Star Wars Griefing Thread (SPOILERS) - Safety off

[Resident Evil]

I haven't been arsed to finish any of these ones since he decided to try shoving his rambling horseshit from his 8+ hour long streams into them. You know, the one with furries where they spend 35 minutes trying to desperately create the best zingers for a 3 minute clip of footage.

He can pretend that it's important all he wants, but no fucker that's waffling and garbage that can be cut.

I agree, even as a MauLer fan (this makes me subhuman but give me a second to hear the rest out), “Longman bad” at a point IS a valid criticism. Things twice as long as their length fro reviews or analysis is fine- for fucks sake, the ammount of energy it takes in even one man small game or movie project is 1000’s of ours for even just one person- talking about it for a fraction of that is forgivable.

But when you’re retreading tired ground, that grows tired within your OWN argument, then it becomes floundering, it becomes substanceless, it becomes noise, nothing. It’s why I don’t often watch EFAP unless I see a super cut. He doesn’t nitpick, but it sure does feel like it because he’s driving home a point 100 miles away 1 mile per hour. It’s why some of my favorite work of his is an unbridled raged, it’s squeezing as much info and critique as humanly possibly without bordering on overwhelming.

The memes are funny sometimes though and JLongBone is nice.

 

[Milwaukee Macho Man]

Star Wars: Eclipse is expected to release in either 2027 or 2028 for next-gen consoles and PC.

At least they're being honest and upfront about when they think it will come out, unlike CDPR. Can you imagine if the last few retards following Disney Star Wars had that kind of hype for a fucking visual novel?

 

[Shekelslovakia]

It looks like MauLer finally remembered that he had a series of video essays to continue.
Part 4:

A long time ago, in A Critique of Star Wars: The Force Awakens - Introduction far far away, Mauler announced that these videos would be released weekly from Part 2 onward... If only he knew how wrong he was lol

Can't wait for part 5 in 2023!!

 

[Sneed F91]

It looks like MauLer finally remembered that he had a series of video essays to continue.
Part 4:

I haven't been arsed to finish any of these ones since he decided to try shoving his rambling horseshit from his 8+ hour long streams into them. You know, the one with furries where they spend 35 minutes trying to desperately create the best zingers for a 3 minute clip of footage.

He can pretend that it's important all he wants, but no fucker that's waffling and garbage that can be cut.

I guess videos like this are what happens when you make youtube a career choice. It's the same reason why Doomcuck is still coping making Disney Wars videos. Honestly the whole "let's make fun of how bad Star Wars is now" thing peaked in 2019 and has been losing popularity ever since. After TROS most normies stopped caring.

 

[Kramer on the phone]

I agree, even as a MauLer fan (this makes me subhuman but give me a second to hear the rest out), “Longman bad” at a point IS a valid criticism. Things twice as long as their length fro reviews or analysis is fine- for fucks sake, the ammount of energy it takes in even one man small game or movie project is 1000’s of ours for even just one person- talking about it for a fraction of that is forgivable.

But when you’re retreading tired ground, that grows tired within your OWN argument, then it becomes floundering, it becomes substanceless, it becomes noise, nothing. It’s why I don’t often watch EFAP unless I see a super cut. He doesn’t nitpick, but it sure does feel like it because he’s driving home a point 100 miles away 1 mile per hour. It’s why some of my favorite work of his is an unbridled raged, it’s squeezing as much info and critique as humanly possibly without bordering on overwhelming.

The memes are funny sometimes though and JLongBone is nice.

"Longman bad" is valid because 99% of the time people pad those vids out with information that doesn't matter or they're retreading other people's shit.

i watched multiple 9+ hour critiques of fallout games and it was fine because they always talked about something different or unique. its why people mocked his 20 hour joker stream, its rather insane to go that long unless you are being somewhat unique in your takes, saying the same shit about taxi driver, 1970s NYC, mental illness, media,etc makes you annoying. its why people cut down shows like Moment of truth 90%, because people like Mauler obnoxiously spread content 10x longer than needed

 

[Sneed F91]

It was really fun to see different concepts of Jedi

You mean you don't like the force being turned into some yin yang Avatar The Last Airbender bullshit?
A Jedi family could be a really interesting concept considering the whole no attachments thing.

a literal click and drag ship plus copy paste various ones to make more numbers.

