War Invasion of Ukraine News Megathread - Thread is only for articles and discussion of articles, general discussion thread is still in Happenings.

President Joe Biden on Tuesday said that the United States will impose sanctions “far beyond” the ones that the United States imposed in 2014 following the annexation of the Crimean peninsula.

“This is the beginning of a Russian invasion of Ukraine,” Biden said in a White House speech, signaling a shift in his administration’s position. “We will continue to escalate sanctions if Russia escalates,” he added.

Russian elites and their family members will also soon face sanctions, Biden said, adding that “Russia will pay an even steeper price” if Moscow decides to push forward into Ukraine. Two Russian banks and Russian sovereign debt will also be sanctioned, he said.

Also in his speech, Biden said he would send more U.S. troops to the Baltic states as a defensive measure to strengthen NATO’s position in the area.

Russia shares a border with Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania.

A day earlier, Russian President Vladimir Putin ordered troops to go into the separatist Donetsk and Lugansk regions in eastern Ukraine after a lengthy speech in which he recognized the two regions’ independence.

Western powers decried the move and began to slap sanctions on certain Russian individuals, while Germany announced it would halt plans to go ahead with the Russia-to-Germany Nord Stream 2 pipeline.

At home, Biden is facing bipartisan pressure to take more extensive actions against Russia following Putin’s decision. However, a recent poll showed that a majority of Americans believe that sending troops to Ukraine is a “bad idea,” and a slim minority believes it’s a good one.

All 27 European Union countries unanimously agreed on an initial list of sanctions targeting Russian authorities, said French Foreign Minister Jean-Yves Le Drian, and EU foreign affairs head Josep Borell claimed the package “will hurt Russia … a lot.”

Earlier Tuesday, Borell asserted that Russian troops have already entered the Donbas region, which comprises Donetsk and Lugansk, which are under the control of pro-Russia groups since 2014.

And on Tuesday, the Russian Parliament approved a Putin-back plan to use military force outside of Russia’s borders as Putin further said that Russia confirmed it would recognize the expanded borders of Lugansk and Donetsk.

“We recognized the states,” the Russian president said. “That means we recognized all of their fundamental documents, including the constitution, where it is written that their [borders] are the territories at the time the two regions were part of Ukraine.”

Speaking to reporters on Tuesday, Putin said that Ukraine is “not interested in peaceful solutions” and that “every day, they are amassing troops in the Donbas.”

Meanwhile, Ukraine President Volodymyr Zelensky on Tuesday morning again downplayed the prospect of a Russian invasion and proclaimed: “There will be no war.”

“There will not be an all-out war against Ukraine, and there will not be a broad escalation from Russia. If there is, then we will put Ukraine on a war footing,” he said in a televised address.

The White House began to signal that they would shift their own position on whether it’s the start of an invasion.

“We think this is, yes, the beginning of an invasion, Russia’s latest invasion into Ukraine,” said Jon Finer, the White House deputy national security adviser in public remarks. “An invasion is an invasion and that is what is underway.”

For weeks, Western governments have been claiming Moscow would invade its neighbor after Russia gathered some 150,000 troops along the countries’ borders. They alleged that the Kremlin would attempt to come up with a pretext to attack, while some officials on Monday said Putin’s speech recognizing the two regions was just that.

But Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin told reporters Tuesday that Russia’s “latest invasion” of Ukraine is threatening stability in the region, but he asserted that Putin can “still avoid a full blown, tragic war of choice.”

Article

 

[Pocket Dragoon]

From what I've heard the survival rate for anyone who took a serious hit was 80%. Granted, with IED's you may not have all your limbs afterwards, but hey, at least you're alive.

Halfway through my first deployment, I fell out & almost died from dehydration, after contracting a nasty gut bug from cold plates brought to us in the bunker. I vaguely remember staggering into the TMC, being probed by an Air Force sawbones, and then waking up in the CSH recovery ward a week later.

Out of 20 beds, besides myself & a few empty spots, the rest were filled with third-country nationals or Iraqis with traumatic amputations, shrapnel wounds & blast injuries, because the Balad combat support hospital run by the AF was essentially their Rammstein.

