Open Source Software Community - it's about ethics in Code of Conducts

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Creative Username said:
this seems pretty epic they buckbroke the fuck out of it
wonder if some autist will eventually make free microcode
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prollyanotherlurker said:
After seeing what they pulled off with the t480 I actually wouldn't completely discount it being option A.

I guess we will need to wait, and see though.
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Maybe I'm being a bit of a debbie downer. And yes, they do seem to be thinking of implementing something akin to a "Libre ME", they say as much in their 3050 Micro page:
Libre ME doesn’t exist yet, but it’s now possible. Example use-case for a libre ME could include, for example, running an out-of-bound packet filter on a secure network (with flash write protection, making it invincible to any OS-based software attacks).
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That sounds to me like a pretty staggering leap in security if they can pull it off. Mate Kukri, the guy who ostensibly solo developed the T480 port seems so inclined at least. Maybe I should be a bit more of a positive polly. Still, the T480 has just about as much ME cruft as I'm willing to tolerate, so unless they can cut newer versions down to roughly the same amount or less, that's where my line is drawn.
 
Ferryman said:
Maybe I'm being a bit of a debbie downer. And yes, they do seem to be thinking of implementing something akin to a "Libre ME", they say as much in their 3050 Micro page:

That sounds to me like a pretty staggering leap in security if they can pull it off. Mate Kukri, the guy who ostensibly solo developed the T480 port seems so inclined at least. Maybe I should be a bit more of a positive polly. Still, the T480 has just about as much ME cruft as I'm willing to tolerate, so unless they can cut newer versions down to roughly the same amount or less, that's where my line is drawn.
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I don't blame you. I'm constantly blackpilled on the state of tech and the internet. And who knows they could start doing what you said.

I do know they had an announcement on the site very recently that they got some kind of sponsorship for the project. So hopefully that means they might have more resources going into doing more ports. Really we will just have to wait and see, could go either way.
 
prollyanotherlurker said:
After seeing what they pulled off with the t480 I actually wouldn't completely discount it being option A.

I guess we will need to wait, and see though.
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The T480 is a fantastic piece of kit. Still quite decently powered despite it being a 7 year old laptop. It's one of the last, if not the last, consumer laptop built that has a high degree of user serviceability. You can fully replace the memory, disks, batteries, and more without any de-soldering or requiring a service center. You can even find replacement screens and motherboards for it still.

ED: Also check out Coreboot. I use it with Protectli devices. The fact that we're getting to open source firmwares and now hardware is a great thing. For the longest time that was the untouched frontier.
 
Ferryman said:
Maybe I'm being a bit of a debbie downer. And yes, they do seem to be thinking of implementing something akin to a "Libre ME", they say as much in their 3050 Micro page:
That sounds to me like a pretty staggering leap in security if they can pull it off.
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i would love a nice libre system that also has staggering amounts of trusted computing shit (i program some irreversible switch and then from that point on my system obsessively verifies everything before so much as posting and my hard drive needs a tpm key in that system to decrypt)
Angie Wormwood said:
The fact that we're getting to open source firmwares and now hardware is a great thing. For the longest time that was the untouched frontier.
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richard stallman has said that free hardware will eventually happen at some point
i feel like with these liberated firmwares, we're just beginning to see little glimmers of it on the horizon
 
Angie Wormwood said:
ED: Also check out Coreboot. I use it with Protectli devices. The fact that we're getting to open source firmwares and now hardware is a great thing. For the longest time that was the untouched frontier.
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If you want really cutting-edge FOSS hardware, I'd suggest taking a look at the MNT Reform. To my knowledge it is probably one of the most libre modern devices by design. Granted, it is ARM and extremely expensive for the power it brings to the table, but the team behind it has gone to great lengths to liberate it from the firmware up as much as possible. Last I heard they've managed to create a FOSS version of the BL31 ARM Trusted Firmware & BootROM modules, which is as close to an ME analog as you can get on ARM (note: Trust Zone is completely different and can be tweaked in userland, despite misconceptions). AFAIK the only closed bits on it are RAM init, HDMI and certain chipsets' wifi/bluetooth firmware. Still, very impressive stuff. I remember doomering about it in the SBC thread a few months back, and they've already made significant progress since then. Love to see it.

