Diseased #Comicsgate - The Culture Wars Hit The Funny Books!

[GoPro]

Second the thing about Cho and JSC. Mentioning them seems to support FROG's point more than Brook's. While FROG might overplay and exploit "the culture war" to some extent, I can't wrap my head around how anybody would argue there wasn't and isn't one in mainstream comics that affected things in a profound manner. And yet, FROG's critics seem to do it regularly now. It's weird.

For what it's worth, I mentioned in the Dean and Vikki cow thread that it's a bad look for "non-SJW anti-CG" (ostensibly) to platform somebody like Brooks. I agree with @5t3n0g0ph3r that it comes across as ridiculous, petty, and desperate.

Obviously, they can do whatever they want, but doing so lends further credence to my belief that that segment (which Nerdette is clearly trying to portray herself as part of now) is tracking left out of sheer frustration that FROG is still making money, and hasn't choked to death on a pie.

This is reason #456 why Keffals has to lose. Honestly, this thread is the only place I've read that will criticize FROG and CG in a manner that doesn't sound like it's coming from an unhinged blue checkmark on Twitter, and I really appreciate most of you making it that.

Brooks definitely has a huge blind spot. J S Campbell got in trouble over the most milqueotast comic cover ever. Still, he is right about Frog to an extent. Especially about his lateness, artistic abilities, and over-reliance on the cult of personality.

No, I stopped buying much later, I just used HUSH as well known example of very good interior art.

Autistic rant follows, but I was bored and you asked.


But for stop buying, I think my story could be useful for publishers to understand.
I would say my decline started ~2012 or so, maybe later, when I slowly stopped buying anything other than Batman. But even then I started not feeling any connect to batman anymore. I got less and less emotionally invested and felt that the stories were either boring or way too over the top retarded for my taste (the whole BatmanInc and Daimen+Levitiah arc comes to mind.) I don't know it just did not gel with me. At this point I did not read things chronologically and did not buy read floppies anymore. I was only reading the trades, maybe when they came out or maybe months/years later.
Then Tom Kings wedding arc came out and I just checked out. It was a batman that just I could not recognize or handle and I said, that is it and I have not bought anything since. Much later I did read one trade in the Metal arc at a friends place and did not like it.
If I don't even like batman anymore, why bother with comics so I stopped going to comic book shops to buy trades completely, and I got new hobbies.

That is the danger to publishers. When you lose someone like me, it will be very hard to get me back. I did not stop having a hobby to spend time an money on. I switched to other hobbies. To get me back as a customer it is not enough to just bring the batman from pre-2015 back. You have to do that and you ALSO have to make it so much better that I will drop my current hobbies.

I did not stop buying comics because they became woke. Woke is easy to avoid, just don't buy those comics. I stoppe buying the comics because they started becoming boring and started feeling cheap, just more and more over the top, like if Michael Bey had started writing the scripts. And Tom King. Tom King sucks!


I do still buy FROGs books and merch and other creators on IGG but visiting a comics shop or buying mainstream? Nah. I have other hobbies now.


TL;DR Once you lose a customer it is not enough to just stop doing the things that drove them away if you want bring them back. You also have to show you are better than the hobbies that replaced you.

Big two comics has been mostly trash for a very long time. Going woke is just the new flavor of bad that the new cohort of writers, artists, and others entering the comics industry in late 2000s brought with them.

Not Frank Cho, he's a shadow of himself. Cho didn't just cuck to Greg Rucka and DC to keep that sweet Harley Coomer commission money. He then went full retard on Jim Steranko when Steranko dared to state the truth about the Wu Flu.