So that 80% survival rate is fairly accurate, even for hajis; as long as they made it to the CSH in an hour or less.

 

[The Demon Pimp of Razgriz]

@Ghostse

Even given that, they were shelling the suburbs of Kiev. Ukraine is winning but its costing them men and the barren no-mans-lands they are pushing east they are pushing east through their own country.

People keep bringing this up and I don't really know why. That's war. This is what war is. War costs. Losses are unavoidable and Ukraine are willing to pay the cost. I know that we of the modern era aren't used to seeing real wars; we are used to one-sided shock and awe campaigns where the U.S. wins the war in a few weeks and then loses to an insurgency after 15 years, but a real war is basically fought like this, with both sides incurring losses. The only way to avoid the losses is to avoid the war, but that wasn't really possible since it was Russia that invaded.

No one (well, no one posting here) knows the current state of the airport. Usable runways or not, there should be still be useable infrastructure (fuel tanks, hangers, etc) that at very least would make it a viable Helicopter base.

That air base has been fought over for eight years now. It was on the frontline between Ukraine and the breakaway republics. No way its operational. In fact, if Ukraine was smart, they probably sabotaged the facility themselves to make it unusable. And Russia doesn't really need another helicopter base. In any case, the airport is too close to the front to be viable; there are other air bases already in Russian controlled territory that are far more useful for any purposes the Russians might have for it.

And operational or not, Ukraine will need to deploy Air defense systems to deny its utility to the Russians. Every SAM overwatching Donetsk is one that isn't covering the front elsewhere.

This is not an issue as Ukraine can simply order more SAMs from abroad. And denying the enemy the use of a forward airport would be considered a top priority over most other potential uses.

But they do have heavy lift capabilities with planes with capabilities similar to the US - yes, Russia doesn't know how to use those capabilities, but adversity is a hell of a teacher.

Be honest...we both know that's not going to happen.

Edit:
According to Denys Davydov, the airport is just ruins now, so its probably not even remotely operational:

 

[Uranus Pink]

No, actually. Our initial training procedures during the war were incomplete with the expectation that the infantryman would learn most of his trade in the field.

Reads like you skipped from basic training to deployment while leaving out specialty training. Cartoonist Bill Maudin got his start after enlisting in 1940. Which also happened to be after U.S.A. sent all of the training small arms and cannons to England to replace what they left behind at Dunkirk. So from that standpoint training would be incomplete when wooden toy guns and broom sticks were used of instead of real rifles. Or trainees being sent immediately to replaces losses at the front.

 

[spinal gas chamber]

Funny, you and many of the others on this thread are willing to blindly accept every negative detail about Russia. Even if the source has no obvious reason to know, or it comes from the mouth of the Ukrainians, because they don't use propaganda.... apparently.

We'll see what's said after Russia wins.

Wow, good point. Lol.

 

[Thomas Talus]

Be honest...we both know that's not going to happen.

Ghostse's position seems to be that you have to plan and prepare like the worst-or-near-worst-case scenario, otherwise you will be caught with your pants down eventually.

 

[Happy Fish]

View attachment 3740803
Imagine complaining about "other companies" getting billions of taxpayer dollars while running multiple meme companies that also got billions of dollars of government funding. Jesus Christ I can't wait for the inevitable complete Tesla stock crash.

Imagine expecting a private company to just give you free internet for the forseeable future because...

No really why the fuck do people think they are entitled to this? It escapes me.

 

[Titos]

If there's one positive thing I can say about Russians is that they're shooting their conscription officers and lighting their offices on fire instead of wearing tyedye and listening to awful music.

Ironic given the Ruskie fucks funded the hippies and are 99% of the reason "the west is degenerate". Fuckers should have to pay in pure suffering for the long march through the institutions. The fact I can't give a fuck about the environment without having to deal with faggots who got brainwashed by their agents into wanting to sabotage western infrastructure alone makes me want Moscow flattened. The fact so called right wing people are willing to forgive and simp for these faggots despite the damage they inflicted on the western world just makes me think they are nothing more than contrarians with 4chan poisoned brains.

