Trainwreck The Empathic Nutritionist / Empathic Mamahood / Robyn Grogitsky-Ramirez / Luna Elva Ramirez / Glenn Ramirez / Atlas Glenn Standford Ramirez - Eyefucking Sociopath Selfie Addict Mother and Closeted Gymrat Pothead Father who use Instagram to Parade their Homemade Homunculus Tard Baby Created by their Refusal to Follow any Medical Oversights

[TheCakeIsALie]

At the risk of more dumb flags, one thing that jumped out at me about the birth story is that supposedly the midwife was checking Luna's heartbeat periodically (I don't know WTF Robyn's whole deal with not wanting that is, like why?). But it made me wonder if that's possible. Is Robyn lying? Or did the midwife fuck up with that too? I think it happens a lot where the doctors or whoever thinks they have the baby's heartbeat but it's actually the mom... I was on the operating table about to get a c section (failure to progress) when they realized what they thought was baby's heartbeat was actually mine... luckily they quickly found hers. Still gives me nightmares to think about. Anyway, I'm left wondering about that part of her birth story, it doesn't really add up.

Yes, this is possible. Several ways:

Pinard stethoscope

A non-electrical, hollow wooden tube that the midwife places on the mother's abdomen, directly over the area where the baby's heartbeat is clearest. The midwife then puts her ear on the other end of the tube to listen to the baby's heartbeat

Vag examination

During the exam, the midwife may place a small electrode on the baby's head and attach it to a thin wire that connects to a machine. This method is not used if there are any infection

Other methods: Doppler or electronic fetal monitor machine

Assuming at home with no equipment: number one would be the most sensical way

Is it possible for people to screw it up? Yes. But with the pinard…its not a sound, it’s vibration

ETA: some midwives find that the American-style fetoscopes (a Pinard on stethoscope ‘ears’) are easier in labour, especially when women are in all-fours or standing positions.

Anyone can misinterpret anything really but it is possible to monitor fetal heart rate in labor. It varies by the skill of the midwife.

 

[Disgruntled Pupper]

Late but

I've seen other tard babies, especially the Hartleys, have feet that scrunch up and turn outwards like Luna's have, but I've never seen the curling backwards that's getting more and more pronounced in her left foot especially. I've said her feet remind me of Chinese lotus feet, but now I'm starting to think of the Wicked Witch's stockings curling up after the house landed on her.

 

[jvgjtidk]

Yes, this is possible. Several ways:

Pinard stethoscope

A non-electrical, hollow wooden tube that the midwife places on the mother's abdomen, directly over the area where the baby's heartbeat is clearest. The midwife then puts her ear on the other end of the tube to listen to the baby's heartbeat

Vag examination

During the exam, the midwife may place a small electrode on the baby's head and attach it to a thin wire that connects to a machine. This method is not used if there are any infection

Other methods: Doppler or electronic fetal monitor machine

Assuming at home with no equipment: number one would be the most sensical way

Is it possible for people to screw it up? Yes. But with the pinard…its not a sound, it’s vibration

ETA: some midwives find that the American-style fetoscopes (a Pinard on stethoscope ‘ears’) are easier in labour, especially when women are in all-fours or standing positions.

Anyone can misinterpret anything really but it is possible to monitor fetal heart rate in labor. It varies by the skill of the midwife.

sorry, what I meant is it possible the midwife was actually checking Luna's heart and it sounded ok only for her to end up with such a terrible hypoxic injury? It seems like she must have either not actually been checking or doing it wrong

 

[New & Improved Username]

I gave birth to my only child in 1992, in the hospital and the fetal heart monitor was a velcro belt type deal.

Srs when will Luna get out of this? I've followed this thread for years now and medfags stood firm on the precident that sufferers of her condition didn't make it past 3 years. When will she be set free?

 

[TheCakeIsALie]

sorry, what I meant is it possible the midwife was actually checking Luna's heart and it sounded ok only for her to end up with such a terrible hypoxic injury? It seems like she must have either not actually been checking or doing it wrong

MCE presents after birth, so she didn’t come out with a large head off the bat. You can tell in a neonate because of brain scans, but the head itself isn’t just suddenly huge and presents right as she’s coming out and oops..large headed baby

I don’t know what went on with that midwife, if she tried to convince Robyn to go to the hospital or what, do we even know if she was actually licensed?

To be quite honest, midwifes should be at the level of nursing. If you’re going be dealing with possible medical mishaps and birth injuries, you should have to undergo real education. My state requires midwives hold minimum, a masters degree in midwifery. Every state should require this. I don’t know if all do, and if all do, then great. I don’t want to
pin this on the the midwife directly unless she did not take any appropriate action within her scope.

