Rotter
kiwifarms.net
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- Oct 23, 2020
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Honestly, its entirely straight forward as hell the modern trans movement is just making it into something its not.Not gonna lie, I don't understand most of this two-spirit bullshit, and frankly I don't think I want to either. It's too insane.
I’m starting to think that lesbians don’t even exist at all. Or at least, all of the real ones are obese butch dykes.lesbians flat out don't exist in a lot of cultures
It must be a wind-up. A real woman made these.There is a psychotic tranny on /tttt/ who makes terrifying MS paint drawings of Hontrapoints and PT and they're hilarious so I'm just gonna dump them here
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^this one has to be my favorite, PT's eyes are just spot on
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Real women aren’t that funny or demented. And I don’t think literally any woman, not even TERFs, knows what a “hon”, “manmoder”, or “repping” isIt must be a wind-up. A real woman made these.
That thing looks like something out of David Cronenberg movie, and wonders why its unfuckable? Yeah, i am uglyphobic.
Much cope.
Very few people who take up this identity are native people. It's more White colonizer appropriation again.Not gonna lie, I don't understand most of this two-spirit bullshit, and frankly I don't think I want to either. It's too insane.
Projection in motion.
Have they tested the dresses to make sure they go spinny?
Not gonna lie, I don't understand most of this two-spirit bullshit, and frankly I don't think I want to either. It's too insane.
Here's an interesting Reddit write up on the bullshit that is 2 spirit with some sources that was originally scoured when r/LGBDropTheT was purged, and it looks like it got taken off its repost in r/detrans. Thank fucking god for the internet archive. You know they'll be hitting that soon enough.EDIT: I will add that its almost impossible to find out any accurate information about this anymore because of the retcon to the lore that trannies have pulled, its actually a bit insane how far they've changed a literal fact.
"Two Spirit" was made up by gay rights activists and hippies.![]()
RESOURCE
(from Wikipedia) "The term two-spirit was created in 1990 at the Indigenous lesbian and gay international gathering in Winnipeg, and "specifically chosen to distinguish and distance Native American/First Nations people from non-Native peoples. The primary purpose of coining a new term was to encourage the replacement of the outdated and considered offensive, anthropological term, berdache." ("berdache" was utilized in Jesuit missionaries accounts to refer to male crossdressers and homosexuals and it literally means "kept boy" "male prostitute"). Nations like the Navajo had banned same-sex unions and Native gay activists "called [themselves] two-spirit to find a way to explain [themselves] to to [their] grandparents that won’t make them say “that’s a load of white man’s bullshit.”
https://culturallyboundgender.wordpress.com/2013/03/09/toward-an-end-to-appropriation-of-indigenous-two-spirit-people-in-trans-politics-the-relationship-between-third-gender-roles-and-patriarchy/#comment-984
"Indians (sic) did not refer to homosexuals as Berdaches, this is a term used by Anthropologists. Indigenous people NEVER referred to homosexuals as two-spirits. Two-spirit is a term coined by Harry Hay, founder of the radical Faeries. In the 1970’s he was making a nuisance of himself trying to find a “Berdache person among the Pueblo people. The spiritual leaders basically laughed at his outrageous theories and wouldn’t have anything to do with him. He finally located one tribal member who merely showed him where the gays lived – on the outside of the village. Unwilling to be stopped by facts, Hay made up the whole two-spirit Faery tale and started trying to sell it to the gay population. The Jungian psychologists of the time ran with it and kept embellishing it with more and more little white lies. Just like Orwell predicted, that little white lie told over and over again became “truth." I am constantly annoyed by gay people who firmly believe they are "two-spirits" who are entitled to be told everything about my spiritual practices on the basis of their homosexuality alone. Millions of people accept as absolute truth a complete fabrication that was pulled out of Harry Hay’s but."
