US US Politics General - Discussion of President Biden and other politicians

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Michael Wade said:
Man..... Coming over here after spending a few days in the Canada trucker thread is like being dumped with a bucket of cold ice water. It's all laughs and sunshine over there, Cops have practically joined up with the protesters. Military is refusing to do shit. The bugmen are too incompetent to even stage a counterprotest. Honestly gives me hope for america's future.... but I know its not going to be as easy for us.
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Thing about the US is, in many parts of the country Covid is over. Outside the big cities people are getting on with their lives. Trudeau's tyrannical policies were affecting the whole country including people like the truckers who haven't been warped by life in the urban bug hives. In the US people can get away from a lot of the madness by fleeing to the countryside, so they have a pressure release valve that Canada didn't.
 
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Vaclav said:
This is a point I've made before about the neoliberal/PMC/bugman complex. They're not able to inspire loyalty in people. People will fight and die for their ethnic group or their religion and the United States was founded on an idea and a mythos that many people believe is worth dying for. What does globalism offer? Netflix and iPhones? Creature comforts don't breed genuine loyalty. The people who serve the globalist system are mercenaries working for a paycheck or slaves working because they're threatened. Both will run in the face of danger, because the system they serve doesn't offer them real meaning.
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I've genuinely enjoyed the exchange over the DNC going scorched earth. My two cents on this are as follows. It will surprise many here just how many, how much, of the deep state/media/ business guys are only in globohomo/wokeism for the money and the power it brings. They don't have any particular attachment to the ideas beyond the immediate gain they see from it. Their real motivation and ideology is simple, "Greed is Good". In the event that ship sinks they will be on the lifeboats.

There will be a huge number of true believers and spoiled establishment types who will go full scorched earth. Honestly I think people like Clinton and Pelosi will go down with the ship. Clinton revealed just how immature, spiteful and emotional she is back in 2016. People like Zuckerberg and his ilk will just pivot and try to stay above water. You will also find a lot of the glowniggers will equally pivot and try to live off their fat pensions.

Vaclav is (more) right there are a lot cynics in the deep state and Gehenna is (more) right that a lot of people officially calling the shots are a bunch of spoiled and vindictive brats who totally will go scorched earth.
 
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The Ugly One said:
Considering the Republicans did a very similar thing in the 00s, it seems like there's something about achieving nearly unchallengeable power in a democracy that makes the dominant power say, "I can't possibly lose another election...now I can finally tell everyone who voted for me to get fucked, I'm gonna just chill out with billionaires and do whatever they want. I mean, what are they gonna do, vote for the other party?" Hell, the Republicans squandered a brief trifecta in 2017-2018 to give one last gasp of handouts to corporations. They had a chance for a comeback and a clear roadmap to rebuild their appeal with American voters, and they threw it all away because a few billionaires wanted even more money.

We're in this weird state in American politics right now where both parties are terrible and figure they can be as awful as they want, because the other guys are so horrible, how could you ever vote for them?
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The issue with politicians in general and Republican politicians specifically isn't that they're sociopaths, but that they're morons.

If you do what the people want, help them and their friends, harm their enemies, execute the oligarchs, seize their wealth, and deport their families, then the people will stand by you no matter what you do. You could literally take everything Jeff Bezo owns and sodomize him on the White House lawn and people would make memes about it.

If Republican politicians weren't complete and utter idiots, they would understand that that is a once in a lifetime opportunity to become a king, and seize it.
 
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Vaclav said:
This doesn't make sense to me. The hypothetical is about the Dems meeting with catastrophic failure, losing the confidence of the public, and then trying to do something underhanded to recover, getting caught and losing all legitimacy.

They have the power they have because they can make things happen for people. The tech companies banish all right-wing thought and allow Antifa to organize on their platforms because they think the Dems will create conditions favorable to them in return. If public faith in the Dems is totally destroyed and the party tries to somehow go scorched earth and make sure no one can have the US if they can't, their powerful backers won't go along with it. Antifa will have their comms and possibly their jawbones shut down. The deep state is concerned foremost with self-preservation, and if the left decides to trash the country they will pivot to the right and have the street-level organizers purged out of necessity. Like someone said, the extreme leftists have very few numbers, just extensive infiltration into powerful institutions, but those institutions will not follow them on a suicidal path. They'll do what they need to survive and build a narrative that justifies it later.

If the hypothetical scenario were to happen, I would guess that the senior leadership of the Dems get purged - convenient, since they're all ancient, and their kids would keep all their corrupt investments. Some mid-level people would get jail time and the party would go into the wilderness for a long period outside of the most hardcore blue hives. Republicans would probably make backroom deals to keep the D party somewhat viable, since having a party fall would create a greater risk to them, a risk of real populists rising and threatening the two-party system. After a couple decades the crimes of the past would be papered over and a new generation of Dems would emerge on the political scene.
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I'm still mainlining my morning coffee right now so maybe I'm misreading this, but the idea that these behemoth organizations/companies/government entities can or even want to pivot that quickly when the country is in chaos isn't realistic. It took decades (maybe even a whole century) for liberals to have the influence and infiltration they have right now. They can't admit they're wrong, or there's too much red tape, or there are too many true believers, etc. for them to say, oh, we're populist/conservative now, lol. Maybe at the top they could try it, but they'd get pushback from the bottom and then the infighting would paralyze any real movement.

And the deep state is only concerned with self-preservation until they aren't. Cutting bait and running is the end result there if it looks like things are tanking for them.