 

[Thomas Eugene Paris]

At the risk of more dumb flags, one thing that jumped out at me about the birth story is that supposedly the midwife was checking Luna's heartbeat periodically (I don't know WTF Robyn's whole deal with not wanting that is, like why?). But it made me wonder if that's possible. Is Robyn lying? Or did the midwife fuck up with that too? I think it happens a lot where the doctors or whoever thinks they have the baby's heartbeat but it's actually the mom...

The midwife likely used a fetal stethoscope or a Pinard horn, which allow auscultation of the fetal heartbeat. As with any moderately complex skill, including fetal ultrasonography, there's some finesse involved, but they're effective if used correctly and are commonly used by midwives. Obviously, using this method , you can't listen to the fetus's heart the entire time the mother is in labor, which is a disadvantage.

It is unclear to me why you're so keen to absolve Robyn of responsibility. I don't think anyone here (thread regulars, at least) is claiming she's solely to blame but it's pretty hard to imagine how she wouldn't have had an inkling that something was wrong. Even worse, to me, her making Glenn promise not to acquiesce if she asked to be taken to the hospital during labor suggests that she was aware beforehand that home birth confers particular risks. She was negligent and irresponsible at the very least. Your asking how could she have known makes it seem as though it's unreasonable to expect a competent adult to have been aware of basic facts.

 

[GenociderSyo]

The midwife killed a child before hand during labor so she was just doing what she knew. And she wasn't even a real midwife she was an IG person all of Robyn's "medical" people are IG people. Robyn thinks even vaginal exams harm the baby she BARELY let them use fetoscopes on her. And the only reason she realized Luna had MCE was because Luna was starving to death and siezing and her followers had to tell her to get something done for it.

 

[jvgjtidk]

No, not trying to absolve anyone of responsibility. I really am just wondering from a medical point of view what a competent heart rate monitor would have shown. If there's something going on, it's just that my first child's birth was fairly traumatic (got stuck, had to be resuscitated) so I'm just excessively interested in childbirth gone wrong.

edit: I do think the biggest thing Robyn can be blamed for is choosing a home birth in the first place and hiring such a shit midwife.

 

[TheCakeIsALie]

The midwife killed a child before hand during labor so she was just doing what she knew. And she wasn't even a real midwife she was an IG person all of Robyn's "medical" people are IG people. Robyn thinks even vaginal exams harm the baby she BARELY let them use fetoscopes on her. And the only reason she realized Luna had MCE was because Luna was starving to death and siezing and her followers had to tell her to get something done for it.

Please tell me that’s not true. That’s abhorrent if so. The medfag in me wants to throttle that person.

The midwife likely used a fetal stethoscope or a Pinard horn, which allow auscultation of the fetal heartbeat. As with any moderately complex skill, including fetal ultrasonography, there's some finesse involved, but they're effective if used correctly and are commonly used by midwives. Obviously, using this method , you can't listen to the fetus's heart the entire time the mother is in labor, which is a disadvantage.

It is unclear to me why you're so keen to absolve Robyn of responsibility. I don't think anyone here (thread regulars, at least) is claiming she's solely to blame but it's pretty hard to imagine how she wouldn't have had an inkling that something was wrong. Even worse, to me, her making Glenn promise not to acquiesce if she asked to be taken to the hospital during labor suggests that she was aware beforehand that home birth confers particular risks. She was negligent and irresponsible at the very least. Your asking how could she have known makes it seem as though it's unreasonable to expect a competent adult to have been aware of basic facts.

Yes, as I explained before, it is useful and a study between a pinard and doppler are pretty close in terms of accuracy. People often forget there are countries out there where you’re lucky if you can even get access to certain medicines let alone actual medical equipment. Remote villages aren’t going to have sonography, ekg equipment etc

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6042559/

 

[GenociderSyo]

Please tell me that’s not true. That’s abhorrent if so. The medfag in Mr wants to throttle that person.

Robyn even posted in support of her when it came out that we had found the info. Robyn and Glenn definitely know this thread exists. It is why there is no reason to even question her actions she does not have any empathy at all.

 

[Rose Tint My World]

I sympathize with those who sympathize with Globyn. I can totally see how someone could view her as a mom doing what she thinks is best for her kids. But that's the problem with both of them - though, Robyn is easier to hate on because shes the one shilling more BS on her instagram. Both of them are idiots, plain and simple. Just stupid, uneducated people. Both value their own interests (gym and shilling stupid products and being the Crunchiest Mama on the internet) above the needs and wellbeing of their own.

I think homebirth and nonmedicalized pregnancy is a retarded practice and ultimately is for the comfort of the mother versus the well being of both mom and baby. I don't think any mom, especially one posting their fucking birth pictures on instagram with every other kid she popped out staring at her birthing a child, is having a homebirth for any reason other than some kind of dick measuring contest with other weird, crunchy mamas.

