Bitcoin, the Funny Money of this decade

WWWWolf

Has a camera, will kick butt
kiwifarms.net
Joined
Mar 25, 2013
I'm thinking the funnier aspects of Bitcoin would be worth making a thread for.

A short technical intro: Bitcoin is a research project for peer-to-peer, pseudonymous cryptocurrencies. In plain English: currencies that don't depend on central banks and tying identities to the transactions - similar to handling cash in person-to-person sales, really. Everything is based on cryptographical proofs of transactions which are difficult to produce, and which, when completed, yield some free money for the volunteers who provide computing power to that cause.

Technically, there's not a whole lot of problems with this, except that anyone with rudimentary knowledge of computers would see that this is definitely a research project, not something that people can actually use on daily basis. The biggest problems are that all transactions take up to 10 minutes to verify (which probably isn't a problem in online shopping but would get really annoying in real life). The second is that everyone properly connected to the network itself needs a copy of the blockchain, which is the record of every transaction ever made in the network - right now several gigabytes and it just keeps piling up every day. Most people skip this and just use online wallets, which brings its own set of problems.

Bitcoin enthusiasts keep saying that all of these problems will eventually be solved. Everything will be just fine. Right.

Oh. Bitcoin enthusiasts? That's where the funny parts are. The software side of Bitcoin is genuinely interesting, but the user community is interesting in a whole different sense.

The two sanest groups of people using and promoting Bitcoin are currency traders and scammers. Currency traders treat it as a commodity to be traded. Scammers do calculated attempts at getting your money.
Of course, people generally think stock-market sharks are part of the despicable side of capitalism in general (as in not the part that ultimately produces goods and services people actually need, just profiting off of people who do), and scammers are something that the laws are there for. (Oops, law enforcement is a bit slow on handling Bitcoin though.)

Conspicuously missing from the list of sane people: consumers and stores. There's few actual stores that accept bitcoin (now that the law enforcement is finally cracking down on drug stores), and people still don't give a damn because the prices aren't anywhere near stable.

Actually getting money in and out of the Bitcoin network is an exercise in pain, mostly because the people who run the exchanges are either incompetent (there's been a great number of security breaches) or absolutely hostile toward the regulations or societal expectations they have to follow ("We can only deal with small sums. To exchange bigger sums, you need proof of identity. Don't worry, we only have a backlog of 3 months to process those. Blame the government bureaucracy, not us! Always screwing the little man! It's not like we'd be in any way obligated to hire more staff to handle these matters in a professional manner that people generally expect from financial institutions!")

And then there's the miners - the people who run the systems that produce proofs of transactions. The system was originally designed so that a small group of people could actually handle that. Now? The network has hundreds of times the capacity it needs. Pretty clear that miners aren't out there for the altruistic, volunteering goal of keeping the network running - they're out there to get FREE MONEY!!!!1!!!!. And oh how they do! They were promised a freedom from all those pesky government rules governing financial transactions, and apparently every single safety regulation in the book. There's dedicated hardware to mine Bitcoin, but because mining is so competitive, the hardware is basically obsolete before it is even released. (How do you get rich in gold rush? Sell hardware to the suckers who think that they're getting gold.)

And this is just scratching the surface. Any other favourite stories of Bitcoin weirdnesses, people?
 
I'm glad this came up in this forum. I actually had a feeling that someone was going to start a thread about this (obvious evidence of my enormous precognitive powers :roll:). After reading a few recent news articles involving Bitcoin, I started to do some research with one question in mind: Just what the fuck is Bitcoin?

Unfortunately, an answer to that was hard to come by. Googling about Bitcoin tends to bring up a bunch of forum posts talking about mining Bitcoin, and how it's either a great opportunity or completely pointless now because so many people have computer farms dedicated solely to processing Bitcoin calculations. Everything else tends to be a swarm of supporters shouting, "Bitcoin is a bigger innovation than the Internet!" "Bitcoin is going to free us from the government's shackles!" Bitcoin is the next coming of Christ! While, on the other hand, Google's top autocomplete searches for "Bitcoin is" are "Bitcoin is stupid," "Bitcoin is a joke," "Bitcoin is evil," "Bitcoin is dead." :lol:

Gradually, I started understanding how Bitcoin works and why people use it. But learning more did absolutely nothing to cultivate my interest in either using Bitcoin myself or the sociopolitical implications of decentralized digital currencies.

I do think, however, that when people joke about using time travel to get rich, instead of saying they'll go back in time to play the stock market, they should say the'll go back in time to 2009 when Bitcoin was worth less then one cent per coin and wait four years to sell them for $1,250 apiece.
 