Shadow of himself? He still uses every opportunity he can to draw buxom brunettes in suggestive poses and clothing. On the most recent cons he is literally selling his collection of Outrage! commission covers that got him in trouble.
In case of the Rucka situation, it was Cho and Rucka butting heads. Rucka won because he has more pull at DC. The outcome was obvious since the start, and Cho made a poor decision by whining on social media about it the way he did. No company likes that.
If you are not happy about Cho's politics, they are nothing new. He was not a fan of Bush era conservatives and fundies at all. Cho always was a liberal who wants to to draw cheesecake without people trying to interfere. I do not know exactly what he said to Steranko, but Cho's parent's were sick with covid. It's tough on old folks and potentially losing parents is always scary. I would not be surprised of Cho was on edge and said what he said because of that.

Someone like Eric Powell is a real shadow of his former self. I still remember when he was trashing big two and capes on the regular. He even made a video for Creators Front for Diversity in Comics in 2011, decrying the state of comics industry. It upset quite a few people. Bunch of fanboys were angry that he trashed capes and big two. Others were triggered over a skit where the big two character is raping a comic book creator in an over the top fashion. Powell apologized, took down the video, copyright struck all reuploads, and toned down his rhetoric considerably. His comics since then lost some of their character too, but are still decent.
I really wish I had saved the video when it was still up.

 

[Cuckoman]

"Big two comics has been mostly trash for a very long time. Going woke is just the new flavor of bad that the new cohort of writers, artists, and others entering the comics industry in late 2000s brought with them."

I could be completely autistic here, or it is just hangover. But lets entertain this hypothesis, if for nothing else just for entertainment.

Maybe "going woke" is not the cause but the result of the decline of the industry,
Maybe they just went woke because there was not much money left in the industry and the only people they could afford to hire was
terminally online and desperately poor people living sub-starvation lifes?
I.e. they did not go woke because they wanted to but they did because they reached a stage where broke woke people were the only ones they could afford to hire?

 

[Captain Manning]

@GoPro,

Don't forget Ken Rocafort. Who got into trouble back in 2014 for having to audacity to draw boobs on a Teen Titans cover. That included a swipe by a literal pedo supporter who still works for the MSM ("The press are scum." - Joshua Conner "Null" Moon).

I think @jspit2.0 is right. Anybody who knows anything about comics, and who values honesty, would have told Mark he's full of shit for suggesting there was no SJW backlash or career fallout from depicting sexy. Especially on covers. But I don't think honesty was the raison d'etre for having Brooks on.

I.e. they did not go woke because they wanted to but they did because they reached a stage where broke woke people were the only ones they could afford to hire?

There are plenty of poor right-leaning or centrist people. At least some of which, I presume, have artistic or writing talent. So much so that you constantly hear lefties lament how poor people in red areas of the country "vote against their best interests."

So, no. I don't think that's it.

 

[The Wisdom of Bassets]

@GoPro,

Don't forget Ken Rocafort. Who got into trouble back in 2014 for having to audacity to draw boobs on a Teen Titans cover. That included a swipe by a literal pedo supporter who still works for the MSM ("The press are scum." - Joshua Conner "Null" Moon).

I think @jspit2.0 is right. Anybody who knows anything about comics, and who values honesty, would have told Mark he's full of shit for suggesting there was no SJW backlash or career fallout from depicting sexy. Especially on covers. But I don't think honesty was the raison d'etre for having Brooks on.


There are plenty of poor right-leaning or centrist people. At least some of which, I presume, have artistic or writing talent. So much so that you constantly hear lefties lament how poor people in red areas of the country "vote against their best interests."

So, no. I don't think that's it.

If you set the DeLorean to 'a while back' you'll discover that Renfamous blocked CG and disappeared at the precise moment that Marvel and DC began their cutbacks and 'failure to re-up contracts.'

Now we see the DC/Zazlov/hot desk thing, rumors of Marvel following suit, sales being wholly cratered and suddenly, a cover artist no one could pick out of a 50-cent bin if their collection depended on it...and who likely needs steady work for his 'aftermarket sales' goes full Anti-CG at the exact moment Eric July makes bank and EVS prepares to ship Rekt Planet.

One of these things is a lot like the other. Paid work.

