I think this is a good example of misunderstanding "Social Justice Warrior" to mean "everybody to the left of a certain point". Corbyn is a leftist, probably an extremist leftist to a lot of people, but he is not in any way a social justice warrior, nor is he particularly receptive to SJW ideas. Corbyn's big policy ideas are neutralism, disarmament and economic nationalisation - while SJWs might agree with them in abstract, they are very far from the kind of policy focuses SJWs talk about (although really, SJWs don't ever talk about policy in any concerted way).
I think this is a good example of misunderstanding "Social Justice Warrior" to mean "everybody to the left of a certain point". Corbyn is a leftist, probably an extremist leftist to a lot of people, but he is not in any way a social justice warrior, nor is he particularly receptive to SJW ideas. Corbyn's big policy ideas are neutralism, disarmament and economic nationalisation - while SJWs might agree with them in abstract, they are very far from the kind of policy focuses SJWs talk about (although really, SJWs don't ever talk about policy in any concerted way).
I don't know, his (and McDonnel's) views of 'it's only alright if the poor oppressed minorities do it' (look at their views on the IRA for godssakes!) as well as Corbyn's idea of women only train carriages scream SJW to me.
In my experience, the people I've known that I would call SJWs have all been staunchly anti-pedo more than anything else. In general, they're the kind of moralists who want to police other people's sexual turn-ons, and you have to admit pedophilia lies at the bottom of the slope of sexual deviancy. If there really is an over-representation of pedophiles in online social justice activism, I'd chalk it up to troll-shielding.
If you want to see what a SJW with even a modicum of power looks like take a gander at Jeremy Corbin, the guys prity much the prototype of SJW political theory and frankly makes me embarrassed to consider myself a labour supporter.
In my experience, the people I've known that I would call SJWs have all been staunchly anti-pedo more than anything else. In general, they're the kind of moralists who want to police other people's sexual turn-ons, and you have to admit pedophilia lies at the bottom of the slope of sexual deviancy. If there really is an over-representation of pedophiles in online social justice activism, I'd chalk it up to troll-shielding.
Yeah but I haven't seen any SJW type folk talk up against the likes of Sarah Nyberg, if SJWs as a group are anti pedo they seem to be hesitant about publicly decrying it.
Yeah but I haven't seen any SJW type folk talk up against the likes of Sarah Nyberg, if SJWs as a group are anti pedo they seem to be hesitant about publicly decrying it.
I think they're torn by the fact that first off, it's a crime often committed by those evil straight white men they hate so much, so they should hate it, but then an absurd number of those straight white men have lately started trannyshielding to get away with it, and the moment you say you're a tranny you're never guilty of anything.
If we are trying to understand the alignment between pedophilia and whatever the hell we are pretending an "SJW" is supposed to be, then l would like to see where it is that pedophilia is a.) accepted in mainstream "SJW" (something that is poorly defined at this point and is essentially a catch-all for tumblr addicts and girls who don't shave their legs) b.) that there is a significant symbiotic relationship between the "SJW" and pedophile communities, and c. that there is some exclusivity to the relationship where the tenets of pedophilia and "SJW"s are directly aligned. Most people that are pointed at and labeled "SJW" are more concerned about human rights violations and that sort of thing, and anything drawing parallels between "SJW"s and pedophiles is outliers. I read the OP and I have no idea why this thread is labeled theorycraft. I see no numbers, stats, empirical evidence backing up a single thing, just a bunch of thin dotted lines and a picture of some idiot with his idiot girlfriend.
If this is a troll thread then okay, lol EssJayDubyas are all pedos, but I have to be honest, this reads like red scare type stuff and for all the kvetching done about how the "SJW menace" exists in an echo chamber this discussion reads like the product of being deeply immersed in such an environment. Any "SJW" who flapped their wings about pedophilia being acceptable behavior would be rejected by the majority of their brothers and sisters. To not think beyond the fact that pedophilia is an act where a child is violated and typically brutalized, and to conclude that because pedophilia is rejected by society pedos would be accepted by "SJW"s is pretty pedantic in my opinion. Just stop.