Psh, Bitcoin. If you're gonna use cryptocurrencies, go for one with widespread adoption.

... in all seriousness, Bitcoin is quite interesting from a technological side, but the economics just aren't there. Even if you ignore the adoption issue (kind of the elephant in the room) - you have all the disadvantages of gold-backed currencies (such as built-in deflationary tendencies) and then some, and there's a reason we moved away from those. Being able to make transactions via networks is nice, but it isn't much of an advantage in the age of PayPal, AlertPay, Google Wallet etc. - or, hell, credit cards. And the community surrounding it does, indeed, consist almost exclusively of scammers, speculators and a few particularly earnest libertarians. They would probably see the complete lack of regulation or central monetary authority as an advantage, I guess.

The miners actually upset me to some degree, I have to admit. It's been called "one of the biggest distributed computing projects in history", which is nice and all, but all that computing doesn't actually serve much of a purpose. People are pissing away perfectly good resources on their retarded nerdcoin get-rich-quick schemes, when there are many more worthwhile causes they could be used for. I can't wait for when mining stops being profitable. (Actually, that may have already happened. I haven't crunched the numbers. :stupid: If it has, the currency is living on borrowed time.)

Speaking of bitcoin weirdness: There's a Bitcoin Kickstarter ripoff! As you would expect, almost all the projects are about Bitcoins, Bitcoin agitprop, Reddit, porn or all of the above (last link is NSFW, obviously).
 
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I read a suggestion by someone that the generation of Bitcoin be based off of Folding@Home or SETI@Home. If the technical obstacles could be overcome, I would be 100% behind a digital currency that was created as a byproduct of disease research, but from the counterpoints in the thread I was reading, the way that Folding@Home and related projects work compared to the processes of Bitcoin mining make the whole idea unviable.
 
If you could do that, yeah, I'd be 100% for that! I have to admit I don't really know enough about stuff like protein folding to estimate how feasible that is, but it sounds like a cool idea. Shame if that's infeasible. I guess you could theoretically pay people in foocoins to reward them for data crunching, but you need to procure those first, so I guess it's a wash. :stupid:

On the less reasonable front - ladies and gentlemen, I present: Bitcoin and the downfall of feminism. (TL;DR summary: "Put simply, pure Bitcoin transactions will present a very challenging proposition for any government to tax." and feminism only exists because of gov't bux.)
 
Bitcoin is based on SHA-2 encryption. SHA-1 was cracked, as was SHA-0, MD-5, MD-4, MD-2 before it, all were released by the same entity: the NSA.

Needless to say, I do not trust bitcoin. I trust gold and silver because they are intrinsically valuable, one of Aristotle's monetary criteria that many seem to wilfully ignore, misinterpret, or sidestep with argumenta ad novellum.
 
Hróðvitnisson said:
I trust gold and silver because they are intrinsically valuable, one of Aristotle's monetary criteria that many seem to wilfully ignore, misinterpret, or sidestep with argumenta ad novellum.

"Intrinisically valuable"... I don't know about that. Depends on how you define the term, I suppose. "Widely accepted as valuable", certainly, but at the end of the day, gold is just pretty, soft yellow metal - you can't eat it, drink it, use it to treat illness or make tools out of it. It has its uses, but few things don't. Gold does have certain properties that make it a good option for a currency, though. Ideally, you want something that doesn't lose value over time, can't (easily) be counterfeited, is useless in itself (i. e. doesn't take up resources that could be better used for something else) and is scarce - these all hold for gold, for trustworthy regular currencies and they theoretically hold for cryptocurrencies, too. If you really want to put your money in something that's not dang dirty gubmint-backed fiat money, though - yeah, go for the pretty metals. (Or cigarettes! Those worked well post-WW2.) As always, adoption is key. Doesn't matter how great your value representation tokens are on paper if nobody but you uses them.

Hróðvitnisson said:
Bitcoin is based on SHA-2 encryption. SHA-1 was cracked, as was SHA-0, MD-5, MD-4, MD-2 before it, all were released by the same entity: the NSA.

Also relevant. (Though breaking properly-implemented encryption/hashing algorithms isn't as easy as one may think.)
 
Recent funny news: a bunch of Bitcoiners smash their iPhones in anger because Apple won't let them have wallet apps in App Store. Some of them did so because some random nobody in Reddit with absolutely no previous post history was promising Nexus 5s for proof that they destroyed their iPhones. I wonder if Clyde Cash was somehow involved and many of the people bid their phones fond faredoo.