A question for any Russians here. How the fuck do people there seemingly ignore he fact that Russia is just as responsible as the Nazis for WW2? Just brainwashed to not think about it? Obviously don't be like the germoids about it but jesus it's like half your fault.

 

[thx1138]

A question for any Russians here. How the fuck do people there seemingly ignore he fact that Russia is just as responsible as the Nazis for WW2? Just brainwashed to not think about it? Obviously don't be like the germoids about it but jesus it's like half your fault.

I don't know about now but it was illegal in the USSR up to it's fall to speak about Lend-Lease or the Molotov/Ribbentropp Pact, so...

 

[Ghostse]

People keep bringing this up and I don't really know why.

If you wake up at night and find a homeless methhead in your kitchen raping your dog with your fridge completely looted, and then proceed to fight him for the next 8 hours, slowly pushing him out of your kitchen while in the process tussling with him break every single plate and appliance in your kitchen.

No one who isn't a homeless methhead (other than billioniares on twitter) is saying you shouldn't have fought him or ceded him your kitchen table, but when your neighbors are cheering when you stun him by smashing his head through the oven door... you're going to have to replace that door, and you're out an oven until you do.

So you're still locked in a fist fight with a methhead, he's making stupid methhead mistakes but he's throwing punched you have to keep ducking. And as you step over the shattered remains of Great Grandma's china to the cheers of your neighbors to "kick his ass!" you might think its sort of macabre they call the complete state of your kitchen as "glorious victory".

So that's why.

And specifically with the shelling Kiev - the Russians have the capacity to get to kiev in 24 hours if they are allowed to do so. Ukraine has to keep on their toes and be ready if they try again. This war is not over, far from it, I don't know why people keep acting like it is. You're setting yourself up for disappointment and will be left scrambling for explanations like the Vatniks are to explain the current reversals.

Edit:
According to Denys Davydov, the airport is just ruins now, so its probably not even remotely operational:

Sounds like this guy is making conclusions based off estimates and not actual proof. He also said they'd have Russia's main hub this week, that hasn't happened. He's got a hell of a bias and leaning into Yookniking. The Donbros held the terminal for a while, they've been fighting over the runway for years. There is a lot of underground infrastructure, and even a few feet of dirt is enough protection for from conventional artilery.

And airstrips on the front are important for CAS. It means your CAS strikes take less time to get to target - less time for the target to react, less time for your opponent to scramble interceptors or move air-defenses.

And referencing his estimates: the Ukraine advance is slowing down - that's not exactly a bad thing. Given what we've seen of Ukraine, and their military actually showing they are able to listen to advice, it likely means they are waiting for their logistics to catch up. But it also probably means that they need to wait for their supply lines because Russia is starting to regroup and you've got concentrations of pulled back troops that now that the front is restabilizing.

IIronic given the Ruskie fucks funded the hippies and are 99% of the reason "the west is degenerate". Fuckers should have to pay in pure suffering for the long march through the institutions. The fact I can't give a fuck about the environment without having to deal with faggots who got brainwashed by their agents into wanting to sabotage western infrastructure alone makes me want Moscow flattened.

This shit right here.
Every single western "Anti-War" "Anti-nuke" organization had soviet backing. Everyone still blasts McCarthy but now you've got lots of biographies and interviews about Hollywood types coming out and saying "Oh yes, I was 100% commie worked commie messaging into everything I possibly could recruited as many people as I could to come to meetings". They made sure to fund environmental groups, anything that would fuck with industry and sow disorder, there was a soviet hand in.

 

[Pocket Dragoon]

If you wake up at night and find a homeless methhead in your kitchen raping your dog with your fridge completely looted, and then proceed to fight him for the next 8 hours, slowly pushing him out of your kitchen while in the process tussling with him break every single plate and appliance in your kitchen.

No one who isn't a homeless methhead (other than billioniares on twitter) is saying you shouldn't have fought him or ceded him your kitchen table, but when your neighbors are cheering when you stun him by smashing his head through the ovendoor... you're going to have to replace that door, and you're out an oven until you do.

