Serious LGBT Discussion

[bearycool]

This place is not to incite idiocy on both sides. If you try to bait someone and or mock someone for their views, you can get your autistic ass out of the door. It's okay to have different views, but it's not okay to make fun of others— at least in this thread for the purpose of civil discussion. You have been warned. If you ignore this warning, then by all means enjoy the harassment that is sure to follow .

This seems just ubiquitous to the forums. We always talk about how much of a faggot others are, or how gay someone is. Lord knows the chat makes me question all of your sexualities sometimes.

But in this thread, we're going to try and be serious. This is deep thoughts after all, and since we do talk constantly about trannies, queers, etc. we should have a critical dialogue on such a thing.

Some guidelines.

• No honeypot shit. Actually try to be critical and serious in your posts
• This isn't SJW General. People are going to use "faggot" and other such words. Don't let offense make you autistic.
• You might be straight, but you probably still have a viewpoint. What are you beliefs, biases, concerns, etc. on LGBT stuff?
• BE CRITICAL! Use the shit you were taught in school, and actually think deep.

So I'll start this out. Why have an LGBT discussion in general?

Well, because it is still an issue both on the internet and the real world. LGBT is not just SJW retardation and trannies and women screaming patriarchy, though that stuff is connected. I actually find the SJW stuff highly idiotic and detrimental to the LGBT community, and likewise to a healthy dialogue on sexuality.

This thread hopes to allow actual critique and discussion beyond the usual lolcow tranny and tumblr-esque bullshit, and actually give light to some real problems-- like the shit happening in Russia, or that HIV rate is rising in the gay community, and why this is happening.

It is these things I hope to present, and any questions to start off are welcomed, and I will be glad to answer them!

 

[Red]

https://kiwifarms.net/threads/lgbt-kiwis.10358/
No need.

 

[bearycool]

https://kiwifarms.net/threads/lgbt-kiwis.10358/
No need.

That's in offtopic, and I have seen that thread. I'm sorry, but that's just people generally say "lolfag" and being goofy.

This thread goes beyond the general "lol, I like cock in my mouth". We are actually going to try to understand what being gay, lesbian, bisexual, and a true trans person is like, and also why we should even care about it.

 

[SpessCaptain]

Hmm, I don't know - like I feel like this is a very broad subject to have a thread on. @Vitriol - opinion?

 

[bearycool]

Hmm, I don't know - like I feel like this is a very broad subject to have a thread on. @Vitriol - opinion?

What's the problem with broad? I can confine it to certain issues such as HIV or just gay people, but really I prefer to have a general discssion on the entire subject. I much prefer a masterthread, or General Discussion on the issue. It allows for open dialogue without too much restraint besides the general rules of Deep Though.

Like how the subject of chemistry is broad, but we still can discuss it.

If you honestly want, we can confine this to "LGBT Issues Discussion" or whatever, and speak strictly on the issues in LGBT.

If that's still too broad, I can even create threads with specific topics of discussion and link them here.

 

[DuskEngine]

https://kiwifarms.net/threads/lgbt-kiwis.10358/
No need.

That thread doesn't really have much going besides "HELLO YES I LOVE COCK"

I do agree with OP that there are a lot of problems with how homosexuality is being discussed in popular culture. Issues with visibility and identity politics should honestly be secondary to reducing harm and guaranteeing people's well-being (if identity and visibility and stuff is worth discussing at all).

I don't think being "erased from media" or whatever falls under the same spectrum as being at-risk for diseases or violence, and it's troubling to see them clubbed together.

 

[Red]

As an LGBT person myself I have a feeling this thread is probably not going to go the way you'd like with such a broad topic on this forum. I mean the non lolcow boards are shitpost central, even after the changes to deep thoughts.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think it's a bad idea, but... this is either going to attract trollshielding tumblrites like flies or become rabid shitposting like the other thread. I'm not very optimistic due to the nature of this board, Deep Thoughts or not.

 

[Vitriol]

Hmm, I don't know - like I feel like this is a very broad subject to have a thread on. @Vitriol - opinion?

