Wuhan Coronavirus: Megathread - Got too big

[Hippopatumus]

There are no demons or something making people totally evil just 'because'. There's a motivation behind absolutely anything and it's moronic to look at people acting and doing bad things and assessing that "They're just evil because they're evil" when there's an obvious motivation of personal gain or some hilariously misguided worldview or ultimate goal at hand.

This is why we will never be able to agree. That's okay.

What I'm saying is that it's reductive and isn't doing anything for anyone (and certainly isn't that 'good' of you) to be so two dimensional and aggressive towards anyone who's taken the vaccine. People make mistakes, can change their minds, and can change after an action or mistake. What's done is done, and nothing will change that. And you need to accept that and do what you can to help people who are going through this.

I have friends and family, many of whom have taken the clot shot, regretted it, been hospitalized, will never take it again and have changed their viewpoints and beliefs, and no longer support the oppression happening worldwide.

If you are still holding onto the views I was condemning, in Nov 2021, you are my enemy. I want nothing but the worst for you, in this literal struggle of good versus evil. There is not always a time for redemption, and not all deserve it.

 

[Vince McMahon]

There is not always a time for redemption, and not all deserve it.

I wonder who the judges are!

With age, they show hostility to freedom,

They read the press that dates as far

Back as the Crimean war. They call it wisdom.

They're quick to criticize and curse

And always sing the same old song,

They never think they can be wrong.

The older these men are the worse.

---Alexander Sergeyevich Griboyedov, Woe From Wit, 1823

 

[Hippopatumus]

With age, they show hostility to freedom,

Hahahahahahahahah are you fucking for real?

 

[m1ddl3m4rch]

All I hear "waaa, my circlejerk is being invaded by a contrarian!"

And oh, I'm not a victim. I will pay for my choice. I do think that you're a nutless loser who displaces his pent up frustration unto someone who has nothing to do with it.

All of that is projection, because you got nothing on me, and you're still the idiot who took poison willingly. To me your opinion is less than dirt. You're the dumb friend in afterschool special about drugs, the one who succumbs to peer pressure and fucks himself up. And at least you admitted you did it to yourself. Pity party with your fellow morons, but don't expect me to fall all over myself shedding tears for you. And try to remain calm, we don't want you getting a jab induced stroke. Sucks to have to think about stuff like that, huh?

What I'm saying is that it's reductive and isn't doing anything for anyone (and certainly isn't that 'good' of you) to be so two dimensional and aggressive towards anyone who's taken the vaccine.

That's all subject to your worldview though, right? And we agreed that none of us is the arbiter of good, so, it's just, like ... your opinion, man.

People make mistakes, can change their minds, and can change after an action or mistake. What's done is done, and nothing will change that. And you need to accept that

I accept that they made a mistake. They don't seem to want to accept that, or the reputation hit for having done something stupid.

and do what you can to help people who are going through this.

No I don't need or have to do that, so I won't. The jabbed have each other. I won't be bothered to help. Their self imposed ailments are their self imposed problem.

 

[Nom Carver]

I have friends and family, many of whom have taken the clot shot, regretted it, been hospitalized, will never take it again and have changed their viewpoints and beliefs, and no longer support the oppression happening worldwide.

If you are still holding onto the views I was condemning, in Nov 2021, you are my enemy. I want nothing but the worst for you, in this literal struggle of good versus evil. There is not always a time for redemption, and not all deserve it.

Wow. This is exactly why holding a childish worldview of objective goods and objective evils is dangerous. Here you are, preaching that there is a flat good and a flat evil, and that you are most certainly on this side of perfect goodness. Yet, you are also condemning people who are being manipulated and basically controlled by the same evil you condemn and you are flat-out admitting that you want them to suffer 'nothing but the worst'.

Why don't we take a look at other groups of people who think they're an objective force of good and never ever question their own morals, why don't we?

Antifa most certainly believes they're objectively the good guys
I'm sure the Nazis were very content in knowing they were great people
Communism was always a perfect form of government to aspire to, and it would be so good for all of the people. It doesn't matter if I killed millions if the end result is so good!
I'm sure black lives matter rioters believe they're fighting objectively evil systemic racism.
Eugenicists I'd wager are all but certain that the sacrifices they propose are for the greater good of everyone
I could go on and on. Basically anything anyone reasonable would deem evil fits under this same criteria of ignorance and assessing everything so shallowly and without any critical thinking.

