Can the clock be run back for balooning budgets and dev time? - The price of ever evolving technology

Celso Bin Portiolli

Understanding the world a tism at a time
kiwifarms.net
Joined
Sep 19, 2024
So, everyone is aware the PS5 has no games.
That was kind of inevitable: every company wants to sell games at full price, be it $60 on console or $40 on handheld (when those were a thing). What constitutes a game being worth full price for the average costumer is directly related to hardware potential, and hardware potential is related to budget.
That is to say, back in the 360 days, if you were to make a Castlevania game, it would have to be a long 3D game, fairly big in scope, which is what we got with Lords of Shadow, a God of War wannabe. The DS, which was its contemporary, couldn't run a game like that, so it would HAVE to be a relatively cheaper, smaller title, like the ones we got, which expanded on the Symphony of the Night formula and were much better games overall.
The catch is: you could not sell the DS Castlevania games on the 360. Not at full price. Even if they were better games, it would not seem worth it to gamers.
So handhelds served an interesting function of providing a market for cheaper, more experimental games that were not indie.
Harada of Tekken fame recollected on the development of Tekken 5 how the hardware itself (the PS2, at the time) limited development resources. That is to say, even if they wanted to spend a billion on graphics, the hardware cap would come much, much earlier.
Nowadays, the Switch serves a similar function. It CANNOT run 400 million dollar AAAA games, so it doesn't. Compared to PS4/5, games for it come out faster and are made for much cheaper, while maintaining retail value.
The bigger issue, though, is that it's all iterative. When the Switch 2 comes out, it will likely be way weaker then the PS5, but much more powerful than the OG Switch, so the budget floor WILL increase, making it a harder to get in then the Switch 1.
Big point here is: as long as the only games seem as worth being full price are long, bloated and expensive, all games aiming for it will have to take the ever increasing time and money to meet it, which will increase risk, which will result in safer, slop-er games.
As a fan of old-school hour long arcade stuff, ain't no big company going to spend all this time and money on that type of game when they can't sell it for a good profit. It has to be a 300 hour RPG open world action hybrid to get the critic scores and sales.
I am not blaming gamers, though, if that is what you take away. I'm part of the group that wouldn't find it worthwhile too. It's just an unfortunate side effect of technological progress and the expectations they set.
Is there a remedy for it? Fuck if I know, lol
 
Please delete if out of date, but if the mods think this post isn't very thread-worth I would be happy to make changes
 
Yes and no.

There is no turning back the clock as you say. The floor has gone up. It's a shame that door will be closed for new, small teams who can't compete on the same level, or make money doing contract ports of bigger games.

The problem with AAA/AAAA budgets is different. They're ballooning not because of tech, but in spite of it. In theory, better tools and more head room should allow games to be made cheaper. Greater access to stock resources like sound effects, textures, and engines should allow devs to fill out their game with content quicker. AAAA games aren't doing that. They're spending money on in house engines that don't work, wasting it on FMVs, cutscenes, and graphics that look good in trailers, spending a fortune on DEI and community managers. And the elephant in the room, investors with the mindset that a game is either the biggest hit ever or an obscure failure.
 
Part of my point is that the floor gets raised for everyone, mid-sized included, which makes the industry as a whole riskier, therefore more safe and lame
Plenty of games that use retro mechanics and graphics that are doing just fine. I was just gifted OTXO by a generous member of this community, a game I am looking forward to playing. As far as I am concerned, it has the potential to be better than any AAAA slop released as of late.
Video on the game, if anybody else is interested
People forget that this industry was always gay and inefficient. What drove it forward were the few pioneers and innovators that everybody else copied, nothing is going to change. Battle Royale? Yeah, that was spawned from AAAA studios trying to imitate PUBG. All the roguelike elements? Older than many people playing those games. Even back in the day, everyone wanted all their games to be multiplayer only for some reason in the late 90s-early 2000s, to the point where giants like Quake and Unreal made multiplayer-only entries instead of single player blockbusters like before(mirroring Black Ops 4 and Battlefield 2042 of modern day). All that the balooning budget will do is whittle away the competition, if you play it safe then you're not going to make a profit. Simple as.
 
They're spending money on in house engines that don't work, wasting it on FMVs, cutscenes, and graphics that look good in trailers, spending a fortune on DEI and community managers.
You forgot the tourism on company dime. Capcom send entire teams across the southern US to 3d scan objects to put in RE7. It's not difficult to model a vase and put on some basic texture but they go and scan them for some reason instead. Almost every AAA dev does it now and it's not even historic objects they want, it's every day garbage you can easily find pictures of online and recreate in Blender.

Big budgets can easily be rolled back and it all depends on the artists being used. A cell shaded game requires a lot less work than a photo realistic one. If cell shading became a popular style then budgets would drop drastically over night. A shift in genre away from open world would drop the budgets as well.

AA devs would do well into looking into alternative high quality art styles if they want to compete. Leave the trashy retro stuff to indie devs and do high quality animated looking games and they can compete on an even footing with AAA games. The only difference is the marketing budget and there's ways around that if you get the right streamers on board and know your audience. You don't need AAA marketing to get your audience to viral you and have you discussed in the right circles.
 
The only way to turn the clock back is for a major readjustment in the industry; allow the bubble to burst and crash the market with no survivors.

A reset needs to happen where powerful hardware offers a myriad options and genres of games. Consoles trying to become PCs has killed the console market. Console games being loaded with the mobile-game-esque whale-bait mechanics has killed console AAA exclusive games.

