Epic! 8-bitguy uses 1 weird trick to detroy rare prototypes!

[Least Concern]

Microcontrollers have become increasingly powerful and cheap too, and they're often better equipped for the requirements or just about enough.

I know microcontrollers exist and are great, but I found the extra step of transferring the program to be enough of a speed bump to be not fun, and the fact that a lot of them are deciding that we all find Python acceptable as a language is lame too. (I know I can theoretically program my Pi Pico in C, but the official (and most unofficial) documentation pretends only MicroPython is an option and I gave up on trying to get the GCC build stack to work on my M1 Mac.)

Yes, I know it's inefficient to run Linux on a full-sized Pi just to make an LED blink, but it also means I don't have to use Python and don't have to do the transfer step. If and when I make something for mass consumption, I'll make it as cheaply and efficiently as possible. For now, I'm just goofing around.

 

[byuu]

(I know I can theoretically program my Pi Pico in C, but the official (and most unofficial) documentation pretends only MicroPython is an option and I gave up on trying to get the GCC build stack to work on my M1 Mac.)

You can just use Arduino (as in the IDE and stuff, there's support for plenty of non-Arduino hardware) for some quick stuff, it's extremely easy and uses C++.

 

[Joe Swanson]

Don't get me wrong, I like my Raspberry Pis, but its enthusiast community is... kinda gay.

That's pretty much the case with every tech community nowadays, mainly because they're infested with troons

 

[Never Scored]

I used to like 8-bit guy. I just wanted to watch someone fuck with old computers, sometimes breaking them, give me the cliff notes of how they work, and make documentaries about their history. Now it's just some guy building a shed and shilling his shitty games and projects. He doesn't even unbox shit anymore. What have you become, David?

Raspberry Pi enthusiasts: "they're SO AWESOME and you can do AAAAAAAAAAAANYTHING WITH THEM!!!!"
me: "Ok I bought one lol what can i do with it"
Raspberry Pi enthusiasts: "uh, roms, pihole, uh, thin client, you can um, stick it inside a robot if you're making a robot"
me: "cool but what can I do that I can't already do with an old obsolete desktop PC"
Raspberry Pi enthusiasts: "it's smol"

Don't get me wrong, I like my Raspberry Pis, but its enthusiast community is... kinda gay. Like you said, there's lots of "it's great for teaching children how to program!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!", but the most popular use seems to be to run emulators through it, and if that's what you really want, you probably have an old Wii sitting around that you could just hack, and install emulators onto for free, right now.

Connect one end of a wire to the +5v pin, put the other end in your dickhole, plug in your raspberry pi. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.

 

[Hijaboholic]

What have you become, David?

I used to watch 8-Bit Guy in the past back when his content was enjoyable. The newer ones are decent, but nowhere near as good as the ones several years ago. My guess is that he is running out of content ideas.

 

[SSj_Ness (Yiffed)]

You're probably right! Enough of those retro tech channels have given me creeper vibes. All I'll watch now is LGR (until he goes woke)

Are there signs of him going woke? I stopped watching a while back after he transitioned fully into doing random shit with computers instead of lazily reviewing games.

Still, it'd be sad to see him putting a rainbow logo up or placing his pronouns into his bio or something.

 

[Least Concern]

Are there signs of him going woke?

Not that I've seen. He seems to be a pretty chill guy and I can't remember him saying anything political at all.

His goofy put-on voice still kinda annoys me but his videos are entertaining enough that I watch 'em all anyway… except for maybe the The Sims expansion pack reviews since I don't give a shit about those.

 

[TenMilesWide]

Not that I've seen. He seems to be a pretty chill guy and I can't remember him saying anything political at all.

His goofy put-on voice still kinda annoys me but his videos are entertaining enough that I watch 'em all anyway… except for maybe the The Sims expansion pack reviews since I don't give a shit about those.

Clint is much like Alec from Technology Connections, in that he seems like a chill dude and the videos are neat but for your own sake don't check his twitter.

 

[Least Concern]

Clint is much like Alec from Technology Connections, in that he seems like a chill dude and the videos are neat but for your own sake don't check his twitter.

Well, of course I had to check after you said that, but I went back maybe a month or so and didn't find anything political at all unless you count a retweet of a picture of some old system posted by someone with troon flags in their username. You sure you weren't thinking of someone else?

I looked up Technology Connections (whose videos I only sometimes watch) for comparison, saw the pronouns in the bio, and gave up there.

 

[TenMilesWide]

Well, of course I had to check after you said that, but I went back maybe a month or so and didn't find anything political at all unless you count a retweet of a picture of some old system posted by someone with troon flags in their username. You sure you weren't thinking of someone else?