The other thing to consider, and Gehenna and Jamais (correct me if I'm wrong, though) have talked about this a lot, is that the power and influence the dems have is all predicated on what the party promised to do for their supporters in the future, and now that the debt needs to be paid they don't have the capital or funds to do it. That's undermining the party more than anything. That's leading to desperation, and desperate people with no scruples have zero problems taking everyone down with them, including people they purport to "care" about and represent.

But like I said, I'm half awake and maybe missing the whole point.
 
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Gehenna said:
The problem with your rebuttal is that if the Democrats go full nutjob the American populace wouldn't be satisfied with that shallow version. They'd remember for a long time how it went down. The entire brand that is Democrats would be tarnished for a long. long time,

There is no backroom deal around that, no sly play of media, no way to just handwave it and go on as normal. Things just don't work like that and even in your rebuttal, you are just trying to handwave it. Trying to claim they'd just somehow be able to get past it without actually saying how.
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people have forgotten about the riots in 2020, they can forget this. 1/6 and Watergate are remembered because the left has never shut up about it
 
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thyme's up said:
It took decades (maybe even a whole century) for liberals to have the influence and infiltration they have right now. They can't admit they're wrong, or there's too much red tape, or there are too many true believers, etc. for them to say, oh, we're populist/conservative now, lol. Maybe at the top they could try it, but they'd get pushback from the bottom and then the infighting would paralyze any real movement.
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The left in the 1960's was very different from what it is now. Remember the Clintons supported "family values" aka fuck fags.

The modern lefts version of the religious right is the progressive faction. who just like conservatives in the 1980s/1990s get courted to boost votes, they are also louder and more aggressive than the more moderate members of the party.

One of the cultural and ideological issues the Dems have is that they kept feeding a stupid fucking golem in order to "defeat" trump. But the golem is retarded and they lack not only the ability to deal with the retard they cant even deal with very real problems.
 
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MysticLord said:
The issue with politicians in general and Republican politicians specifically isn't that they're sociopaths, but that they're morons.

If you do what the people want, help them and their friends, harm their enemies, execute the oligarchs, seize their wealth, and deport their families, then the people will stand by you no matter what you do. You could literally take everything Jeff Bezo owns and sodomize him on the White House lawn and people would make memes about it.

If Republican politicians weren't complete and utter idiots, they would understand that that is a once in a lifetime opportunity to become a king, and seize it.
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When they realized they had this opportunity, they worked closely with the Democrats and the FBI to try and frame their guy as a Russian spy and have him removed from office.

soy_king said:
people have forgotten about the riots in 2020, they can forget this. 1/6 and Watergate are remembered because the left has never shut up about it
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I was talking to this left-wing guy not too long ago who was caterwauling about the "unprecedented Jan 6 insurrection" and asked him how it was different from people storming the Senate offices and trying to intimidate Senators into not confirming Brett Kavanaugh, or how it was different than rioters trying to firebomb federal buildings in Portland. He was completely unaware that either event had even happened.
 
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The Ugly One said:
When they realized they had this opportunity, they worked closely with the Democrats and the FBI to try and frame their guy as a Russian spy and have him removed from office.
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I disagree. They didn't realize they had the opportunity, and still haven't. They are too stupid to think on their own and operate on a sort of hierarchical groupthink. We won't get any change in attitudes until the current crop of politicians drops dead of heart attacks in the next 20 years, and maybe not even then.
 
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Ita Mori said:
"God-fearing" Republicans always seem to bend to the will of anti-christs... 🤔
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Kind praises from your rivals tend not to save political careers, which is something a lot of anti-Trump Republicans found out when they lost their primaries or general elections in 2020. Pence was put in a difficult position and while he may of avoided the fallout of the events of January 6, 2021 it cost him his reputation for many Republican voters who support the Trump/Populist faction of the party.
 
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MysticLord said:
I disagree. They didn't realize they had the opportunity, and still haven't. They are too stupid to think on their own and operate on a sort of hierarchical groupthink. We won't get any change in attitudes until the current crop of politicians drops dead of heart attacks in the next 20 years, and maybe not even then.
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I'm not sure they truly understood the opportunity in front of them, but I think it is ultimately the same impetus behind why Third World dictators are content to be top dog in a shithole rather than relax on the tyranny and insanity and allow some prosperity in their countries, because doing things that are good for the country overall means not hooking your son up with a new Lamborghini or gilding your palace toilets.

In the case of the Republican party, they had spent decades crafting a system of kickbacks to ensure money from the wealthy donors kept flowing in, and elected officials could retire to six-figure board seats or no-show law firm partnerships. Going along with Trumpian populism could have won them a huge share of votes that Democrats had abandoned and actually be good for the country, but it would piss off everyone from Google to Raytheon. Good for the party, good for the country, but not good for the average GOP congressman on a personal level.
 
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The Ugly One said:
I'm not sure they truly understood the opportunity in front of them, but I think it is ultimately the same impetus behind why Third World dictators are content to be top dog in a shithole rather than relax on the tyranny and insanity and allow some prosperity in their countries, because doing things that are good for the country overall means not hooking your son up with a new Lamborghini or gilding your palace toilets.

In the case of the Republican party, they had spent decades crafting a system of kickbacks to ensure money from the wealthy donors kept flowing in, and elected officials could retire to six-figure board seats or no-show law firm partnerships. Going along with Trumpian populism could have won them a huge share of votes that Democrats had abandoned and actually be good for the country, but it would piss off everyone from Google to Raytheon. Good for the party, good for the country, but not good for the average GOP congressman on a personal level.
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It's short term, small scale thinking. They'd going after chump change when they could be kings.

The problem ultimately is that they are low quality people.
 
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