"The two-spirit tradition appears to be nothing but a hoax. Pretty much every pop-culture mind-candy book provides no hard evidence that gays were revered in any Native American culture. A lot of the authors take wild leaps of logic and freely speculate as to what they hope to be true. Two of the books I looked at were written by Will Roscoe whose research was guided by Harry Hay. Another one was written by Walter L. Williams, who dedicated his book to his friend Harry Hay. Another one was edited by Sue Ellen Jacobs, who admits to a personal correspondence with Harry Hay and uses Will Roscoe as a reference. A lot of these books also site authors that have been widely criticized by Native people such as Paula Gunn-Allen, the fruitcake who speaks to aliens from distant galaxies through a crystal skull, and Beverly Little Thunder, who managed to elicit several death threats from Lakota elders for her version of the female Sun dance.(Lesbians without shirts getting their chests pierced, I’d like to see that)
On the Berdaches as revered shamans side of the argument, the sources were almost exclusively modern day Lakota informants. The most frequently sited is, Terry Calling Eagle. Also sited were Michael One Feather, Vincent White Cloud, Luke Standing Elk, Twila Giegle Dillon and John One Grass. I couldn’t find any information about the qualifications of these individuals. Terry Calling Eagle is quoted frequently on gay web sites. Most of the books using these informants also site Harry Hay’s philosophical writings as evidence (The Hammond Report, One Institute Quarterly 6 (1963) p. 11) and a lot of them site the work, Lame Deer, Seeker of Visions by John Fire Lame Deer. I read the whole book and I couldn’t find any evidence there.
On the other side, there were a lot of prominent female anthropologists who wrote about Berdaches in the 30s and 40s who came to the conclusion that Berdaches were not revered and in some cases were even excluded from becoming healers and medicine men because the tribe believed they were spiritually deficient. Ermine, Vogelin 1938 Tubatulabel Ethnography. Anthropological Records (2) I:I-90 and Cora Dubois, Wintu Ethnography. University of California Publications in American Archeology and Ethnology 1935. Vogelin reported that is was impossible for Berdaches to become shamans in Wintu society. And DuBois reported that in Chugach Eskimos culture, the man-woman were not able to become shamans and they were regarded as unfit to be healers. She also reported that in the majority of the California tribes, the Plateu and the Great Basin, Berdaches were regarded as not having the necessary spiritual gifts and possessing no sacred qualities. Julian H. Steward, a prolific writer in Anthropological Records Cultural Element Distributions(4:2) p 252 and (8:3) p 279 reports that Berdaches were uncommon in Shoshone society and regarded with mild interest and no disapproval. Regarding Shamanism and Berdaches she concluded that "Native thought did not connect the two phenomena." In 15 reported cases the reported Berdaches were unremarkable. They were just seen as men who wanted to do women’s work. One male Berdache had a wife and children, another kept house for white people, another one had an abnormally small penis. None of the informants mentioned anything about spiritual powers in the 30s and 40s. All the hoopla came well after Harry Hay claimed to have found all this evidence.
Overall, based on an incredible absence of evidence and a lot of wishful thinking by white gays trying to promote a political agenda, I would say that a thinking person would have to conclude that the is no link between Berdaches and heightened social status or increased spiritual gifts in any Native American culture.
I’m straight and white myself, but until somebody can provide me with hard evidence, I’m going to tell everyone I know that the two-spirit myth is pure bunk.
And I will continue to be annoyed by all the silly white people running around calling themselves two-spirits and engaging in random acts of preciousness.”
https://culturallyboundgender.wordpress.com/2013/03/09/toward-an-end-to-appropriation-of-indigenous-two-spirit-people-in-trans-politics-the-relationship-between-third-gender-roles-and-patriarchy/#comment-984
Radical Faeries (Documentary)
(from Wikipedia) "The Gay American Indians (GAI) was a gay rights organization founded in San Francisco in 1975 by Randy Burns and Barbara May Cameron, initially as a safe place to socialize and share. It was reputed to be the first organization of its kind in the country. The initial purpose of the group was described by Randy Burns (co-founder) as a "safe place to socialize and share." The founders wanted a space to address the intersectionality of their identities. GAI Members advocated for the use of the term "two-spirit" as an alternative to the term "berdache" because they viewed the latter as problematic due to the term's origins. The group also worked in the 1980s with Will Roscoe, a scholar, to produce a book about the meaning of "berdache."
from the book "The Trouble with Harry Hay"
It appears that the American far left wasn't as pro-gay in the 1970s as it is now.
"...In 1976... Distressed that struggles between gays and the Left continued twenty-five years after his own separation from the Communist Party, Harry wrote a letter to Faygele Singer, the embattled gay Leftist, hoping to comfort him with “newer levels of Marxist perceptions which were emerging in me as gay values.” The letter was the basis for his position paper, “Gay Liberation: Chapter Two,” "which he regarded as his most important piece of writing and as a central catalyst of the Radical Faerie movement."