Even if you want a low intervention pregnancy I simply cannot understand why you wouldn't want that to happen in a setting where there are loads of trained professionals to assist if something goes wrong. There are places that offer waterbirths and other alternative births while still being a part of a hospital. Even if you don't give a fuck about your kids which Robyn doesn't, I can't wrap my mind around not having any kind of self preservation regarding such an intense event like childbirth. Take my words for what you will though because I can't imagine wanting to go through childbirth without heavy meds.

 

[SpiceyHuman]

Even if you want a low intervention pregnancy I simply cannot understand why you wouldn't want that to happen in a setting where there are loads of trained professionals to assist if something goes wrong. There are places that offer waterbirths and other alternative births while still being a part of a hospital. Even if you don't give a fuck about your kids which Robyn doesn't, I can't wrap my mind around not having any kind of self preservation regarding such an intense event like childbirth. Take my words for what you will though because I can't imagine wanting to go through childbirth without heavy memeds.

You bring up a very valid point.
Evwry hospital that I have given birth in, had low intervention options especially for women who choose a obgyn that offers more traditional births. Some rooms had birthing tubs, birthing bars/chairs to assist in various birth positions, some offered aroma therapy and music if you wanted it, etc. The key is, like you said, if something starts to go wrong, they can catch and hopefully handle it immediately.

 

[Disgruntled Pupper]

Srs when will Luna get out of this? I've followed this thread for years now and medfags stood firm on the precident that sufferers of her condition didn't make it past 3 years. When will she be set free?

That's the fun of tard babies- no one knows, but for sure, they'll last longer than you think!

I think it's important to keep in mind that 1) we've gotten better and better at keeping extreme cases alive and that 2) because of #1 and because of how rare most of these cases are, the data for things like life expectancy is still very much in flux. Especially for Luna, her condition is almost unheard of in developed countries, so when trying to determine prognosis there's just not a lot to go off of. The doctors (or our medical kiwis) can look at how long previous cases were reported to live, but when did those cases live and die? The 2000s? The 80s? The 50s? Where did they live and die? Here? Africa? Machu Picchu? What care did they get and what, if anything, was done to try to extend their survival? There's a lot of variables that no one knows.

 

[TismFarmer]

I have to say, Oakleaf is very adorable and the spit of Atlas..
At least Gymbrah has his 2 little mini-mes even if Lizard Woman gets the horror show..

 

[just lurking]

I have to say, Oakleaf is very adorable and the spit of Atlas..
At least Gymbrah has his 2 little mini-mes even if Lizard Woman gets the horror show..

Luna likely would've been a mini robyn had robyn not destroyed her brain in child birth. Sometimes i see the little girl she would've looked like and it makes my heart hurt because she deserved to grow up like any other kid instead of.. this hell.
Atlas and tree certainly soften the blows this thread gives

 

[Lemon Squeezer]

I gave birth to my only child in 1992, in the hospital and the fetal heart monitor was a velcro belt type deal.

Srs when will Luna get out of this? I've followed this thread for years now and medfags stood firm on the precident that sufferers of her condition didn't make it past 3 years. When will she be set free?

Each post in this thread adds a day to Luna's existence. Woe be upon ye, BP dwellers.

 

[Breadbear]

Why is this a debate? It's in the OP. The midwives used a doppler and periodically checked Luna's heartbeat.

 

[just lurking]

Each post in this thread adds a day to Luna's existence. Woe be upon ye, BP dwellers.

Lunas been cursed ala the lich queen. Maybe the day lich queen goes is the same day luna goes, breaking the curse

Or modern medicine is just too good unfortunately

 

[BoobWhiskers]

Or modern medicine is just too good unfortunately

Well, if it makes you feel any better, Robyn uses precious little of it?

 

[Thomas Eugene Paris]

I really am just wondering from a medical point of view what a competent heart rate monitor would have shown.

The fetal heart rate pattern is abnormal in the setting of perinatal asphyxia. If Robyn had given birth at a hospital, with continuous fetal heart rate monitoring, this would have been detected before it was too late.

edit: I do think the biggest thing Robyn can be blamed for is choosing a home birth in the first place and hiring such a shit midwife.

That's the thing, though. Robyn's choice to have a home birth attended by an incompetent midwife is not just "the biggest thing", it is the entire problem.

I don’t want to
pin this on the the midwife directly unless she did not take any appropriate action within her scope.

I don't mean to sound like a dick, but I very much disagree. The midwife bears at least as much responsibility for the outcome as Robyn does. She had to have realized at some point that she was in over her head and something unusual was happening, but she continued to reassure Robyn that everything was fine.

The midwife was the professional in this situation and should have known that there was a problem well before Luna's brain was destroyed. Fuck the midwife.