General Discussion for Virtual Youtubers / Vtubers / Chuubas - it's okay to be a simp for 2D, just don't thirstpost.

Burnt Fish said:
mmm no not really or at least not entirely, everything Kiara said there is pretty in line with a lot of the western discourse surrounding AI art in artist circles right now.
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Isn't it more that Japan is super autistic about copyright to the point that Nintendo still is a massive pain in the ass to work with and you have to split your revenue with them as a stream or they will flip their shit? There's probably some kind of scale that could be made about copyright that ranges from China to Japan and the USA is somewhere in the middle.
 
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kukkia said:
Selen literally says that there isn't a rule against talking about Holos in that clip. Scarle mentions Tempus whenever they show up in her chat, Alban is fine acknowledging that he plays games with Ollie off stream, and Ren tweeting about Hololive has become a meme at this point.
There does seems to be some hesitation, but it's not a one-way thing. Kiara seems to have been just as hesitant to mention Enna and Millie by name in her stream.
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This Kiara clip honestly doesn't do justice to how much dead air there was while she was typing to her manager about it, either. The fact that she had to cut red tape talking about something as innocuous as her own dream was honestly like pulling teeth.

You don't negotiate with management like that unless something has been said about it behind closed doors.
 
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DelusionTree said:
Japan doesn't have fair use under the law.
Companies there generally don't go suing every artist or creator because of the optics but if they believe your work is harming their brand they definitely will.
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They don't sue, but from what I heard Nintendo would just DMCA everyone who streamed or posted videos about their shit because there was no lawsuit involved. Eventually they just created a special set of rules for Nintendo and other Japanese companies where if you use their content and monetize it, they just take 30% but eventually they scrapped that and now you can just do lets plays like a normal person unless you're a company, then you're limited.
 
In a rather surprising move from ANYCOLOR, looks like Nijisanji is finally giving their ex-ID members their own merchandises now, starting from one Siska Leotyne.
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Not only it wasn't based on their notable ID member like say, Mika Melatika or Hana Macchia, it's also not something like them Birthday merch either, so it's still a bit of a surprise for once. Say what y'all want about ANYCOLOR and their lack of merch, but atleast it has mugs and shirt!
 
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RiverBear said:
What's with the current trend of Nijis being unable to talk about Holos or anything related about them? I also remember there were rrats floating around of the NijiEN girls cancelling their Nintendo Direct watchalongs because there was a chance Holo was going to be featured in a Little Witch Nobeta feature
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It makes even less sense when you consider them being fine with the main branch doing it. EN gotta EN I guess.
 
Burnt Fish said:
mmm no not really or at least not entirely, everything Kiara said there is pretty in line with a lot of the western discourse surrounding AI art in artist circles right now.

Japanese (and other Asian) artists do tend to get more up in arms about how their artwork is used and AI's modeling off of danbooru and similar sites that a lot of Asian artists don't approve of in the first place could definitely ruffle some feathers (I've seen a particular Korean artist I follow say that people should not even save her work to their hard drive at all, let alone reposting it on another sight like danbooru)

But this particular pushback against AI art is not at all unique to Japan or Asian artists. There's a reason why the replies of Kiara and Calli's statement is full of western artists and their fans spamming "yaaaaas queen" because the attitude toward it is largely the same in art communities here. NovelAI (which is the big one people have been using lately) as I understand it primarily was trained with art from Danbooru which is just an art reposting platform where users upload other artists work. A ton of artists are unhappy with this as they did not have any choice in their art being put on Danbooru, and they did not have any choice in their work being used to train this AI. and all of this done with zero credit to the artists work. And I've seen a few instances, though I don't have it on hand right this monent, that pretty well show that the AI will produce what looks like just a traced and reskinned version of another artist's work.

The actual artists are part of their communities, the creator of that AI is not, they're siding with their community and focusing on their creations instead of supporting some AI that just happens to be a fancy new toy in the moment. Which is honestly just the smart choice as a content creator.

And on top of that consider that a lot of the art pieces being derived from, and art styles being mimicked (some of the AI models let you tell it to mimic a particular artist's style) are artists that do work for hololive as well. And making those artists unhappy as well would be just a bad move for holo.

On the whole the easy way to look at this is this. The creator of the AI has nothing to do with this and probably doesn' know or even care about vtuber hashtags of all things, so there's little reason to be defensive on his behalf. The users frustrated not being able to post with the hashtag are the equivalent of just people pissed they can't post art they didn't draw in a hashtag for fan creations there's zero reason to care about these people they are doing nothing for the community and are still free to play with the AI all they want just not post it in the official art tags. And the artists applauding the move are artists that are actively creating and participating in the community and not some faceless AI or the random Indian dude that programmed it.

I'm actually somewhat surprised in all of the talk about it today that Ina didn't say anything since she's the one I would have expected to be the most outspoken on it.


no, I literally made this giant autistic post in response to someone else saying it's japanese corpo speak and copyright stuff, to explain that it's not really that. I said as much in the very first sentence. I don't know how else to respond because you just repeated the same point I was refuting but stated a different way. Yes, Japan is autistic about copyright, but also the Art AI stuff goes far beyond that outside of Japan as well.
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On the Current Art Discourse (forma de AI)

If people were just using AI art to make cool shit, it would be fine, but some motherfuckers are always trying to ice skate uphill. Artists just barely stopped getting their art stolen by NFT bros for profit, so their wariness towards having it stolen and plugged in a machine for profit seems makes perfect sense to me.