Also, Bitcoin prices took a gigantic dive again because Russia banned them.

Hróðvitnisson said:
Bitcoin is based on SHA-2 encryption. SHA-1 was cracked, as was SHA-0, MD-5, MD-4, MD-2 before it, all were released by the same entity: the NSA.
In security circles, everyone's rightfully sceptical if someone says they have developed an unbreakable cryptosystem. Because they're obviously bullshitting. No such thing as a 100% secure cryptosystem or a hash algorithm.

Also, all of the algorithms have to be published, publicly discussed and publicly analysed. It doesn't matter who designed the algorithm as long as the consensus of the scientific community at the large says that the algorithm is secure enough for the time being.

NSA famously recommended changing the DES algorithm in 1976, before it was finalised. Everyone cried bullshit and thought it was an attempt at introducing a backdoor. They tried to find one ever since. Funnily enough, everyone nowadays seems to agree that NSA's changes improved the design.

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Edit: Grammar ain't easy when you're drunk
 
lonesome said:
Hróðvitnisson said:
I trust gold and silver because they are intrinsically valuable, one of Aristotle's monetary criteria that many seem to wilfully ignore, misinterpret, or sidestep with argumenta ad novellum.

"Intrinisically valuable"... I don't know about that. Depends on how you define the term, I suppose.
Depends on whether you subscribe to the labor-theory of value or not, which turns into a philosophical debate. If you do, gold (like any commodity) is valuable by virtue of being mined and processed by human labor, and paper money can be used as a substitute if it has a central authority backing its value (either in gold or as a representation of the total value of the country's GDP). In that case, my interpretation would be that Bitcoin is more like paper money than gold, in that it has no inherent value (it's produced by machine calculations, so if it has any value on its own, it's incredibly insignificant) and is only an intermediary form of wealth. So in that case Bitcoin's only value over dollars, euros, rubles, etc. would be tax evasion and anonymity.
 
To say an object has "intrinsic value" is equivalent to saying it has "zero counter-party risk." Things like pearls, bushels of wheat, and the large stone wheels on the island of Yap meet this criterion. However, pearls are neither divisible nor fungible, wheat is not durable, and stone wheels are not portable, rendering them useless as money.

However, a depository certificate for a bushel of wheat cannot be said to be intrinsically valuable because there is a counter-party - whoever is storing the grain. The certificate, being a piece of paper whose value is contingent upon someone else's willingness to redeem it, is not money.

In passing, to see that steaming pile of cow manure called the "Labour Theory of Value" is still stinking up economic thought is troubling indeed.
 
Hold on guys I have a Nigerian Prince on the phone who tells me that I just inherited millions of dollars
 
If your currency is banned in any one country, something tells me you've failed in your endeavour.

Plus you can't buy hookers or blow with bitcoins so who cares anyways
 
Okay, can we please read the rules before creating topics? What the fuck. How is cryptocurrency a lolcow?

This forum is not designed to facilitate angry rants about groups and entities you don't like. It's for infamous e-celebs who do funny shit.
 
Null said:
Okay, can we please read the rules before creating topics? What the fuck. How is cryptocurrency a lolcow?

This forum is not designed to facilitate angry rants about groups and entities you don't like. It's for infamous e-celebs who do funny shit.

Like I said in the original post, Bitcoin itself isn't really funny, but the user community is full of really weird and fascinating personalities.

But I'm aware that making such thread would attract criticism toward Bitcoin itself, so I'm not really opposed to moving the thread.
 
WWWWolf said:
Null said:
Okay, can we please read the rules before creating topics? What the fuck. How is cryptocurrency a lolcow?

This forum is not designed to facilitate angry rants about groups and entities you don't like. It's for infamous e-celebs who do funny shit.

Like I said in the original post, Bitcoin itself isn't really funny, but the user community is full of really weird and fascinating personalities.

But I'm aware that making such thread would attract criticism toward Bitcoin itself, so I'm not really opposed to moving the thread.
It doesn't really matter, it's a pretty dumb concept for a thread like this. There's a lot of weirdasses who obsess over Ron Paul, but making a thread over that would be dumb too.

"People and groups you don't like aren't automatically lolcows. The criteria for a Lolcow is someone on the Internet, who is extremely weird, and their reaction to this attention is funny. Anything else gets locked."
 
Bitcoin and similar things are just there to show we are very close to living in the times as told in the book of Revelation.

