One man + multiple wives is the correct and natural state of the human family

[CiaphasCain]

I’m divorced.

Then she has escaped a fate worse than death.

 

[YourFriendlyLurker 2.0]

You ain't that rich, my lustful nigga.

 

[grump]

Dominant alpha men (alpha and beta referring to simply the realities of status and not a judgement call on their metaphysical worth) absent of social pressure, will naturally attempt to gather multiple of the most attractive females. This is shown over and over in ancient, tribal, and mormon etc societies across multiple cultures and anywhere where it has been allowed to resurface. Obviously the dynamic between the ancient man and his harem would be completely different from modern marriages so the jokes about ancient polygamy being impossible because a man would be henpecked by multiple wives is off the mark.

In cases where alpha men can't gather a harem they or at least the ones who can afford to will resort to tactics will serial monogamy. Its an inborn instinct and makes sense in the context of evolutionary biology and is seen all around us even today. Men spread their genes wide. It worked in the past because beta males made do with less partners or no partners or were simply killed or driven off.

In modern society we no longer kill off all the beta men anymore so men have to play Darwin's game the way women do by having one mate at time and upgrading or getting the best one possible. You could argue that this is the better way for today's civilization but to pretend that man's natural physical inclination is lifelong sexual monogamy is to indulge in a sentimental myth and ignores all the obvious evidence right in front of your face throughout history and in everyday behavior. A typical man without the suppression from intense social conditioning/pressure would bang every hot girl he came across if he had the chance. If he gets a chance at a hot 24 year old he sure as shit isn't going to ride or die for his 55 year old mate.

The gradual surpression and redirection of male sexuality across the millenia is perhaps the most consequential event in human history and its amazing how nearly everybody is blind to it. Even those who are not raging feminists.

 

[Großmann]

If he gets a chance at a hot 24 year old he sure as shit isn't going to ride or die for his 55 year old mate.

This makes me wonder if you have a family of your own or not. This is the type of behavior that literally ruined a generation of men, with baby boomer dads running out on their families to fuck and leaving their wives home with their Gen X children as she slowly becomes neurotic, which, in turn, screws them up. A man governed by his penis is a weak man.

 

[Male Idiot]

Appealing. Natural even. Islamic? Certainly! As long as you can just muzzle them when they start bitching.

But without heavy tinkering with birth rates, this is a pipe dream.

You would need to kill off most men, or increase female birth rate to match and have a population ratio of 20% men to 80% women.

While that maybe possible with genetical engineering, we aren't yet there and it is a few centuries off.

It would be just easier and less messy to make robot extra wives, or just genetically engineer polyamory away.

Or even genetically engineer sexual attraction away and just have an AI match you genetically to one woman, and give both of you a pill that makes you madly in love.
That would not have the issues of a 80% woman civilisation when they face the 90% male cloned Chinese army.

 

[Caddo Cobgang]

Ok Warren Jeffs

 

[Sweeter and Savoury]

I dunno

I was married for over 30 years and I honestly don't think I could manage more then 1 woman in my life. Not the sex bit but all the other shit that comes with a real relationship.

Now I know this is thirst bait for horny Farmers who can only think with their cocks because they are still in their 20's but believe it or not after decades together sex is not the most important part of a relationship. Adding more women into an already...exciting thing is just asking for chaos and pain.

A single woman is still more chaos and insanity then the average man can handle. More? I'll pass I like sleeping without worrying about waking up dickless.

 

[Rodeo Roadrunner]

A typical man without the suppression from intense social conditioning/pressure would bang every hot girl he came across if he had the chance. If he gets a chance at a hot 24 year old he sure as shit isn't going to ride or die for his 55 year old mate.

What an insane statement. Civilization was created not by men being slaves to their bodies and biological desires, but by mastering them. They first mastered themselves, then they turned to master Nature. Man imposed rules on Nature; primarily because Civilization cannot exist without basic rules and morality, codified into Laws. And these aren't just laws in public, as a matter of the State. Laws meant for Men themselves; codes of morality that they willingly imposed upon themselves for the betterment of all. You know this due to how human societies around the world independently developed many similar morals and moral codes. Things like, honor, loyalty, the ability to keep your promises. All of things that apply to staying true to your wife, and not just leaving her the moment you get a chance at a younger woman just because she has youth.

Even in the case where rulers/sultans/khans would take multiple wives, even taking younger ones as they themselves grew older, they didn't toss aside their first wife. It was actually considered a great DISHONOR to set aside their first wife. That's the other thing that all these 'harem enjoyers' commonly miss; the individuals that had harems weren't every supposed alpha male. It was an extremely rare circumstance, usually brought about by the fact that they were a ruler of a nation, or someone who had the FINANCIAL MEANS to support multiple women. It wasn't some badass alpha male dude; it was literally a fat sultan sitting in his palace with a bunch of women because he happened to be the ruler of a nation.