Also, while art with those tools can be awesome, there is value in making it for yourself. Yes, even bad art. It's good for the soul, and we do love SOUL around here, yeah?

Vocaloid bonus:

 
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Slutpuppies said:
On the Current Art Discourse (forma de AI)

If people were just using AI art to make cool shit, it would be fine, but some motherfuckers are always trying to ice skate uphill. Artists just barely stopped getting their art stolen by NFT bros for profit, so their wariness towards having it stolen and plugged in a machine for profit seems makes perfect sense to me.

Also, while art with those tools can be awesome, there is value in making it for yourself. Yes, even bad art. It's good for the soul, and we do love SOUL around here, yeah?

Vocaloid bonus:

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kek . cope more . Robots are better than them and they can't deal. Work has no intrinsic value and if people like robot stuff better than what the "real artists" make then there is no point in "real artists"
 
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grenskul said:
kek . cope more . Robots are better than them and they can't deal. Work has no intrinsic value and if people like robot stuff better than what the "real artists" make then there is no point in "real artists"
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It's not cope, I can't draw for shit XD

Not if I worded it right, so I'll try it again. My feelings about making art don't have shit to do with what people like. (People liking things isn't a metric of quality, and you know that.)

I wasn't making a point about an audience at all. If you want to be a person that draws or writes or cooks or anything, the process of learning to do that is valuable for your growth as a person.

Work may not have intrinsic value, but if the first thing you think about when you think of art is work then I genuinely feel for you.
 
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Rratcatcher said:
Hide your kids, hide your wife, hide your dog, but most importantly, hide your sandwiches.
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Kronii, the Sacrilegious Sub Smoothie Sipper (plot twist: she mainly defiles her own body, not yours)
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thhrang said:
This is the most horrifying thing I've heard in a long time. I already knew that last part, though. :story:
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You're living rent-free in/vt/'s heads, woke crowd says you're a nazi, Fishman & co. surely still remeber that one time when they made a mod out of a user of a forum which doxxed one of their talents... Who knows, maybe in 5 years you'll have your own thread. :tomgirl:
 
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Looks like Selen has returned from her Japan trip and resuming her normal stream tomorrow with this stream. I might try catching her stream live and hear what she do during Nijifes and whether she and Nagao ended up playing soccer together or not.

Fellow Nijifags that are curious about Nijifes might want to catch it as well, if only to hear from her how it goes in her perspective.
 
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Didn't get to watch it live last night but Gura's Backrooms stream was nice. Her horror game streams have always been some of her best, with her early Outlast ones being a few of my favorites.

"They're just making me mad with these cheap-o jump scares!" "This game has definitely overstayed its welcome."
You could tell she was getting tired of the game around the 60 minute mark - starts getting annoyed with the mic thing, then just turns the mic off; starts making fun of the game more and more while talking about random shit and finally starts begging the monster just to kill her before trying to speedrun the objectives and then just giving up.

also, what the fuck is going on with her house. talks about seeing ghosts and getting nasty spider bites. with all the glasses she has on her desk now it sounds like she's sliding back into pippa territory.

talking with chat part:
- sounds happy to get back into regular streaming
- "I was currently ebbing but now I'm back to flowing."
- wants to do a stream or two of sampling weird steam games
- feels old now that she gets excited over baking and kitchen appliances
- cooked a ton of stuff with pumpkin... then realized she didn't like the taste of pumpkin
- wants to do some sort of nostalgia game with SNOT, like Neopets or Webkinz
- wants to start her own instagram food blog... just to get free food from companies
- gura's dream is to "be a vtuber by night, by day I am a living historic educator and also food news related social media page owner... who receives lots of snack PR"
- chat: "I wouldn't let Gura into my backrooms.", Gura: "Who said I needed permission?"
- had a chance to meet Game Theory's Matpat but decided against (I have no idea who that is)
 
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Faceless Enjoyer said:
In a rather surprising move from ANYCOLOR, looks like Nijisanji is finally giving their ex-ID members their own merchandises now, starting from one Siska Leotyne.
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Not only it wasn't based on their notable ID member like say, Mika Melatika or Hana Macchia, it's also not something like them Birthday merch either, so it's still a bit of a surprise for once. Say what y'all want about ANYCOLOR and their lack of merch, but atleast it has mugs and shirt!
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Not surprising at all, main branch always get merch and had some variance going.
grenskul said:
kek . cope more . Robots are better than them and they can't deal. Work has no intrinsic value and if people like robot stuff better than what the "real artists" make then there is no point in "real artists"
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Eh. My only issue with Artists is trying to charge me the equivalent of 3-6 months of rent because "I gotta eat and pay my bills!" while they sit on your commission for up to a year depending on how sought after they are, so honestly the commission environment kind of brought AI shit into light inevitably. I'd still much sooner prefer actual artwork from an artist over AI, even if the AI can shit out something superior (or significantly cursed.)
 
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