Yeah, but it feels good to ovensmash dents in a meth-monster's head after he's been shitting on the carpet and/or raping your dog (be it metaphorically or literally).

Because that shit is simply uncalled for & someone needs to pay, even if insurance covers it & you've got a righteous self-defense alibi. Which is what Ukraine has in abundance.

So yeah, I dont blame them.

So you're still locked in a fist fight with a methhead, he's making stupid methhead mistakes but he's throwing punched you have to keep ducking. And as you step over the shattered remains of Great Grandma's china to the cheers of your neighbors to "kick his ass!" you might think its sort of macabre they call the complete state of kitchen as "glorious victory".

So that's why.

If the tweaker/Russia/Putin never gets back up, then it's a glorious victory; especially if they're used to fertilize next year's crops.

But just crippled & toothless? Still a glorious victory; because the whole world saw you do it, cheered you on, and then paid for everything the tweaker (or Russians) broke (and/or shit on/raped).

Not that I think Ukraine would've had any restraint even if they hadn't had everyone cheering them on, but the lack of it certainly isn't hurting their cause.

 

[Uranus Pink]

Imagine expecting a private company to just give you free internet for the forseeable future because...

No really why the fuck do people think they are entitled to this? It escapes me.

That private company failed to get anything in legal writing or on govt. contracts on the terms of how long, and how much and everything else I missed. Since Musk volunteered StarLinks services to the war effort he on the hook until Uncle Sam said otherwise. All this because Musk didn't check with his legal and financial departments first.

I may well entirely wrong and he had via Starlink got the paperwork done first. But it leads to him wanting to publicly cancel it. Which again leads to the issue of breaking contract which right in the middle of a military conflict. Where that shit won't fly with either U.S. govt legal department, and those individuals you never want a visit from.

 

[Astro Galactic Megalul]

A question for any Russians here. How the fuck do people there seemingly ignore he fact that Russia is just as responsible as the Nazis for WW2? Just brainwashed to not think about it? Obviously don't be like the germoids about it but jesus it's like half your fault.

They usually don't know this and take all the credit for winning the war, partly because "we had the most losses so we sacrificed more for it". There's all kinds of retarded logic going into ignoring contribution of the West.
These people don't even call it "World War II" anymore, but "The Great Patriotic War" instead. Which basically means focusing on Russian part of it, embellishing it and mostly ignoring everything else. Putin ramped up propaganda using Cult of Victory that fetishizes said war during his rule, and uses it as a basis to frame the war in Ukraine now.
When it comes to war, for these people WWII-era movies is their frame of reference. Which you'd think would make them think twice, but thinking is not their strong suit.

It doesn't work as much on the younger generation who doesn't watch TV and interacts with the rest of the world using internet. With the older generations Putin just rewired their Soviet brainwashing slightly and capitalized on it. This is Putin's electorate, brainwashed old farts glued to TV screens and believing everything they see in the state media. Young Russians don't have representation in the government, it's mostly Soviet fossils and their inheritors, and that's the reason we find ourselves here in this situation.

The Cult of Victory always irked me because it's not even about honoring sacrifices and lessons learned from that horrific war anymore. It's about glory of the state and instilling the idea of self-sacrifice on its behalf unquestionably.

 

[MG-34]

They usually don't know this and take all the credit for winning the war, partly because "we had the most losses so we sacrificed more for it". There's all kinds of retarded logic going into ignoring contribution of the West.
These people don't even call it "World War II" anymore, but "The Great Patriotic War" instead. Which basically means focusing on Russian part of it, embellishing it and mostly ignoring everything else. Putin ramped up propaganda using Cult of Victory that fetishizes said war during his rule, and uses it as a basis to frame the war in Ukraine now.
When it comes to war, for these people WWII-era movies is their frame of reference. Which you'd think would make them think twice, but thinking is not their strong suit.

It doesn't work as much on the younger generation who doesn't watch TV and interacts with the rest of the world using internet. With the older generations Putin just rewired their Soviet brainwashing slightly and capitalized on it. This is Putin's electorate, brainwashed old farts glued to TV screens and believing everything they see in the state media. Young Russians don't have representation in the government, it's mostly Soviet fossils and their inheritors, and that's the reason we find ourselves here in this situation.