Creative Username said:
i would love a nice libre system that also has staggering amounts of trusted computing shit (i program some irreversible switch and then from that point on my system obsessively verifies everything before so much as posting and my hard drive needs a tpm key in that system to decrypt)

richard stallman has said that free hardware will eventually happen at some point
i feel like with these liberated firmwares, we're just beginning to see little glimmers of it on the horizon
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That's the dream. If Francis and co. manage to pull it off, that'd be a development worthy of a QubesOS-tier white paper. I can't imagine a bigger "fuck you" to whatever glownigger developed the ME than the creation of a Libre variant.
 
Wanted to archive locally to spark discussion but can't rn due to server side shenanigans.

Thoughts?

Challenge: constructing a wall of text that uses (almost) every word that ASFW.io deems unacceptable out of pure spite.

My cousin is looking to become a master at information technology although the PC he uses to do so is black which he doesn't like aesthetically and wishes he has a white one instead. He is the owner of a manual detailing common backend exploitable vulnerabilities. The program he developed has native features which scan for malicious users. He codes alone because his university promotes a culture fit he doesn't agree with, pragmatically speaking. Sometimes his decisions cause a massive pow-wow amongst peers, criticizing his design decisions. Fortunatelly he can attend those meetings due to hiring a woman for housekeeping while away. He poured thousands of man hours researching cyber security but wishes he had the man power to make his ambitions into reality. Some people call him crazy for the ammount of work he piles on just for research but to him thats normal due to a good work ethic. He has a dummy account which pokes his projects back ends for security flaws. He hopes his worth ethic will leave a positive legacy on the coding community as an example of abnormal methods being functionally better than mainstream methods. His grandfather, a old school comodore 64 coder does the best he can to connect with his grandson by listening to his lectures on the modern coding landscape. After doing his own research on the topic, the old man concluded his grandson is crushing it and has a bright future in the industry.
 
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Vibe_Guy said:
Wanted to archive locally to spark discussion but can't rn due to server side shenanigans.

Thoughts?
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I think that is very problematic. Does the rust foundation think about marginalized folks at all? I'm ashamed I wrote the firmware for all of those vibrating sex toys in rust now that I know they have enforced bigoted wording. It's a shame these fascists are allowed to even touch a computer. I think everyone that codes in rust should all unite in protest. I think the first steps to an equitable outcome would be:
  1. Archive or delete all repos for projects written in rust
  2. Tell every Distro and operating system to no longer package rust
  3. remove every rust program from our computers
  4. seethe and dilate.
And we should keep this up until every single member of the rust community resigns. Thank you for listening fellow allies.
 
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part 1 is here.

Alright where I left off last time the "drama", was just starting to ramp up. Irene Knapp had helped push the idea of moderation based on "social norms" and not allowing "fascism and bigotry". They had a big controversy over the Anduril sponsorship. Because they are a US defense contractor. There were plenty of other small situations that arose out of those two things that foreshadowed what would follow. Essentially the moderation team had been installed, and they had been given nearly unchecked power. A blank check to enforce whatever they wanted through the loose guidelines that were laid out for them to work with.
  • The document I linked at the end of the last one. Is when the idea that Eelco (the creator of nix) should resign from the foundation first arises.
  • moderators delroth and hexa go on strike over the Anduril situation
  • Jon also mentions "CppNix", and says this letter was the first time he noticed them using that term.
This is the end of the letter. they are essentially threatening the creator that if he doesn't resign they are going to publicly attack him.

We are all tired. Everything about dealing with this months-long crisis is burning everyone out. We are sure it is burning you out too. We are writing this because we care about the community, believe it can change, and we want structural change so that the community does not imminently collapse.

