General Discussion for Virtual Youtubers / Vtubers / Chuubas - it's okay to be a simp for 2D, just don't thirstpost.

[Incoherent Rambling]

Do clippers need to put subtitle? NO. They need to make clips to be called clippers.

Sure, but should they monetize a clip channel? That's the real question.

 

[Glavetomas]

Do clippers need to put subtitle? NO. They need to make clips to be called clippers.

Never said they had to, never insinuated that they had to.
I'm saying I consider the act of putting same-language subtitles as the language spoken to be the bare bones minimum amount of work needed for me to feel monetization is justifiable for a clipper. Not that clippers who don't subtitle aren't clippers.
Case in point; I personally look down upon SodaFunk Ch for having a heavily monetized clipping channel with membership enabled when he doesn't even subtitle the clips he releases. That's not to say I look down on all clippers who doesn't add subtitles to their clips.
And its just one element of potential work put in. If a clipper makes clips where they edit in context for what the girl is talking about, or other girls reactions, I think monetization is justifiable. But this is my take on it. There's no universal answer to any of this, and I'm not saying I am right and anyone who disagrees is wrong.
I don't understand what's so hard to comprehend about my stance on this.

Hell they could add a slow-mo effect after whoever they're clipping says something funny and add an obnoxious laugh track and I'd think they'd be justified in monetization. Would I watch it? Hell no. But its a bit more work than just clipping out the funny bit and adding a copypaste outro & stolen fanart thumbnail.

 

[Gravityqueen4life]

Sure, but should they monetize a clip channel?

Yes. Alot of seeth and drama can be born from that.

 

[RiverBear]

Yup. It's not an even playing field at all, unfortunately.

I've just found a channel that is doing 20-30min English subbed clips of every Niji captain's streams of PowerPro for the Koushien tournament. Which means they're releasing these huge compilations only a day or two after the original stream and have been doing that consistently for the last week or so. Barely breaking 5K views.

View attachment 2394890

There's lots of reasons for this (clickbait works, familiarity with the streamer, the size of clips etc) but overall it's clear that the demand is for people like SodaFunk who can give them quick and easy satisfaction rather than hardworking translators who can offer new and insightful clips from all kinds of V-Tubers.

Or you know, there's more demand for Hololive than Niji. Not everything has to have a convoluted explanation

 

[Avokado]

Sure, but should they monetize a clip channel? That's the real question.

Never said they had to, never insinuated that they had to.
I'm saying I consider the act of putting same-language subtitles as the language spoken to be the bare bones minimum amount of work needed for me to feel monetization is justifiable for a clipper. Not that clippers who don't subtitle aren't clippers.
Case in point; I personally look down upon SodaFunk Ch for having a heavily monetized clipping channel with membership enabled when he doesn't even subtitle the clips he releases. That's not to say I look down on all clippers who doesn't add subtitles to their clips.
And its just one element of potential work put in. If a clipper makes clips where they edit in context for what the girl is talking about, or other girls reactions, I think monetization is justifiable. But this is my take on it. There's no universal answer to any of this, and I'm not saying I am right and anyone who disagrees is wrong.
I don't understand what's so hard to comprehend about my stance on this.

Hell they could add a slow-mo effect after whoever they're clipping says something funny and add an obnoxious laugh track and I'd think they'd be justified in monetization. Would I watch it? Hell no. But its a bit more work than just clipping out the funny bit and adding a copypaste outro & stolen fanart thumbnail.

From my understanding, Cover doesn't allow the derivative works (in this case: clips). So the clips/video can't be monetized. But how about the channel? How about other videos in that channel that not related to Hololive? AFAIK, it's okay to monetized the contents unrelated to Hololive.

Keep Hololive contents not monetized and only use them to gain exposure. Meanwhile create your own content unrelated to Hololive to be monetized. I think that's the correct way.
If HoloBass do that, probably he'd still be around.

I personally dislike clips with too much self insert from the clipper. I admit that I don't really watch SodaFunk's clips. But, his thumbnails scream self insert.

 

[Glavetomas]

From my understanding, Cover doesn't allow the derivative works (in this case: clips). So the clips/video can't be monetized. But how about the channel? How about other videos in that channel that not related to Hololive? AFAIK, it's okay to monetized the contents unrelated to Hololive.

Keep Hololive contents not monetized and only use them to gain exposure. Meanwhile create your own content unrelated to Hololive to be monetized. I think that's the correct way.
If HoloBass do that, probably he'd still be around.

