War Invasion of Ukraine News Megathread - Thread is only for articles and discussion of articles, general discussion thread is still in Happenings.

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President Joe Biden on Tuesday said that the United States will impose sanctions “far beyond” the ones that the United States imposed in 2014 following the annexation of the Crimean peninsula.

“This is the beginning of a Russian invasion of Ukraine,” Biden said in a White House speech, signaling a shift in his administration’s position. “We will continue to escalate sanctions if Russia escalates,” he added.

Russian elites and their family members will also soon face sanctions, Biden said, adding that “Russia will pay an even steeper price” if Moscow decides to push forward into Ukraine. Two Russian banks and Russian sovereign debt will also be sanctioned, he said.

Also in his speech, Biden said he would send more U.S. troops to the Baltic states as a defensive measure to strengthen NATO’s position in the area.

Russia shares a border with Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania.

A day earlier, Russian President Vladimir Putin ordered troops to go into the separatist Donetsk and Lugansk regions in eastern Ukraine after a lengthy speech in which he recognized the two regions’ independence.

Western powers decried the move and began to slap sanctions on certain Russian individuals, while Germany announced it would halt plans to go ahead with the Russia-to-Germany Nord Stream 2 pipeline.

At home, Biden is facing bipartisan pressure to take more extensive actions against Russia following Putin’s decision. However, a recent poll showed that a majority of Americans believe that sending troops to Ukraine is a “bad idea,” and a slim minority believes it’s a good one.

All 27 European Union countries unanimously agreed on an initial list of sanctions targeting Russian authorities, said French Foreign Minister Jean-Yves Le Drian, and EU foreign affairs head Josep Borell claimed the package “will hurt Russia … a lot.”

Earlier Tuesday, Borell asserted that Russian troops have already entered the Donbas region, which comprises Donetsk and Lugansk, which are under the control of pro-Russia groups since 2014.

And on Tuesday, the Russian Parliament approved a Putin-back plan to use military force outside of Russia’s borders as Putin further said that Russia confirmed it would recognize the expanded borders of Lugansk and Donetsk.

“We recognized the states,” the Russian president said. “That means we recognized all of their fundamental documents, including the constitution, where it is written that their [borders] are the territories at the time the two regions were part of Ukraine.”

Speaking to reporters on Tuesday, Putin said that Ukraine is “not interested in peaceful solutions” and that “every day, they are amassing troops in the Donbas.”

Meanwhile, Ukraine President Volodymyr Zelensky on Tuesday morning again downplayed the prospect of a Russian invasion and proclaimed: “There will be no war.”

“There will not be an all-out war against Ukraine, and there will not be a broad escalation from Russia. If there is, then we will put Ukraine on a war footing,” he said in a televised address.

The White House began to signal that they would shift their own position on whether it’s the start of an invasion.

“We think this is, yes, the beginning of an invasion, Russia’s latest invasion into Ukraine,” said Jon Finer, the White House deputy national security adviser in public remarks. “An invasion is an invasion and that is what is underway.”

For weeks, Western governments have been claiming Moscow would invade its neighbor after Russia gathered some 150,000 troops along the countries’ borders. They alleged that the Kremlin would attempt to come up with a pretext to attack, while some officials on Monday said Putin’s speech recognizing the two regions was just that.

But Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin told reporters Tuesday that Russia’s “latest invasion” of Ukraine is threatening stability in the region, but he asserted that Putin can “still avoid a full blown, tragic war of choice.”

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Think what you want, but I think it is far too early to start declaring a Russian failure. Kiev is likely to fall soon, they seem to be rolling up the south handily, and the Ukrainian government is showing signs of desperation..
Its day 2 of the invasion and somehow Russia already failed. Keep in mind that the US and UK took 3 weeks to reach Baghdad, a distance of 300 miles and Iraq didn't have years of being handed advanced weaponry capable of making a American invasion a bruising experience. Just fucking dismiss these retards out of hand, if this was the American military timetable for Iraq it would require an entire week to get to Kiev, instead the Russians are already there with only 1/3rd of their forces deployed.
 