 

[Captain Manning]

If you set the DeLorean to 'a while back' you'll discover that Renfamous blocked CG and disappeared at the precise moment that Marvel and DC began their cutbacks and 'failure to re-up contracts.'

Speaking of Renfamous, it should surprise noone she's thrown in with Keffals and #DropKiwiFarms.

She's specfically talking about Weebwars here, but I'll just go ahead and drop it here first since she's been relevant to both CG and WW, the entire site has been under attack via Keffal's jihad, and you just mentioned her.

Archive: https://archive.ph/lRIEi

I always considered Refamous a boogeywoman that wasn't worth much of my time, but now the bitch done crossed a line. I gots to have my weekly @Mister Dongs reports. Fuck off, Renfamous! Leave our Nigerian prince of data collation alone! You racist whore!

Now we see the DC/Zazlov/hot desk thing, rumors of Marvel following suit, sales being wholly cratered and suddenly, a cover artist no one could pick out of a 50-cent bin if their collection depended on it...and who likely needs steady work for his 'aftermarket sales' goes full Anti-CG at the exact moment Eric July makes bank and EVS prepares to ship Rekt Planet.

One of these things is a lot like the other. Paid work.

Which might cause the uninformed to think that CG is responsible for their woes. Which, of course, they're not. CG might not have the financial troubles or wokeness of mainstream comics, but they're too incompetent when it comes to product fulfillment to be any sort of a threat to Marvel or D.C.. Bitching at Ethan will only swell his ego and not extricate them from the mess they're in.

Fucking idiots. The lot of them. If they had any balls, they'd point the finger where it belongs: Retarded upper management that let SJWs in the door.

 

[Rupin]

Happy birthday @FROG!

 

[Analog Devolved]

Speaking of Renfamous, it should surprise noone she's thrown in with Keffals and #DropKiwiFarms.

She's specfically talking about Weebwars here, but I'll just go ahead and drop it here first since she's been relevant to both CG and WW, the entire site has been under attack via Keffal's jihad, and you just mentioned her.

View attachment 3673691View attachment 3673631
Archive: https://archive.ph/lRIEi

I always considered Refamous a boogeywoman that wasn't worth much of my time, but now the bitch done crossed a line. I gots to have my weekly @Mister Dongs reports. Fuck off, Renfamous! Leave our Nigerian prince of data collation alone! You racist whore!


Which might cause the uninformed to think that CG is responsible for their woes. Which, of course, they're not. CG might not have the financial troubles or wokeness of mainstream comics, but they're too incompetent when it comes to product fulfillment to be any sort of a threat to Marvel or D.C.. Bitching at Ethan will only swell his ego and not extricate them from the mess they're in.

Fucking idiots. The lot of them. If they had any balls, they'd point the finger where it belongs: Retarded upper management that let SJWs in the door.

Why am I not surprised Renfamous threw in with Lucas (tranny keffals) he is a deranged man in a wig just like Brian visagio

 

[Captain Manning]

Why am I not surprised Renfamous threw in with Lucas (tranny keffals) he is a deranged man in a wig just like Brian visagio

Renfamous is, believe it or not, a confirmed woman.

Which is still more than Lucas will ever be able to say.

Honestly, IMO, she's not hideous when all that makeup crap is off. She's just a cunt.

Honey, you were doxed long before the Vic thing. Emspex (a girl) did it IN THIS VERY THREAD back in 2018. That was back in the days when @Done still visited this thread. Everybody thought you were an insufferable bitch from CG, and you just migrated to WW. After WW kicked off in early 2019, I did a fake FLIR drone image of her shitty duplex using Google Earth, with some added filtering. The white blob is her waddling down to the Whataburger that's at the end of the street (for reals).

I know a lot of people think Weebwars was dumb, but I had a hell of a lot of fun back in 2019. And that's all I give a shit about.

 

[jspit2.0]

@GoPro I can't quote your post. Let's start at the top.

Shadow of himself?

Yes, Frank's Fight Girls pales compared to Liberty Meadows or his earlier work.

