2016 U.S. Presidential Election

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Thanks man. I think you mentioned you were a Republican operative in another thread. Who would you vote for in your own party?
Jeb Bush and Marco Rubio are at the top for me; I'm completely undecided at this point. I think that John Kasich is almost as good, but I doubt he runs. I'd be neutral on Chris Christie, Lindsey Graham, and Rand Paul. I'd have to hold my nose to vote for Bob Ehrlich, Carly Fiorina, Peter King, George Pataki, Mike Pence, and Rick Perry. In a primary, I would not, under any circumstances, vote for John Bolton, Ben Carson, Ted Cruz, Mark Everson, Jim Gilmore, Mike Huckabee, Bobby Jindal, Rick Santorum, or Donald Trump, and, in some cases, would consider voting for a third party candidate in the unlikely scenario that they won the nomination.
 
My Opinion on the candidates/potentials so far:

  • -Ben Carson: Already out, the whole "gays are a choice, people that go to prison and come out gay is proof" thing ruined him quick. It goes to show just because you're well educated in one area doesn't mean you are in another.
  • -Ted Cruz: IMO he might have something, despite what people think of him he hasn't had any true issues come up yet, and the whole Government shutdown thing could actually be used to his advantage if he spins it right. Plus his credentials pre-politics are pretty good. He'll likely cause a LOT of infighting though amongst establishment and anti-establishment.
  • -Jeb Bush: Big money and establishment guy, he'll probably lose simply because his last name is "Bush" if he's picked for the GOP. Also political family dynasties should be outlawed.
  • -Rand Paul: Alright guy, I await for new "It's Happening" memes with his face shooped on them instead of his father's. He has a sound policy and I think it's a bit lulzy that the attacks on him currently are accusing him of sexism and having an uncontrollable temper simply because he doesn't take shit from crappy interviewers.
  • -Mike Huckabee: Claims to be an outsider but is an Establishment guy who will only get the religious vote.
  • -Chris Christie: Not happening.
  • -Lindsey Graham: The Republican base hates him because he always sides with Democrats on most things.
  • -Scott Walker: Might be an option to the Republicans because he is known as a fighter amongst the Repubs for not caving in on the union thing and winning a recall campaign against him because of it and then winning the election after that.

  • -Hillary Clinton: Already lost, she has too many enemies, controversy is all around her, Obama is obviously against her, she has the Benghazi thing, she's extremely secretive and has a recorded history of having a horrible temper behind the scenes to everyone around her and is known to go on explosive tirades and threatening/humiliating media outlets and their journalists if they're even slightly negative about her. She's in it solely to stroke her ego. She's not Bill Clinton. Also the whole political dynasty thing again.
  • -Elizabeth Warren: Supposedly Obama 2.0 ideology-wise, this is reportedly the person Obama wants to replace him. She's kind of an unknown and quiet right now (which people think means she's going to possibly run) but in the past she's been open on her views and not shy about saying what she believes in which might make her pretty unpopular with anyone that isn't a hard liberal. If she covers things up, plays the moderate, and sucks up to millennials until she gets into office then she has a chance.
  • -Mark Warner: Seeing as I lived in VA when he was Governor, he's an alright guy policy-wise and is pretty moderate when governing from what I remember. I would vote for him if he was a presidential nominee and the Republican was a Jeb Bush ot something.
If it comes down to a Hillary vs. Jeb Bush, then I'm going to write someone in and then plan on leaving the U.S.
 
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Scott Walker won't get the nomination because it would mean the GOP loses Wisconsin. He's had some pretty unpopular decisions as of late. Jeb won't get it because he's another Bush. My money is on Cruz getting the nomination but proving to be too extreme for the moderates the GOP needs.

I would prefer Warren get the Democratic nomination but she's also a bit too extreme for the moderate. It'll be Clinton, though I'm not optimistic about her chances of winning. Compared to Cruz, I think she'll stand a better chance, though.
 