Although Eelco has made significant contributions to the ecosystem, he is also actively blocking progress on extinguishing practically all the current fires at the Foundation and in CppNix.

This document should be seen as the canary in the coal mine for what many people have been feeling for years and does not exhaustively cover absolutely all problems in the community, but we hope it is enough to justify action.

Eelco’s behaviours described in this document are unbecoming of community leadership, no matter what politics the reader holds. It is not acceptable to undermine responsible peoples’ authority from above without discussion. It is not acceptable to refuse to hold the community’s views over one’s own, especially if those views are expressed by 200 people writing a letter. It is not acceptable to hold onto de facto sole decision-making authority, especially without owning the responsibility for such decisions. It is not acceptable to build and perpetuate a culture where input gets silently ignored and decisions get vetoed without communication or discussion. It is not acceptable to repeatedly hold conflicts of interest that lead people to believe that DetSys and Nix are one and the same.

We can infer from the events of the recent open board call that he is one of the primary blockers to cultural reform in this community including inside and outside the Foundation’s closed doors: what happened in the open board calls is not exceptional behaviour for him. It is business as usual, and we need to stop tolerating it. The best time to have stopped this behaviour was in 2021, but the next best time was after NixCon 2023, and there is no time like the present.

This is a present in which people don’t have the patience for Eelco to figure out his leadership style on his own timeline anymore. He has had years to reform. We believe that he should resign for the good of the community.

The need for reform in terms of listening to the community and making the community safe is existential, or you will not have a community anymore. You may have two, or zero, depending on how you count. The community needs to see visible evidence that change is being worked on with committment and dedication.

The signatories of this document intend to switch to, as well as actively support, any fork efforts for the entire Nix community unless something significantly changes soon. If there is no satisfying progress in action on Eelco’s resignation from positions of authority in all parts of the Nix project by Wednesday May 1, 2024, we intend to ensure this letter reaches a wide audience.

It is now up to you to commit to changing.

Regards,



  • As he mentions a fork of nix, named "lix" was formed. Irene Knapp of course played a part in the formation. You can see a list of the members of the lix team with their pronouns next to their names of course. Irene Knapp absolutely helped stir up this shit in nix. I really want to get to the bottom of what else he has had his hands in.

Actually. While getting the links for the current lix page, and the archive (thankfully someone had already archived it). On the current page Irene Knapp is no longer listed as a member. I'm not sure if she just stuck around long enough to stir up shit, or she moved on for other reasons. Either way feel free to compare the archived page, and the live page.

Lix website
archive

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  • Jon mentions Raito and joepie91 ( though this joepie is one of the main antagonists) are two of the main people around nix who he has seen using "marginalized folks" as their supporting arguments, so they were likely involved in writing the letter.
  • from the time that letter was written, Eelco has about 9-10 days to make a decision
  • He looked at who made the firsts pull requests in the repo for the letter. You will also notice a familiar name or two. And funny enough, ktempkin, as he mentions someone who isn't a nix contributor is the first to sign. Followed by Irene Knapp, another non contributor. Funny.
  • Then the other things he points out that is interesting. Basically an admission that there had already been behind the scenes pressure for this kind of thing. And they didn't like that it was done publicly. And because the behind the scenes coup bullshit failed, the are forcing his hand by doing this in the public. (i really hate these people)
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  • And Jon as he mentions feels at this point is where things really start to heat up.
  • People start getting banned, and people start dropping their maintainership of packages because of this situation.
  • Jon requests to be added as a board observer. Because he felt like a lot of these things were happening in the background with no outside input coming in.


I really can't help but feel bad for Jon through this whole situation. Like I mentioned in the first write-up. You can tell just from how he talks. This guy is just some tech autist. He did IT in the air-force. And he joins this community wanting to help. Then he ends up with all of this bullshit. He get's labeled a nazi, because he was one of the few voices of reason. Had personal attacks thrown at him. Idk I can just hear it in his voice while talking about this, the frustration from this situation. And he is such a nice guy, in this a lot of the time his response to this stuff is a softly spoken "what the hell?". I hate seeing people like this having to deal with these fucking tech trannies.
  • Along with getting denied for that board observer position he is being asked to step down as release manager by the "moderation team"
I think something like this speaks for itself

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  • The guy who said that got a banned for a day. But in retaliation, another member proposes Jon should be removed from the community. Insane gaslighting in my opinion.


