Undertale

[LUNEKO]

My personal theory is that the Soul is Kris and you are Kris. There's a lot of subtle differences in the narration of the game compared to Undertale's which make the differences between Frisk and the player much more clear. I think Toby's making whether "Kris" is the vessel or the Soul ambiguous on purpose, in a twist on UT's meta-narrative of named player characters.

I don't think this is heading there, specially if you take the genocide route you can see Noelle constantly pointing out how Kris is acting very different from the usual and keeps wondering if he's playing pranks or something else going on.
During the fight against Berdly there's a special interaction where if Kris gets knocked out but Noelle stands Berdley will beg Noelle to leave Kris side because he's sincerely worried about what is happening to Kris, yet Noelle refuses not because Kris tells her too (as he's knocked out) but because she hears a voice from beyond commanding her to kill Bredley

I think Toby wants to make it clear that the evil this time around is not the spirit of some character like with Asriel and Chara in Undertale but instead its directly the player channeling psychotic urges into the story to create a genocide run where there wasn't supposed to be one
As for Kris going around opening fountains it could be seen as a similar thing to the secret bosses (Jevil and Spamton) where they went mad after discovering they are trapped in a videogame and trading their sanity for enough power to break free, but failed. Kris is probably trying to start the roaring in order to find power to free themselves from the player, cause an intentional game over to make the player stop having control over everyone's life even if it means everyone dies

 

[Billy_Sama]

I enjoyed it but its really hard to complain about a game that is free.

 

[Coelacanth]

I wasn't a fan of the budding romance between Susie and Noelle either, but Jesus I feel like there's some next level sperging about a relationship that isn't actually established yet moreso than anything that can actually be considered a problem with Chapter 2.

I get it, not the most attractive part of the game so far, but it's also only Chapter 2 out of 7. We're not even sure the two will actually hook up by the end given Toby's love of twists and subversions. Maybe let it ride a little instead of have it dictate your entire experience?

I'm willing to give Toby the benefit of the doubt considering that he's been known to subvert anything, I'll give you that. I also realise that the obnoxiousness is fulled a lot by the fandom. But past experiences and knowing the sort of people Toby associates with don't raise my hopes.

Besides it's not all trash for me - Ch2 has Spamton who is a gem of a character that I really enjoyed. Gutted he had to be killed off.

 

[Ape]

The fact that there’s gonna be 7 chapters and chapter 2 took 3 years to make is interesting to me. On one hand it sucks that we have to wait so long cus both of the chapters have been extremely captivating. On another hand it’s kinda neat that we get to grow up alongside the games release. For example if someone’s starting college rn they’ll probably graduate by the time all 7 chapters come out. It’s neat that we’ll get to look back at when these chapters were released and reminisce about how different the world was with each corresponding chapter.

 

[bugbear]

If I had to theorize, I'd say Kris willingly made a deal with the devil, or at least something similar. A goth cat npc in the town mentions that she and Kris used to hang out, and she taught him/her about magic and the occult. My guess is that Kris is very unhappy and has no direction in life, so, why not let some foreign entity take control instead? Kris might actually somewhat enjoy being controlled because now, for the first time in a while, Kris actually has friends, and some excitement in his/her life. There are multiple times Kris rips out the soul, yet he/she always picks it up again, which makes me think that the Ktis is willingly letting the soul take control.
As for why Kris tolerates the soul, it's probably just the friendships the player made. Kris is afraid that all the friends will never like him/her for what he/she truly is, and only like the soul's personality, so Kris plays along, essentially becoming a spectator of his/her own life. That's also why Kris takes the soul after the genocide route, even though the characters point out how much that fucked with his/her mind. Kris made so many friends, and doesn't want to lose them, so he/she still lets the evil soul take control.

 

[The Real Me]

Something fucking wild that I haven’t seen mentioned anywhere is that in the Genocide Route, not only did Kris lead to Berdly’s actual fucking real life death, it’s also implied that he stuffed the body in the computer closet after Susie left, similar to how he cleaned up the playthings in Chapter 1.

