Lootboxes are not gambling - There is literally nothing wrong with Lootboxes

[Colonel J]

Lootboxes aren't gambling as you can't win money or lose your money and win nothing at all and if you don't like it don't buy it like I do. Lootboxes have no detrimental physical/mental effects from ceasing the activity like what occurs in actual addictions.

People keep spouting the terrible argument that "X-country banned lootboxes. So clearly lootboxes ARE gambling." I'll be countering this terrible argument and getting it out of the way with another equally terrible argument in case someone here is retarded enough to bring it up.

X-country says lootboxes aren't gambling. So clearly lootboxes AREN'T gambling.

Loot boxes whose contents rely on chance don't meet the UK's criteria for unlawful gambling.
According to the UK Gambling Commission, since the prizes unlocked in loot boxes are usable only in the games in which they're won, and can't be cashed-out, they don't fit the bill for "licensable gambling activity."
https://www.ign.com/articles/2017/1...s-loot-boxes-arent-gambling-under-british-law

Lets take League of Legends of Overwatch form of lootboxes for example. I can't make any money off what I win. Sure i can sell my account to make money that way, but the profit margins would be terrible, unless i sold a hacked account or something and occur 0 losses, and that's not allowed by Riot Games or Blizzard and they will actively ban you for it.

There is a caveat, however. Lootboxes can become gambling if you can profit from it. In a game like CS:GO, you can actually sell what you win to other players legally. I will concede that this particular form lootboxes can be considered gambling.

tldr: Many games do lootboxes well. Some games do them "poorly" so people want to overreact and get rid of them all. These people are faggots.

edit 2 proofs showing how lootboxes aren't gambling from the actual definitions of the word:

Proof 1 and 2 are dependent on how we read the definition of gamble. "Play games of chance for money."

This can mean:
1) playing game a of chance for the purpose of money (Proof 2)
or
2) playing a game of chance at the cost of money (Proof 1)

 

[bearycool]

This is about ethics in lootbox journalism

#LootboxGate
#GamersRiseUp

 

[Colonel J]

This is about ethics in lootbox journalism

#LootboxGate
#GamersRiseUp

Subscribe to my Patreon!

 

[Cedric_Eff]

Sounds like OP works at Activision-Blizzard.

 

[King Buzzo]

Sounds like OP works at Activision-Blizzard.

Nah, but their uncle works at Nintendo.

 

[Glad I couldn't help]

Yes, just like there is nothing wrong with patching your game for the couple of bugs found post-launch, creating an ecosystem that rewards mod-makers who extending the value of your game many years over or revising your promises as development progresses.

Spoiler: Also

Spoiler: BUY

Spoiler: MY

Spoiler: GAMES

 

[BoingBoingBoi]

There is a caveat, however. Lootboxes can become gambling if you can profit from it. In a game like CS:GO, you can actually sell what you win to other players legally. I will concede that this particular form lootboxes can be considered gambling.

this is a pretty big fucking caveat if your view is that there is literally nothing wrong with lootboxes. at best you can say that not all Lootboxes are gambling, though some are, or that Lootboxes are not in principle gambling.

also, "there is literally nothing wrong with Lootboxes" is a completely different claim than "not all Lootboxes are gambling." there can be other things wrong with lootboxes aside from the fact that they might be akin to gambling in some cases. for example, people complained about the lootboxes in shadow of war because without using them, the endgame was a miserable grind, and so they actively took away from many players' enjoyment of the game. the risk of making aaa and other titles pay-to-win because of lootboxes is another big reason people dislike them that is completely independent from the gambling aspect.

 

[Rand /pol/]

Libtarfs btfo

 

[Colonel J]

this is a pretty big fucking caveat if your view is that there is literally nothing wrong with lootboxes. at best you can say that not all Lootboxes are gambling, though some are, or that Lootboxes are not in principle gambling.

also, "there is literally nothing wrong with Lootboxes" is a completely different claim than "not all Lootboxes are gambling." there can be other things wrong with lootboxes aside from the fact that they might be akin to gambling in some cases. for example, people complained about the lootboxes in shadow of war because without using them, the endgame was a miserable grind, and so they actively took away from many players' enjoyment of the game. the risk of making aaa and other titles pay-to-win because of lootboxes is another big reason people dislike them that is completely independent from the gambling aspect.

The thing is, I can't think of another game that allows you to sell what you win like CS:Go does. I'm confident in saying you can't in a supermajority of games that have lootboxes.

