War Invasion of Ukraine News Megathread - Thread is only for articles and discussion of articles, general discussion thread is still in Happenings.

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President Joe Biden on Tuesday said that the United States will impose sanctions “far beyond” the ones that the United States imposed in 2014 following the annexation of the Crimean peninsula.

“This is the beginning of a Russian invasion of Ukraine,” Biden said in a White House speech, signaling a shift in his administration’s position. “We will continue to escalate sanctions if Russia escalates,” he added.

Russian elites and their family members will also soon face sanctions, Biden said, adding that “Russia will pay an even steeper price” if Moscow decides to push forward into Ukraine. Two Russian banks and Russian sovereign debt will also be sanctioned, he said.

Also in his speech, Biden said he would send more U.S. troops to the Baltic states as a defensive measure to strengthen NATO’s position in the area.

Russia shares a border with Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania.

A day earlier, Russian President Vladimir Putin ordered troops to go into the separatist Donetsk and Lugansk regions in eastern Ukraine after a lengthy speech in which he recognized the two regions’ independence.

Western powers decried the move and began to slap sanctions on certain Russian individuals, while Germany announced it would halt plans to go ahead with the Russia-to-Germany Nord Stream 2 pipeline.

At home, Biden is facing bipartisan pressure to take more extensive actions against Russia following Putin’s decision. However, a recent poll showed that a majority of Americans believe that sending troops to Ukraine is a “bad idea,” and a slim minority believes it’s a good one.

All 27 European Union countries unanimously agreed on an initial list of sanctions targeting Russian authorities, said French Foreign Minister Jean-Yves Le Drian, and EU foreign affairs head Josep Borell claimed the package “will hurt Russia … a lot.”

Earlier Tuesday, Borell asserted that Russian troops have already entered the Donbas region, which comprises Donetsk and Lugansk, which are under the control of pro-Russia groups since 2014.

And on Tuesday, the Russian Parliament approved a Putin-back plan to use military force outside of Russia’s borders as Putin further said that Russia confirmed it would recognize the expanded borders of Lugansk and Donetsk.

“We recognized the states,” the Russian president said. “That means we recognized all of their fundamental documents, including the constitution, where it is written that their [borders] are the territories at the time the two regions were part of Ukraine.”

Speaking to reporters on Tuesday, Putin said that Ukraine is “not interested in peaceful solutions” and that “every day, they are amassing troops in the Donbas.”

Meanwhile, Ukraine President Volodymyr Zelensky on Tuesday morning again downplayed the prospect of a Russian invasion and proclaimed: “There will be no war.”

“There will not be an all-out war against Ukraine, and there will not be a broad escalation from Russia. If there is, then we will put Ukraine on a war footing,” he said in a televised address.

The White House began to signal that they would shift their own position on whether it’s the start of an invasion.

“We think this is, yes, the beginning of an invasion, Russia’s latest invasion into Ukraine,” said Jon Finer, the White House deputy national security adviser in public remarks. “An invasion is an invasion and that is what is underway.”

For weeks, Western governments have been claiming Moscow would invade its neighbor after Russia gathered some 150,000 troops along the countries’ borders. They alleged that the Kremlin would attempt to come up with a pretext to attack, while some officials on Monday said Putin’s speech recognizing the two regions was just that.

But Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin told reporters Tuesday that Russia’s “latest invasion” of Ukraine is threatening stability in the region, but he asserted that Putin can “still avoid a full blown, tragic war of choice.”

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That isn't what I said or did. Someone previously commented on how my posts itt were longwinded (were) and it's because if I don't autistically breakdown everything I say then you interpret it however you want. I'm not even going to reiterate what I said and meant by it; there's no point.

To you I am pro-Russian and anti-Ukrainian. That isn't going to change.
You are free to return to memers at the Happenings thread, if the bias concerns you that much.
 