If we are trying to understand the alignment between pedophilia and whatever the hell we are pretending an "SJW" is supposed to be, then l would like to see where it is that pedophilia is a.) accepted in mainstream "SJW" (something that is poorly defined at this point and is essentially a catch-all for tumblr addicts and girls who don't shave their legs) b.) that there is a significant symbiotic relationship between the "SJW" and pedophile communities, and c. that there is some exclusivity to the relationship where the tenets of pedophilia and "SJW"s are directly aligned. Most people that are pointed at and labeled "SJW" are more concerned about human rights violations and that sort of thing, and anything drawing parallels between "SJW"s and pedophiles is outliers. I read the OP and I have no idea why this thread is labeled theorycraft. I see no numbers, stats, empirical evidence backing up a single thing, just a bunch of thin dotted lines and a picture of some idiot with his idiot girlfriend.
If this is a troll thread then okay, lol EssJayDubyas are all pedos, but I have to be honest, this reads like red scare type stuff and for all the kvetching done about how the "SJW menace" exists in an echo chamber this discussion reads like the product of being deeply immersed in such an environment. Any "SJW" who flapped their wings about pedophilia being acceptable behavior would be rejected by the majority of their brothers and sisters. To not think beyond the fact that pedophilia is an act where a child is violated and typically brutalized, and to conclude that because pedophilia is rejected by society pedos would be accepted by "SJW"s is pretty pedantic in my opinion. Just stop.
Naturally 'sjws' are outliers- I thought the term was just Internet slang for far left extremists. Several posts also acknowledged that the same thing occurs on the far right.
Naturally 'sjws' are outliers- I thought the term was just Internet slang for far left extremists. Several posts also acknowledged that the same thing occurs on the far right.
It's more so that both the extreme right and left are defined by how collectivist and controlling both are. Neither will acknowledge the muck in their ranks because to them politics is a game and they can't let the other "team" see any weakness so they round the wagons and deny. Both are collectives of control freaks and cheerleaders.
These people should never get anywhere close to politics they see it as a power grabbing game instead of something that is forcibly going to change how people live if they get their way. When ever you make a new law or policy it's pretty much pointing a new gun to everyone's head especially if it's a radical one like both sides are vying for because the state can only enforce with threats of what they can do to you.
No one is saying all of them do it. It's just it's been an odd thing people have noticed some will go out of their way to defend them as well as the possibility of pedophilia becoming a new thing to champion though I imagine it would be a really special fringe to try it.
Naturally 'sjws' are outliers- I thought the term was just Internet slang for far left extremists. Several posts also acknowledged that the same thing occurs on the far right.
No one is saying all of them do it. It's just it's been an odd thing people have noticed some will go out of their way to defend them as well as the possibility of pedophilia becoming a new thing to champion though I imagine it would be a really special fringe to try it.
The OP did. You are aware this is a thread where the OP specifically linked pedophilia to SJWs right? Not that there are some in the community, but he was attempting to draw a direct link between SJWs and pedophilia and identify the phenomenon as a theory backed up by empirical evidence.
I will contend that any "odd thing" you notice in people championing pedophilia is not something that I have seen as being a part of what people loosely call "SJW"s. I will give you guys some help. Go find a bit of research where "SJW"s were found to have a significantly higher level of support for pedophiles than the population at large. Find some research where there was a correlation between being an "SJW" and support for pedophilia. Until then, all this looks like wheel spinning where accuracy takes a backseat to length.
The OP did. You are aware this is a thread where the OP specifically linked pedophilia to SJWs right? Not that there are some in the community, but he was attempting to draw a direct link between SJWs and pedophilia and identify the phenomenon as a theory backed up by empirical evidence.
I will contend that any "odd thing" you notice in people championing pedophilia is not something that I have seen as being a part of what people loosely call "SJW"s. I will give you guys some help. Go find a bit of research where "SJW"s were found to have a significantly higher level of support for pedophiles than the population at large. Find some research where there was a correlation between being an "SJW" and support for pedophilia. Until then, all this looks like wheel spinning where accuracy takes a backseat to length.
I didn't interpret it that way. When most people say social justice warriors they are more so talking about the extreme progressive ideology than the actual people. No one here is saying that yes 100% of Socjust is pro pedo it's just something we've noticed is being done by some people who would identify with Socjust.
