How Do We Forget?

[Circular Square]

Through the passage of time, our memory tends to grow dimmer; details, words, names, incidents, forgotten either piece-by-piece or rapidly like with dementia/Alzheimer's. But I've also heard of other things that seem similar. The destruction of idols or statues. The burning of books, sacred or secular. My question is, can such activities be considered a form of forgetting?
Sorry if I sound like a pseud

 

[Thunk Provoker]

In a sense, they can. Destruction of things like books or statues is often done because the destroyer sees the thing as representing some idea that is so immoral that it's a threat to society. So it's willful forgetting.

The thing is that this demands constant vigilance to prevent these ideas from developing, so they can never be truly forgotten. To forget something with time you just need to not pay attention to it, so it's much more likely to be lost forever.

 

[Haim Arlosoroff]

How does a society move on from their failures?

Whether you see the Great Evil of the west as Colonialism or Postcolonialism, and the books promoting whichever dogma you reject, what do you do when the movement and cultural zeitgeist is over? Do you leave the society broken and turned against itself? Do you fight to kill one of the contradictory ideas and messages in order for the other to live and society to reunify?

These are the problems of civilization, from the Bronze Age to the Axial Age to the Christian Age, that we haven't simply had the insight to properly solve within our civilization. For if the Nile receded and the crops failed then should not the Pharaoh be overthrown and his statues destroyed? If the locals refuse to follow Roman law and its uplifting technological and social constructs then do they deserve to be brought low and scattered? When witchcraft and magic become common delusions and those who believe in such things become seduced by the Devil in dreams and visions should they be burned alive at the stake to ensure their villages survive and retain their Christian purity?

There is a phenomenon called a Mass Formation or more commonly called mob mentality. It happens when a complex situation is noticed by the common man and is seen to be potentially fatal (or causes an anxiety disorder) but which the common people only indirectly interact with. COVID, homosexuality and transgenderism, nuclear war, apocalyptic signs from religious texts seeming to appear in your life, the decisions of political parties, your job in the greater economy of modern international trade, or the consent manufacturing that launches wars after an attack on the nation are examples today of triggers for mob mentalities to form or a Mass Formation to occur. The usual steps then follow:

• There are formed beliefs in the absolute necessity of conformity, in the overwhelming compulsion to act, and the dire need for a strong man like Dr. Fauci or Adolf Hitler to be followed as the only man who knows what is happening and how best to survive it. Who else has the superhuman charisma and wondrous insight into the life-or-death issues of the day? Of course those who question whether they really have these traits are accused of violent behavior and rightfully legally repressed in more-and-more-common "rare acts". Protection of "rare acts" in the name of Patriotism or Progress such that they be only seen and spoke about first and foremost as rare and temporary are a sign of a Mass Formation. The highly emotional rejection of the moral rejection of this repression (and the insistence that such measures be seen as rarely occurring) is a key sign that a person is a member of the mob mentality. Ironically the secret Police which later develop around Mass Formations often contain the least fanatical of the larger society, but contain those who know the process cannot be stopped and so blent in by urging the predictable (but certainly not moral or logical) next steps.
• There is a growing hatred and disgust openly normalized of the unvaccinated, or of the soviet agent amongst us, or of Democrat or Republican party bases living in our otherwise beautiful city with us. Eventually only by directly displaying our allegiances and conforming to a blind loyalty to the party, faith, or community ensures we are safe and away from the dangerous elements dooming society. We have all seen the signs out in front of the liberal family's home. Salvation lies in commitment to the cause, and excusing its excesses as necessity. This is normally the stage where the books are burnt and the statues toppled, it is just a sign of deeper commitment to solving the crisises of our time and so is but a step along the path. The organizing about these purges are usually formalized and the resulting organizations are usually trusted with the later stages of the Mass Formation. If America forms a federal police service it will hire the statue-topplers and the BLM rioters to great surprise over there at Fox News.
• There are certain mannerisms that originally were meant to save us (like Alcohol wipes or supporting our local businesses) but once it becomes known that they are each useless, instead of being discarded they are continued as social signals to our orthodoxy and faith. Uniforms develop and are pridefully upkept and worn. Party Emblems such as Rainbow Flags or Swastikas are instinctively protected while the opposition's symbols are instinctively attacked. Far worse, the perception of the attack always carries with it a perceived vulnerability in the social structure. Jews are a racial parasite, secretly working together, so logically Germans will have to fanatically work together. Class enemies turn workers against each other, by quotas and incentives, so logically politicians should provide top-down plans and goals with punishments and rewards to society. It should be understood most that the increasingly muddled symbols and suggestions are the final battles against the enemies hiding amongst us in their dog-whistles and innuendo, more and more purges against less and less noticeable etiquette and microaggressions begin leading to the end-stage of the Mass Formation. The society turns into its enemy in order to fight its enemy so it must exchange the obvious accusations from yesterday with the increasingly desperate hair-splitting of tomorrow. Democrats take money from banks, republicans try to be cool and accepting, unvaccinated promote health cures, Trudeau uses emergency acts to shut down his opponents finances. But don't worry, there are still important differences. Its just that some people get excited, but they're the good guys because they signal that they're on our team.
• There are purity spirals which eventually consume us all and turn family members against each other. The Holodomor, the First Five-Year Plan (1928-1932), and the Great Terror of 1937–1938, are probably the worst campaigns so far of political repression and executions. At all times they were openly directed and carried out by uniformed Soviet officers under their changing titles: the Cheka during the Civil War, the OGPU during forced collectivisation of agriculture, and the NKVD during the Great Terror. The people though never fought back. Its so confusing to people until they understand one central fact, at all times the people's loyalties were to the Mass Formation rather than each other, there was no concept of 'us' or 'them' without thinking in the very terms of the purity spiral which was killing them and their families. The madness was the reason for moral unity, and so there was no other reason for others to trust you or for you to trust them. By the end we are all made to see a mere suggestion of danger as the danger itself, and so a reduction to the furthest abstraction of the hated thing was the thing entirety. It only burns itself out once the fear of Reactionaries, or Reds, or Unvaccinated itself is completely removed, and so in a rejection of committing to an ultimate conformity to oppose them isn't emotionally triggering any further.