  • -Jim Webb: Seeing as I lived in VA when he was Governor, he's an alright guy policy-wise and is pretty moderate when governing from what I remember. I would vote for him if he was a presidential nominee and the Republican was a Jeb Bush ot something.
Jim Webb was never a Governor. He was a U.S. Senator from 2007 to 2013, and served as Ronald Reagan's Secretary of the Navy in the '80s.
 
Jim Webb was never a Governor. He was a U.S. Senator from 2007 to 2013, and served as Ronald Reagan's Secretary of the Navy in the '80s.

Shit, I was thinking of Mark Warner. :oops: Whoops. Anyways Mark Warner is considered a potential candidate as well and who I was talking about.
 
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I have a strange feeling Hillary Clinton is going to win. I'm calling it now.
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Plz no.
 
As a fairly moderate conservative, i'm glad I don't have to choose between the democrats and the GOP :P

That said i'm going to predict that Jeb Bush takes office.
 
Hillary Clinton: Already lost, she has too many enemies, controversy is all around her, Obama is obviously against her, she has the Benghazi thing

The only people for whom Benghazi resonates are people who would never vote Democrat in a million years. Seriously, Benghazi was supposed to blow the election wide in 2012 and it obviously didn't. Nobody cares.

I really look forward to Republicans claiming Benghazi is going to be the defining issue of the 2020 election

Edit: May as well throw in some positive predictions. Clinton has the Democratic nomination locked up, she may get a few shots across the bow during the primaries but it would take another Obama-level campaigner to stop her at this point, and there obviously isn't anybody out there who could play that role. I know Obama came from behind in 2008, but he still had a lot going for him before the primaries. There's nobody right now who's in an equivalent position to where Obama was at this stage of the race in 2007.

For the Republicans it's predictably harder to pick. If I was a Republican strategist I would be praying for Mark Rubio, because he's not obviously insane, he has some appeal with the Tea Party but isn't so closely identified with thim that he'd alienate people who dislike the Tea Party, he's a Hispanic and he's from Florida. Republican efforts to capture the Hispanic vote are usually hilariously cack-handed and show a fundamental misunderstanding of the basics of Hispanic identity, but if Rubio can even shear off an extra 5% of the vote, that would make a huge difference in an election. Plus, Florida. For some reason Rubio doesn't seem to be considered a front runner, but he really should be. (Back in 2012 I said that the most positive thing Romney could do would be to pick Rubio as his running mate to give the Republicans a better chance in 2016)

As for who's likely, while Jeb Bush looks good on paper I just can't see him winning it. Bush belongs to a political era that's already passed us by. If he did get the nomination he would get it for the same reasons Romney did - nobody is really super enthusiastic about a Jeb Bush candidacy (except, I presume, for his personal friends), but he's not overtly offensive to any demographic. But "everybody's second choice" isn't a great piece of political branding.

Rand Paul has to be taken seriously too. He has the potential to energise his father's supporters but is much better at reaching out to the rest of the party. I could definitely see him as the candidate. There are a lot of question marks over where he stands on key policy issues like foreign policy, but that kind of vagueness can be a strength (it shouldn't be, but it is)

As for the rest... meh. Huckabee was a strong contender in 2008 but he's allowed his political capital to evaporate. Santorum only looked good in 2012 because he was people's second choice after Herman Cain. (Let that sink in for a second) Chris Christie seems to have blotted his copybook with various petty scandals, although if it were this time last year I'd rate him much higher. And Ben Carson is just... honestly if you can't see why Ben Carson will never be President I don't have anything to say to you.

I think the Republicans are gonna win, regardless of who their nominee is.
 
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One of the most mature, unbiased, and thoughtful political posts I've ever seen on this site. I agree with almost everything you said here.

My Opinion on the candidates/potentials so far:
  • -Ben Carson: Already out, the whole "gays are a choice, people that go to prison and come out gay is proof" thing ruined him quick. It goes to show just because you're well educated in one area doesn't mean you are in another.
I think many older people who are apolitical will not care about this. I find that outside in the world when people don't pay attention to news or politics that many people have never even heard or considered the thought that gay marriage is a real thing in many places. Carson is an extremely intelligent person, but not intelligent enough to just say nothing on this. I question how well he can do politically since knowing when to not say anything is important.