I looked up Technology Connections (whose videos I only sometimes watch) for comparison, saw the pronouns in the bio, and gave up there.

I thought I'd seen Clint making some Orange Man Bad or Black Lives Matter posts some time ago but yeah I might've been thinking of someone else.

 

[ditto]

I stopped watching a while back after he transitioned fully into doing random shit with computers instead of lazily reviewing games.

The LGR Blerbs is better since it's usually shorter and unscripted. His main channel videos are overproduced and a bit shallow imho. Not to mention the Mighty Voice delivery that grates after a couple of minutes.

Still I miss the comfy Clint who would crack open a soda and review a terrible DOS game

 

[Least Concern]

Still I miss the comfy Clint who would crack open a soda and review a terrible DOS game

Ha, I guess I'm a boomer 'cuz I never saw his older vids. Before I knew he used to make those, I wondered why he called himself "Lazy Game Reviews" when he so rarely reviewed games. Losing the "angry video game reviewer" schtick was a good move, and ditto with the chinstrap - he actually looks older in that video than he does in the ones from today. The better lighting probably helps too.

And yeah, that game looks like just pure shit.

 

[seri0us]

Does LGR still orbit that fat goth girl

 

[Mr. Duck]

His goofy put-on voice still kinda annoys me but his videos are entertaining enough that I watch 'em all anyway… except for maybe the The Sims expansion pack reviews since I don't give a shit about those.

Even he doesn't care about those Sims videos, he's sick of The Sims 4 and only does them out of obligation, or something.

 

[awoo]

I think it's because they were so long.

If you need the touch of real hardware. The easiest and cheapest way is probably an emulator for one of the countless Z80 systems out there, because you get (emulated) periphery to play around with too and can see results without leaving the comfort of your PC and modern UI. You can even inspect the memory of the emulated machine to see what's happening without awkward serial debugging and other such old school tech. Emulators these days are incredibly accurate. It's also usually very easy to cross-develop. (That's how modern software for these old systems is usually made) All these fancy C64 demos the demo scene produces these days? Written on a boring PC.

The Z80 is a good CPU to do assembler with, the 6502 which is the other popular CPU usually coming up in these experiments is a bit more feature-less but is generally faster because amongst other things it can access memory faster. (important, we are cooking with no caches here - always fetching - actually it's also kind of a misnomer, it's just that Z80s memory access cycle is really slow) In reality, this makes actually less a difference than you think it should *if* you use the Z80 and all it's registers to the biggest extend and try to minimize memory access. With code optimized to it's strengths, a fast 6502 can't be beat by any other 8 bitter though. That does require some wizardry and programming for the Z80 is just that much easier, especially somewhat more complex programs. A fast Z180 with 18 or even 33 Mhz will be hard to reason as "not being enough", it has enough speed and is just that much more convenient. (Although there are modern 65C02 with up to 14 Mhz... no idea how these compare but it stands to reason they're not slower) I'm excluding the modern 8 bit microcontrollers who are all technically much faster because their architecture doesn't really lend itself to build proper computers.

If anyone reading this is ever interested in building his own computer out of these CPUs, beware of fakes from China. there are a lot and nothing will be more frustrating than finding out that the IC you got is just some other IC reprinted and not behaving like the datasheet. It'll throw you off, especially if you lack the experience to tell.

If all the Amiga crazies haven't bought them all up yet, the 68k is a good step up when you're ready for the added complexity of 16-bit. Assembly on the 68k is dangerously close to creeping up to a difficulty level that stops being a fun side project for the beginner though.

Generally, remember to not build a too cpu-centric design as these are limited with these CPUs anyways. In many of these classic computers, the CPU wasn't really the central part. There's a lot of exciting and cheap periphery on the market these days that doesn't mind being controlled by an 8-bitter and could do the heavy lifting.

Well there I can list two advantages of working with calculators: widely available emulators for all platforms and active community, and also the chips are definitely legit. I suppose that applies even more to arduinos. I don't think the 68k is a rare chip tho because I still see lots online, who knows how legit they are. I'm not good at searching for these components because I mostly buy random Chinese components like arduinos on aliexpress for messing around.

 

[byuu]

and also the chips are definitely legit. I suppose that applies even more to arduinos.

Arduino with fake chips do exist. The ATMEGA328, the MCU the Arduino Uno/Nano is based on, has a Chinese clone, the LGT8F328P.
And of course all the other parts of Arduino boards are replaced with Chinese counterparts as well.