Not just a click and drag, but a copy paste of a scan of an IRL model for a completely different film scaled up to a comically huge degree.

 

[Registration]

You mean you don't like the force being turned into some yin yang Avatar The Last Airbender bullshit?

I never liked it to be honest.
I mean, you know midichlorians? People seem to hate it, even the concept of it but I always liked it, even Qui Gon Jinn, I see him as someone not bound by the Jedi's way of doing things, making it space for others to see "the Force" as something different.

Dunno if someone already did it, but I think it could be cool to see people manipulate midichlorians to use "force" power by technology, making pseudo control systems (but I guess is too high tech for SW anyways) or at least something that can affect jedi and sith's power.
Yes, I hate the whole mysticism towards the force, even more when you have canonically ghosts roaming around the universe and they affect the world around it, this for me makes it worse than being vague about it rather than a hard system.

If I could change it, I would kinda leave this whole mysticism bullshit in a way that is how jedi perceive the force, making another point of view for sith that is different and other groups have their own way that is different than both, you know, variety?


I also liked the non humanoid beast jedi, Thon, I guess somehow they still do some of minors characters that aren't humanoid but it was cool.

 

[Uranus Pink]

I never liked it to be honest.
I mean, you know midichlorians? People seem to hate it, even the concept of it but I always liked it, even Qui Gon Jinn, I see him as someone not bound by the Jedi's way of doing things, making it space for others to see "the Force" as something different.

But that would require nuance and SW and SW fans only see things in black and white. To them Qui Gon Jinn is a closet Sith as any deviation from the set in stone Jedi teachings is verboten. Then there the hypocrisy of choosing you destiny and predestination in the SW EU. Especially with the Skywalker and Solo families. As each succeeding generation is given the choice of "you will be a Jedi" and you don't wanna be a Jedi, FUCK choosing you destiny, you will a Jedi.

 

[Wyzzerd]

Dunno if someone already did it, but I think it could be cool to see people manipulate midichlorians to use "force" power by technology, making pseudo control systems (but I guess is too high tech for SW anyways) or at least something that can affect jedi and sith's power.

There was something similar with the shadow troopers from jk2. Synthetic force crystals set in cortosis armor let normies be saber wielding bastards. Yes I will ffanatically bring up kyle katarn and the jedi knight games any chance I get. Those are peak star wars to me!

There were also the ysalamiri that stopped force powers. But that was less technology and more using nature to ruin a jedis day.

 

[Mississippi Motorboater]

Speaking of LOTF and the Legacy Era, I have to say I have really grown to appreciate Lumiya as a character.

For a few reasons-she is a menacing villain in her own right, not as powerful as the heroes but ruthless, relentless, and utterly sincere.

Secondly her motivations-while she is driven by both a desire for revenge(though she denies this to Jacen fervently), she really does want a "new" Sith based on sacrificing for the many, of giving oneself totally so that others might know peace. She does indeed isolate Jacen and manipulate him, but she didn't intend for him to fail, she has triumphed whether he succeeds or fails.

She has broken Luke Skywalker and passed on the Sith mantle (it would be up to Jacen to win then, not her).

Lumiya: "Remember your oaths, Luke, they're all you have left in the end"

Lumiya may be only the villain for the first half of the series, but she is the true victor.

I think one of LOTF's best accomplishments was fleshing out Lumiya, and making her more of a manipulator than just a half-robot assassin. I think it works as an extension of her Marvel characterization as well, since she already had plenty of practice using subterfuge and deception on Luke Skywalker to convince him that she was a Rebel ally. Having that same character possessing the tact and cunning to make Jacen question what he knows was a really good use of existing character traits. I also think her interactions with Alema, particularly in Sacrifice, were really interesting to read. That's when you can tell that Lumiya's exercising a lot of caution with manipulating someone who is outright insane, but just emotionally broken enough to be skewed towards her own causes.

It's really neat how the Legacy Era novels took such old Star Wars concepts like Lumiya and the Celestials and made them such an instrumental part of the final two storylines. They even threw in callbacks to the West End RPG Games with some of the things Luke and Ben encounter on their Force Odyssey.