Dmitriy Medvedev (former Russian PM and president, now the Chairman of United Russia) said that VKS are now tasked with destroying the Starlink constellation, because apparently, Starlink enabled the strike on Moskva.

Ahahabahababahagagagagaga
Damn Putin is doing Mishki dirty. It's almost like he's making him say the dumbest, most inflammatory Baghdad Bob level bullshit as a way to sully his personal brand overseas. After all, Medvedev is/was considered to be the most open minded, liberal, and western leaning person in the RF's high echelon. If Putin can make Mishki ruin his credibility overseas, it means he can't overthrow him.
 
Damn Putin is doing Mishki dirty. It's almost like he's making him say the dumbest, most inflammatory Baghdad Bob level bullshit as a way to sully his personal brand overseas. After all, Medvedev is/was considered to be the most open minded, liberal, and western leaning person in the RF's high echelon. If Putin can make Mishki ruin his credibility overseas, it means he can't overthrow him.
Well, while this particular thing ended up being a fake, Medvedev is used as a Zhirinovsky replacement for some time now.
 
Apparently URAL ran out of parts for tanks back at the end of March, meaning the Russians should really have been making every piece of armour count and not littering huge portions of the Ukranian Countryside with them.
I'm curious to see if the Russians will be desperate enough to refit early T-72s from storage with basic analog gunsights and send them in. From what I understand they have no domestic capability to build night vision, thermals or range finders and were buying from western Euro vendors.
 
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Does anyone know what the local time was when the Moskva was sunk?

Not that it should matter on a ship like that, I'm sure Russia can hot rack with the best of them, but was it 3 PM or 3 AM?
Why would it matter? The sailors on watch won't be sober regardless.
Apparently URAL ran out of parts for tanks back at the end of March, meaning the Russians should really have been making every piece of armour count and not littering huge portions of the Ukranian Countryside with them.
Well, that's just horrifying to think about. At least there's plenty of salvage they can cannibalize for replacements.
I'm curious to see if the Russians will be desperate enough to refit early T-72s from storage with basic analog gunsights and send them in. From what I understand they have no domestic capability to build night vision, thermals or range finders and were buying from western Euro vendors.
I believe we've already seen that happen. They've been deploying pre-ERA T-72 models to Ukraine to make up for losses, and someone (forget who exactly), posted up a photograph showing it. Only a matter of time until the T-54s show up now.

EDIT: The Finns are mobilizing their mechanized forces:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Damnthatsi...nish_tractors_amassing_on_the_russian_border/
 
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I'm curious to see if the Russians will be desperate enough to refit early T-72s from storage with basic analog gunsights and send them in. From what I understand they have no domestic capability to build night vision, thermals or range finders and were buying from western Euro vendors.

We've already seen A models along the north eastern Cherniv axis which became speculated as a supporting/wasting ukranian units by forcing them to defend areas.

Nobody was still quite expecting them to try and conduct warfare as if it was 1960 though by only gunning for cities instead of trying to capture strategic points.
 
I believe we've already seen that happen. They've been deploying pre-ERA T-72 models to Ukraine to make up for losses, and someone (forget who exactly), posted up a photograph showing it. Only a matter of time until the T-54s show up now.

We've already seen A models along the north eastern Cherniv axis which became speculated as a supporting/wasting ukranian units by forcing them to defend areas.

Nobody was still quite expecting them to try and conduct warfare as if it was 1960 though by only gunning for cities instead of trying to capture strategic points.
Interesting. I thought all the old T-72s and other long obsolete garbage we've been seeing was crap they were giving to the LPDR as ATGM fodder to carve a safe path for the real Russian military. These actions are pretty surreal. Reminds me of Wargame Airland battle where you can throw in tons of cheap equipment to stall your opponent mid game when you run out of good shit.
 
This is akin to who is the greatest nazi discussion. But Ukraine had no efforts to de-Russify anything, simply normalize being Ukrainian, loose the shame of speaking Ukrainian, be proud of its heritage. This is different from actively hunting Russian speakers (which in Ukraine there are a lot ... like Mariupol) It's logical that in France, all government institutions have to know French, but can ultimately speak whatever. You should not be a second grade citizen in your own country.

