- Joined
- May 4, 2021
The ARVN fought for like 20 years and lost around 1,5 million men. Those guys certainly could use more respect. Sure they were far from an efficient fighting force, but they didn't even collapse from the Tet Offensive.
Taliban offensive of 2021 and collapse of Afghan government.
- Thread starter Ancient Pioneer
- Start date
- Joined
- Sep 27, 2018
ARVN was also crippled by the fact that they'd been handed a mechanized army reliant on air support and American fuel and that got fucked over by the oil crisis and Congress deciding to wipe their hands of Vietnam altogether.
- Joined
- May 4, 2021
The fact that RVN was so corrupt that the soldiers didn't receive much of the aid didn't help either. In hindsight giving them pickup trucks with 50 cals would have helped them much more. lol
PS1gamenwatch
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Oct 26, 2015
- Joined
- Jul 25, 2016
>throw a rave party because the Soviets took a massive L and and are leaving Afghanistan in defeat and disgrace
>few years later the communist DRA falls, creating a vacuum that will be filled by an unstable transitional government
>said government collapses creating an IRL adaptation of Violence Jack until some sort of order is restored through most of the country by the Taliban who are predominantly ethnic Pashtun and Pakistani straw men
>Tajik north is meanwhile held by the Northern Alliance
>meanwhile the Taliban not only implement harsh Shariah law in their territories, but also brutalise ethnic minorities, in particular their rival Tajiks
>Taliban are on a roll because they're getting tanks, training, intel and state of the art equipment provided by Pakistan while the Tajiks fight with old weapons they looted from the Soviets
>Tajiks, your only allies since most of the Pashtuns sided with the Taliban by now, ask you for weapons and financial aid
>in return they promise you to eradicate the Taliban and the Al Qaeda who have been infesting the region lately
>refuse their offer because they finance themselves through opium trade and muh Iran-Contra
>get pantsshittingly butthurt after almost 3,000 of your citizens get BTFO by a bunch of Saudis, so of course you invade Afghanistan for "revenge"
>in actuality you hope to use this opportunity to expand your influence in this vital region and to contain Iran
>Taliban are defeated and Al-Qaeda severely crippled, for now
>instead of handing over Afghanistan to your Tajik allies, you stab them in the back and throw them under the short bus because muh democracy
>thanks to muh democracy, the Pashtuns - by being the country's largest ethnic group - not only win the elections and marginalise the Tajiks, but also start assassinating their political leaders left and right
>Pashtuns meanwhile live double lives of being in the Afghan military by day and in the Taliban by night, making you indirectly the Taliban's biggest financial and military benefactor
>turns out all that money intended to be spent on democracy, feminism, western education and all that nonsense went into the Taliban's war chest who are now patiently waiting for the right moment to take over
>realise how thanks to the above mentioned fact you also indirectly and accidentally gave them American military training
>come to the realisation that the Taliban didn't just play you like a fiddle, but played Vivaldi's "Four Seasons" on you in ways that would inspire André Rieu and Vanessa Mae
>Tajiks, who were once your bestest of tomodachis in this godforsaken shithole, now resent the absolute shit out of you for betraying them and see you as much as problem as the Taliban
>why are you still here? Just to suffer?
>finally recognise Afghanistan as the sunk cost fallacy that it is and and start packing and hope the current government will be at least half as stable as the communist DRA the Soviets left behind back then; spoiler: It won't
>you even sign a peace agreement with the Taliban
>your nation building experiment was such a catastrophic failure that the Taliban are now making a spectacular comeback
>20 years worth of dead American soldiers, and more importantly wasted American taxpayer money down the drain for ultimately nothing
>all your hard work of introducing democracy and feminism undone, your leverage against Iran gone and your former allies now considering you an enemy
>Afghanistan will now most likely become Pakistan 2.0, a Chinese satellite or continue being a perpetual war zone
>the only thing for you to do now is to either take the L like the Soviets did or return and repeat the cycle anew, but this time without any allies
>tfw
Sasuga!
>few years later the communist DRA falls, creating a vacuum that will be filled by an unstable transitional government
>said government collapses creating an IRL adaptation of Violence Jack until some sort of order is restored through most of the country by the Taliban who are predominantly ethnic Pashtun and Pakistani straw men
>Tajik north is meanwhile held by the Northern Alliance
>meanwhile the Taliban not only implement harsh Shariah law in their territories, but also brutalise ethnic minorities, in particular their rival Tajiks
>Taliban are on a roll because they're getting tanks, training, intel and state of the art equipment provided by Pakistan while the Tajiks fight with old weapons they looted from the Soviets
>Tajiks, your only allies since most of the Pashtuns sided with the Taliban by now, ask you for weapons and financial aid
>in return they promise you to eradicate the Taliban and the Al Qaeda who have been infesting the region lately
>refuse their offer because they finance themselves through opium trade and muh Iran-Contra
>get pantsshittingly butthurt after almost 3,000 of your citizens get BTFO by a bunch of Saudis, so of course you invade Afghanistan for "revenge"
>in actuality you hope to use this opportunity to expand your influence in this vital region and to contain Iran
>Taliban are defeated and Al-Qaeda severely crippled, for now
>instead of handing over Afghanistan to your Tajik allies, you stab them in the back and throw them under the short bus because muh democracy
>thanks to muh democracy, the Pashtuns - by being the country's largest ethnic group - not only win the elections and marginalise the Tajiks, but also start assassinating their political leaders left and right
>Pashtuns meanwhile live double lives of being in the Afghan military by day and in the Taliban by night, making you indirectly the Taliban's biggest financial and military benefactor
>turns out all that money intended to be spent on democracy, feminism, western education and all that nonsense went into the Taliban's war chest who are now patiently waiting for the right moment to take over
>realise how thanks to the above mentioned fact you also indirectly and accidentally gave them American military training
>come to the realisation that the Taliban didn't just play you like a fiddle, but played Vivaldi's "Four Seasons" on you in ways that would inspire André Rieu and Vanessa Mae
>Tajiks, who were once your bestest of tomodachis in this godforsaken shithole, now resent the absolute shit out of you for betraying them and see you as much as problem as the Taliban
>why are you still here? Just to suffer?