I would recommend you look back to see how long it took for the US military to reach Baghdad in the 2003 invasion and that was considered " a blitz," interestingly the opposition tends to dislike hostile armies moving through their country and do naughty things like shooting at them and blowing bridges. At Najaf the US lost 30 Apaches and several armored vehicles to a military that is worse off than Ukraine is.
For the US losing military hardware is inconvenient as opposed to losing servicemen which none of the Apache crews were killed.
 
I would recommend you look back to see how long it took for the US military to reach Baghdad in the 2003 invasion and that was considered " a blitz," interestingly the opposition tends to dislike hostile armies moving through their country and do naughty things like shooting at them and blowing bridges. At Najaf the US lost 30 Apaches and several armored vehicles to a military that is worse off than Ukraine is. The gap between Russia and Ukraine isn't THAT far, its mere numerical and stuff like wireguided anti-tank missile platforms are a huge difference compared to the 2003 invasion. NATO has been funneling these kind of weapons into the country for months and they're not exactly easy to deal with.
Yes, Baghdad. A city that's literally on the other side of the world as the Americans. Meanwhile, Russia can't even establish air superiority RIGHT NEXT DOOR. That is a very bad sign for a former superpower. Combine that with lackluster morale, along with a well-equipped enemy that has all the morale in the world, and it can end very badly for the Russians.

Taking Kiev isn't the end of it-it's just the beginning.

If Putin goes full Kefka, I demand he paint his face and play Dancing Mad at every press conference.
I was expecting him to be more like Gihren Zabi, making grandiose speeches about the glory of all Slavs, the way Gihren spoke about the Spacenoids:


And the ones who will suffer most are the Ukrainian people because of the oligarch assholes who run the country and Biden's poking the bee's nest over and over.
You do realize Russia is ruled by oligarchs too, right? Putin didn't reign them in, he made them his friends. Both Ukraine and Russia are ruled by oligarchs with ties to former Communist Party elites. And their corruption makes Biden look positively pristine.
 
That was before we had modern technology and weaponry. If Russia can't even own the skies after invading a fucking next-door neighbor, a former client-state, then it doesn't look like they can do so at all.
Most people in both countries probably have family and friends in both countries, as Ukraine and Russia had a lot of travel between them for the past hundred years. It's not like when America is bombing Afghanistan where they can just drone kids and shrug their shoulders about it.
 
Most people in both countries probably have family and friends in both countries. It's not like when America is bombing Afghanistan where they can just drone kids and shrug their shoulders about it.
Exactly. It's easier to wage war when the enemy has little to no relations to you, or doesn't even look like you. They're some tribals out from nowhere who have no one caring about them. Meanwhile, families in Russia and Ukraine are being torn apart.

See, I called it.

Pretty soon this will be Germany Vs Stalingrad.
This is what happens when you declare a war and go off half-cocked. I wonder if Putin starts forcing his men to not pull back as they're surrounded by Ukrainian guerillas?

So Russia surrendered and lost 800 men? Lol. Ukraine has more balls than the us.
They're telling a nuclear power who's right next door to go fuck themselves. We ran away from some desert shithole bandits.

Of course they do.
 
Exactly. It's easier to wage war when the enemy has little to no relations to you, or doesn't even look like you. They're some tribals out from nowhere who have no one caring about them. Meanwhile, families in Russia and Ukraine are being torn apart.
Yup. It's not like in the West where people just side with Ukraine because Russia is the big evil, but it's a very complicated topic in both countries and a lot of immigrants from both in the West hold conflicting views on the subject. The soldiers don't have a problem killing each other, but probably aren't going to just launch a full siege that results in any real form of civilian casualties. So Russia so far has made a lot of progress into Ukraine and the battle will probably grind to a halt now that they're at a major city because they can't easily attack it. It doesn't mean Russia has failed in the war, if anything it may turn opinion to them as Russian loyalists in the city might remain and then if a take over happens it will be easier to hold.
 
if anything it may turn opinion to them as Russian loyalists in the city might remain and then if a take over happens it will be easier to hold.
Yeah, that fanfiction has already been proven false with grannies willing to take up arms. There may be some "loyalists" in the east, but not enough to overcome the amount of people that remember how fucking horrible it was to live under the Soviets.
 