If PC can live in harmony with yuge games like cyberpunk and smaller, arcade-tier 'shower with your dad simulator', there's no reason console can't except for greed. Greed and the blind charging-forward of moar profit, despite investors and console studios knowing how to make a fucking game anymore - because a game to them is a piece of entertainment media chock-full of 'the message'.

Let the greedy become so hungry for more that the they eat themselves and cannabilise the industry until nothing is left but excreted disasters.
 
A good game concept. Either a single indie dev makes a game about it; takes 8 years and when it releases, it's a 3 hour game. Alternatively, a huge company does it; risks complete bankruptcy to make a game about the same concept of 20-30 hours, and if it succeeds, youll get a sequel 5 years later.
 
Probably not. Any actually fun innovative concepts or ideas are ran out of town because people just want to complain about everything and don't really give a shit about the quality of games. Indies are more concerned with milking paypigs on patreon for as long as possible and never delivering anything more than a demo or two if they aren't outright scammers, and AAA has been a political propaganda outlet since forever. Instead of recruiting for the military like COD used to, its pushing dysgenics and other traitorous nonsense. Just like with mobile games, its probably a money laundering front for the rich and powerful instead of a fun interactive medium like it used to be.

I seriously doubt any sizable fraction of the millions poured into development actually goes to the studio or developers and is just pocketed by Management.
 
Last edited:
Probably not. Any actually fun innovative concepts or ideas are ran out of town because people just want to complain about everything and don't really give a shit about the quality of games.
The problem word in this section is "people."

Gaming has gotten worse as more browns, histrionic women, and LGBTQMAP+ have gotten into it. This means that the lowest common denominator of who has to be catered to has tanked.
 
The problem word in this section is "people."

Gaming has gotten worse as more browns, histrionic women, and LGBTQMAP+ have gotten into it. This means that the lowest common denominator of who has to be catered to has tanked.
>"NOOOO WE HAVE TO COMPLAIN ABOUT NIGGERS AND TROONS ALL THE TIME! WE CANT ENJOY LIFE AND SIMPLY NOT GIVE ATTENTION TO THEM! WE MUST CONSOOOM!!!!!"

Your kind of response was exactly what I'm talking about. The Propagandists don't even have to make games anymore when regardless of the place, they're constantly going "DID YOU SEE WHAT THE TROONS MADE?" Well guess what. I don't give a fuck and won't let them live rent free in my head like you do and others like you do. Keep your spook glownigger bullshit to yourself.
 
Notice that they can't actually say that the statement is incorrect.

To elaborate, it's not just the technology. It's that the playerbase has gotten worse as gaming has expanded. Many so-called game players cannot tolerate simpler graphics or not having a "casual mode" even when the game is already pretty simple.
 
Last edited:
The best that can be hoped for is that some of these companies melt away, or are forced to back off of the worst of the shit they get up to.

People are hoping for "another game crash", but forget that the crash of 1983
1. Only really affected consoles, pc gaming and arcades were basically untouched.
2. Was less of a crash and more of consoles getting viewed as dumb fad toys. Yeah it annihilated a lot of the console companies from that time, but it was hardly video games disappearing.
3. Was localized to the US.

A market crash isn't coming, at least not in the way people are probably hoping. Yeah, Sony lost millions on Concord, but with how much money they have to toss around, that's "fire a few people and grumble" type money, not "the sky is falling" type money.
 
Part of my point is that the floor gets raised for everyone, mid-sized included, which makes the industry as a whole riskier, therefore more safe and lame
that's not how the industry works tho, you'll always get our undertales and stardew valleys. all that's imploding is AAAA goyslop for being unsustainable and a corporate product without a customer base.
 
that's not how the industry works tho, you'll always get our undertales and stardew valleys. all that's imploding is AAAA goyslop for being unsustainable and a corporate product without a customer base.
My point is more that anything in between solo indie and Triple A slop gets more expensive tougher to sell
 
>"NOOOO WE HAVE TO COMPLAIN ABOUT NIGGERS AND TROONS ALL THE TIME! WE CANT ENJOY LIFE AND SIMPLY NOT GIVE ATTENTION TO THEM! WE MUST CONSOOOM!!!!!"

Your kind of response was exactly what I'm talking about. The Propagandists don't even have to make games anymore when regardless of the place, they're constantly going "DID YOU SEE WHAT THE TROONS MADE?" Well guess what. I don't give a fuck and won't let them live rent free in my head like you do and others like you do. Keep your spook glownigger bullshit to yourself.
I mean, tell me when he's telling lies. There is more browns, LGBTQoids and histrionic women everywhere now and everywhere they go they bring the whole medium down with them. Which of these are you?

The best that can be hoped for is that some of these companies melt away, or are forced to back off of the worst of the shit they get up to.

People are hoping for "another game crash", but forget that the crash of 1983
1. Only really affected consoles, pc gaming and arcades were basically untouched.
2. Was less of a crash and more of consoles getting viewed as dumb fad toys. Yeah it annihilated a lot of the console companies from that time, but it was hardly video games disappearing.
3. Was localized to the US.

A market crash isn't coming, at least not in the way people are probably hoping. Yeah, Sony lost millions on Concord, but with how much money they have to toss around, that's "fire a few people and grumble" type money, not "the sky is falling" type money.
Video game companies weren't spending 400 million+ back then on games that only lasted 2 weeks. Sure, E.T was so bad it had to be thrown in landfills, but at least you can still play it today without a need for updates or an internet connection if you find a working cartridge. Concord discs are just coasters now.
My point is more that anything in between solo indie and Triple A slop gets more expensive tougher to sell
Good, make gatekeeping great again
 
Back