Finally once the phenomenon ends in exhaustion and where previously the Catholic burned the Protestant for heresy, now the two churches stand side-by-side and leaders ignore the situation in learned helplessness unless another Mass Formation happens which splits the group along similar lines.

Civilization simply has never dealt with the issue wisely and successfully. We have not yet matured out of these issues, and probably America will die to a Mass Formation. The modern international economy will die to one. The technological era we are in will end fatally or otherwise by one. We are helpless against our collective delusions forming one, and the destruction of our learning and our leadership figuratively in book-burning and the tearing down of statues or literally by assassination of thought-leaders is just a natural byproduct of mob mentalities compelling us into rigid ordering and turning on those who so much as hesitate.

 

[Circular Square]

In a sense, they can. Destruction of things like books or statues is often done because the destroyer sees the thing as representing some idea that is so immoral that it's a threat to society. So it's willful forgetting.

The thing is that this demands constant vigilance to prevent these ideas from developing, so they can never be truly forgotten. To forget something with time you just need to not pay attention to it, so it's much more likely to be lost forever.

I do agree that the destroying of the old things would lead to some maintaining some sort of memory of it, but given enough time and enough of a stranglehold on the verboten info, it could pass away from public memory and be like something that was forgotten naturally.

Also Haim, don't stop the longposts, please keep doing what you're doing

Spoiler

I enjoy reading them, sincerely

The biblical book of Ecclesiastes talks a lot about how "there is no remembrance of former things" especially in regards to generations/inheritances. I've always thought it meant more along the lines of the passage of time leading to the old being forgotten, but it could also be a reference to more willful forgetting.

Spoiler

Sorry for the incoming long post

I did find a specific example of forgetting being conflated with the destruction of the old in the Futurism manifesto by Marinetti which seems to hold in high-esteem such actions:

"The oldest of us is thirty: so we have at least a decade for finishing our work. When we are forty, other younger and stronger men will probably throw us in the wastebasket like useless manuscripts—we want it to happen!"

I was a bit surprised at seeing this in writing since it encapsulates a lot of the sentiment (I think) in things similar to it but more specialized (throwing out traditional religion, throwing out old scientific theories, throwing out the old in general).

Now what Haim said's got my noggin joggin so allow me to introduce something to you all; We know our memory is finite and we can't retain all the information we come across (our brain already filters out a lot for us). We also know that forgetting is natural and so our memory can become distorted/lost over time. But in the case where we choose to do anything that gives us information (which is pretty much every action in our lives) you could say we are choosing to make a memory (at least potentially). On the flip-side, however, by doing something you are also choosing to forget a bit of whatever is not related to what you're doing (assuming our memory is like a leaking bucket with a bunch of holes with sealed off compartments, by doing something we seal one of the holes for a period of time and maybe add water the specific compartment, but the rest of the bucket is still leaking).

If you guys agree, wouldn't one be responsible for their forgetting in this sense? If you guys disagree, please share your thoughts.

 

[RembrandtCourage]

 

[Haim Arlosoroff]

Also (((Haim))), don't stop the longposts, please keep doing what you're doing

Drinking, which is why that was so poorly formatted. I cleaned it up slightly.

Now what (((Haim))) said's got my noggin joggin so allow me to introduce something to you all; We know our memory is finite and we can't retain all the information we come across (our brain already filters out a lot for us). We also know that forgetting is natural and so our memory can become distorted/lost over time. But in the case where we choose to do anything that gives us information (which is pretty much every action in our lives) you could say we are choosing to make a memory (at least potentially). On the flip-side, however, by doing something you are also choosing to forget a bit of whatever is not related to what you're doing (assuming our memory is like a leaking bucket with a bunch of holes with sealed off compartments, by doing something we seal one of the holes for a period of time and maybe add water the specific compartment, but the rest of the bucket is still leaking).

Life is just the series of paths we take, its scary to think of the people we would have become had we gone down the other way. In my marriage, I notice me and the wife altering how we talk to each other. We grow together so we don't grow apart. Our children learn by what they see more than what we teach them, if we were different with each other then I imagine my children would see the world very differently. I was responsible for their forgetting in that sense, if I'm understanding what you mean?


We are the sum of our choices, good and bad.

 

[Large]

with our heads