Yeah, I see a lot of hate right now. I see some monuments to Pushkin getting removed by locals. It's sad, it's emotional. That Russian mulatto poet, despite being an arrogant asshole did write down some mean verse.

Consider how many Russian schools there are in Ukraine or other satellite countries, despite that in some communities they are a minority group. And how many Ukrainian schools or other ethnic schools there are in Russia despite how many people were force resettled as far back as anyone can remember ... none.


The real issue is that Russian is a collective tag that stands for imperial way of thinking, that unifies slavs, non-slavs, basically any ethnic group into one nation. The traditions and culture of that nation simply put are asshole traditions of expansion and suppression of other cultures, i.e. absorption.

I have family members who are "russian" but in fact are one/same generation removed from three different ethnic groups/countries. At some point I don't want them to call themselves "russian" and call who they really are, i.e. their own ethnicity and not some imperial idea. Like I said many times before, the heart of Russia 300 years ago was called kingdom of Moscovia and all the people currently gathered in that place, all have ethnic roots elsewhere.

Sorry bro, the best I can do right now is to say, don't hate "russians" but hate the imperial idea of "russia" of absorbing your neighbors and being slave assholes of the world. Every Russian needs to find his own ethnic roots, his own ethnic history to be proud of, not the idea of dying for a tsar to conquer Caucus or Yakuts or whatever. Sit home, grow wheat, grow your family and be nice to your neighbors.


As far as russian hate in general, that shit has long roots and it always seem like it's Russia against the world from the moment Peter came up with that term. It's rooted in different culture of blind subservience, not questioning natural order of things, little value to life, collectivism ... all that shit may be OK to a lot of Asians, but the real objection is that Russians want to push it unto all its neighbors. Dear Russians, you are not special, live your fucking lives and pray to you KGB church and roam your lands, you got plenty of 'em. You build fucking St. Petes' right next to civilization "to cut a window into Europe" and then you bitch about NATO encroachment.


And the main thing I wanted to say to all russians: what will be remembered the most are not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends.

Its not only your friends who will be silent, silence of hundreds of milions is on the way.
 

Ukraine has asked G7 for $50 billion to cover budget deficit, says senior official

April 17 (Reuters) - Ukraine has asked G7 nations for $50 billion in financial support and is also considering issuing 0% coupon bonds to help it cover a war-linked budget deficit over the next six months, the president's economic adviser Oleh Ustenko said on Sunday.
Speaking on national television, Ustenko said these options were being actively discussed.
 
Does anyone know what the local time was when the Moskva was sunk?

Not that it should matter on a ship like that, I'm sure Russia can hot rack with the best of them, but was it 3 PM or 3 AM?

It was over night, but official time table and sequence of events is not clear, and I mean there is a difference between Russian, Turks and CIA versions.

everyone is on the same page though that this took place during a storm that are frequent this winter-spring, heavy seas, 13knots winds and heavy rain with low cloud cover that prevented normal sat imagery or search planes flow.

according to, from words of Lithuanian defense minister,
1:14am cruiser lists on it's side
half an hour later all electricity goes out
from 2am, Turk warship has evecuated 54 sailors
3am cruiser is sunk

Ukrainian MVD head says same, 54 saved:

Journos tried to verify this and got reply from Turks that no Turk warship took any part in the operation, i.e. 54 sailors saved is fiction

Recently there was a published video showing what RF claims the sailors off Moscow, but there is probably 100-150 sailors tops, location is hotly disputed as is surroundings (time) as tree have fully grown leaves. There is no sound to the video and sailors seem all to be in good spirits and laughing.

So far any relatives of sailors who were onboard are totally mum.