The assessment you have that you are somehow objectively correct, and that it is also somehow objectively good to despise and wish horrible fates on otherwise innocent people who are largely the victims of wide-scale manipulation targeted specifically at them is delusional at best and evil at worst.

I'm getting flashbacks to that doctor from a few pages ago who 'loves saving people' but also wants everyone unvaccinated to die horrible awful deaths for making his job a bit more hectic.

And I want to make the point also, this isn't from any anti-religious standpoint of my own. I am very theistic. But I don't use theism as an excuse to hand wave away my incredibly poor morals while still touting myself as "The bestest person to evar live!!!1111!!"

 

[Gorilla Tessellator]

Hey, where this purity spiral came from? Are we going to jump to each other throats just like TPTB want us to do, so their evildoings will be ignored while we pointlessly fight who is more pure, righteous, or wise?

I took a vaccine. I had more than one reason to do so, and yes, I was too tired to fight. I assessed my position, risk/threats etc., and I came to conclusion that in my current position I am too weak to be part of resistance. I also came to conclusion that even though risk of vaccine for me is higher than risk of COVID, it's possible to mitigate it. Or you can say: I am fooling myself. However, I came across this piece of research today that seems to confirm my take: sauce

I also decided not to invest too much energy into this despicable hoax, just enough to stay fairly up-to-date, but not more. It's not worth it.
I am worried mostly about my children. What world they are going to live in? This is the only thing that truly worries me atm.

 

[teriyakiburns]

I'm heading out to buy a few jigsaw puzzles. Who in the thread wants some?

I wonder who the judges are!

 

[Richardface]

What is the process with requesting a religious exemption. Is there anything specifically I should say or not say?

I request an exemption from this requirement as my conscience does not permit me to take it.

Response to any further questions:ih ave stated my conscientious objection. My conscience is a matter between myself and my Creator and it is not your place to examine it.

 

[The Wicked Mitch]

What world they are going to live in?

The one you've contributed to building for them.

That's not to shit on you but it is something I wish more parents would consider, it has blown my mind for decades how I seem to be more worried about the future than people who should by all accounts be much more invested by virtue of being young/having children.

 

[Hippopatumus]

Antifa most certainly believes they're objectively the good guys
I'm sure the Nazis were very content in knowing they were great people
Communism was always a perfect form of government to aspire to, and it would be so good for all of the people. It doesn't matter if I killed millions if the end result is so good!
I'm sure black lives matter rioters believe they're fighting objectively evil systemic racism.
Eugenicists I'd wager are all but certain that the sacrifices they propose are for the greater good of everyone

This is actually a better argument than I could ever make, so thank you for making it.

There is a difference between guys like me, who just wanna grill, and antifa, or Nazis, or Communists:

One side wants to exercise control over the other.

That is the evil. That is the oppression. There is a right and wrong and there IS a black and white. If you haven't recognized it by now you probably will not.

 

[Gorilla Tessellator]

The one you've contributed to building for them.

That's not to shit on you but it is something I wish more parents would consider, it has blown my mind for decades how I seem to be more worried about the future than people who should by all accounts be much more invested by virtue of being young/having children.

I agree with you. We all build the world for our children every day. I doubt that one isolated action is that destructive, just like one positive action doesn't set anything in stone. It's a continuous process that will end with my death.

I just realized another point I wanted to make: even though someone took vax, it's not likely to be the last choice he/she is going to make. If the doomers are right, we are going to fight the tyranny for years, and if someone doesn't take the boosters he is effectively unvaxxed again. This is another reason why it's pointless to argue. What we really want is some actionable plan, unity, friendship and strengthening each other.

 

[Nom Carver]

This is actually a better argument than I could ever make, so thank you for making it.

There is a difference between guys like me, who just wanna grill, and antifa, or Nazis, or Communists:

One side wants to exercise control over the other.

That is the evil. That is the oppression. There is a right and wrong and there IS a black and white. If you haven't recognized it by now you probably will not.