-Ted Cruz: IMO he might have something, despite what people think of him he hasn't had any true issues come up yet, and the whole Government shutdown thing could actually be used to his advantage if he spins it right. Plus his credentials pre-politics are pretty good. He'll likely cause a LOT of infighting though amongst establishment and anti-establishment.

Cruz is an interesting candidate. I really like the guy. As a conservative non-Republican I would agree with you on the infighting thing. My observations of the Republican party is there is a principled part and a political part, and the establishment tends to be more political and want to give here and there to grow the base. (Not a bad thing politically, but it alienates others.) I actually love watching them fight (even if it damages chances for conservative candidates) so at least it won't be boring.

-Jeb Bush: Big money and establishment guy, he'll probably lose simply because his last name is "Bush" if he's picked for the GOP. Also political family dynasties should be outlawed.

Yep.

-Rand Paul: Alright guy, I await for new "It's Happening" memes with his face shooped on them instead of his father's. He has a sound policy and I think it's a bit lulzy that the attacks on him currently are accusing him of sexism and having an uncontrollable temper simply because he doesn't take shit from crappy interviewers.

The issue I have with the Pauls is their extreme isolationism. I used to think this way pre-9/11. Now I think we should have learned lessons from Pearl Harbor. It'll be really interesting to see if he can resonate with the young folks the way his dad did. I used to see the Paul crowds and think "they like him because it's the cool thing to do" but whenever I talk to Paul supporters they are extremely well informed.

-Mike Huckabee: Claims to be an outsider but is an Establishment guy who will only get the religious vote.

As a huge Huckabee fan, religious American (but not religious voter) I would agree. I have family in the extreme Bible Belt and they all voted for Huckabee as did their entire areas. I know many people who vote solely on whether a candidate is pro-life or pro-abortion. Single issue voters piss me off. Anyway, he spent a ton of money as governor of Arkansas and I don't know if his conservative credentials will resonate with primary voters. That said, he was extremely magnanimous in 2008 when he bowed out of the race to increase Romney's chances over McCain. People won't forget that. Plus he can play the guitar.

-Chris Christie: Not happening.
-Lindsey Graham: The Republican base hates him because he always sides with Democrats on most things.

Yep.

-Scott Walker: Might be an option to the Republicans because he is known as a fighter amongst the Repubs for not caving in on the union thing and winning a recall campaign against him because of it and then winning the election after that.

Personally I like Walker the best right now. I'd like to see Cain run again. I wish he would have stayed in it. Many of his accusers were discredited and I think he could resonate with people again. But, I imagine that's a dream that will never happen. Walker survived vicious attacks and has proven he knows how to handle himself during situations like that. In addition, he's proven that he will tackle politically unpopular issues to try and improve the situation in his state. We need to do something about our entitlement spending. Outright welfare and non-discretionary spending are dwarfed by it. Some unpopular decisions need to be made and fast. We can't kick the can down the road forever.

You also forgot Carly Fiorina. I like her but I don't think she'll resonate with the national party.

-Hillary Clinton: Already lost, she has too many enemies, controversy is all around her, Obama is obviously against her, she has the Benghazi thing, she's extremely secretive and has a recorded history of having a horrible temper behind the scenes to everyone around her and is known to go on explosive tirades and threatening/humiliating media outlets and their journalists if they're even slightly negative about her. She's in it solely to stroke her ego. She's not Bill Clinton. Also the whole political dynasty thing again.

Yep. There are also issues about whether or not the Clintons broke the law receiving all this money in their foundation from foreign governments and nationals while she was Secretary of State. It won't turn into any legal troubles for them but it will certainly drag down her campaign.