  • Jon gets silenced for 2 weeks by zimbatm he says it was likely because zimbatm was tired of the backlash he was getting from the others. And doesn't really seem to hold it against them because he is "probably broken at this point"
  • A bit after their is an RFC for equitable moderation. Something jon had been trying to do was getting a code of conduct that was actually clear on it's guidelines passed, and also have it enforced in a fair reasonable way. Rather than having tranny jannies running wild with power, forming a mob to remove someone if they happen to mention Jordan Peterson on a personal blog.
  • 14 minutes after this. he was banned for 6 weeks. for "derailing sensitive discussions and willfully furthering division in the community"
  • they skipped all the normal moderation steps that would normally happen during a ban like this.
  • with the amount of time he was banned that meant he had no chance to rerun for his position of release manager.
  • Especially with the stated reason given. "furthering division" in these circumstances, the division is obviously speaking out against the insane political bullshit these people were trying to force on the community. He was seen as something in the way of having this completely homogeneous pro-progressive politics. Ban any one that descents, community. And it in my opinion was likely on purpose to prevent him from keeping his role as release manager. Because he wasn't willing to step down on his own.
  • moderator ryantm steps down (jon speculates because of burnout)
Jon Makes a post on reddit.
the archive

I recommend a read through the reddit, (or the archive if like me you use a vpn, and don't want to switch servers until you find one that works). There is a lot of support for Jon in that. But also you can see some other interesting exchanges like this one.

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  • There is some backlash over this happening. The moderation team suspends or bans 12 people because of it.
  • They drafted a letter to convince people Jon deserved to get banned because the moderation team was getting push-back.
Jon's comments on the letter.
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the letter
the archive (there seems to be fewer already created archives in this part of the timeline)

the letter is about as frustrating as you would expect.

They deleted the post they are referencing with the "everything is political statement". It's complete bullshit, and they deleted the context that would prove them wrong.

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Just complete bullshit. If you look around at any of the stuff that happened. You can quickly see how full of shit they are.

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  • After this point they just completely deflect anyone that brings up the biased and unchecked actions form the moderation team.
  • finally we get to Eelcos resignation.



I also get the feeling, Eelco is a guy kind of like Jon is. A tech autist, that just wanted to make a project he thought interesting, and useful. Between the things mentioned in the first half of this. He didn't care about community moderation, he just wanted to work on his project. This ended up being to his own detriment, as we can see. I have a lot of sympathy for him as well. He did what in the past would have likely worked fine (and did work fine for quite a while, until these people got their nails sunk into the project). It's one of the saddest things in this whole story. Having this project he started IN 2003!! Ripped out from under you by these insane intersectional progressive commie wierdos.

the to letter about nixos
archive
  • Famously as I believe it should have been mentioned in that clip. Eelco was told "you need to add yourself as a signatory for it to appear amicable"
abdication letter
archive
  • Graham Christianson replied within 4 minutes of his abdication letter going up

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The trannies run the asylum now.



Everyone that isn't banned permanently (the people that showed resistance to the takeover) at this point is told if they mess up once from this point on they will get a perma-ban.

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  • It's just insanity at this point. Towards where that clip ends. You get a clear picture of the kind of events that happened. Someone pointed out that bringing up the insane political shit was breaking the CoC. The person was told to apologize for it. But in retaliation for pointing out they broke the CoC the person that did nothing wrong was banned.
  • the response to Shea Levy's ban. (I keep saying you can see how insane things have gotten. But really. They are just so blatantly gaslighting. I hope these people get the same treatment at some point. These people should never be trusted so much as sending a pull request to a project after the shit they have pulled.)

archive
  • Shea Levy writes a document calling bullshit on this.
it was (mercifully) already archived

It's quite long these are the most relevant bits in my opinion.