"It's okay that I want the opposition to me to suffer horrible awful fates as long as I don't want to exercise control over them! After all, Antifa's never tried to harm or hurt people's lives who they don't like, they just want to control. Or like how the Nazis never wanted to exterminate or to torture jews, they just wanted to control them. Wishing that people suffer the worst possible fate is a good thing because I endorse it. But these groups were evil so they neeeeever did that!"

No but you're right and I'm wrong because "If you haven't recognized it by now you probably will not." And everything is just totally black and white and clear as day. Sounds just a teensy tiny itty bit like the same kind of reasoning all of those groups I mentioned (and more) used to justify their actions.

 

[The Wicked Mitch]

I agree with you. We all build the world for our children every day. I doubt that one isolated action is that destructive, just like one positive action doesn't set anything in stone. It's a continuous process that will end with my death.

One isolated action repeated by billions shapes the future, it's not the singular action that's the main problem, it's the mindset that leads to the action.

All of this could've been done and over with if, at the first sign of muh mask mandates, every single person ( but especially those with children ) had simply said: "Fuck off" and stuck to their guns, the spell would've been broken in an instant.

That's it, what were they going to do? Tiananmen square every parking lot and school playground in the Western world?

 

[Fanatical Pragmatist]

Out of curiosity, is it possible to vaccine dodge if you are worried/are at risk of the side effects? Im wondering if a trusted physician/ doc is legally able to give a patient a means to skate to around mandates with a letter, but I am not sure.
Very much, "asking for a friend", who is in the last semester and just needs 4 measly classes to bolt
And if the poke is inevitable, which is the lesser of the evils?

If you have a family doctor/primary care doc, then maybe.
That being said, if you don't have a doctor you see regularly then its a really, really hard task.

One side wants to exercise control over the other.

That is the evil. That is the oppression. There is a right and wrong and there IS a black and white. If you haven't recognized it by now you probably will not.

You're not wrong but you're still missing the point.
Blaming the people who complied out of coercion isn't the same as blaming the asshat authoritarian fucks who coerced them.

I'm sorry but just "lol quit ur job and work at mcdonald's to pwn the uber-vaxxers!" isn't a viable strategy for most people.

 

[Gorilla Tessellator]

One isolated action repeated by billions shapes the future, it's not the singular action that's the main problem, it's the mindset that leads to the action.

All of this could've been done and over with if, at the first sign of muh mask mandates, every single person ( but especially those with children ) had simply said: "Fuck off" and stuck to their guns, the spell would've been broken in an instant.

That's it, what were they going to do? Tiananmen square every parking lot and school playground in the Western world?

The problem is: even though there are many people who oppose the mask mandates, the willing sheep are also a big group. How can you change the sheep? I spoke with two acquaintances who strongly believe in this BS. They were trying to convince me using sound bites from MSM. These are not the types who would put unvaxxed in concentration camps, but their conviction was super strong.

I think most of the people just don't realize how evil the government is. They just don't comprehend it. That's why it's possible for them to swallow the propaganda. You can't blame the people who see through BS for the fact that many people are still blind. The brainwashing is really industrial quality and millions of $ were invested for this purpose.

How do we deprogram the sheep? How do we increase the awareness? I sure hope that the lies will just become more and more outrageous that even the most faithful sheep will break out of the programming. But maybe there is another way?

 

[Blake Chortles]

I said before I'd post my exemption if successful. Well it was. In Florida but a pozzed out medical org.

To whom it may concern,

I am a Christian, a believer in the Triune God of the Bible, a follower of the Son, Jesus Christ, and submitted to Him as my Lord and Savior. I sincerely believe it is my purpose in life to serve God and establish a relationship with Him. It is also to help others build their relationship with Him. The most important commandments Jesus Christ gave are to love God with all your heart, soul, and mind and to love my neighbor as myself. Jesus Christ established their primary importance.

I believe Jesus Christ is King of kings and Sovereign over all of heaven and earth. His commands are eternal and authoritative over all creation, including myself, then, now, and in the future. I believe that his Word given in Scripture is authoritative and inerrant.

Conscience is a critical and integral part of my relationship with Jesus Christ that governs my actions and the way I serve God. I am to use this combination of reason and adherence to his Word to serve God in all aspects of life. I am to love my neighbor by loving them as I love myself, by being jealous for their well-being, their God-given freedom, and their walk with God. My neighbor is not simply the person who lives next door, but myself, my family, and every human as they all are made in the image of God.