-Elizabeth Warren: Supposedly Obama 2.0 ideology-wise, this is reportedly the person Obama wants to replace him. She's kind of an unknown and quiet right now (which people think means she's going to possibly run) but in the past she's been open on her views and not shy about saying what she believes in which might make her pretty unpopular with anyone that isn't a hard liberal. If she covers things up, plays the moderate, and sucks up to millennials until she gets into office then she has a chance.

I don't know much about her to be honest. I don't think a hard liberal will win. I don't really think any liberal will win. We are very much a pendulum and it always swings the opposite way. Obama isn't any more popular than Bush was (and Bush wasn't as conservative as the media made him out to be) and I think as a result we'll see someone more center or right-of-center but that's just my opinion.

Mark Warner: Seeing as I lived in VA when he was Governor, he's an alright guy policy-wise and is pretty moderate when governing from what I remember. I would vote for him if he was a presidential nominee and the Republican was a Jeb Bush ot something.

Under Warner they raised sales taxes. First thing McDonnel did was raise speed limits. I liked McDonnel. Too bad about the whole bribery thing. Warner is not a bad guy.
If it comes down to a Hillary vs. Jeb Bush, then I'm going to write someone in and then plan on leaving the U.S.

QFT.

Anyway, awesome post. If I could rate like a million more times I would.
 
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You also forgot Carly Fiorina. I like her but I don't think she'll resonate with the national party.
See, that's part of Carly Fiorina's rationale for running. She knows that (A) people generally like her on at least some level, (B) that she provides a perspective, as the former CEO of HP, that is severely underrepresented in the field (on both sides), and that (C) the Republican Party will need a woman on the primary debate stage and to make attacks on Clinton that the far left would claim to be "sexist" or "mansplaining" or something like that if they came from a man. Really, Carly Fiorina isn't so much running for President as she's running for VP or a Cabinet position. Personally, as of now, I don't think that I would want her on the ticket, although I absolutely want her to run and at least make it to January for reason C that I mentioned.
 
See, that's part of Carly Fiorina's rationale for running. She knows that (A) people generally like her on at least some level, (B) that she provides a perspective, as the former CEO of HP, that is severely underrepresented in the field (on both sides), and that (C) the Republican Party will need a woman on the primary debate stage and to make attacks on Clinton that the far left would claim to be "sexist" or "mansplaining" or something like that if they came from a man. Really, Carly Fiorina isn't so much running for President as she's running for VP or a Cabinet position. Personally, as of now, I don't think that I would want her on the ticket, although I absolutely want her to run and at least make it to January for reason C that I mentioned.

I agree with you on C but the fact she was fired from HP in 2005 will make her business sense a tough sell. Regardless of what turnaround she may have caused at HP. I knew many people at that time when she was CEO and they didn't like her, but they were all old and sexist. (and mostly democrats) So what can you do?

Polls showed nobody bought the "war on women" nonsense. Really I would think people are tired of constantly hearing how everyone in the Republican party hates every group except white males but maybe not.

Longshots for 2016 but people to watch are Tom McClintock from California, Mia Love from Utah, and Mike Lee from Utah. I'm a big Mia Love fan. I wonder what @The Dude thinks.

EDIT: When I say "people to watch" I don't mean in 2016 I mean in the future.
 
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I agree with you on C but the fact she was fired from HP in 2005 will make her business sense a tough sell. Regardless of what turnaround she may have caused at HP. I knew many people at that time when she was CEO and they didn't like her, but they were all old and sexist. (and mostly democrats) So what can you do?

Polls showed nobody bought the "war on women" nonsense. Really I would think people are tired of constantly hearing how everyone in the Republican party hates every group except white males but maybe not.

Longshots for 2016 but people to watch are Tom McClintock from California, Mia Love from Utah, and Mike Lee from Utah. I'm a big Mia Love fan. I wonder what @The Dude thinks.

EDIT: When I say "people to watch" I don't mean in 2016 I mean in the future.