Just this morning one speaks out:

from earlier post:
Country like Ukraine should not exist, it's Russian soil inhabited by people who forgot that they are Russian

1650209235717.png


his most recent post:
My son, Shkrebets Egor Dmitrievich, was conscripted into service July 2ns, 2021. ... He as posted to cruiser Moscow as cook ...
Night 13.04 to 14.04, a tragedy took place ... RF ministry of defense says that all crew was evac-ed
This is a lie!
A bold faced lie!
My son is a conscript and I was told that his name is not on the rolls of dead. He is listed as MIA.
A conscript who should not have taken part in combat is missing in action! They are refusing to give me any details ...
Please spread this post so these pieces of shit would not hide this tragedy ...
I will dedicate the rest of my life for the truth to come out.
The person, from whom a son was taken through this vile method, is not afraid of anything! ...

1650209337142.png
 
It was over night, but official time table and sequence of events is not clear, and I mean there is a difference between Russian, Turks and CIA versions.

everyone is on the same page though that this took place during a storm that are frequent this winter-spring, heavy seas, 13knots winds and heavy rain with low cloud cover that prevented normal sat imagery or search planes flow.

according to, from words of Lithuanian defense minister,
1:14am cruiser lists on it's side
half an hour later all electricity goes out
from 2am, Turk warship has evecuated 54 sailors
3am cruiser is sunk

Ukrainian MVD head says same, 54 saved:

Journos tried to verify this and got reply from Turks that no Turk warship took any part in the operation, i.e. 54 sailors saved is fiction

Recently there was a published video showing what RF claims the sailors off Moscow, but there is probably 100-150 sailors tops, location is hotly disputed as is surroundings (time) as tree have fully grown leaves. There is no sound to the video and sailors seem all to be in good spirits and laughing.

So far any relatives of sailors who were onboard are totally mum.

Just this morning one speaks out:

from earlier post:


View attachment 3187931

his most recent post:


View attachment 3187932
Some people have already started to send messages to the father about his dead son and mock him for his death and apparent pro-Russian views.

Corpsebaggers are as vile as Z-Russians, do not change my mind.
 
It was over night, but official time table and sequence of events is not clear, and I mean there is a difference between Russian, Turks and CIA versions.

everyone is on the same page though that this took place during a storm that are frequent this winter-spring, heavy seas, 13knots winds and heavy rain with low cloud cover that prevented normal sat imagery or search planes flow.

according to, from words of Lithuanian defense minister,
1:14am cruiser lists on it's side
half an hour later all electricity goes out
from 2am, Turk warship has evecuated 54 sailors
3am cruiser is sunk

Ukrainian MVD head says same, 54 saved:

Journos tried to verify this and got reply from Turks that no Turk warship took any part in the operation, i.e. 54 sailors saved is fiction

Recently there was a published video showing what RF claims the sailors off Moscow, but there is probably 100-150 sailors tops, location is hotly disputed as is surroundings (time) as tree have fully grown leaves. There is no sound to the video and sailors seem all to be in good spirits and laughing.

So far any relatives of sailors who were onboard are totally mum.

Just this morning one speaks out:

from earlier post:


View attachment 3187931

his most recent post:


View attachment 3187932
Hopefully he’ll get the truth sometime. Hopefully the story can be verified too.
 
Interesting. I thought all the old T-72s and other long obsolete garbage we've been seeing was crap they were giving to the LPDR as ATGM fodder to carve a safe path for the real Russian military. These actions are pretty surreal. Reminds me of Wargame Airland battle where you can throw in tons of cheap equipment to stall your opponent mid game when you run out of good shit.

What's been surreal is this bizarre notion the Russians had all these hyper-elite murderkill professionals ready and waiting. 20 seconds googling shows they began abandoning the development of the Arata, going from hundreds of tanks to a hundred to about 20 within the space of a few years. They even began phasing out the 90s and 80s in favour of shoving shit onto the T-72s because it apparently worked for the Ukranians with even older tanks.