What's the problem with broad? I can confine it to certain issues such as HIV or just gay people, but really I prefer to have a general discssion on the entire subject.

Like how the subject of chemistry is broad, but we still can discuss it.

If you honestly want, we can confine this to "LGBT Issues Discussion" or whatever, and speak strictly on the issues in LGBT.

If that's still too broad, I can even create threads with specific topics of discussion and link them here.

If people want to have a discussion with you on lgbt issues i have no problem per se however like @Valiant i prefer for threads to be focused. Notwithstanding my general preference for narrow threads i'm unsure how much actual disussion you will get out of lgbt on the forum so in this case i'm happy to let the general thread remain and we can always split it if a separate discussion on AIDs, Gay Parenthood etc develops.

However while your opening post gives a good guide on tone you don't actually lay out any topics for discussion, why not disclose your opinion on what the major issues for lgbt ppl are today and how to tackle them?

 

[bearycool]

That thread doesn't really have much going besides "HELLO YES I LOVE COCK"

I do agree with OP that there are a lot of problems with how homosexuality is being discussed in popular culture. Issues with visibility and identity politics should honestly be secondary to reducing harm and guaranteeing people's well-being (if identity and visibility and stuff is worth discussing at all).

I don't think being "erased from media" or whatever falls under the same spectrum as being at-risk for diseases or violence, and it's troubling to see them clubbed together.

This I agree.

If we don't have a backbone on health, stability, and, yes, "love", you're going to have a shit community. An example:

Kiwi Farms might be about lolcows, but it's still a tight nit community because it understands the necessity of "Wellbeing" for its members. The health and wellness of others is vital for a community to thrive.

the LGBT community has gotten better, but it still needs work. Especially with gays, there is this constant occurrence of having to hooking up and having one night stands. Now while I don't have a problem per se on that, it is basically the main idea of gay dating. It is like you SHOULD have sex before you fall in love, and there is no courtship. Like "lol, let's fuck, and then maybe fall in love" and nothing more. Gays hypersexualize themselves greatly, and we need to cut that out a little.

If people want to have a discussion with you on lgbt issues i have no problem per se however like @Valiant i prefer for threads to be focused. Notwithstanding my general preference for narrow threads i'm unsure how much actual disussion you will get out of lgbt on the forum so in this case i'm happy to let the general thread remain and we can always split it if a separate discussion on AIDs, Gay Parenthood etc develops.

However while your opening post gives a good guide you don't actually lay out any topics for discussion, why not disclose your opinion on what the major issues for lgbt ppl are today and how to tackle them?

Okay, we can begin with what is close to home for me: Gays. Specifically, we'll start with talking about health, wellness, love and the issue of drugs faggots go through all the time. I just outlined some stuff in my response to @DuskEngine so we can start there if need be.

HIV and drugs have been increasing lately with gays, and I feel that is problematic. I can go into more detail in a moment, so just let me collect my thoughts.

 

[getoffmylawn]

From what I've learned from some of my gay friends, it seems like within the gay community there is a heavy emphasis on looks and wealth which prevents a lot of average gay people from feeling comfortable within the community. I've been told that it made them feel even more distressed than when they came out, because the people they came out to where understanding but they didn't feel accepted by the larger gay community. Did any LGBT kiwis have this sort of issue, and if you did, how did it make you feel/how did you deal with it?

 

[Red]

Especially with gays, there is this constant occurrence of having to hooking up and having one night stands. Now while I don't have a problem per se on that, it is basically the main idea of gay dating. It is like you SHOULD have sex before you fall in love, and there is no courtship. Like "lol, let's fuck, and then maybe fall in love" and nothing more. Gays hypersexualize themselves greatly, and we need to cut that out a little.

I have literally never met a single gay person who believes that.
Not saying it doesn't exist, but that's hardly an issue IMO. Hookups and casual sex are just the big thing with young adult men right now, gay or not. I haven't really met anyone who thought that they had to have sex before finding love. Can hardly call that an LGBT issue. A lot of young men go after hookups and flings long before entering a serious relationship in general, regardless of sexuality. It's more of a cultural problem overall.