Yup. It's not like in the West where people just side with Ukraine because Russia is the big evil, but it's a very complicated topic in both countries and a lot of immigrants from both in the West hold conflicting views on the subject. The soldiers don't have a problem killing each other, but probably aren't going to just launch a full siege that results in any real form of civilian casualties. So Russia so far has made a lot of progress into Ukraine and the battle will probably grind to a halt now that they're at a major city because they can't easily attack it. It doesn't mean Russia has failed in the war, if anything it may turn opinion to them as Russian loyalists in the city might remain and then if a take over happens it will be easier to hold.
Exactly. They might be hitting some of their own people, and civilian casualties would just galvanize and justify NATO's stance even more. Russia won't outright lose the war, but if they get their noses bloodied by such a smaller foe, then that makes their political standing and prestige look even worse for wear, like what happened when America left Vietnam or Afghanistan. It would cause a ripple effect that would cause them to lose face among their ex-Soviet neighbors, which will in turn, speed up Russia's decline, which was the exact opposite of what Putin wanted when he launched this war.
 
Yeah, that fanfiction has already been proven false with grannies willing to take up arms. There may be some "loyalists" in the east, but not enough to overcome the amount of people that remember how fucking horrible it was to live under the Soviets.
Could easily go that way as well, it's one of those things we won't know until it's over with. Bit of a non answer on my part, but I don't think making any concrete predictions right now is worthwhile.


Exactly. They might be hitting some of their own people, and civilian casualties would just galvanize and justify NATO's stance even more. Russia won't outright lose the war, but if they get their noses bloodied by such a smaller foe, then that makes their political standing and prestige look even worse for wear, like what happened when America left Vietnam or Afghanistan. It would cause a ripple effect that would cause them to lose face among their ex-Soviet neighbors, which will in turn, speed up Russia's decline, which was the exact opposite of what Putin wanted when he launched this war.
Eh, I think you're thinking of it like the West. Think of Slavs like Asians, they all look similar, there's a thousand different varieties, and all of them hate each other. Russia could lose the war horribly and that still wouldn't stop the Serbs from wanting to murder fuck Kosovo enough to not be friends with Russia to some degree. I mean fuck, a big driver for WW1 was the Russians losing the Russo-Japanese war horribly and it just made the Balkans want to go to war with everyone else more.
 
See, I called it.

Pretty soon this will be Germany Vs Stalingrad.
Speaking of which Mark Felton fortuitously put up an excellent video today detailing the rather complex history of Ukrainian forces during WW2. It actually gives a lot to think about .
i especially love that the symbol of that Ukrainian SS brigade was in all honesty the “Double Cross”
 
Eh, I think you're thinking of it like the West. Think of Slavs like Asians, they all look similar, there's a thousand different varieties, and all of them hate each other. Russia could lose the war horribly and that still wouldn't stop the Serbs from wanting to murder fuck Kosovo enough to not be friends with Russia to some degree. I mean fuck, a big driver for WW1 was the Russians losing the Russo-Japanese war horribly and it just made the Balkans want to go to war with everyone else more.
Oh, of course, the Serbs and the other Eastern Europeans will still hate the living shit out of each other. That will never change. But Russia bungling an invasion against a country that was literally right next door? That will bode ill for their political prestige and standing. Their neighbors in both Asia and Europe will not fear them the way they used to, which is the exact opposite of what Putin wants. This whole war was launched by Putin to make Russia feared again, and instead, he's giving the world more reasons to join NATO and bleed him dry.
 
Oh, of course, the Serbs and the other Eastern Europeans will still hate the living shit out of each other. That will never change. But Russia bungling an invasion against a country that was literally right next door? That will bode ill for their political prestige and standing. Their neighbors in both Asia and Europe will not fear them the way they used to, which is the exact opposite of what Putin wants. This whole war was launched by Putin to make Russia feared again, and instead, he's giving the world more reasons to join NATO and bleed him dry.
Russia has been known to be a shithole for some time, the only thing they really have to make people fear them are nukes, hackers, and covert hitmen. That last one has also been a little questionable with Putin being unable to take out Navalny despite poisoning him more than once. It wouldn't be surprising at all if everyone in any position of power knew exactly how much power Russia had before this happened but they're too useful as a bugbear to the US to do anything, they're too useful to Europe as an energy source, and they're too useful to China as a distraction. Basically Russia has this weird stasis of being just important enough to everyone, but not having any real power outside of randomly tard raging and murdering someone once in a while. Everyone else probably just accepts that once in a while they have to sacrifice a life to Papa Putin to keep things normal.
 