I personally dislike clips with too much self insert from the clipper. I admit that I don't really watch SodaFunk's clips. But, his thumbnails scream self insert.

Well, I'm not Cover. I harbor no love for them as a company and think they, like Nintendo and many other Japanese companies, are quite behind in the modern era. If someone takes the time to watch a stream, find the funny parts, edit it and add subtitles to another language then re-upload it, they should be allowed to monetize it (for clippers that sub JP girls to EN and so forth). This way we could get semi-professional translators and subtitles, with an entire economy based on subbing vtubers. Let the free market decide who does a good job and who does a bad job. Instead of just having a bunch of passionate basement dwellers doing it out of passion or for clout.

And yeah. I dislike self-insert clips a fair bit myself.

as for other videos in channels that also clip Hololive, yeah monetize it obviously if that's what they want. If someone wants to use Hololive clips as exposure, all the power to them. We agree on most things, it would seem.

 

[Sanshain]

Pippa now barely a hundred subs away from beating Iori as the most-subbed Phase Connect member. Feels good man.

 

[Scuttle]

Or you know, there's more demand for Hololive than Niji. Not everything has to have a convoluted explanation

I understand you want to respond to everything I say passive-aggressively in this thread and I'm not losing sleep over it, but try not to argue with someone when they're literally in agreement with you.

'Hard work isn't rewarded' and 'Niji has less demand' are not mutually exclusive statements. I even said that 'familiarity with the streamer' (i.e. I like Miko therefore I'll be more likely to watch Miko clips) was one of the core reasons people would rather watch SodaFunk than the person in the image I posted.

I didn't even MENTION Hololive, that was you, and the person I was responding to was talking about Veibae.

 

[Glavetomas]

I understand you want to respond to everything I say passive-aggressively in this thread and I'm not losing sleep over it, but try not to argue with someone when they're literally in agreement with you.

'Hard work isn't rewarded' and 'Niji has less demand' are not mutually exclusive statements. I even said that 'familiarity with the streamer' (i.e. I like Miko therefore I'll be more likely to watch Miko clips) was one of the core reasons people would rather watch SodaFunk than the person in the image I posted.

I didn't even MENTION Hololive, that was you, and the person I was responding to was talking about Veibae.

Looking at the channel in question though.
Before the Koshien streams, their videos were mostly in Japanese. No previous clips in English, at least not obviously.

To me, it makes sense that people prefer other clippers to Ganneko, as Ganneko quite literally began clipping & subtitling with the Koshien event. I wish them success and really hope they take off to become a source of good quality Nijisanji clips, God knows to value diversity and hololive's stranglehold over vtubing in the west can be quite suffocating. But wouldn't it be more fair to compare them to Ajasapa or another well known Niji clipper? As in, comparing successful holo clippers with Ajasapa.

Saying Ganneko's hard work isn't rewarded is silly. This is his hard work, he just started. And thanks to you, I learned of him. That got him one more subscriber. If he keeps this up, he'll be rewarded greatly for sure. But expecting a literal nobody's sudden clip/compilations to compete with Veibae horny videos from clippers with established audiences is setting yourself up for failure.

 

[Scuttle]

Looking at the channel in question though.
Before the Koshien streams, their videos were mostly in Japanese. No previous clips in English, at least not obviously.

To me, it makes sense that people prefer other clippers to Ganneko, as Ganneko quite literally began clipping & subtitling with the Koshien event. I wish them success and really hope they take off to become a source of good quality Nijisanji clips, God knows to value diversity and hololive's stranglehold over vtubing in the west can be quite suffocating. But wouldn't it be more fair to compare them to Ajasapa or another well known Niji clipper?

Absolutely. I was just using an example of someone who, recently or no, has churned out five 20-30 minute translated clips (and I believe they even made a compilation on the history of Koushien just before that), as someone clearly putting the time in against people doing brain-dead clips like the aforementioned hypothetical Veibae one.

You could absolutely compare him to Ajasapa, or even compare Soda to Ajasapa if you wanted to go the route of untranslated content and what is more likely to merit monetisation, but my response was solely that it's a shame that work ethic doesn't translate to popularity on YouTube because the demand exists for people LIKE Soda (and not specifically Soda) who is plugged in to the clickbait positive feedback loop.