Of course, this is coming from someone who lives in an area where even existing as a gay person is probably going to get you shot or curbstomped. I basically cannot imply my girlfriend and I have any romantic inclinations in public because this is such a backwater place. Hookups are probably less of problem here because actually being gay is still something you need to hide.

 

[bearycool]

As an LGBT person myself I have a feeling this thread is probably not going to go the way you'd like with such a broad topic on this forum. I mean the non lolcow boards are shitpost central, even after the changes to deep thoughts.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think it's a bad idea, but... this is either going to attract trollshielding tumblrites like flies or become rabid shitposting like the other thread. I'm not very optimistic due to the nature of this board, Deep Thoughts or not.

If people do that, I will become supervisor of this thread and get stuff back on topic if I must. I'm kind of use to such sperging with this topic, so I at least have some experience with it.

From what I've learned from some of my gay friends, it seems like within the gay community there is a heavy emphasis on looks and wealth which prevents a lot of average gay people from feeling comfortable within the community. I've been told that it made them feel even more distressed than when they came out, because the people they came out to where understanding but they didn't feel accepted by the larger gay community. Did any LGBT kiwis have this sort of issue, and if you did, how did it make you feel/how did you deal with it?

Yes, your gay friend is right. As it is, there is a sort of hypersexuality going on. This means there is just a bunch of physical attraction and lust, and no understanding of the mental and spiritual side of a relationship. Again, that could be just me.

I have literally never met a single gay person who believes that.
Not saying it doesn't exist, but that's hardly an issue IMO. Hookups and casual sex are just the big thing with young adult men right now, gay or not. I haven't really met anyone who thought that they had to have sex before finding love. Can hardly call that an LGBT issue.

AH there we go! Disagreement! Now we can get into the nitty gritty :33.

I don't know about you, but it seems an issue with where I live. It is general for both straight and gay, but there is a sense that you kind of have to fuck before marriage, or before love sometimes. Maybe this is just where I live or my personal experience, so I dunno. But it is an LGBT issue namely because you have two young adult men instead of one, and not just one guy in say a heterosexual form of casual sex. Also, Grindr is a thriving app.

I don't know, I just feel we have a bit of trouble with being a bit too liberal on our sexual appetite. We need to learn to be more minful and aware of that, and have some mentality and even spirituality on it.

 

[Fallensaint]

I have literally never met a single gay person who believes that.
Not saying it doesn't exist, but that's hardly an issue IMO. Hookups and casual sex are just the big thing with young adult men right now, gay or not. I haven't really met anyone who thought that they had to have sex before finding love. Can hardly call that an LGBT issue.

Disagree, you have apps like Grindr specifically for it. Now I know you'll argue that there are the same things for straight people but the difference is that they don't work. They are spam or viruses whereas Grindr is thriving.

 

[Red]

Disagree, you have apps like Grindr specifically for it. Now I know you'll argue that there are the same things for straight people but the difference is that they don't work. They are spam or viruses whereas Grindr is thriving.

I've edited my post for clarification.

I was referring more to the implication that gay people feel pressure to have flings before entering a relationship. I've never seen that-- they want flings, or they don't. I mean, there is a problem with pressure on young men to fuck as much as possible, but that includes straight men. Look at tinder, the straight version of grinder.

I do think it's an issue, though not one I've ever seen myself due to the circumstances of where I live. I just don't think it's a strictly LGBT issue.

EDIT: Just because I've never met an aspect of a community doesn't mean I don't think they exist. I was trying to state that it isn't much of a problem here where public gayness still gets curbstomped and people have disowned their children for having sex before marriage.

 

[bearycool]

I've edited my post for clarification.

I was referring more to the implication that gay people feel pressure to have flings before entering a relationship. I've never seen that-- they want flings, or they don't. I mean, there is a problem with pressure on young men to fuck as much as possible, but that includes straight men. Look at tinder, the straight version of grinder.

I do think it's an issue, though not one I've ever seen myself due to the circumstances of where I live. I just don't think it's a strictly LGBT issue.