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  • After this points Jon states its basically an echo chamber with anyone that is willing to disagree being banned.
  • They try to remove the subreddit because "People banned over here causing discord and spewing hatred" i.e. they didn't have complete control over it like everything else.
  • Someone asks if they should switch the official package manager from nix to lix



I feel the best description of the next events is what is show in the screenshot.

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an archive of the reddit thread he made. The post is removed by moderators in the archive and live site

defending himself on discourse
archive

a lot of truly frustrating responses.

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There is so much here I think just reading the timeline here is the best option.

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Infinisil Asking for his perma-ban
archive


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  • He is perma-banned.
  • Then the famous "nazi purge" of nixos happens directly after his ban.
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Really his prediction at the end here of what will happen in the nix community proved to be exactly right



Honestly there is so much here It was hard deciding what to put in, and what to leave out. I do think I will likely dive a bit further into the nix drama outside of just his timeline. I think it would be worth looking into a lot of the people involved in this. I definitely think Irene Knapp especially is worth the look. But I will see what I can find in the next week or so. And if there is enough to do similar write-ups.


In conclusion.

❤️

edit: I will take this out later. trying to watch some of the videos I'm noticing it give an error after starting, saying "because of network error". I don't know if that's only happening to me or not. I might have to attempt to reupload videos if that doesn't go away. Although I suspect the uploads are fine, and it's something else causing that.
 
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👏 Technical 👏 Support 👏 Forum 👏

Shouldn't they be busy obnoxiously locking threads because of nEcRoInG
 
prollyanotherlurker said:
joepie91
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AKA Sven Slootweg. That guy is a piece of work. Autistic they/them with ESR levels of unwarranted confidence. Wants to make you "think critically". Proudly describes himself as a "manipulator" and "social engineer". The below (Archive) is from his personal website (Archive):

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What you need to know about me - a manual​

Hi. I'm Sven Slootweg, better known as joepie91. I do lots of things on the internet, and I behave somewhat differently from most people. A lot of people have trouble getting used to how I do or say things, so I've created this page in the hope of clarifying how and why I do things.

I don't sugarcoat.​

If you ask me for criticism, I will give you clear, unfiltered criticism. No sugarcoating. I will tell you exactly what I think how I think it. If you cannot deal with this, either try and get used to it, or don't ask me for criticism.

If I see something happening that I consider unacceptable, I will respond to it - again, not sugarcoating. I can be a giant pain in the ass, some of the most notable examples involving web and application security.

Why do I do this? Although it is commonly claimed that I do, I have no desire to feel 'right' or 'powerful'. I simply believe that avoiding or sugarcoating does noone a favour.

If I were to sugarcoat what I said, you would never have a clear idea, and I would have to tread carefully not to offend you. We both lose. Therefore, I will be straight-forward with you.

I desire the same from you. If I do something stupid, tell me so and explain what I'm doing wrong. If I'm doing something unacceptable, tell me so.

I argue.​

I have a lot - and I mean a lot - of discussions with people. Sometimes about major topics, sometimes about things so small you're going to be annoyed at my nitpicking.

I can be extremely persistent, constantly point out any fallacies, and tear apart an argument with seemingly complete disregard for your feelings.

Why do I do this? The only way to solve problems and challenges correctly, is by thinking critically. Constantly putting discussions in front of people and being extremely persistent in them, makes people think more critically.

Most people get the urge to either try and 'beat' me at discussing, or to avoid making unsupported arguments because they know I will follow up with a rant. Past experiences show that this works to make people think more critically.

Honestly, the importance of critical thinking is massively underestimated. Nearly every problem that society has could easily be solved if all of the parties engaged in critical thinking.

I don't mind you hating me, as long as I can improve your critical thinking in the process. The easy way or the hard way.

As a final note on this, know that even if I am arguing with you vehemently, I don't hate you. I simply want you to get better at critical thinking.