These people keep fucking turbo-prop bombers in the air for fucks sake, despite making hundreds of the TU-22s they retired the damn lot, only putting one back into service briefly for a "last hurrah" and to make the RAF moderately nervous for ten whopping minutes as it arrived near british airspace quicker than their lethargic vodka fueled turboprops normally do.

They didn't decline somewhat gracefully like the British who then continued to maintain just enough power to go twat some uppity third world nation like the Argentines, they collapsed. Their birthrates collapsed. Their economy collapsed and managed to lose one war against some midly angry kebabs in the arse end of nowhere of the Russian Empire that pissed them off so much they flattened Grozny like a child kicking over building blocks.

They're doing it again now because the Ukranians were on their way towards being considered european more than "Knockoff Russians" and were developing accordingly despite the corruption. Russians wanted their empire back and felt picking on the last nation that wouldn't have a shitload of angry poles and americans come along ready to crack skulls was the way to go.

On top of that, even without the pouring in of western weapons systems, the Ukranians were on the way to having the resources to retake Donbass and other areas lost to those definitely independant peoples and not with the Monke Tsars hand deep in their guts. Ukranian military figures were still expected to hit 400,000+ this year and has only been sped up thanks to the war effort.

This is why the Russians have targetted as many factories and other spaces where the Ukranians could supply themselves. Even before the war the Ukranian and Russian armies were almost 1:1 in terms of personnel and the Ukranians had significantly smaller territory to defend then their next door neighbours.
 
What's been surreal is this bizarre notion the Russians had all these hyper-elite murderkill professionals ready and waiting. 20 seconds googling shows they began abandoning the development of the Arata, going from hundreds of tanks to a hundred to about 20 within the space of a few years. They even began phasing out the 90s and 80s in favour of shoving shit onto the T-72s because it apparently worked for the Ukranians with even older tanks.

These people keep fucking turbo-prop bombers in the air for fucks sake, despite making hundreds of the TU-22s they retired the damn lot, only putting one back into service briefly for a "last hurrah" and to make the RAF moderately nervous for ten whopping minutes as it arrived near british airspace quicker than their lethargic vodka fueled turboprops normally do.

They didn't decline somewhat gracefully like the British who then continued to maintain just enough power to go twat some uppity third world nation like the Argentines, they collapsed. Their birthrates collapsed. Their economy collapsed and managed to lose one war against some midly angry kebabs in the arse end of nowhere of the Russian Empire that pissed them off so much they flattened Grozny like a child kicking over building blocks.

They're doing it again now because the Ukranians were on their way towards being considered european more than "Knockoff Russians" and were developing accordingly despite the corruption. Russians wanted their empire back and felt picking on the last nation that wouldn't have a shitload of angry poles and americans come along ready to crack skulls was the way to go.

On top of that, even without the pouring in of western weapons systems, the Ukranians were on the way to having the resources to retake Donbass and other areas lost to those definitely independant peoples and not with the Monke Tsars hand deep in their guts. Ukranian military figures were still expected to hit 400,000+ this year and has only been sped up thanks to the war effort.

This is why the Russians have targetted as many factories and other spaces where the Ukranians could supply themselves. Even before the war the Ukranian and Russian armies were almost 1:1 in terms of personnel and the Ukranians had significantly smaller territory to defend then their next door neighbours.
The Tu-22 Blinder (not the Tu-22M Backfire which is a very different plane) is a nightmare to pilot and had a long list of accidents and crashes. The Tu-95 is a cheaper aircraft to fly, and safer to take off and land with. It’s why they keep it around, it’s job is to either do ASW work or sling cruise missiles, not go into contested airspace. Speed isn’t the big factor in either role.
 
What's been surreal is this bizarre notion the Russians had all these hyper-elite murderkill professionals ready and waiting. 20 seconds googling shows they began abandoning the development of the Arata, going from hundreds of tanks to a hundred to about 20 within the space of a few years. They even began phasing out the 90s and 80s in favour of shoving shit onto the T-72s because it apparently worked for the Ukranians with even older tanks.
You can't create elite armies when 90% of your military runs on corruption and butt-rape. The most you'll get is a horde of gopniks that know how to commit war crimes, but little else.