But that's just me talking, and I'm not debating that any further. :stupid:
 
TrippinKahlua said:
Bitcoin and similar things are just there to show we are very close to living in the times as told in the book of Revelation.

But that's just me talking, and I'm not debating that any further. :stupid:
Nero is already a couple thousand years dead and the generation that saw Jesus is dead too, bro, you're a bit late to the Revelation party. :lol:

I like Dogecoin. If that shit ever hits $1, I'll have a whole $60! :roll:
 
Null said:
"People and groups you don't like aren't automatically lolcows. The criteria for a Lolcow is someone on the Internet, who is extremely weird, and their reaction to this attention is funny. Anything else gets locked."

Something that hasn't been brought up is all the inherent weirdness behind cryptocurrencies and especially bitcoin. Things like:

* Mt. Gox, the largest trading site, isn't a cute name on something like Fort Knox. It actually stands for the Magic the Gathering Online Exchange. It was a website dedicated to the selling and trade of DIGITAL magic cards, and it was realized bitcoins could get them more money.

* Mt. Gox regularly has "ddos" attacks whenever there is a run. That means they freeze everyone's assets in place for hours/days at a time to keep from having to pay out during a drop in currency. This makes the people who heavily invest in it want to sell even MORE. The standard advice for bitcoins is "buy high, sell low" because that's about all you can do. It's hard to react to market fluctuations when the stock market doesn't let you sell and also you can only buy in 10 minute windows.

* But that's assuming there's someone who wants to buy your stuff. It's like the stockmarket. You can have $100,000,000 in a stock, but unless there's a buyer for it, you can't sell it all. If no one wants to buy $800 worth of bitcoins, you're not getting it. And nevermind the 10 minute trade delay that may see a drop after your posted price and your coins aren't bought then either.

* Satoishi, the "guy" who "invented" it is an unknown person no one has met and no one has any idea where he came from. Nevermind that this was designed solely as an exercise and never ever ever ment for public use.

* There is a hard limit on bitcoins that the adopters don't want to admit. Maybe it's 8 decimal places? So if 1 bitcoin equals $800, than 0.00000001 of a bitcoin equals 0.000008's of a cent. BUT, keep in mind everyone who has a religious belief in the currency wants to see it's value rise expotentially and non-stop, especially since there are a limited number that can be mined. Eventually the mine runs out. This doesn't seem like a lot, but remember that bitcoins can be lost. If you format your computer and don't back up your wallet? Gone. If you send your coins to the wrong address? Gone. If you send your coins to someone who doesn't provide you with a service? Gone. If there's a split in the blockchain but you send coins out anyway? Gone? Oh, about that...

* Everyone has to have a copy of the blockchain, which is currently sitting at 14gigs and growing. If 51% of the userbase adopts a blockchain that has a change in it, say to how records are processed or whatever, then 49% of the users are using fake currency that REALLY doesn't exist! As soon as they get synced to the real blockchain, all transfers and purchases are voided. You can sell your product, receive your money, and not be able to cash it out because Mt. Gox is either down OR your exchange doesn't believe you are legit.

* Bitcoin is all about scammers! Butterfly labs is a bit one, because they're liars and thieves that are propped up by an under-intelligent and increasingly more devout customer base. Then you have the online gaming league ESEA that inserted malware into their client so while your system is idle it maxed out your graphics card and mined bitcoins for them. Lastly, you have people who flat out lie and run ponzi schemes - schemes that have no repercussion, no way to get your money back, and that people defend to the very end... and continue to defend after the fact because that guy is a REAL CAPITALIST who just "gamed the marks".

* And never forget that it's a losing game as far as mining goes. The difficulty of the math problems that you are expected to solve rises with every person involved. The more people mining, the harder it is to mine. You no longer have the nerd in his basement getting brain damage, you have people building bigger and bigger rigs and more and more ascii machines to mine funny-money that they can't cash out and can't buy anything with. It actually costs you money to mine bitcoins, and it wastes lots of power. The heat generated from mining a few years ago could be used to dehydrate fruit.

* And please don't forget the Winklevoss twins, the meathead rowers who Zuckerburg fucked over. The CEO of the bitcoin company they founded was arrested for money laundering, because if you're not in bitcoins to scam people you're in it to get fucked.

Long story short. "Bitcoin" isn't a lolcow. Everything and everyone that uses and believes in it is. They will bray from the rooftops about boycotting Paypal for not accepting bitcoins. They will crow victory if Stephen Colbert makes fun of them because obviously "his heart wasn't in it" and it was satire becuase he totes believes in them.
 
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