I didn't interpret it that way. When most people say social justice warriors they are more so talking about the extreme progressive ideology than the actual people. No one here is saying that yes 100% of Socjust is pro pedo it's just something we've noticed is being done by some people who would identify with Socjust.
You are saying that there is a statistically significant difference in pedophile acceptance between people who ascribe to an "extreme progressive ideology" and the population as a whole. If so, where are the numbers that back this up? I can't find them.
You are saying that there is a statistically significant difference in pedophile acceptance between people who ascribe to an "extreme progressive ideology" and the population as a whole. If so, where are the numbers that back this up? I can't find them.
Yes let me go out and gather all the internet and test this out. You're taking this speculation kind of personal. The point I'm making is like I said it is recent events relating to pedophilia that has happened a couple of times and Socjust is what ties these events together.
Yes let me go out and gather all the internet and test this out. You're taking this speculation kind of personal.
How am I taking it personal? By asking for precision in the development of a theoretical link between pedophilia and "SJW"s?
You can't imply that you have some statistical findings that support these claims and then give nothing but a wall of text of pop culture psych and soc understandings of how phenomenon work. That doesn't work, but that's what the OP did before launching into whatever you want to call the spoilered text in the OP.
The point I'm making is like I said it is recent events relating to pedophilia that has happened a couple of times and Socjust is what ties these events together.
So I in turn ask if there is a statistically significant difference in pedophile acceptance between people who ascribe to an "extreme progressive ideology" and the population as a whole. If there is not, then these few anecdotal stories are outlying events and are not empirical evidence that would support a theoretical link between pedophilia and the "SJW" community.
I didn't interpret it that way. When most people say social justice warriors they are more so talking about the extreme progressive ideology than the actual people. No one here is saying that yes 100% of Socjust is pro pedo it's just something we've noticed is being done by some people who would identify with Socjust.
I think that's a trend that's not found in evidence.
Like the Nyberg thing, for example, is a big reason why I find the OP unpersuasive. I would say there's a big difference between explicitly supporting child molestation (or consuming child pornography or things like that) and merely denying that someone engaged in those behaviors. They're both shitty for big reasons, but the former is very alarming, while the latter is boring and commonplace.
I haven't really seen any prominent people on twitter support Nyberg in a way that really shocks me*. It's all stuff like "oh, pfft, we know those are lies/photoshops/blah blah blah". I mean, claiming the case against Nyberg is all faked is a really retarded claim, but only if you actually bother to look into the evidence carefully. The mainstream defenses of Nyberg just seem like very textbook "our guys didn't do anything wrong" stuff.
* Except that guy who tweeted the picture of his young daughter to Nyberg. That definitely shocked me.
You can't imply that you have some statistical findings that support these claims and then give nothing but a wall of text of pop culture psych and soc understandings of how phenomenon work. That doesn't work, but that's what the OP did before launching into whatever you want to call the spoilered text in the OP.
So I in turn ask if there is a statistically significant difference in pedophile acceptance between people who ascribe to an "extreme progressive ideology" and the population as a whole. If there is not, then these few anecdotal stories are outlying events and are not empirical evidence that would support a theoretical link between pedophilia and the "SJW" community.
I, for one, can appreciate a call for citations, but this isn't a situation where we can provide one.
Nobody here is going "all Social Justice Warriors defend pedophilia" or anything of that nature; it's an attempt to understand a simple observable - specifically, why Pedophilia Defense has recently apparently been forcibly added to the platform, irrespective of the wishes of all others involved. I'm pretty sure that the bulk of SJWs, even the most die-hard ones, are not cool with pedophiles, but we've started to see this behavior sort of directly inserted, and, curiously, having some small level of support to back it up. We don't have numbers here because this just started. There are no numbers to cite yet, just observables in the wild and attempts to extrapolate what they mean.
The thread thus is an attempt to discuss why this happened, how, and theorize what exactly led to this.
Let's briefly surmise what we know so far, however, solely for the sake of completeness:
1. Tumblr has been rumored to house a veritable Pedophile infestation, but this has thus far not been substantiated in any way, shape, or form. Tumblristas as a whole seem to hate Pedos as much as everyone else, even in the SJW community. Analysis: Tumblr is, curiously, not involved in this.