 

[Justa Grata Honoria]

Absolutely , I would rather share chad with 3 other women than talk to any of the men in here . We already let for generations incels , genetic failures and various trash to breed under arranged marriages and various other ways. It's time to cleanse the human race from non Chad's and their offspring.

 

[grump]

What an insane statement. Civilization was created not by men being slaves to their bodies and biological desires,

'Biological'/innate base desires lie alongside all aspects of civilization which is just another expression of it. Even when you think you are working against it you are working toward it. For example feminism seems like it is about high minded ideals but it is about base desires too where ugly women control the reproduction of men to increase their fitness. Civilization itself is ultimately no more than a deal and not an infallible one to maximize resources between parties. No more sacred than that.

Things like, honor, loyalty, the ability to keep your promises.

Literally nothing of that has anything to do with enforced monogamy. Ancient kings with harems could still have honor, loyalty, and keep promises and even keep their first wives.

Even in the case where rulers/sultans/khans would take multiple wives, even taking younger ones as they themselves grew older, they didn't toss aside their first wife. It was actually considered a great DISHONOR to set aside their first wife. That's the other thing that all these 'harem enjoyers' commonly miss; the individuals that had harems weren't every supposed alpha male. It was an extremely rare circumstance, usually brought about by the fact that they were a ruler of a nation, or someone who had the FINANCIAL MEANS to support multiple women. It wasn't some badass alpha male dude; it was literally a fat sultan sitting in his palace with a bunch of women because he happened to be the ruler of a nation.

Alpha in the sense I was talking about is about power and not necessarily stuff like good looks or physical fitness. Good for you if you can bench 400 lbs when the king can still send you to the executioner in a heartbeat.

Even in the case where rulers/sultans/khans would take multiple wives, even taking younger ones as they themselves grew older, they didn't toss aside their first wife.

I'm not making an argument against monogamy. If someone wants to do it go ahead. I'm advocating against the demonization of who men are naturally. A man can be at peace with who he is and accept reality on both sides and be monogamous at the same time. Or if he somehow manages to get the insane power that he's the emperor of the world and can get multiple hot ladies and they're fine with it. Congrats, I'm not going to lecture him. Men certainly don't owe women anything on this account. Like men the vast majority of women have the partner they do because they can't do any better but would upgrade in a new york minute if they could in the absence of social conditioning or sometimes even with it. Knowing this and being able to laugh about it with your partner is much healthier than clinging to the Oneitis hallmark fantasy where you pretend that you've both found your most ideal partner in the universe.

 

[One Winged Pear Farmer]

You can always tell these people are incels because if they ever lived with a single woman they would know how batshit insane you’d have to be to think multiple is desirable in any way

 

[Trump's Chosen]

This ensures the greatest potential for the children in the household.

This ensures children will have little fatherly involvement and that society will be weak and unstable because of the larger amount of incels who should instead be the foundation that society is built on their backs because they have a stake in the society.

One of the reasons why it works for ants and bees to have so many non producing slaves in their colony, is because workers are 75% genetically similar to all the children in their colony, so they lay down their lives for others that are genetically closer to them than our children are to us.

It's very rare for a society to be polygamous and succesful. It can support a number of people on the top to be like that, but not as a society wide construct.

 

[Lobster Cult High Priest]

why are wignats like this?

Mormons fixed it for you

 

[Rodeo Roadrunner]

For example feminism seems like it is about high minded ideals but it is about base desires too where ugly women control the reproduction of men to increase their fitness. Civilization itself is ultimately no more than a deal and not an infallible one to maximize resources between parties.

There is nuance to this. If you mean MODERN feminism, like 3rd wave feminism, then sure. 1st wave feminism I don't think that, since quite a few of the major proponents in the West for that were men in the 1st place, taking the stance that women should have the same rights as men under the law. There are graduations to it, but I don't think that has anything to do with ugly women wanting to control men's reproduction. You would have to give me examples of 18th and 19th century feminists stating those goals.

Literally nothing of that has anything to do with enforced monogamy. Ancient kings with harems could still have honor, loyalty, and keep promises and even keep their first wives.

For that part I was focused on making the point that societies across the world generally focused on a set of morals which included those elements, and those elements preclude the idea that you would just drop your wife the moment you can get a younger model. Later I also mention that even the in the cases where polygamy was allowed, setting aside your first wife was often looked down upon for those reasons.