The Cult of Victory always irked me because it's not even about honoring sacrifices and lessons learned from that horrific war anymore. It's about glory of the state and instilling the idea of self-sacrifice on its behalf unquestionably.

If I'm not mistaken doesn't the Russian Governent offer tax relief or stipends for WW2 Movies focused on the Eastern Front so you see a glut of low effort Russian made WW2 films every year?

 

[The Demon Pimp of Razgriz]

If you wake up at night and find a homeless methhead in your kitchen raping your dog with your fridge completely looted, and then proceed to fight him for the next 8 hours, slowly pushing him out of your kitchen while in the process tussling with him break every single plate and appliance in your kitchen.

No one who isn't a homeless methhead (other than billioniares on twitter) is saying you shouldn't have fought him or ceded him your kitchen table, but when your neighbors are cheering when you stun him by smashing his head through the oven door... you're going to have to replace that door, and you're out an oven until you do.

So you're still locked in a fist fight with a methhead, he's making stupid methhead mistakes but he's throwing punched you have to keep ducking. And as you step over the shattered remains of Great Grandma's china to the cheers of your neighbors to "kick his ass!" you might think its sort of macabre they call the complete state of your kitchen as "glorious victory".

So that's why.

That analogy doesn't really answer my question, or hit my point really. At the end of the day, you have a right to defend your home and everyone in it, the same as Ukraine has a right to defend its territory and people. At the end of the day, Ukraine did so. You aren't guaranteed that your victory won't result in losses, but the losses would be greater if you did nothing. So you do something to mitigate the losses and defend what's yours. What I'm questioning is why anyone is taken aback that Ukraine's fight is costing anything at all. Its war. THE LOSSES ARE INEVITABLE. There is no such thing as a bloodless war. The only way to avoid the losses would be to avoid the war, which wasn't possible. It is what is.

And specifically with the shelling Kiev - the Russians have the capacity to get to kiev in 24 hours if they are allowed to do so. Ukraine has to keep on their toes and be ready if they try again.

Russia doesn't have the forces to attempt another advance on Kiev, and if they did, it would fail just like the last one did, because the Ukrainians are ready for them this time. Ukraine will keep forces on the border regardless, because, yes, they have to prepare for the potentiality of it, but chances of it are absurdly low and it would be a strategic mistake for Russia.

This war is not over, far from it, I don't know why people keep acting like it is. You're setting yourself up for disappointment and will be left scrambling for explanations like the Vatniks are to explain the current reversals.

The war isn't over, but one would have to be blind not to see where the wind is blowing.

Sounds like this guy is making conclusions based off estimates and not actual proof. He also said they'd have Russia's main hub this week, that hasn't happened. He's got a hell of a bias and leaning into Yookniking. The Donbros held the terminal for a while, they've been fighting over the runway for years. There is a lot of underground infrastructure, and even a few feet of dirt is enough protection for from conventional artilery.

And airstrips on the front are important for CAS. It means your CAS strikes take less time to get to target - less time for the target to react, less time for your opponent to scramble interceptors or move air-defenses.

And referencing his estimates: the Ukraine advance is slowing down - that's not exactly a bad thing. Given what we've seen of Ukraine, and their military actually showing they are able to listen to advice, it likely means they are waiting for their logistics to catch up. But it also probably means that they need to wait for their supply lines because Russia is starting to regroup and you've got concentrations of pulled back troops that now that the front is restabilizing.

Unlike anyone in this thread, Davydov actually has lived in Ukraine and is familiar with area. As I said, that airport has been on the frontline of the War in Donbass for eight years now. It would be weirder if it wasn't in ruins. Considering the fact that he probably has local contacts, I'll take his word for it over random guy on the internet. As for him talking about Ukraine capturing Svatose, he himself mentioned that he got that prediction wrong. And, anyway, it was a prediction. He's allowed to get that wrong. As for airstrips, those are easy to destroy to make unusable. Years of fighting would have probably already damaged them beyond repair.