2. Reddit has an active and ongoing problem with pedophiles. This one's confirmed several times over, to the point where Gawker has extensively covered it. What we know about this particular situation is that several people have been banned by mods for outing known pedophiles and moderators tolerating abuses by certain users. Analysis: Reddit seems to have some level of this issue.
3.Twitter is legendary for its admins and mods tolerating Pedophiles and blocking attempts to out or hold them accountable. In addition to several people in Twitter's Safety and Admin department being either direct friends of certain users who are confirmed pedophiles. At least one member of Twitter's safety department is a convicted sex offender. During the Nyberg debacle, multiple users wound up with their accounts locked for talking about Sarah Nyberg being a pedophile, and Twitter outright locked down the #SarahNybergIsAPedophile hashtag. Despite hundreds of people tweeting it, a search will turn up only a handful of tweets. Analysis: Twitter seems to also have this issue, and arguably deeper than Reddit.
4. Anti-Gamergate seems to be one of the only unifying points amongst pedophile defenders from categories 2 and 3. Make no mistake, these people are not a majority, but they are directly involved with a number of main "line" Antis that people take seriously. Everyone from Randwhale to Kluwe to Bombchu to Brianna Wu lined up to defend Nyberg, actively trying to get evidence of her misdeeds taken down, and the numerous disturbing links to pedophile communities are all well-known and chronicled much better in the various threads we have. Probably best known was Izzy Galvez's link to several friends of his involved in VirPed.org, the so-called "Virtuous Pedophile" community, which one lone Kiwi descended into and discovered was not exactly Virtuous at all. There's other examples as well, such as Valis99, a convicted sex offender that was Feminist Frequency's Twitch mod, and Hannibal The Victor, a notoriously aggressive Anti-GGer who later turned out to hve sexually assaulted a minor. Analysis: For reasons uncertain, Anti-GG has a surprising number of confirmed (and indeed, convicted) pedophiles and sex offenders. Many of these seem to be tied to either Reddit, Twitter, or both, but the unifying trait is that as Anti-GGers they're waist-deep in victim culture and Social Justice. We're not sure why this is the case, but it is, and we're trying to figure out why.
5. Salon and several other leftist publications have gotten increasingly more willing to outright defend or even attempt to normalize pedophilia as a sexual identity issue. Several other users here have covered it in far more detail, but the TL;DR is that they've essentially declared that Pedophiles aren't inherently dangerous - even as one of Salon's most infamous articles has its writer trying to defend someone who was caught by police trying to meet with a child. Analysis: There is a clear and present attempt to normalize Pedophilia being taken by several Neoprogressive outlets. Salon is merely the loudest and most obvious; there's more of it on there at Social Networking.
What we can conclude from these is that: 1. There is an attempt to normalize Pedophilia as a sexual issue akin to gay and transgendered rights.
Like many (such as Harmful Opinions) noted, this seems to be more of a foot-in-the-door sales pitch. It's also one we saw extensively from NAMBLA.
2. A centerpiece of this attempt seems to be Pedophiles using personal connections to posit such beliefs.
Whether it's Sarah Nyberg being protected by Twitter staff and by her fellow Anti-GGers (to the point of them trying to bury evidence against Nyberg), to Salon during the Todd Nickerson debacle, to the accusations against Reddit, key amongst all of these is abuse of authority to protect Pedophiles whilst at the same time trying to frame Pedophiles as an oppressed class.
3. Social Justice seems to be the vector these incidents seem to be using.
We don't know for certain why this is now a thing, but we can definitely see that this is the case. The biggest pushes for this are coming from outlets with a long history of Social Justice, and their goal seems to be to push for Pedophilia to be considered a protected class in the same vein as sexual orientation and gender identity.
4. This does not seem to have been a willing exchange, no matter what these people say.
Again, we can't say why this is, but we can see that this may very well be a case where Social Justice got dragged along for the ride with groups outright using its own means and methods. I outlined this more in the initial posts, but a common SocJus sobriquet is that someone who believes in Social Justice, even if they are a terrible person, is inherently more moral than someone who does not. This belief structure more than likely is the reason that this bizarre and oddly fascinating series of occurrences has manifested in this fashion. Given that Tumblr SJWs actively go after suspected Pedophiles (often outing them in call-out blogs), this may very well be a case where Pedophilia decided that Social Justice was its ally, whether Social Justice wanted it or not. I know from the GG incident that the Nyberg incident red-pilled (to use a colloquialism of the chans) a lot of people and led to several SJWs abandoning Anti-GG as a whole.