In the Pacifist route, I checked out the computer closet and it says something along the lines of “It’s mostly empty, even a big person could fit inside.” and after you leave the computer lab in Genocide, attempting to interact with the doors will say something like “There’s no reason to go back.” Implying that everything has been dealt with.

Anyway, cannot wait to see what Kris’ next gaslighting girlboss move will be in Chapter 3 because Papyrus is a gullible motherfucker.

 

[MightyBiteySnake]

If I had to theorize, I'd say Kris willingly made a deal with the devil, or at least something similar. A goth cat npc in the town mentions that she and Kris used to hang out, and she taught him/her about magic and the occult. My guess is that Kris is very unhappy and has no direction in life, so, why not let some foreign entity take control instead? Kris might actually somewhat enjoy being controlled because now, for the first time in a while, Kris actually has friends, and some excitement in his/her life. There are multiple times Kris rips out the soul, yet he/she always picks it up again, which makes me think that the Ktis is willingly letting the soul take control.
As for why Kris tolerates the soul, it's probably just the friendships the player made. Kris is afraid that all the friends will never like him/her for what he/she truly is, and only like the soul's personality, so Kris plays along, essentially becoming a spectator of his/her own life. That's also why Kris takes the soul after the genocide route, even though the characters point out how much that fucked with his/her mind. Kris made so many friends, and doesn't want to lose them, so he/she still lets the evil soul take control.

I think an interesting thing people are overlooking is in the normal Spamton NEO fight he asks Kris if they want to be a "heart on a chain" forever. I think the two ways to interpret this are either that Kris is the Soul and the body is the chain, or Kris is the Soul and WE the player are the chain. Also, I think it bears repeating that the game never implies the way the vessel treats the Soul is a recent development.

 

[Kulee Baba]

It'll happen eventually, hopefully. Dude has one of the best theme songs so I don't see why he can't have his time to shine. There's 5 chapters to go, anything can happen. And who knows, maybe Toby will do some stuff for the fans.

I wasn't a fan of the budding romance between Susie and Noelle either, but Jesus I feel like there's some next level sperging about a relationship that isn't actually established yet moreso than anything that can actually be considered a problem with Chapter 2.

I get it, not the most attractive part of the game so far, but it's also only Chapter 2 out of 7. We're not even sure the two will actually hook up by the end given Toby's love of twists and subversions. Maybe let it ride a little instead of have it dictate your entire experience?

Thought about these two posts a bit. I definitely do now have some empathy with game critics. I think I made a mistake playing Chapters 1&2 back to back in a few sittings. I don't know what they do nowadays but in the old days game journos were flown into a hotel and they had to play the game in a short time span. Just playing an action game would be easy for me, but man if I had worked for GameSpot and had to review a real JRPG my name would be infamous among weebs.

My advice for anyone still waiting for Deltarune who is like me, a person who enjoys the story & humor but more or less wants the abbreviated version is to just not rush Chapter 2. Because I still think the ratio of cutscenes and dialog was too high compared to the battles, but I was starting to rush through it which surely played a factor.

 

[Nointey]

 

[fu͏nny]

Just want an excuse to post this schizo classic

 

[Coelacanth]

Just want an excuse to post this schizo classic

The voice they gave Suzie is canon to me and nothing will ever be able to change my mind.

 

[MightyBiteySnake]

Just want an excuse to post this schizo classic

It's a MOTHER FUCKING MERCEDES BENZ

 

[Mary the Goldsmith]

Something fucking wild that I haven’t seen mentioned anywhere is that in the Genocide Route, not only did Kris lead to Berdly’s actual fucking real life death, it’s also implied that he stuffed the body in the computer closet after Susie left, similar to how he cleaned up the playthings in Chapter 1.