Ah, I'm glad your brought this up.

This is a personal anecdote, but I think it holds some water.

I actually have cognitive dissonance, especially when I browse grindr. I am a very sexual person, and do want to fuck. The problem is, most guys I browse want a fling, or are ambiguous on if they want something more. I am sexual, but I want a relationship. And even those who say they want one usually go for sexual at once. There is no courtship process really.

I actually hooked up with a guy who said they wanted more, maybe friends, and when we did the deed he kind of left and blocked me on the app. That shit sucks man, but it was an experience. And maybe it has made me bias because of it, who knows. Neverheless, I still think it is valid.

 

[Red]

Ah, I'm glad your brought this up.

This is a personal anecdote, but I think it holds some water.

I actually have cognitive dissonance, especially when I browse grindr. I am a very sexual person, and do want to fuck. The problem is, most guys I browse want a fling, or are ambiguous on if they want something more. I am sexual, but I want a relationship. And even those who say they want one usually go for sexual at once. There is no courtship process really.

I actually hooked up with a guy who said they wanted more, maybe friends, and when we did the eed he kind of left and blocked me on the app. That shit sucks man, but it was an experience. And maybe it has made me bias because of it, who knows. Neverheless, I still think it is valid.

I completely see what you mean. Look at any pop-culture or social media about relationships and you can see how a lot of young people, mostly men but not always, are just in it for sex and relationships are baaaaad. It's not strictly an LGBT issue, it's an everyone issue, is what I'm trying to say. Hypersexuality and hypermasculinity are the big things right now. Granted, I only know this stuff from looking at the Internet because here the big things are driving huge trucks and taking your guns in public. I've never personally been threatened to my face but I've had a customer at work complain to my manager after overhearing me mention the word girlfriend to my co-worker. They wanted me fired, to which my manager just laughed considering I'm probably the only reliable night shift employee they have. Needless to say nothing came out of it, but I've been referring to her as my partner for the time being. She lives in a much more progressive country and visiting her feels amazing because we can actually hold hands without getting called dyke faggots by passing drivers. (Also she has things called SIDEWALKS would you imagine) A neighbor has actually threatened to my parents that he was going to rape me, but I know nothing is going to come out of it because he's already on strict watch due to attempts to groom young girls in the neighborhood. Like, 8.

TLDR Hookup fever isn't a huge problem here because the more pressing issue is gay people are still incredibly marginalized here. Sex before marriage is still not widely accepted here so hookups are limited to highshoolers before they move to civilization to go to college.

To be fair, though, I wouldn't use grindr for relationships. It's not really the target demographic. A dating site or LGBT community events would probably be a better shot for you. Sending good vibes to you for hopefully a nice dude to come along and not immediately want penis.

Also sorry this might be a bit incoherent because I'm on sleeping pills RN and it's very difficult to keep my word vomit together. I AM ON MY MEDS AND I AM ON LINE

 

[vertexwindi]

I've always wondered why the T is in LGBT, considering transsexualism has very little to do with sexual preference.

And yes, Grindr is a poor app for anything but hook-ups. Personally not a fan.

 

[Red]

've always wondered why the T is in LGBT, considering transsexualism has very little to do with sexual preference.

Transgendered people tend to face the same issues from the public as LGB people do. A lot of misinformed people consider them "sexual deviants" and even a lot of people in the gay community marginalize them.

 

[DoshesToDoshes]

Not too long ago, I came across a man wearing a dress with his friends. I was uncomfortable next to him (her?), yet I felt bad for feeling uncomfortable.

 

[DirkBloodStormKing]

Well, I'm bisexual and I've felt somewhat isolated in the past for it. Like, of course I liked boys but I was ashamed of liking girls for a while because there were a lot of people (including some relatives) that were not too accepting of LGBT in general, let alone bisexuality.

While I do like the fact that people are becoming more and more accepting of LGBT people where I live (America), there are still some places where people will not be accepting of it, even people I'm sort of friends with in real life (since some of my friends are rather conservative and religious).