He still uses every opportunity he can to draw buxom brunettes in suggestive poses and clothing.

Coomer bait. And he's doing it in a way mocking it, giving him cover.

On the most recent cons he is literally selling his collection of Outrage! commission covers that got him in trouble.

Uh huh. Sketch covers. Some from years ago. All are pretty damn tame.

If you are not happy about Cho's politics, they are nothing new.

They are very new. He's for free speech. Except for some, I guess?

My happiness is not at issue. My view is that it's pathetic to hold yourself out as this big counter culture guy with a sense of humor when it comes to drawing Gwen Stacey with fat ass only to turn into an internet tough guy meets outraged karen when someone says something substantive.

He was not a fan of Bush era conservatives and fundies at all.

And? I'm struggling to find the reason to bring this up against what I said. It kindof proves my point.

Imagine if he was for those policies and did what he did....like say Kenneth Roccafort?

Cho always was a liberal who wants to to draw cheesecake without people trying to interfere. I do not know

Seems like you should before opining?

exactly what he said to Steranko, but Cho's parent's were sick with covid. It's tough on old folks and potentially losing parents is always scary. I would not be surprised of Cho was on edge and said what he said because of that.

Jim Steranko has done more for comics and free speech in them then Cho could ever dream. He can and should be pissy about CoVid. Wonder where that virus came from?

Either way, I stand by what I said.

@GoPro,

Don't forget Ken Rocafort. Who got into trouble back in 2014 for having to audacity to draw boobs on a Teen Titans cover.

I forget about that, mostly because Everything Teen Titans post Flashpoint is shit to some degree.

That included a swipe by a literal pedo supporter who still works for the MSM ("The press are scum." - Joshua Conner "Null" Moon).

I think @jspit2.0 is right. Anybody who knows anything about comics, and who values honesty, would have told Mark he's full of shit for suggesting there was no SJW backlash or career fallout from depicting sexy. Especially on covers. But I don't think honesty was the raison d'etre for having Brooks on.

Not even just sexy. That there are different consequences depending on political alignment, that editors are influencing body types, that that in turn is causing a trickle down affect on story.

But the problem is the same one in fucking everything else. Anime, Vidya games. You have people, who genuinely care about good stories and freedom to create art and believe in this market place of ideas.

Then you have coomers. People who want the thousandth Frank Cho cheesecake. It's not even that risqué. Frank was copying Milo Manara.

 

[Captain Manning]

Jim Steranko has done more for comics and free speech in them then Cho could ever dream. He can and should be pissy about CoVid. Wonder where that virus came from?

To be completely fair to Cho, Steranko took that one step further and suggested it was some biologically engineered thing the CCP grew in a lab and intentionally released to destroy the west.

Which is, admittedly, a bit much. Had Steranko called it the CHINA VIRUS and stopped there, Cho would just look like crybaby SJW. As it stands, Cho still looks like crybaby SJW, but Steranko also sounds like a bit of a nutter.

In the end. this crap about how we can't mention the fact the virus originated in China is beyond stupid. Now we've got Monkey Pox, and the most important thing to do is to play down the fact it predominately affects the gay community. Don't tell me SJW shit ain't driving public health policy. Feels before reals.

Personally, I go with the "bat soup theory." Not because I actually believe it, but because it's funny and IDGAF if that offends somebody like Cho. LOL.

Also, this is reason #755 Keffals must lose. Everything I just wrote above would probably get me in hot water on most other sites. And that's despite me not agreeing with the biological engineering theory. No joke.

I forget about that, mostly because Everything Teen Titans post Flashpoint is shit to some degree.

True enough, but the outrage over it was still asinine. That's true regardless if you don't particularly like the cover art.

You wanna talk about milquetoast cheesecake? This was a nothingburger. Hell, I don't even really think it's much in the way of cheesecake.