Deeper analysis and more data is most-certainly needed, and we're going to need a lot more information. What are your thoughts?
That your conclusions are not rooted in any evidence, further that there really is no evidence, just a complex mish-mash of conjecture and a dearth of evidence. I mean here, I will just remove all the conjecture and please tell me if I am being unfair. I spoilered everything not backed up by fact.
I, for one, can appreciate a call for citations, but this isn't a situation where we can provide one.
Nobody here is going "all Social Justice Warriors defend pedophilia" or anything of that nature; it's an attempt to understand a simple observable - specifically, why Pedophilia Defense has recently apparently been forcibly added to the platform, irrespective of the wishes of all others involved. I'm pretty sure that the bulk of SJWs, even the most die-hard ones, are not cool with pedophiles, but we've started to see this behavior sort of directly inserted, and, curiously, having some small level of support to back it up. We don't have numbers here because this just started. There are no numbers to cite yet, just observables in the wild and attempts to extrapolate what they mean.
The thread thus is an attempt to discuss why this happened, how, and theorize what exactly led to this.
Do you have emails from SJW leadership where pedophile values are espoused to be valuable to the SJW movement? Any communications of leadership down? Please share it.
Let's briefly surmise what we know so far, however, solely for the sake of completeness:
1. Tumblr has been rumored to house a veritable Pedophile infestation, but this has thus far not been substantiated in any way, shape, or form. Tumblristas as a whole seem to hate Pedos as much as everyone else, even in the SJW community. Analysis: Tumblr is, curiously, not involved in this.
2. Reddit has an active and ongoing problem with pedophiles. This one's confirmed several times over, to the point where Gawker has extensively covered it. What we know about this particular situation is that several people have been banned by mods for outing known pedophiles and moderators tolerating abuses by certain users. Analysis: Reddit seems to have some level of this issue.
3.Twitter is legendary for its admins and mods tolerating Pedophiles and blocking attempts to out or hold them accountable. In addition to several people in Twitter's Safety and Admin department being either direct friends of certain users who are confirmed pedophiles. At least one member of Twitter's safety department is a convicted sex offender. During the Nyberg debacle, multiple users wound up with their accounts locked for talking about Sarah Nyberg being a pedophile, and Twitter outright locked down the #SarahNybergIsAPedophile hashtag. Despite hundreds of people tweeting it, a search will turn up only a handful of tweets. Analysis: Twitter seems to also have this issue, and arguably deeper than Reddit.
4. Anti-Gamergate seems to be one of the only unifying points amongst pedophile defenders from categories 2 and 3. Make no mistake, these people are not a majority, but they are directly involved with a number of main "line" Antis that people take seriously. Everyone from Randwhale to Kluwe to Bombchu to Brianna Wu lined up to defend Nyberg, actively trying to get evidence of her misdeeds taken down, and the numerous disturbing links to pedophile communities are all well-known and chronicled much better in the various threads we have. Probably best known was Izzy Galvez's link to several friends of his involved in VirPed.org, the so-called "Virtuous Pedophile" community, which one lone Kiwi descended into and discovered was not exactly Virtuous at all. There's other examples as well, such as Valis99, a convicted sex offender that was Feminist Frequency's Twitch mod, and Hannibal The Victor, a notoriously aggressive Anti-GGer who later turned out to hve sexually assaulted a minor. Analysis: For reasons uncertain, Anti-GG has a surprising number of confirmed (and indeed, convicted) pedophiles and sex offenders. Many of these seem to be tied to either Reddit, Twitter, or both, but the unifying trait is that as Anti-GGers they're waist-deep in victim culture and Social Justice. We're not sure why this is the case, but it is, and we're trying to figure out why.