"...Hay... called for mass change in thinking. He proposed that the qualities of noncompetitiveness and creativity, characteristics often observed in gay people, made gays naturally suited to guide this change in thinking... To Harry, this “Gay gift” was a difference in consciousness that could introduce new ideas necessary for human survival. In the 1950s, he had argued that in the ancient world, it was the gays who passed on certain craft skills with greater devotion than heterosexual family lineages, whose blood devotions surpassed all other; this sort of role in favor of cultural evolution, always shifting with changing social needs, was, he suggested, the bio-social reason for gays—and could be used as their political justification."
...
"At the U.C.L.A. and U.S.C. libraries, Hay spent endless hours looking up their sources, “always hunting for us.” In the process, he created thousands of note cards, all headed “berdache,” with countless subheadings. Frequently, Harry stumbled upon related areas of study, such as the political impact of the changes in calendrical forms on peasant religions. These detours consumed further attention and resulted in reams of additional notes.
…
Some of Hay’s research did see publication. In a paper called “The Hammond Report,” published in 1963 in ONE Institute Quarterly, the serious homophile journal of the time, Harry unearthed a forgotten document written in 1882 by a former United States Surgeon General Dr. William A. Hammond, while in the field, observed Indians called mujerados, a Spanish term meaning “made women.” [i.e. "a man who was notionally transformed into a woman by taking the passive role in homosexual intercourse"] This tantalized Harry as a possible type of berdache. Hammond described the mujerados he had found among Pueblo Indians in Northern New Mexico, who were the “chief passive agent in the pederastic ceremonies.” [Note: Hay supported NAMBLA]. Hay offered a lengthy commentary and roundly protested this paper’s “burial by omission” for nearly one hundred years.
Though limited in distribution, Harry’s article was significant for the time as a rare scholarly treatment of the berdache, a subject that has become popular in recent years. Years later, several scholars researching the berdache, including Walter Williams and Will Roscoe, found the article and sought Hay out for further consultations. Williams, author of The Spirit and the Flesh, the definitive study of the berdache thus far, called Hay “the inspirer” to many current berdache scholars, and Roscoe, biographer of the famous berdache We’Wha, credits Harry with doing more than any other single individual to promote research into the subject during a long period of academic neglect."
"...By and large, Harry was disappointed in his hope of finding berdaches functioning on reservations or in other Indian populations. The Bureau of Indian Affairs, he came to realize, had systematically educated Indians throughout the nation to abandon their original language and culture, especially those cultural practices found “vulgar” or “abominable.” "
...
"Many of Hay’s writings from the 1950s reflected a strikingly evolved feminism, especially in his concentration on the religion of the Great Goddess, popular in many parts of the ancient world, and the ways in which its values offered harmony to civilization. More specifically, Hay’s references to a cultural unity of Druids, fairies and other queer historical types in his 1955 paper “The Homophile in History” anticipated the work of such writers as Arthur Evans, Judy Grahn and Starhawk by two decades."
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Khwaja Saraa (Pakistan's "third gender" or "deviant" (aka homosexual) men who survive through begging and prostitution) vs transgender (newly emerging in Pakistan's westernized, well-educated, liberal elite):
"They can never be women. They cannot give birth. Even if they change their bodies they can’t change who they are. We are not women. We are what Allah has made."
Ninotchka Rosca (Philippines) laughing out loud at the phrase "female penis". "I had to study English for decades to come to that!"
Gee, if losing nipples is an "amazing job" to them, I wanna know what a bad job looks like.View attachment 2235332
No. Mr. Gallagher did NOT do an "amazing job". I'm appalled that Liam would do this to you. Your tits will cast no shadow from now on.
What's this spinny dress meme exactly?I find the ‘you don’t need dysphoria to be trans’ thing hilarious. Basically if there’s no reason for your troonery than you like a spinny dress then it’s just a subculture that’s into body modding and playing dress up, no more deserving of any special new rights or considerations than being a goth. Not that I expect troons to spend more than five minutes thinking about the logic of their arguments, extreme shallowness seems to be part and parcel.
Trannies don't actually understand how women act or dress and try to do "girly" things to seem like they're one.What's this spinny dress meme exactly?
Reddit troons going "dress go spinny." It's a dumbass meme. Ironically enough I've known ciswomen who like doing it, it's just been poisoned by Reddit, like most things have.What's this spinny dress meme exactly?