And while Ukraine isn't advancing across large chunks of terrain, they are still advancing, everyday, and Russia is doing little to stop them. Russia's transport networks and Svatose is already well within their artillery range. Meanwhile, Russia is literally stalled out completely in the Bakmut direction.

 

[Happy Fish]

That private company failed to get anything in legal writing or on govt. contracts on the terms of how long, and how much and everything else I missed. Since Musk volunteered StarLinks services to the war effort he on the hook until Uncle Sam said otherwise. All this because Musk didn't check with his legal and financial departments first.

I may well entirely wrong and he had via Starlink got the paperwork done first. But it leads to him wanting to publicly cancel it. Which again leads to the issue of breaking contract which right in the middle of a military conflict. Where that shit won't fly with either U.S. govt legal department, and those individuals you never want a visit from.

So basically fuck him for trying to be nice in the first place. Got it. That is some pretty stupid reasoning that I doubt would hold up in any court except aparently the court of left wing opinion.

 

[Uranus Pink]

So basically fuck him for trying to be nice in the first place. Got it. That is some pretty stupid reasoning that I doubt would hold up in any court except aparently the court of left wing opinion.

Wrong on where and how Musk got himself fucked. As this was something to take care of out of sight of the public eye. As bringing up problems like not enough pay to cover the costs could've easily been dealt through the proper channels. Which those "channels" it would've another day that ends in y and a nothing burger with Lend-Lease now covering the bill.

I been viewing his particular clusterfuck through historical to modern U.S. military procurement and he walked into it completely blind how that system operates. Which included a laundry list of ways he could've quietly and legally get himself and Starlink out from providing continued service.

Irrelevant of left or right side, I am on the side of helping Ukraine win. Cause I seen this story before and if Putin isn't stopped with Ukraine, he and/or his successors will continue until it is sea [Atlantic] to shining sea [Pacific] for the Russian expansion. And if it's wasn't an American problem now it sure as fuck will be soon enough.

 

[Happy Fish]

Wrong on where and how Musk got himself fucked. As this was something to take care of out of sight of the public eye. As bringing up problems like not enough pay to cover the costs could've easily been dealt through the proper channels. Which those "channels" it would've another day that ends in y and a nothing burger with Lend-Lease now covering the bill.

I been viewing his particular clusterfuck through historical to modern U.S. military procurement and he walked into it completely blind how that system operates. Which included a laundry list of ways he could've quietly and legally get himself and Starlink out from providing continued service.

Irrelevant of left or right side, I am on the side of helping Ukraine win. Cause I seen this story before and if Putin isn't stopped with Ukraine, he and/or just successors will continue until it is sea [Atlantic] to shining sea [Pacific] for the Russian expansion. And if it's wasn't an American problem now it sure as fuck will be soon enough.

It is far more likely he didn't want to continue to listen to pro Ukraine warhawks like yourself continue to bitch at him about it and is willing to pay to have one less headache.

 

[Uranus Pink]

It is far more likely he didn't want to continue to listen to pro Ukraine warhawks like yourself continue to bitch at him about it and is willing to pay to have one less headache.

Unfortunately for him, he walked right into this blindly naive on how that particular fun house of horror sausage plant is run. And now there's is no more exit strategy for him especially with the democrats in power.

Better a warhawk than stand aside and let another genocide happen.

 

[Vince McMahon]

It is far more likely he didn't want to continue to listen to pro Ukraine warhawks like yourself continue to bitch at him about it and is willing to pay to have one less headache.

He could've taken less Ambien and give his Twitter back to his handlers, if free Starlink subscription for the UAF bleeds money that much for him.

Poor little Musky-Wusky, getting that sweet good guy PR, basically hooking the entire military of a nation to free networking capacities and then not understanding why they get upset when he threatens to cut the supply.

 

[Uranus Pink]

Read the other thread on Elon, and if true that he thinks he pull one of his schemes on the democrat lead U.S. govt now that it is pissed off. Say hello to imminent domain cause why pay full asking price when the U.S. Govt can take all of his shit for free.