Alpha in the sense I was talking about is about power and not necessarily stuff like good looks or physical fitness.

Sure, but often people now will try and make the claim that if they can just hold frame enough, that if they plug in the right words and body language into their interaction with women that they can get a harem. Sorry but it doesn't work that way. Maybe you can swing it for a while, but it always comes crashing down, especially in today's 1st world. Elon Musk can't get his baby momas to stay in line, and he is arguably one of if not the most powerful man on Earth. If he can't do it no one can. At least not in a society where women have rights. If you live in a 3rd world country where women are near property then sure, but that isn't worth discussing.

I'm advocating against the demonization of who men are naturally.

If your claim is that some small subset of men naturally want to have a harem, then sure I suppose that is reasonable. But there are differences even there between a sort of sexual fantasy, where you want a threesome, or you want a harem of women servicing you, vs the idea of ACTUAL polygamy, which is where you have to live with, manage, deal with, and raise children from multiple women at the same time. I don't think most men want that at all, and I think the ones that do is a small enough section that they are an exception to the rule, not a natural state of men.

Knowing this and being able to laugh about it with your partner is much healthier than clinging to the Oneitis hallmark fantasy where you pretend that you've both found your most ideal partner in the universe.

Yes, marriage is work, a partnership, where you take what you can get and make it work. I don't believe in soul mates or Disney nonsense, and that sort of thinking in the past few decades on the part of men and women has been a disaster for gender relations.

 

[regalterry]

Too lazy to read through the thread, but here's my 2 cents.

Polygny is a bad idea for human societies, it's why most cultures phase the practice out eventually. I do agree it's the "natural" default for humans, since the overwhelming majority of human civilizations through history (and I am talking of civilizations as units, not the number of people said civilizations encompassed) were polygnyous.

Most human cultures, under pressure from natural selection - if such a concept can be applied to human societies, eventually adopted a social contract whereby most men are guaranteed a mate via the way culture handles marriage, thus encouraging "beta" men be productive members of society.

On the other hand, if your civilization is experiencing expansion by conquest, then it's a pretty good way to motivate young men to join the military. Local women are in short supply because they have been married off to older, more established males, so the only way a young man can get a mate, or several, is by taking them from other tribes.

This setup also has the additional benefit of whittling down the number of young men via war attrition, so the pool of available females vs males will stay lopsided, allowing each man to have access to multiple females.

After the expansion/conquest period of a civilization ends and the inflow of additional women stops, this is where the problems begin. It results in what we'd nowadays call as "incel rage", a large percentage of young men that cannot find a mate because all the women are being hoarded by older or richer men, thus leading do widespread social instability and the rise of degeneracy (gooning, homosexuality et al).

A large reason why so many Middle Eastern countries are shitoles (besides being populated by low IQ subhumans) is that they never weaned themselves off polygny.

 

[grump]

If your claim is that some small subset of men naturally want to have a harem, then sure I suppose that is reasonable. But there are differences even there between a sort of sexual fantasy, where you want a threesome, or you want a harem of women servicing you, vs the idea of ACTUAL polygamy, which is where you have to live with, manage, deal with, and raise children from multiple women at the same time. I don't think most men want that at all, and I think the ones that do is a small enough section that they are an exception to the rule, not a natural state of men.

Most men biologically want sex with many women. Obviously thats not the same thing as living the rest of your life with multiple women in a modern style marriage dynamics. Thats not how it was in the ancient days and people who keep bringing it up as an argument against man's natural tendency toward polygyny are making strawmen.

 

[Local Farmer]

Imagine not only dealing with one women on the rag, but multiple at the same time

 

[donksmanSupreme42]

not exactly, if we were a harem-based species,all men would have had tiny dicks and balls
cuz there'd be no need to waste energy maintaining these energy hungry organs when youre gonna get laid 24/7 anyway, so even if u have a micropenis and have a 1% fertilization chance, you'd still pump out children cuz ur gonna be fucking ur harem 24/7


that's how it works with pretty much all other primates that use a harem-style social structure (mostly gorillas and baboons)

 

[I'm Retarded?]

3-4 is rookie numbers. I have over a dozen wives though unfortunately I have been unsuccessful in impregnating any of them despite how many times I've nutted in my body pillow

 

[George Lucas]

You can always tell these people are incels because if they ever lived with a single woman they would know how batshit insane you’d have to be to think multiple is desirable in any way

The ‘one woman is insane, thus two must be double insane’ is a misunderstanding of women.

A woman who lives alone with her husband will start to see her husband as an equal and want to steer dynamics of the household. By adding more women to the household, they start trying to control each other instead of the husband. The husband becomes insulated from whatever dumb drama the women are worrying about.