Have said here many times that the Russian and Chinese militaries are just as screwed up as ours, in their own ways, Believe this statement has been borne out in the case of Russia.
Based on their fact the Russians are apparently still using outdated and ineffectual Soviet era doctrine I'd argue they're even more screwed up than us. Western militaries have their porblems for sure, but based on how the Russians are acting we'd fucking destroy them.


I think you're a bit premature in declaring Russia's air force to have failed.
The Ukrainians started the war with a nominal strength of 60-70 fighters/multi roles + ~30 CAS/Ground attack and some outdated S300s. The Russians with ~900 fighters/multi-role ~450 CAS/ground attack ~100 heavy bombers and their vaunted and allegedly all-powerful S400. The fact that the Russians still don't have the kind of the kind of air superiority they need, to the point where the Ukrainians allegedly managed to hit back at a Russian Air Force is bad. Does it mean the Russian Air Force is "losing"? No, but just like the issues the ground forces are having, not winning decisively is in it's own ways potentially as bad as losing in the long run.
 
Russia has been known to be a shithole for some time, the only thing they really have to make people fear them are nukes, hackers, and covert hitmen. That last one has also been a little questionable with Putin being unable to take out Navalny despite poisoning him more than once. It wouldn't be surprising at all if everyone in any position of power knew exactly how much power Russia had before this happened but they're too useful as a bugbear to the US to do anything, they're too useful to Europe as an energy source, and they're too useful to China as a distraction. Basically Russia has this weird stasis of being just important enough to everyone, but not having any real power outside of randomly tard raging and murdering someone once in a while. Everyone else probably just accepts that once in a while they have to sacrifice a life to Papa Putin to keep things normal.
Indeed. Which is why if Putin bungles this war and it lasts longer than anticipated, then Putin's reach becomes even more questionable. His survival, even more so. If the Russian Oligarchs begin to see him as a fuck-up who made their nation the laughing stock of the western world due to their army encountering major shits in Ukraine, then they might decide to poison him and blame it on the Americans.

Based on their fact the Russians are apparently still using outdated and ineffectual Soviet era doctrine I'd argue they're even more screwed up than us. Western militaries have their porblems for sure, but based on how the Russians are acting we'd fucking destroy them.
If it wasn't for the nukes and MAD, the West would probably be on our way to Moscow by now.

The Ukrainians started the war with a nominal strength of 60-70 fighters/multi roles + ~30 CAS/Ground attack and some outdated S300s. The Russians with ~900 fighters/multi-role ~450 CAS/ground attack ~100 heavy bombers and their vaunted and allegedly all-powerful S400. The fact that the Russians still don't have the kind of the kind of air superiority they need, to the point where the Ukrainians allegedly managed to hit back at a Russian Air Force is bad. Does it mean the Russian Air Force is "losing"? No, but just like the issues the ground forces are having, not winning decisively is in it's own ways potentially as bad as losing in the long run.
All Ukraine needs to do is hold the line long enough for Russian morale to collapse. Then the Russian problem will take care of itself. They don't need to hit Moscow with a missile strike; dissent is already rife back home, and the Russians aren't exactly as motivated as the Ukrainians are.
 
The Russians with ~900 fighters/multi-role ~450 CAS/ground attack ~100 heavy bombers and their vaunted and allegedly all-powerful S400. The fact that the Russians still don't have the kind of the kind of air superiority they need, to the point where the Ukrainians allegedly managed to hit back at a Russian Air Force is bad. Does it mean the Russian Air Force is "losing"? No, but just like the issues the ground forces are having, not winning decisively is in it's own ways potentially as bad as losing in the long run.
Russia still has to maintain its airforce in other sectors, they don't just hurl every fucking plane into a war at once, their army still has to maintain positions near the Baltic states, Finland and keep an eye over in Vladivostok plus the security detail in Khazakstan. Russia still has forces in Syria as well. The committed air assets to Ukraine are nowhere near where you expect them to be.
 
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