5. Salon and several other leftist publications have gotten increasingly more willing to outright defend or even attempt to normalize pedophilia as a sexual identity issue. Several other users here have covered it in far more detail, but the TL;DR is that they've essentially declared that Pedophiles aren't inherently dangerous - even as one of Salon's most infamous articles has its writer trying to defend someone who was caught by police trying to meet with a child. Analysis: There is a clear and present attempt to normalize Pedophilia being taken by several Neoprogressive outlets. Salon is merely the loudest and most obvious; there's more of it on there at Social Networking.
What we can conclude from these is that:
1. There is an attempt to normalize Pedophilia as a sexual issue akin to gay and transgendered rights.
Like many (such as Harmful Opinions) noted, this seems to be more of a foot-in-the-door sales pitch. It's also one we saw extensively from NAMBLA.
2. A centerpiece of this attempt seems to be Pedophiles using personal connections to posit such beliefs.
Whether it's Sarah Nyberg being protected by Twitter staff and by her fellow Anti-GGers (to the point of them trying to bury evidence against Nyberg), to Salon during the Todd Nickerson debacle, to the accusations against Reddit, key amongst all of these is abuse of authority to protect Pedophiles whilst at the same time trying to frame Pedophiles as an oppressed class.
3. Social Justice seems to be the vector these incidents seem to be using.
We don't know for certain why this is now a thing, but we can definitely see that this is the case. The biggest pushes for this are coming from outlets with a long history of Social Justice, and their goal seems to be to push for Pedophilia to be considered a protected class in the same vein as sexual orientation and gender identity.
4. This does not seem to have been a willing exchange, no matter what these people say.
Again, we can't say why this is, but we can see that this may very well be a case where Social Justice got dragged along for the ride with groups outright using its own means and methods. I outlined this more in the initial posts, but a common SocJus sobriquet is that someone who believes in Social Justice, even if they are a terrible person, is inherently more moral than someone who does not. This belief structure more than likely is the reason that this bizarre and oddly fascinating series of occurrences has manifested in this fashion. Given that Tumblr SJWs actively go after suspected Pedophiles (often outing them in call-out blogs), this may very well be a case where Pedophilia decided that Social Justice was its ally, whether Social Justice wanted it or not. I know from the GG incident that the Nyberg incident red-pilled (to use a colloquialism of the chans) a lot of people and led to several SJWs abandoning Anti-GG as a whole.
Deeper analysis and more data is most-certainly needed, and we're going to need a lot more information. What are your thoughts?
So I in turn ask if there is a statistically significant difference in pedophile acceptance between people who ascribe to an "extreme progressive ideology" and the population as a whole. If there is not, then these few anecdotal stories are outlying events and are not empirical evidence that would support a theoretical link between pedophilia and the "SJW" community.
If I say that the Catholic Church has in the past defended pedophile priests, demanding proof that all priests are child molesters or that priests are even more likely to be child molesters is ridiculous, since it isn't even what is claimed.
All I need to prove to say that SJWs have defended pedophiles is to point to Nyberg and hundreds of tweets from SJW supporters of Nyberg including most of the prominent ones like Brianna Wu and Arthur Chu. I wonder why these specific people generally agreed on to be SJWs have done this specific thing.
No such studies exist because "SJW" isn't even an academic term. It's a slang term to refer to a bunch of people who are generally disliked here, and people don't even agree on what they are.
If I say that the Catholic Church has in the past defended pedophile priests, demanding proof that all priests are child molesters or that priests are even more likely to be child molesters is ridiculous, since it isn't even what is claimed.
You are aware of what a statistically significant difference would be, right? Statistical significance does not equal "all". OP in the title of the thread indicates there is statistical evidence. I asked to see it.
All I need to prove to say that SJWs have defended pedophiles is to point to Nyberg and hundreds of tweets from SJW supporters of Nyberg including most of the prominent ones like Brianna Wu and Arthur Chu. I wonder why these specific people generally agreed on to be SJWs have done this specific thing.
If the barrier for empirical evidence is that low then we can point to Hitler and hundreds of tweets from Jewish Nazi sympathizers as evidence that Jewish people support the Holocaust.
No such studies exist because "SJW" isn't even an academic term. It's a slang term to refer to a bunch of people who are generally disliked here, and people don't even agree on what they are.
Then why did OP say in the very title of this thread that there is statistical evidence to support a link between SJW and pedophilia? You're quoting the wrong guy if you want to say what you are here.