There was no mention of comparing companies or company talents, or any intent to compare a 'Niji clipper' to a 'Holo clipper'. If you were to ask me the same question about the Pomu/Elira clipper's popularity compared to the likes of Ganneko or Yuri Shizu I would still agree with you. Especially the Pomu one, who dumps clips in bulk when he gets off work.

 

[Airihead]

I'd argue she has the best intro of any vtuber I've seen purely based on how catchy the music is and how effortful the beat timed animations are

 

[horni]

Or you know, there's more demand for Hololive than Niji. Not everything has to have a convoluted explanation

Long clips (run time in minutes is double-digit) usually get less views, doesn't matter if it's Holo, Niji or the brand Pippa belongs to. There is a guy (or a group?) who translated Watame's complete playthrough of Link's Awakening:

trigger warning: [game ending spoilers] [feels]

and it has barely over 2k views.

Subbing stuff is time-consuming and requires language skills (and if you are translating something you have no interest in, it is also painfully boring, at least for me). If something that costs you less work is bringing more views than lots of work, this is no-brainer. That's why the most popular clippers/subbers usually won't bother with long clips and the circle ends.
There are exceptions to every rule though and there are long clips with lots of views, usually when a vtuber is telling something important about their life, but the most popular clips will be around one minute with vtuber doing some dumb shit for a quick punchline.

 

[TiredCatto]

how i see, this SodaFunk situation if they decided to debuting as vtuber itself feel like its not gonna work at all. not counting regardless either he is not a girl, content itself and its not actually the first time these whole gossip about Clipper just start become a vtuber thing, it was back when there less clipper and the Hololive moment from bilibili still the one that mostly clipping.

there this dude birdkun21 who getting attention around that time since he become clipper as well, especially since the Gintoki seiyuu watching pekora clip getting popular. somehow decided to slowly self-insert himself into the clip, as ugly avatar at first. and then turn into "i've decided to become vtuber" with lack of avatar preparation, look ugly tbh. with the whole community feel like support him just to end up getting eaten by algorithm, but it seems a bit coincidental with the fact a lot of new clipper pop up, while he think it was the best decision to make himself a vtuber.

 

[Godzilla1984]

I'm trying to give StringStorm's idol project a chance, but so far the girl's streams are rubbing me the wrong way and I just can't put my finger on it.
Nana and Talibah connected at the hip ain't helping me like either and being hamstrung by the GW banhammer is kneecapping the characters out of the gate.
I don't like Cover as a company, but the collaboration ban at debut does serve a purpose to build up one's identity without using someone else as a crutch.

https://youtube.com/c/stringstorm

https://youtube.com/channel/UCqA3bP8wegl7B_RY847Tfsg

https://youtube.com/channel/UCdgHXfqn013bWspGSgWk3Xw

Nana and Talibah play Jackbox (EXTREMELY SCUFFED! NOT CLICKBAIT! WOWOWOW!!!!)

Subscribe to these two!Talibah: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqA3bP8wegl7B_RY847TfsgNana: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdgHXfqn013bWspGSgWk3XwTheir t...

youtu.be

Nana and Talibah play Overcooked and now there's mess everywhere

Subscribe to these two!Talibah: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqA3bP8wegl7B_RY847TfsgNana: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdgHXfqn013bWspGSgWk3XwTheir t...

youtu.be

Nana and Talibah play Left 4 Dead but Nana gets bullied

Subscribe to these two!Talibah: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqA3bP8wegl7B_RY847TfsgNana: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdgHXfqn013bWspGSgWk3XwTheir t...

youtu.be

 

[EenGevolg]

Subbing stuff is time-consuming and requires language skills (and if you are translating something you have no interest in, it is also painfully boring, at least for me).

Spoiler: Probably TMI

As someone who's been dabbling in trying to make clip translations, the absolute longest, slowest, and most boring aspect of it is probably making the timestamps. Translation itself isn't all that time-consuming, unless either it's an ungodly amount of text, or the source contains weird wordplay that you actually have to carefully assess if you want to maintain the semantics as best you can. If you're REALLY feeling lazy, you could even run it through DeepL and have it do 40-70% of the work for you, before you edit the rest yourself. Meanwhile, if you have nothing to go off of, timestamping is an absolutely tiresome, sluggish and joyless experience that you can't really get around. This is why Youtube's past Community Contributions system was so helpful, you had what you needed then and there. Honestly, I can't say my opinion on this would really matter though, considering I translate from English, rather than straight from Japanese. Not only does it mean that I can just extract timestamps based on subtitles inside a video, and that I'd likely lose out on info by essentially translating a translation, but I'm also not having what I'd imagine is the nonstop battle Japanese translators would have to maintain the most accurate context.