In hindsight, that whole era feels like the continuity coming full-circle to homage every part of the timeline, like it was a "last hurrah" just before Disney discontinued everything.

Ah, but what is a name? Vergere addresses this question herself in Traitor. She states that Jedi and Sith are just labels. And its clear she is not a traditional Sith, given she ran away when she learned what Palpatine really was.

I reconcile this by arguing that yes, Vergere was a Sith candidate/sith in training but she was also more than that-she was the mentor of the man who did indeed defeat and redeem the Vong, who saved Mara with her tears, and who gave her life so that her pupil might make a galaxy free of weeds.

^While there is a dissonance you can reconcile the Vergere of the NJO and the Denningverse on the grounds she is both and all of what she is said to be.

You'd need a lot of personal headcanon and ductape to reconcile Vergere's Sith status, but hey, who am I to stop people.

Then there the hypocrisy of choosing you destiny and predestination in the SW EU. Especially with the Skywalker and Solo families. As each succeeding generation is given the choice of "you will be a Jedi" and you don't wanna be a Jedi, FUCK choosing you destiny, you will a Jedi.

...not all of them.

 

[Registration]

There was something similar with the shadow troopers from jk2. Synthetic force crystals set in cortosis armor let normies be saber wielding bastards. Yes I will ffanatically bring up kyle katarn and the jedi knight games any chance I get. Those are peak star wars to me!

There were also the ysalamiri that stopped force powers. But that was less technology and more using nature to ruin a jedis day.

Oh, that is cool then.

But then again, it kinda reminds me of how lightsabers are perceived and used. They are just a tool, wouldn't it make much more sense that the blades in the lightsaber would be an extension of the jedi/sith inner power rather than just a crystal beam emission boom? I guess the rarity and the power of it would make much more sense than just a technological item.

But I guess is too anime for SW lol.

But that would require nuance and SW and SW fans only see things in black and white. To them Qui Gon Jinn is a closet Sith as any deviation from the set in stone Jedi teachings is verboten. Then there the hypocrisy of choosing you destiny and predestination in the SW EU. Especially with the Skywalker and Solo families. As each succeeding generation is given the choice of "you will be a Jedi" and you don't wanna be a Jedi, FUCK choosing you destiny, you will a Jedi.

That is one of the reasons I like the old KOTOR comics so much, the Jedi order there wanted to vanquish evil at such costs that they had a vision and killed their own padawans, without realizing that they were the evil themselves. And the guy who was a failure of a jedi ended up bringing in good for the galaxy in his troublesome way. But in the end he never was a jedi, just a failed padawan.

And all this working as a spinoff to the big story of a prophecy dude being the great savior/villain of the kotor game itself. Even without playing the game, I could see the motions of game character actions interfering in the galaxy and the reflex of those actions on Zayne's group.

Those comics finally made me LOVE something out of SW for the first time.

 

[Ishtar]

You'd need a lot of personal headcanon and ductape to reconcile Vergere's Sith status, but hey, who am I to stop people.

Vergere, Lumiya and Caedus it should all be noted die for others. This is not how Sith usually operate.

Vergere dies for Jacen, ostensibly so he can fulfill his Sith destiny, Lumiya dies for Jacen-buying time for him(and taking the Jedi off his trail) and settling the score with Luke, and Jacen basically allows himself to be slain if it allows Allana and TK a chance to escape(as opposed to finishing Jaina off with a final force blast as he could have done).

The argument can really be made that none of them are "traditional" Sith in the sense they aren't motivated by the holy grail of immortality or general aggrandizement.

Lumiya's primary teaching to Jacen is that he has to sacrifice everything, family, friends, his life. For something else. What that was varied inconsistently(the writers couldn't agree what Jacen's motivations were-it varied from stopping the Dark Man, to ensuring Allana would rule the galaxy to saving Luke, to saving Allana from falling herself).

That is what he does, he gives everything, not so he has a shot at ruling the galaxy forever, but for someone else's future. In short, he's willing to prune all the weeds, even himself(to use Vergere's Traitor metaphor).

So I'd say yes can you reconcile Vergere as being a Sith, a Jedi, and a teacher first and foremost.

After all,

"Jacen Solo. Listen well. Everything I tell you is a lie. Every question I ask a trick, you will find no truth in me. Though you believe nothing else you may rest your faith on this."