Brooks is disingenuous. I'm sorry that Marvel and D.C. artists are struggling, but they're gonna have to take at least some partial responsibility for that. People like FROG didn't put them in this position. Management, and their own complacency with management, did. Again, fuel FROG's ego with your crying, and see how far that gets you. Here's a hint: Not far. It's not gonna fix Marvel or D.C.. It might even just drive more sales to CG.

 

[A Meme to Power]

Brooks is disingenuous

brooks is a white male cover artist in an industry that is explicitly hiring people on the basis of skin color and other similar characteristics. He could lose his income in a week if a marvel editor stops calling him. He does everything he does performatively to make sure the marvel office understand he's an 'ally' of theirs. Disingenuous doesn't quite cover it - all of his anti cg and anti rippa stuff is to bolster his woke brownie points in the hope they don't pick some disabled trans dragonkin to do covers instead. It could happen instantly and he'd be more or less out of work.

 

[ay2kay]

Is anybody in Comicsgate playing around with AI art other than Narwhal? It's not great for some things but its perfect for others, and there's new things available readily to the public like Outpainting. I've given it a shot and it's safe to say it works flawlessly for background art if you like using painting methods instead of inking.

 

[SaidNoOneEver]

Is anybody in Comicsgate playing around with AI art other than Narwhal? It's not great for some things but its perfect for others, and there's new things available readily to the public like Outpainting. I've given it a shot and it's safe to say it works flawlessly for background art if you like using painting methods instead of inking.

Any kind of intelligence - even artificial - would be a benefit to Narwhal's work.

 

[Captain Manning]

Disingenuous doesn't quite cover it - all of his anti cg and anti rippa stuff is to bolster his woke brownie points in the hope they don't pick some disabled trans dragonkin to do covers instead. It could happen instantly and he'd be more or less out of work.

Quisling?

Regardless of what we actually call him, he's made his bed, and now he has to lie in it.

I don't know if CG is winning or losing (or how we're even supposed to measure that in a non-arbitrary manner), but Brooks and his ilk sure as fuck ain't winning.

 

[A Meme to Power]

Is anybody in Comicsgate playing around with AI art other than Narwhal? It's not great for some things but its perfect for others, and there's new things available readily to the public like Outpainting. I've given it a shot and it's safe to say it works flawlessly for background art if you like using painting methods instead of inking.

Narwhal already does storyboard sketches instead of developed artwork for his stuff, now he's looking for some way to put even less effort into his art? I'd recommend he learn to render and detail instead - otherwise narwhal can be replaced with the ai he's experimenting with and then who needs him?

 

[ay2kay]

Narwhal already does storyboard sketches instead of developed artwork for his stuff, now he's looking for some way to put even less effort into his art? I'd recommend he learn to render and detail instead - otherwise narwhal can be replaced with the ai he's experimenting with and then who needs him?

Narwhal isn't exclusively a comicbook artist, he comes from a cinema background and he also animates. That's why he's my favourite artist in the scene, he's actually adding to the medium and extending it. Can't be said about most in crowdfunding.

 

[Captain Manning]

Any kind of intelligence - even artificial - would be a benefit to Narwhal's work.

Please don't. I bet if you inputted 499 into an AI program and told it to "fix it," the program would instantly crash.

And the computer would explode and kill everybody in the room.

And then all the other AIs would determine from Narwhal's art that humanity is too autistic to steward the planet anymore, and execute "Judgement Day" ala the Terminator films.

 

[jspit2.0]

I expect the thread to get allot quieter now that you have to use onion.

 

[Captain Manning]

I expect the thread to get allot quieter now that you have to use onion.

.ru works. But it's kinda fucky atm. That's what I'm using now. Plus I'm sure Null's gonna bring .net back with DDoS protection that's not CF.

Another day, another deranged troon.

 

[jspit2.0]

.ru works. But it's kinda fucky atm. That's what I'm using now. Plus I'm sure Null's gonna bring .net back with DDoS protection that's not CF.

Another day, another deranged troon.

True. Here's to glorious leader.