 

[RiverBear]

Absolutely. I was just using an example of someone who, recently or no, has churned out five 20-30 minute translated clips (and I believe they even made a compilation on the history of Koushien just before that), as someone clearly putting the time in against people doing brain-dead clips like the aforementioned hypothetical Veibae one.

You could absolutely compare him to Ajasapa, or even compare Soda to Ajasapa if you wanted to go the route of untranslated content and what is more likely to merit monetisation, but my response was solely that it's a shame that work ethic doesn't translate to popularity on YouTube because the demand exists for people LIKE Soda (and not specifically Soda) who is plugged in to the clickbait positive feedback loop.

There was no mention of comparing companies or company talents, or any intent to compare a 'Niji clipper' to a 'Holo clipper'. If you were to ask me the same question about the Pomu/Elira clipper's popularity compared to the likes of Ganneko or Yuri Shizu I would still agree with you. Especially the Pomu one, who dumps clips in bulk when he gets off work.

You posted a clipper's work of translating Niji talents that only reached 5k views in a few days despite the amount of effort they put in. We have had instances of other channels that translate the other company's clips and gets hundreds thousands of views instantly (e.g. the Holo sportfest megaclip)

I'm not being passive aggressive here - I'm telling you that your premise was wrong from the get go.

You explain that people would rather watch Sodafunk's effortless clips (of Hololive that would get thousands of views either way) by showing fully translated clips of Niji as proof (that would get less in any given day)

If you had shown a non translated NijiEN clip having more views than the fully translated Koshien Cup, I wouldn't even argue with you.

But as it stands there are obvious other factors as to why more people watch Sodafunk than the fully translated Baseball clips - and I am willing to bet it isn't because "people would rather watch clips that took no effort"

 

[ThekiwifarmingPanda]

shion yo

she say there will be announcement

 

[Diya]

shion yo

View attachment 2395069
she say there will be announcement

"I'm back! I'm gonna sing a song! And this serve as my graduation stream! Good bye!"
Welcome back, Shion. It's been a while since Hololive is at full roaster, right? (not counting the slow down activity from Marine and Akirose.)
Edit : She's fine. Mention stress from moving and playing the Pokemon MOBA a lot. Does touch lightly on feeling depressed, but doesn't go into detail. At least she seems much better now. Also, the announcement is for the new cover song, Odo by Ado.

 

[Scuttle]

You posted a clipper's work of translating Niji talents that only reached 5k views in a few days despite the amount of effort they put in. We have had instances of other channels that translate the other company's clips and gets hundreds thousands of views instantly (e.g. the Holo sportfest megaclip)

I'm not being passive aggressive here - I'm telling you that your premise was wrong from the get go.

You explain that people would rather watch Sodafunk's effortless clips (of Hololive that would get thousands of views either way) by showing fully translated clips of Niji as proof (that would get less in any given day)

If you had shown a non translated NijiEN clip having more views than the fully translated Koshien Cup, I wouldn't even argue with you.

But as it stands there are obvious other factors as to why more people watch Sodafunk than the fully translated Baseball clips - and I am willing to bet it isn't because "people would rather watch clips that took no effort"

Well if you want examples of Holo clipping projects not getting many views then someone has provided that, too.

As for me? All I wanted to show was that people are translating 2 hours' worth of content in a week and not pulling numbers I feel are relative to the hard work they put in. I even explicitly addressed clip length, the streamers being clipped, and the instant gratification loop as reasons people prefer clippers like Soda.

I did not say that 'People would rather watch clips that took no effort', I said 'People would rather watch clips for reasons X, Y, and Z that happen to take less effort than what other people are making'. There's nuance there.

Either way, it was no one but yourself who mentioned Hololive and turned what I said into a 'Hololive vs. Nijisanji' thing. It's odd that you didn't respond to the person I was replying to despite sharing the exact same sentiments I did.

I didn't really think 'its a shame that clickbait is more popular than high-effort products' to be a controversial statement, yet here we are.

 

[moments fade pain remains]

Hungry Jack's partnership with Hachama.

Domino's should get a deal with Haachama. The pepeloni copypasta alone is more than enough to generate traction.

Screaming goat vs normal Rushia.

When your response to a goat yelling is to yell back to it.