Vergere is Jedi, Sith, Vong familiar, teacher and mentor.

Because all of these things are labels that do not represent the totality of who she is.

 

[Sneed F91]

Did some of you guys really sit through 7 episodes of pic related

 

[Mississippi Motorboater]

Vergere, Lumiya and Caedus it should all be noted die for others. This is not how Sith usually operate.

Vergere dies for Jacen, ostensibly so he can fulfill his Sith destiny, Lumiya dies for Jacen-buying time for him(and taking the Jedi off his trail) and settling the score with Luke, and Jacen basically allows himself to be slain if it allows Allana and TK a chance to escape(as opposed to finishing Jaina off with a final force blast as he could have done).

The argument can really be made that none of them are "traditional" Sith in the sense they aren't motivated by the holy grail of immortality or general aggrandizement.

Lumiya's primary teaching to Jacen is that he has to sacrifice everything, family, friends, his life. For something else. What that was varied inconsistently(the writers couldn't agree what Jacen's motivations were-it varied from stopping the Dark Man, to ensuring Allana would rule the galaxy to saving Luke, to saving Allana from falling herself).

That is what he does, he gives everything, not so he has a shot at ruling the galaxy forever, but for someone else's future. In short, he's willing to prune all the weeds, even himself(to use Vergere's Traitor metaphor).

So I'd say yes can you reconcile Vergere as being a Sith, a Jedi, and a teacher first and foremost.

After all,

"Jacen Solo. Listen well. Everything I tell you is a lie. Every question I ask a trick, you will find no truth in me. Though you believe nothing else you may rest your faith on this."

Vergere is Jedi, Sith, Vong familiar, teacher and mentor.

Because all of these things are labels that do not represent the totality of who she is.

That's just it, though. I'm not the one who has trouble reconciling Vergere as a Sith because, frankly, I found some of her actions in Traitor to be extremely sketchy and manipulative to begin with...particularly when it came to grooming Jacen while he was in a tortured and psychologically-broken state. That felt like unmistakably Sith behavior even as I was reading NJO for the first time---even Luke was portrayed as justifiably unsettled, and even resentful towards Vergere in Destiny's Way when he learns about her time with Jacen. So when LOTF rolled around, Lumiya announced to the world and the readers that Vergere was indeed a Sith Acolyte, my only response was to nod and say: "Everything finally makes sense."

Now, the reason I'm able to do that is because I'm not married to this "Gray Jedi" concept like so many people are. And in the case of characters like Vergere, Lumiya and Caedus, them simply being Sith doesn't make their characters any less nuanced or sophisticated. Because, as you noted, they are all very unconventional Sith, who embrace sacrifice, martyrdom, and the willingness to depart from the teachings of their predecessors to achieve their own ends.

Very few Sith characters have ever reached an endpoint like Jacen's--faced with a choice between Dark Side Revenge and using his last breath to save his daughter--and opted for the selfless path like he did. That's a drastic departure from most Sith in his position, and what I appreciate about his writing in LOTF.

And I think both he and the Lost Tribe characters that were introduced in FOTJ were resounding proof that even late in the EU's lifespan, there was still plenty of new and unconventional ways left to write the Sith as characters.

 

[starborn427614]

Did some of you guys really sit through 7 episodes of pic related

It wasn't terrible, but it was heavily flawed and desperately in need of an editor who understands proper pacing. Those flashbacks should've comprised no more than two episodes with the rest of the show being set in the present day.

 

[Midwit]

Did some of you guys really sit through 7 episodes of pic related

It was awful but I don't regret watching it, whereas I do somewhat regret watching The Bad Batch. My god that show was fucking boring.

 

[The handsome tard]

You know, a problem I have realised with Vader's redemption kind of mirrors one with another villain, the joker.

The question if Vader deserved to be "forgiven" and become a force ghost at the end and "Why Batman doesnt kill the joker already" are rooted into the same issue with both characters.

They have become far too murderous and commited far too many attrocities

Back in the OG Trilogy, we havent seen much of Vader's actions off screen, we know only what was told to us so that is easier to "forgive". What we dont see, its not as impactful than what we actually witness. Then the prequels came out and we saw EP 3 and this man murdered helpless children...it kind of gets worse when you realise he didnt even do it for something he actually believed in, it was mostly on the selfish hope that his wife could be saved from a vague cause of death.