In the Pacifist route, I checked out the computer closet and it says something along the lines of “It’s mostly empty, even a big person could fit inside.” and after you leave the computer lab in Genocide, attempting to interact with the doors will say something like “There’s no reason to go back.” Implying that everything has been dealt with.

Anyway, cannot wait to see what Kris’ next gaslighting girlboss move will be in Chapter 3 because Papyrus is a gullible motherfucker.

I got the "There's no reason to go back" text even though I wasn't doing a genocide route, I did a normal route but I did not recruite every single enemy, but I didn't actually kill anyone.

I see a lot of people ignore that all signs point to "Kreepy Kris" being the default for Kris, and your influence to help them make friends be unusual and weird. The flavor text for the birdcage implies that the Soul has been in the vessel for a very long time, and has been able to remove the soul for about that long. Alphys also says that "Kris usually only sleeps during the first half of class" implying that the vessel has been off doing late night shenanigans for quite a while.

Creepy Kris is the default Kris, but Creepy Kris and Genocidal Kris are two different things, as Noelle mentions that Kris is acting strange if you force her to kill, and a lot of signs seem to imply that Kris is being made to kill against their will, so I'd say Kris is a sort of "neutral" type, they are a creepy mischievous kid, but killing is where they draw the line.

 

[MightyBiteySnake]

Creepy Kris is the default Kris, but Creepy Kris and Genocidal Kris are two different things, as Noelle mentions that Kris is acting strange if you force her to kill, and a lot of signs seem to imply that Kris is being made to kill against their will, so I'd say Kris is a sort of "neutral" type, they are a creepy mischievous kid, but killing is where they draw the line.

They how do you explain the vessel opening another Dark World even after a Weird Route run? It just doesn't add up

 

[Mary the Goldsmith]

They how do you explain the vessel opening another Dark World even after a Weird Route run? It just doesn't add up

It could be that he had never killed before and with the player's "push" he ended up enjoying it, or he belives that in the dark world lies a way to permanently free himself from the player and he opens another one hoping this one works, but I guess we won't know until the rest of the game comes out.

 

[SteelPlatedHeart]

Can’t share it properly here, but you should check out this animation.

https://twitter.com/bunhearts/status/1440524782957596679?s=21

 

[X-Shaped Weeaboo]

Can’t share it properly here, but you should check out this animation.
View attachment 2567455

https://twitter.com/bunhearts/status/1440524782957596679?s=21

I don't know what made the fanbase collectively agree to draw Berdly more and more Falco-like, but I am all fucking for it.

This character might genuinely be the one time I've ever laughed at "GAM3R" jokes.

 

[Brubby]

opinion on [hyperlink blocked] being "choices"? Saw a speculation of this and it fits grammatically in Spamton's sentences and matches the character creation narrator's line "No one gets to choose who they are in this world." in addition to the puppet themes.

Are the eggs people? is this a black lodge creamed corn thing? Spamton says hes a "man of the [pipis]" , " a real [pipis] person". The obvious insert being people. You can literally eat the pipis to heal and eggs don't transform into other objects when leaving the dark world.

I'm on board with the idea that kris is evil given his past repuation as detailed from npc exposition - and the player forcing him to be good or helping him be evil. Maybe it has something to do with the bunker incident.

 

[Nauseated Courgi]

I don't know what made the fanbase collectively agree to draw Berdly more and more Falco-like, but I am all fucking for it.

This character might genuinely be the one time I've ever laughed at "GAM3R" jokes.

They've probably saw most streamers and let's players mistake Berdly's get up as a falco reference rather than DBZ reference. Being a blue bird didn't help either.

 

[The Real Me]

They've probably saw most streamers and let's players mistake Berdly's get up as a falco reference rather than DBZ reference. Being a blue bird didn't help either.

I think a decent amount of people that treat him like Falco do know that it’s meant to be more of a Saiyan get-up since he has the huge shoulder pads and his battle flavourtext even has a line something akin to “Berdly crushed his power scouted in anger.”

I’d say Toby probably took influence from both sources though.