to the blood punch, but t'd have been better if the punch/interact button did nothing at all if you don't have blood punch stored or a button to touch.

Were it me, I'd add in some hidden feature where melee power gets supercharged when your ammo is at 0 just for shits and giggles.

 

[Stasi]

Is GZDoom still the best/recommended way to play OG Doom? Or is there better source port out there these days?

Found my old install of GZDoom on a backup hard drive with all the Doom engine games on it and thinking of playing through Heretic again.

 

[Hooked on phobics]

Is GZDoom still the best/recommended way to play OG Doom? Or is there better source port out there these days?

Found my old install of GZDoom on a backup hard drive with all the Doom engine games on it and thinking of playing through Heretic again.

Notably, zandronum STILL has a place for multiplayer but, frankly not much else. GZdoom is capable of multiplayer, but its peer to peer, harder to setup, and more wonky / demands decent user knowledge.

Zandronum is usually bundled with doomseeker , which is about and plug and play as you will get for zdoom multiplayer, it even downloads server mods for you, so you just click a server and join.

But yeah, gzdoom is the way to go for single player. better graphics and mod capability, I was just getting up and running with brutal doom on my steam deck.

 

[Lone Wandering Courier]

Is GZDoom still the best/recommended way to play OG Doom?

Generally, for vanilla OG doom people tend to lean towards Chocolate Doom, Crispy Doom, or fork of Crispy Doom like Woof!. Most people don't like GZDoom largely due to texture filtering (though it can be turned off) and it actually isn't 100% compatible with Vanilla Doom. For Heretic though, GZDoom is a decent way to go

 

[Hooked on phobics]

it actually isn't 100% compatible with Vanilla Doom

Do you mean its not 100% accurate to the graphics of dos? because pretty sure you can enable software graphics and other stuff to basically emulate skulltag esqe graphics.

 

[Lone Wandering Courier]

Do you mean its not 100% accurate to the graphics of dos? because pretty sure you can enable software graphics and other stuff to basically emulate skulltag esqe graphics.

No, more like the scripting/code/logic or whatever you want to call it. Even if you set script compatibility to "Strict" it still has different behavior from the vanilla game.

 

[Hooked on phobics]

No, more like the scripting/code/logic or whatever you want to call it. Even if you set script compatibility to "Strict" it still has different behavior from the vanilla game.

this might be the case for incredibly fringe elements, but outside the most anally retentive, I don't think most would care. I've played plenty with gzdoom and saw no noticeably game-play differences.
Is one of those differences that "infinite ghosts" glitch, which causes all monsters to be immortal no clipping ghosts? because TBH, why the ever loving shit would you want that for practical gameplay?
If thats the kinda things being lost, I think nothing of value was lost (outside the occasional trying it for the laughs)

 

[Kane Lives]

this might be the case for incredibly fringe elements, but outside the most anally retentive, I don't think most would care. I've played plenty with gzdoom and saw no noticeably game-play differences.
Is one of those differences that "infinite ghosts" glitch, which causes all monsters to be immortal no clipping ghosts? because TBH, why the ever loving shit would you want that for practical gameplay?
If thats the kinda things being lost, I think nothing of value was lost (outside the occasional trying it for the laughs)

Several (usually joke) maps actually rely on this. Plutonia in particular has a lot of map behaviour that relies on engine quirks and bugs that may be lost if you "fix" the bugs. (The classic one is how they did the invisible bridge in MAP02, and how they simulated the appearance of deep water with missing lower linedefs.) That said, most of those aren't of interest to the casual player, and even GZDoom tend to support these with compability settings.

 

[Cantercoin]

Doom 1 + 2 have just been combined into 1 new megabundle with a bunch of new features like:

• All the previous official expansions and a new episode called Legacy of Rust made in collaboration with ID, Machine games, and Nightdive studios.
• Community-published mod support with an in-game mod browser
• The ability to switch between the OG midi music or Andrew Hulshults IDKFA
• BOOM source compatibility
• Improved controller and M/KB support, etc.
  

 

[Scarthew]

Doom Eternal was one step forward, two steps back from Doom 2016. I really wanted to like it, but shit like the punching and the extremely limited ammo was too annoying. I'm going to wait on reviews for the next Doom before playing it.

Doom eternal is fucking amazing we finally got a AAA game from the west that has some level of actual design and balance to its mechanics and.... we'll never see it again because faggots like you who don't even play games just like to cry. Why have any semblance of game design when the masses have made it clear they don't like games, they just want to run around with a shotgun and turn their brain off.

 

[The handsome tard]

If this new version plays its cards right, it could be the definitive way of playing Doom as it includes actual online co-op and deathmatch (which the previous one didnt have for...reasons) and it can play mods and wads too.

Doom eternal is fucking amazing we finally got a AAA game from the west that has some level of actual design and balance to its mechanics and.... we'll never see it again because faggots like you who don't even play games just like to cry. Why have any semblance of game design when the masses have made it clear they don't like games, they just want to run around with a shotgun and turn their brain off.

Doom 1 + 2 have just been combined into 1 new megabundle with a bunch of new features like:

• All the previous official expansions and a new episode called Legacy of Rust made in collaboration with ID, Machine games, and Nightdive studios.
• Community-published mod support with an in-game mod browser
• The ability to switch between the OG midi music or Andrew Hulshults IDKFA
• BOOM source compatibility
• Improved controller and M/KB support, etc.

Really excited but is this something we will need to buy again or is it a free update akin to Quake 1 and 2? I swear I wasnt able to find a straight answer.

edit: okay, turns out its a free update.