They didn't decline somewhat gracefully like the British who then continued to maintain just enough power to go twat some uppity third world nation like the Argentines, they collapsed. Their birthrates collapsed. Their economy collapsed and managed to lose one war against some midly angry kebabs in the arse end of nowhere of the Russian Empire that pissed them off so much they flattened Grozny like a child kicking over building blocks.
As unhealthy as the lifestyles of modern western Europeans are, they don't have casual abortions and vodka up the ass which kills birthrates faster than free condoms being given out at stores. Combine that with runaway corruption and a very bad brain drain due to monopolies making economic development for the lower classes unfeasible, and you've got a recipe for a bureaucratic and economic nightmare.

They're doing it again now because the Ukranians were on their way towards being considered european more than "Knockoff Russians" and were developing accordingly despite the corruption. Russians wanted their empire back and felt picking on the last nation that wouldn't have a shitload of angry poles and americans come along ready to crack skulls was the way to go.
Building empires takes years of developing healthy societies that can shoulder the burden of expansion in both blood and gold. Russia has neither; it has a dying populace and an economy the size of New York State, despite having a landmass several times as big as the USA and God knows how much natural resources that can be economically developed.

On top of that, even without the pouring in of western weapons systems, the Ukranians were on the way to having the resources to retake Donbass and other areas lost to those definitely independant peoples and not with the Monke Tsars hand deep in their guts. Ukranian military figures were still expected to hit 400,000+ this year and has only been sped up thanks to the war effort.

This is why the Russians have targetted as many factories and other spaces where the Ukranians could supply themselves. Even before the war the Ukranian and Russian armies were almost 1:1 in terms of personnel and the Ukranians had significantly smaller territory to defend then their next door neighbours.
To add to that, any advantage the Russians gained by targeting Ukrainian factories and supply points got nullified by NATO shipping weapons by the truckload to the Ukrainians. Now the whole world is Ukraine's arms factory, and the military-industrial complex gets good business and free test grounds for their toys, being used against the Russians. Everything that the West needed to happen came to pass, thanks to Putin having as much foresight as Leeroy Jenkins on crystal meth.
 
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It was over night, but official time table and sequence of events is not clear, and I mean there is a difference between Russian, Turks and CIA versions.

everyone is on the same page though that this took place during a storm that are frequent this winter-spring, heavy seas, 13knots winds and heavy rain with low cloud cover that prevented normal sat imagery or search planes flow.

according to, from words of Lithuanian defense minister,
1:14am cruiser lists on it's side
half an hour later all electricity goes out
from 2am, Turk warship has evecuated 54 sailors
3am cruiser is sunk

Ukrainian MVD head says same, 54 saved:

Journos tried to verify this and got reply from Turks that no Turk warship took any part in the operation, i.e. 54 sailors saved is fiction

Recently there was a published video showing what RF claims the sailors off Moscow, but there is probably 100-150 sailors tops, location is hotly disputed as is surroundings (time) as tree have fully grown leaves. There is no sound to the video and sailors seem all to be in good spirits and laughing.

So far any relatives of sailors who were onboard are totally mum.

Just this morning one speaks out:

from earlier post:


View attachment 3187931

his most recent post:


View attachment 3187932
I've seen some news agencies say that it was a Greek Ship, not a Turkish one that rescued 54. It still seems strange that there is a consistant story of 54 rescued by a third party vessel, but everyone is unclear on who made the rescue and where they might be if it had been made?

Can you imagine the degree of incompetance on display if the ship did in fact go down with most or all hands? Especially after Putin said it was evacuated and under tow? I think this conscript cooks Dad is just the begining. It was the outraged parents that forced the truth to come out over the Kursk.
 
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