People don't like pay to win lootboxes. That's fine and i agree. However, all these cringey "videogame ethics" youtubers only make it about gambling because they get money for it and they know very well that pay2win games aren't illegal and will likely never be illegal. I don't like lootboxes and I don't like pay2win games so I don't buy either.

What you said is correct though. I will change the title to be reflect more accurately what I'm trying to say in this thread.

edit: i can't change the title anymore but i reported my post asking a mod to do it

 

[The Last Stand]

Lootboxes aren't gambling as you can't win money or lose your money and win nothing at all and if you don't like it don't buy it like I do. Lootboxes have no detrimental physical/mental effects from ceasing the activity like what occurs in actual addictions.

Then you said...

In a game like CS:GO, you can actually sell what you win to other players legally. I will concede that this particular form lootboxes can be considered gambling.

In that sense, loot boxes ARE gambling as those skins you mentioned, have literal value to them. Whether you bought them or not, the skins you may get have monetary value as you can resell them for real money.

Remember when you wanted to unlock something in a video game, you'd either have to work for it or unlock it ingame. And you'd get what you unlocked. Now unlocks are randomized, and on top of that monetized. In worse cases, like FIFA, loot boxes ARE gambling because 1) the points used to get said card packs by normal gameplay is nerfed to the point where BUYING the packs looks attracted and 2) to even get the most out of the game mode, you'd have to get premium players. How do you get those premium players? Premium card packs. How to get them? Grind for ridiculous hours of gameplay to barely get ONE or buy the premium pack for a chance to get the player you want.

Since you're paying money on lootboxes for a RNG to determine to get the best player, gameplay advantage or cosmetic, it IS gambling.

Spoiler: One definition of gambling

1. play games of chance for money; bet.
   "she was fond of gambling on cards and horses"
   synonyms:
   bet · wager · place a bet · lay a bet · stake money on something ·
   [more]
   • bet (a sum of money) on a game of chance.
     "he was gambling every penny he had on the spin of a wheel"
2. take risky action in the hope of a desired result.

 

[BeanBidan]

Nice thread, Michael Morhaime

 

[Stoneheart]

Cosmestic Lootboxes in Free to play games are fine.
But im sick of Lootboxes in full price games.

 

[NOT Sword Fighter Super]

Sam says this better than I ever could:

 

[Colonel J]

In that sense, loot boxes ARE gambling as those skins you mentioned, have literal value to them. Whether you bought them or not, the skins you may get have monetary value as you can resell them for real money.

I have already conceded that CS:GO's lootboxes can be considered gambling, but not because of the lootbox system itself. But because you can sell what you win. If whoever owns the game, i'm not sure, disabled the ability to sell what you win it's not gambling anymore.

I can play poker for fun, but once I start betting money on poker and have the chance of losing it all, then it becomes gambling. I hope you understand what I'm trying to say.

One definition of gambling:
A. play games of chance for money; bet.
B. take risky action in the hope of a desired result.

You see, the problem with that second, terrible definition of gambling is that it can apply to many things which is why I like the results of either losing your money entirely, winning nothing, or to increase your money to constitute gambling.

Firstly, is buying a lootbox "risky"? I'd say no. The price of them are relatively low and you are guaranteed to win something. Secondly, that definition it can apply to many actions. I can take a risky move in a videogame or a sport, high risk high reward, and we will both agree that sports and videogames should not be banned despite some parts of it being gambles by definition.

As for the first definition... While it is true there is some chance involved in what you win, lootboxes are not a game. A game is something you can win or lose and you cannot win or lose from a lootbox as I have said earlier. You always win something from a lootbox. I'd consider "losing" a game a chance to be winning nothing at all like what occurs in actual gambling.

 

[MG 620]

Lootboxes and DLCs are cancer to the industry.

 

[Mammal Pod]

If you want lootboxes make a F2P game. Otherwise you can go eat shit.

 

[Foxxo]

Lootboxes are gambling on the games where the fans are autistic enough to put money behind the rewards. In that case, it's the autists' fault.

Heck, TF2's market currency outside of actual money is keys that can be used for any lootboxes (which Valve has functionally discontinued releasing in favor of box-specific keys to raise their value).

 

[OhGoy]

>tfw no dork cube

 

[Red Hood]

Card sharps- cool. Some nerd buying a lootbox- never gonna be cool.

 

[The Cunting Death]

I don't care what it is, I want it gone.