I love Mia Love. I think she's awesome and I've been a supporter of her's for a long time. I think people like her can really do some good for this country and I think she has a wonderful, successful future ahead of her.
 
If anything, I think he'll mainly be a foil for other anti-establishment candidates. Rand Paul is officially running while Ben Carson, Rick Parry (lol srsly) and Rick Santorum are all formally exploring a candidacy. My understanding is that all of the aforementioned people and Ted Cruz are vying for the same votes. I suspect that they'll merely divide the Tea Party/Religious right wing of the GOP while the moderates will all coalesce around the establishment candidate.

That's certainly what the GOP wants. The big money people want either Christie or Bush to not run so that there isn't a protracted slugfest between the big guys. The last thing they want are legit candidates fighting out a bloody primary while Hillary cruises to the convention.

Really there's no way to game this out on the GOP side at this point because there's so many candidates running, and unlike last time several of them are legit, and that splits constituencies, money, etc.
See, that's part of Carly Fiorina's rationale for running...(C) the Republican Party will need a woman on the primary debate stage and to make attacks on Clinton that the far left would claim to be "sexist" or "mansplaining" or something like that if they came from a man. Really, Carly Fiorina isn't so much running for President as she's running for VP or a Cabinet position. Personally, as of now, I don't think that I would want her on the ticket, although I absolutely want her to run and at least make it to January for reason C that I mentioned.

It won't work. It'll be like expecting Herman Cain to inoculate the party from charges that they are racist.
 
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Rand Paul has to be taken seriously too. He has the potential to energise his father's supporters but is much better at reaching out to the rest of the party. I could definitely see him as the candidate. There are a lot of question marks over where he stands on key policy issues like foreign policy, but that kind of vagueness can be a strength (it shouldn't be, but it is)

I do wish that Paul had stuck to his ideological guns a little more instead of reaching out to the Republican base. Even if it would have burned his chances of success, I feel like a candidate who campaigned on a serious anti-war stance (especially a conservative one) would open the way for that to become a bigger platform in the future.
 
Jeb Bush looks strong on paper, but he is going to follow the exact same trajectory that Rudy Giuliani took during his campaign in 2008. Despite polling well and having a lot of money, Bush will falter in the early states and end up running out of steam by the time Super Tuesday rolls around. He won't even compete in Iowa, will get upset by one or two candidates in New Hampshire, and then under-perform in Florida because he'll have to be competing against Rubio. Bush is going to just kind of fizzle out.

Walker, Paul, and Rubio are going to be the biggest contenders. My money is on Walker winning. Paul will have a sizable and dedicated base of support to stay competitive. Rubio will siphon away some of Bush's support and already has a lot of Romney people lurking around him. Christie is going nowhere, Cruz is an asshole, and the religious/so-con candidates will ultimately be as pointless as they were in the last two primaries.
 
That's certainly what the GOP wants. The big money people want either Christie or Bush to not run so that there isn't a protracted slugfest between the big guys.
Not really. Jeb Bush has an enormous money network; literally no one on the GOP side will outraise him unless he implodes. There are still some big money people, especially in New Jersey and NYC, who want Christie to run, but they're starting to get antsy. Christie legitimately doesn't give a fuck at this point, from my understanding, and will declare in May or June. There's not some monolithic, "big money" group behind the scenes. (It's looking like Rubio will be picking up a lot of cash, too, if he can meet expectation, especially from former Romney bundlers.) Regardless, I don't think there's enough oxygen to sustain both Bush and Christie, and the field ought to be narrowed to one establishment candidate against a more conservative candidate by the end of February or beginning of March. At the moment, my money would be on Bush vs. Walker, but that could easily change.


It won't work. It'll be like expecting Herman Cain to inoculate the party from charges that they are racist.
Carly Fiorina is far less of a clown than Herman Cain. No one, crazy tea party people aside, wanted Cain to run. She knows what she's doing.
 
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If anybody could piss away an election against Hillary "WHAT DIFFERENCE DOES IT MAKE" Clinton, it's the modern republican party.
 
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