>finally recognise Afghanistan as the sunk cost fallacy that it is and and start packing and hope the current government will be at least half as stable as the communist DRA the Soviets left behind back then; spoiler: It won't
>you even sign a peace agreement with the Taliban
>your nation building experiment was such a catastrophic failure that the Taliban are now making a spectacular comeback
>20 years worth of dead American soldiers, and more importantly wasted American taxpayer money down the drain for ultimately nothing
>all your hard work of introducing democracy and feminism undone, your leverage against Iran gone and your former allies now considering you an enemy
>Afghanistan will now most likely become Pakistan 2.0, a Chinese satellite or continue being a perpetual war zone
>the only thing for you to do now is to either take the L like the Soviets did or return and repeat the cycle anew, but this time without any allies
>tfw
Sasuga!
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- Joined
- Jun 23, 2015
So ANA is pretty fucking shit, but what about their special forces and commandos? I heard that they are decent and will put up a fight.
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2017
How many are left? They aren't easily replaced and attrition is going to wear them down if it hasn't already.
PS1gamenwatch
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Oct 26, 2015
- Joined
- Nov 10, 2019
From personal experience their effectiveness is tied to how invested their ODA trainers were and how much they care about "the mission". At their core they are still Afghan boy loving weirdos who will offer you hash/the acog off their rifle for your youngest most boyish looking private.
Still miles ahead of ANA and ANP but they aren't equivalent to the guys who worked with MACVSOG or even the Sons of Iraq (that latter formed the fighting nucleus of ISIS).
- Joined
- May 4, 2021
Really good summary. The reconstruction period was really half-assed both in Iraq and Afghanistan. I am amazed how could this happen. It is like America forgot the lessons it learnt during the last century... Is this loss of corporate knowledge? Or nobody cared to properly plan?
- Joined
- Mar 31, 2020
Well just another case of "nobody deals with Afghanistan and comes out on top" The Brits lost there during their empire time, the Soviets tried and failed now we tried and failed. Would be best to just isolate the country and be done with it. Or leave it to China maybe they have a better chance with their "Use muslims as organ replacements" policiy
PS1gamenwatch
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Oct 26, 2015
- Joined
- Oct 21, 2018
Chemicals and radiation is what you use against cancer...
- Joined
- Jul 25, 2016
In my opinion it's a cautionary tale of what happens when you put principles and idealism before reality. The results will always be disastrous.
Ameritards betraying their Tajik allies was the biggest WTF and one can only speculate how things would have turned out if Ameroids had just given the Northern Alliance the support they needed and left the rest to them. But hey, muh revenge for 9/11, muh democracy, muh nation-building and so on. At least Iran got a giggle and Pakistan a vassal state out of this in the end for all that American tax payer money I suppose.
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- Joined
- Apr 18, 2021
Imagine if America had just left us alone during the Afghan war. Imagine if they had not funded our enemies to hurt us. Imagine if they had had even a tiny bit of foresight.
“Oh no! We can’t have the soviets win in Afghanistan, so let’s fund and arm extremists, there’s no way that could come back to hurt us”
That aside, imagine being an American who’s successive governments have spent trillions of dollars on some desert hellhole that refuses to modernize and will be unstable forever. Imagine what that money could have done back in the US.
“Oh no! We can’t have the soviets win in Afghanistan, so let’s fund and arm extremists, there’s no way that could come back to hurt us”
That aside, imagine being an American who’s successive governments have spent trillions of dollars on some desert hellhole that refuses to modernize and will be unstable forever. Imagine what that money could have done back in the US.
- Joined
- May 8, 2019
Gender programs, F35, and surveillance state shit
Pentex
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Jul 24, 2020
$2.26 trillion in total costs.
$530 billion in interest.
$88 billion wasted on the ANA.
$36 billion in 'infrastructure projects.'
2,442 US soldiers killed.
In a just world, everyone who voted for the Afghan (not) War/Occupation, along with everyone who profited from it, would be [fedposting redacted] until the gutters overflowed.
$530 billion in interest.
$88 billion wasted on the ANA.
$36 billion in 'infrastructure projects.'
2,442 US soldiers killed.
In a just world, everyone who voted for the Afghan (not) War/Occupation, along with everyone who profited from it, would be [fedposting redacted] until the gutters overflowed.
- Joined
- Sep 9, 2019
It was graft, pure and simple.
mudwogg
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Apr 6, 2021
If ever the US military returns sometime in the future, I hope the troop composition would be those whom the latest recruitment ad targeted.