Through exhaustive, careful prayer, reflection, research, and consultation with medical professionals I cannot in good conscience receive a Covid-19 vaccination at this time. I do not believe it is in the best interests of God's kingdom, myself, or my neighbor, whom I am to love and care for to receive one at this time.

There are many commands relevant to this situation beyond these two but they are the most important. As a follower of Jesus Christ I am commanded to obey Him to the fullest extent of my capabilities with grave consequences for failing to do so.

I sincerely believe I would be breaking the two most important commandments given by God, by not obeying the governance he has placed over me by his Word and by not loving my neighbor. Thank you

Sermon: A Christian Response to Mandatory "Cookies"

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[m1ddl3m4rch]

sophistry from a philosophaster

RRREEEEEEEEEEE

You're the one arguing that the notion of objective good is childish, dangerous and fuels extremism. If there's no objective good, there's only subjective good. In which case your moral lectures can be dismissed as your subjective set of ethical maxims, because it's all subjective anyway.

And what a terrible argument. "You know who else believed in objective good? ANTIFA! NAZIS! COMMUNISTS! BLM! EUGENICISTS!" Other people who opposed those groups also believed in objective good, and could make their moral case without resorting to self-defeating 'subjective good' argumentation.

You're not wrong but you're still missing the point.
Blaming the people who complied out of coercion isn't the same as blaming the asshat authoritarian fucks who coerced them.

The two worked together. The government was given the semblance of the public will because of the compliance of the coerced. Choices have consequences. At least some of the blame belongs to the compliant. They were coerced into choosing, yet they chose. I prefer to blame both. Hopefully they'll remember this event and choose better next time.

 

[The Wicked Mitch]

The problem is: even though there are many people who oppose the mask mandates, the willing sheep are also a big group. How can you change the sheep? I spoke with two acquaintances who strongly believe in this BS. They were trying to convince me using sound bites from MSM. These are not the types who would put unvaxxed in concentration camps, but their conviction was super strong.

I think most of the people just don't realize how evil the government is. They just don't comprehend it. That's why it's possible for them to swallow the propaganda. You can't blame the people who see through BS for the fact that many people are still blind. The brainwashing is really industrial quality and millions of $ were invested for this purpose.

How do we deprogram the sheep? How do we increase the awareness? I sure hope that the lies will just become more and more outrageous that even the most faithful sheep will break out of the programming. But maybe there is another way?

Unfortunately I don't think you can, the vast majority of people are the niggercattle that the Kissingers, Quiglys and Brzezinskis of the world believe them to be.

I can't speak for the US but I'll use my fully pozzed model zog European nation as an example.

24 hours before muh mask mandate goes into effect: 5% of people, mostly deathfat old mobility scooters and Asians wearing masks

The day of: 95 fucking % simply obeys. Has the state placed infantry at every grocery store to gun down those who resist? No. Have the stores hired Blackwater to enforce muh mandate? No. Have some stores put a stockboy near the front of the store to ask people to put their mask on? Yes. What happens when you don't comply? Not a goddamned thing.

Fast forward six goddamn months and im still either the only one or part a very small minority not wearing it, the mandate ends tomorrow.

The next day? Literally nobody except for the same deathfats and Asians mentioned above are wearing a mask. It was at this point that I nearly stroked out when it dawned on me that NPC-theory is most definitely not a meme.

EDIT

I forgot to mention, they recently brought back muh mandate because covid passes were working extremely well, I was initially hopeful despite the above because instead of 95% it was now 80% complying.

Guess what? we're back at 95% again I guess that boy Klaus was on to something when he said we'd be rethinking our world, I certainly have

 

[Nom Carver]

You're the one arguing that the notion of objective good is childish, dangerous and fuels extremism. If there's no objective good, there's only subjective good. In which case your moral lectures can be dismissed as your subjective set of ethical maxims, because it's all subjective anyway.

And what a terrible argument. "You know who else believed in objective good? ANTIFA! NAZIS! COMMUNISTS! BLM! EUGENICISTS!" Other people who opposed those groups also believed in objective good, and could make their moral case without resorting to self-defeating 'subjective good' argumentation.

 

[JosephStalin]