One can make the argument that Anakin does pay for it by pretty much being Vader, which is an ungodly painful existence being in a suit that is meant to keep you alive while subtly still maintaining you in constant agony at all times. But during his time as Vader, he argurably did much much worse things. That goes for both canon and legends. I feel like the writers went through some serious flanderization of Vader in the expanded material by putting him on high stakes that he obviously will always make it through because of continuity. By the end, knowing all Vader did, you cant help the think him getting to become a force ghost at the end is a tad forced.

Its the same problem as the joker being sent to Arkham constantly because somehow its still believed he could be fixed...when he is so nutty that he actually makes people there insane and work for him instead.

They arent just villains anymore, they are mass murderers that are difficult to imagine any sort of realistic redemption to them (especially if you argue Vader didnt even redeem himself because it was the right thing but because he wanted to save his son, it was a good act fueled by a selfish desire like before).

I mostly blame the writers behind Vader always giving him massive kill numbers per story and yet he got to always walk away scot free even after his own death.

 

[Ishtar]

Vader isn’t “forgiven”.

The force is not a God. It doesn’t dispense judgement or forgiveness on sinners.

His Sith identity died and anakin Skywalker re emerges, and then he learns how to survive death through the process of becoming a force ghost.

 

[Midwit]

I mostly blame the writers behind Vader always giving him massive kill numbers per story and yet he got to always walk away scot free even after his own death.

I honestly think that none of the writers actually understand who or what Vader is, or rather the fact that by the time the OT rolls around he has pretty much completely gotten over himself and that stability is what makes him so powerful, he is a dignified yet villainous space-noble with a training in mysticism and, frankly, his behaviour is so far removed from how other Sith act that I'm hesitant to actually call him one. I don't believe that the Vader from the comics is the same character who would choke out one of his subordinates and then crack a dry joke afterwards, which is also why I think that the Vader's Castle in Rogue One is actually great whilst the hallway sequence is absolute dogshit.

The version of Vader these people have in their heads is little more than a combination of an even edgier Anakin and the super badass Darth Vader they used to imagine when playing with their action figures. He bears no resemblance to the actual Vader that we see in the films and instead is turned into this flanderised mess of a character who by all means should've been killed long ago but can't due to the OT still being canon and the idea that Vader is this unstoppable Force of nature when he really isn't. I guess this is inevitable when you have a character so marketable but with so little to actually do between films.

His Sith identity died and anakin Skywalker re emerges, and then he learns how to survive death through the process of becoming a force ghost.

Frankly I just consider Force Ghosting to be enlightenment straight up, it's not just some technique that any random chucklefuck can learn.

 

[Ishtar]

People do one of two things with Vader, they either make him into some cold hardass that is terminator level focused, or make him a broken wreck that a slight memory of Padme would bring him to tears.

He isn’t either of these things. He possesses an abiding hatred of himself, but more importantly believes he’s already damned. The only thing he has to hope for is maybe somehow he will be able to overthrow palpatine(good fucking luck doing that in legends where Palpatine was getting ever stronger), and so he satisfied himself with just bringing order to the galaxy, killing rebels, terrorists and Jedi holdouts.

He has sublimated his self loathing into his latter purpose. He has his issues under control, he focuses on the tasks at hand or what has been assigned to him, and he managed to even train a few apprentices of his own/carry out his own plots from time to time.

Vader is a broken man, but his indomitable will has allowed him to weld that brokenness deep inside himself, so that it doesn’t affect his performance.

I mean, there was one time his suit malfunctioned and his helmet got removed(he was trapped under a ship or landslide or something) and survived on the dark side of the force alone. As he told Palpatine “the dark side gave me all I needed”-the man isn’t going to curl into a ball when faced with a difficult situation or opponent but he is broken, he is depressed, he does hate himself, and genuinely doesn’t care about anything.

Just because he’s broken on the inside doesn’t mean he has to be a pansy, and just because he has a will of hardest steel doesn’t mean that he isn’t spiritually and emotionally shattered.

He’s both. That is what makes Vader, popular recognition ignored an interesting character.