I manipulate.​

In case it hasn't become obvious to you yet, I am a social engineer. Full-time. 24/7. I use manipulation and other psychological tactics in nearly every conversation I have. I will try to change the way you think, and try to solve problems you might not even realize you had.

I will also gladly tell you why and how I am manipulating you, if you're willing to take the time to listen. If you believe you cannot be manipulated, then don't bother, disregard this, and move on.

If you do want to know, just ask. But don't be surprised if my answer, at first, reads like made-up non-sense. Social engineering is very subtle.

Why do I do this? You are being manipulated every single day of your life. Marketing, propaganda, and many other aspects of society are focused entirely around manipulation. Nearly all of it for commercial or other selfish gain.

One of the hallmarks of social engineering is that you can change peoples beliefs and habits, without those people even understanding why they hold that belief, or why they have that habit. It's largely unconscious, and many believe they are immune to it.

The only way to counter manipulation through irrationality, is by manipulating people back into rationality. That is what I do. That is also why I will gladly tell you what I am doing to manipulate you. Manipulation for a good cause doesn't need to be hidden to be effective.

I'm a moralfag.​

I am a moralfag. I disregard laws for anything other than practical purposes. I judge solely by morals, and constantly put my morals to the test by discussing with others. I ignore 'mass opinion' when defining my morals, and hold some very unpopular opinions as a result.

I can explain to you exactly what my reasoning is for my moral standpoints, and when you interact with me for an extended amount of time, you will notice that I take morals into account in virtually everything I do.

I can also become very annoying about morals. I will make a fuss over something that you consider insignificant, just because it conflicts with my morals. I will refuse to work on or endorse something, because it conflicts with my morals.

My morals are always open for debate. If you believe I am misjudging something, by all means tell me so - but be sure to explain why. Mass opinion alone will not change my view on things.

I don't keep grudges.​

Perhaps the hardest thing for people to understand, is that I don't keep grudges. I don't believe that an individual is inherently bad, and believe that the only things worth judging are someones acts and attitudes.

Even if I've lashed out at you in the past, no matter how violently, don't hesitate to talk to me again. I don't hate you, I don't hold a grudge against you, and if you decide to genuinely change that which I criticized before, you will notice my criticism vanishes instantly.

I also don't judge people from rumours. Never feel afraid to talk to me. The only case where I will escalate a situation to more severe things (think doxing), is when I have already talked to you, and you actively refuse to listen while harming others in the process. Very few people have ever reached this stage.

Final words​

I am comfortable with who I am, I am aware of how I act, and I have a good reason for doing every of the above things. You will not convince me to do otherwise unless you have a logical counter-argument that does not involve your own opinion.

I do not mean ill to anyone, even if it seems like I do. I am simply very determined, and very unwilling to make moral compromises. If you do not like raw criticism, then feel free to ask any of the millions of other people that sugarcoat their responses for you. Don't ask me.

In practice, all of the above things have turned out to work well, making people more aware and making them 'think better'. Don't try to tell me that it doesn't work - I've already seen it work. I'll also gladly give you some examples.

If you want to talk to me for whatever reason, you can find my contact details here.

Note that this page is mutable; it may change in the future if I decide I worded something badly, or if something is missing.

- Sven

Unsurprising revelation from his dormant blog (Archive):
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X.com
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Here's a picture of our boy
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That's from his "kink account" (Archiving works poorly)

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Ferryman said:
I'd suggest taking a look at the MNT Reform.
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My experience using one for a few years alternates between "This is fucking awesome. I can fix/reprogram anything myself" and "Jesus Christ this thing just barely works.", but I haven't sold it yet. Looking forward to the RCORE SoC upgrade module.

My biggest hate for ARM comes from the way these fucking things boot. DTBs, DTOs, retarded headless bootloaders like U-Boot and Fastboot made for embedded systems or phones, chip-specific kernels, etc. People don't appreciate the freedom we all had because of the IBM PC clone BIOS. Without it Linux probably wouldn't have stood a chance.
 
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