 

[awoo]

Arduino with fake chips do exist. The ATMEGA328, the MCU the Arduino Uno/Nano is based on, has a Chinese clone, the LGT8F328P.
And of course all the other parts of Arduino boards are replaced with Chinese counterparts as well.

Does it matter tho? like if I want to make my wooden box with a button that lights up project

https://sites.google.com/site/ericmklaus/projects-1/lgt8f328p-arduino-clone first google link says it's instruction, pin compatible so does it matter for casuals like me

 

[byuu]

Does it matter tho? like if I want to make my wooden box with a button that lights up project

Not really. But you should generally be aware that even less than 1$ ICs get faked.

 

[AmpleApricots]

The chinese will fake absolutely everything and they do not care. To be fair, some of their fakes are just as good as the original, but cheaper. Not all fakes are though and some have serious reliability/accuracy difficulties (e.g. moisture/temperature sensors) and buying some things from some rando off aliexpress/ebay means you're gonna get a fake 99% of the time. Even if you buy from reputable electronics suppliers like Mouser you can end up with a fake but they will remedy the situation for you (while the chinaman will just laugh at you from afar) and it's very, very rare. Of course that's more expensive.

They usually do not fake old/out of production ICs (fake as make an unlicensed copy) but what they will do is sand the surface from some random IC of the same size/type off, laser-engrave whatever labeling they sold you and there you go, having a complete random and potentially non-working chip that's labeled as something entirely different, or a processor/RAM with a worse speed rating than what's actually printed, etc.. You don't want to find that out after you ordered 6 weeks ago and notice you can't start your project with this. It's not always the case and even the Chinese sometimes have legit NOS, but tbf it's always a gamble. It's not even always the fault of the Chinese seller, sometimes they themselves got scammed by other Chinese. Even if you do larger business in China and don't have people in place in China you can trust, you are 100% going to get scammed. China is basically scams all the way down. Fucking somebody over because they didn't consider all possible angles and decided to trust you is an culturally acceptable, normal thing to do in China. They do that ruthless capitalism thing a lot better than we do with our stupid little morals and Christianity-inspired conscience.

I don't think the 68k is a rare chip tho because I still see lots online, who knows how legit they are.

I was half-kidding with that statement because last time I checked (which admittedly, is years ago) the Amiga community was absolutely nuts and hoarded everything tangentially related to the Amiga in any way. The 68k (and it's descendants) was a very common processor and was used in a lot of embedded things, from dishwashers, to BMWs, to military rocket guidance systems, space rockets and commercial airplanes. I wouldn't be surprised if there were many around still and their manufacturing probably didn't even end that long ago. The MC68SEC000 is also still made and could probably be adapted to even work in these old systems with a bit of additional circuity. Tbh I'd be surprised if nobody did this. EOL since 2020 apparently. Pity.

I also kinda want to take a statement back I made earlier. 68k Assembler can be fun. If you're starting out, try it on some fun system like an Amiga where you get a lot of cool registers and periphery hardware to play around with and see results immediately. The Amiga's OS and GUI is also advanced enough that it's not a PITA to develop directly on the machine. If you don't have an Amiga, you can also do it all in emulation.

 

[seri0us]

The chinese will fake absolutely everything and they do not care. To be fair, some of their fakes are just as good as the original, but cheaper. Not all fakes are though and some have serious reliability/accuracy difficulties (e.g. moisture/temperature sensors) and buying some things from some rando off aliexpress/ebay means you're gonna get a fake 99% of the time. Even if you buy from reputable electronics suppliers like Mouser you can end up with a fake but they will remedy the situation for you (while the chinaman will just laugh at you from afar) and it's very, very rare. Of course that's more expensive.

They usually do not fake old/out of production ICs (fake as make an unlicensed copy) but what they will do is sand the surface from some random IC of the same size/type off, laser-engrave whatever labeling they sold you and there you go, having a complete random and potentially non-working chip that's labeled as something entirely different, or a processor/RAM with a worse speed rating than what's actually printed, etc.. You don't want to find that out after you ordered 6 weeks ago and notice you can't start your project with this. It's not always the case and even the Chinese sometimes have legit NOS, but tbf it's always a gamble. It's not even always the fault of the Chinese seller, sometimes they themselves got scammed by other Chinese. Even if you do larger business in China and don't have people in place in China you can trust, you are 100% going to get scammed. China is basically scams all the way down. Fucking somebody over because they didn't consider all possible angles and decided to trust you is an culturally acceptable, normal thing to do in China. They do that ruthless capitalism thing a lot better than we do with our stupid little morals and Christianity-inspired conscience.

>china
>capitalist