Gross Aella Martin / Rachael Antier Slick / Abigail Glass / @Aella_Girl / @Aellagirl / @Miss_Aella / u/Sweatywoman / RedVerse / Apostate Slick / Knowingless - Rationalist LessWrong poly libertarian hooker girl throwing rape orgy parties. Former $100k/month OnlyFans star and $3,000/hour prostitute. Would rather come up with gross hypotheticals than shower.

[Alfred MacDonald]

Can you give us more info on the broader "postrationalist" community? From what I've heard, most of these people have the right combination of obnoxious personality traits associated with being a great lolcow. If what I'm hearing is correct, you're being very euphemistic when you mention "a deficiency in us that makes us dumbasses on certain domains of social interaction."

I don't know a lot about them because I honestly consider them only useful as an anti-example. Most of them (e.g. default_friend) will be on https://www.youtube.com/@JustinMurphy/videos

This is batshit, and involves a lot of them: https://mcrumps.substack.com/p/my-own-dimes-square-fascist-humiliation

It's not the same thing as my dumbass comment, which I meant to mean "thinking this way makes us sometimes lose sight of what prevents us from dumbassing in the first place." I think "postrationalist" is far more ridiculous (as in literally, like mentioned earlier) on a fundamental level; it's like "anti-feminist", insofar as being "anti-rationalist" has a huge possible impact and likewise with anti-feminist; if you are anti-feminist over, say, what temperature the air conditioning should be in the "sexist air conditioning" debate, you might also attract people who say unironically hyper-misogynist things as a side-effect. If you are "anti-rationalist" you will cross the basic barrier of "people who think Roko's basilisk is a waste of time" and also allow "spiritualist hippies who unironically believe they can hex you or something."

(As an aside, the only person involved in this postrationalist sphere who hasn't been realnamed is Zero HP Lovecraft. He's an influencer of this demographic, though he broke with it and doesn't participate in it.)

There are good reasons to reject LessWrong-style rationalism, but this presumes you understand it; a lot of postrationalists never bothered. They are, essentially, yuppies/hippies with technology and high income.

 

[Madoka Magica]

I don't know a lot about them because I honestly consider them only useful as an anti-example. Most of them (e.g. default_friend) will be on https://www.youtube.com/@JustinMurphy/videos

This is batshit, and involves a lot of them: https://mcrumps.substack.com/p/my-own-dimes-square-fascist-humiliation

It's not the same thing as my dumbass comment, which I meant to mean "thinking this way makes us sometimes lose sight of what prevents us from dumbassing in the first place." I think "postrationalist" is far more ridiculous (as in literally, like mentioned earlier) on a fundamental level; it's like "anti-feminist", insofar as being "anti-rationalist" has a huge possible impact and likewise with anti-feminist; if you are anti-feminist over, say, what temperature the air conditioning should be in the "sexist air conditioning" debate, you might also attract people who say unironically hyper-misogynist things as a side-effect. If you are "anti-rationalist" you will cross the basic barrier of "people who think Roko's basilisk is a waste of time" and also allow "spiritualist hippies who unironically believe they can hex you or something."

(As an aside, the only person involved in this postrationalist sphere who hasn't been realnamed is Zero HP Lovecraft. He's an influencer of this demographic, though he broke with it and doesn't participate in it.)

There are good reasons to reject LessWrong-style rationalism, but this presumes you understand it; a lot of postrationalists never bothered. They are, essentially, yuppies/hippies with technology and high income.

Oh, I have a passing familiarity with these people and I read that Crumps essay when it came out. Would you say there's a strong overlap between the "postrationalist" community and the Dimes Square scene in the Crumps article? Who else stands out as noteworthy?

FWIW, Katherine Dee (default_friend) and Justin Murphy were hawking Milady NFTs long after Milady founder CharlotteFang77/Rohit Okhandiar was outed as a pedophile. Katherine also attended NYU with @Indian_Bronson, who is a good friend of @eigenrobot, whom you mentioned as the chief figure of the "postrationalist" crowd. I looked at Justin Murphy's YouTube page and noticed he interviewed both Aella Girl and Indian Bronson. He also has Curtis Yarvin on a lot. Most of these people are connected with Urbit too. Looks like an incestuous bunch.

I believe Zero HP Lovecraft was revealed to a mobile game developer or was that false? He seems to be close to the online "dissident right" along with BAP and those types.

 

[Dr. Butt]

People here think it's funny if you try to explain yourself to them. I wouldn't take their comments seriously, it's just the Internet.

They always try, though! Remember Nick Holliday's new wife and her tantrum? Adult men and women keep reading this shitlord hub, and after tens of thousands of pages of shitlording, still act surprised when shitlords make fun of them for caring. Everyone in this thread was counting down the days until Alfred here had his meltdown/flounce, tell me you weren't.

 

[Flatline]

Looks like you uploaded the paste today, is there any more context or receipts to this elsewhere?

The text file was dated October 2022. The conversation could've happened prior to that. Who knows. Still hilarious.

 

[Alfred MacDonald]

Would you say there's a strong overlap between the "postrationalist" community and the Dimes Square scene in the Crumps article? Who else stands out as noteworthy?

The weird thing about postrationalists is that you could group them together socially but they won't call themselves that; e.g. other than Yarvin, the most important person in the Dimes Square story is Dasha, who hosts the Red Scare podcast and would hang out with these people (and apparently does) but has very little involvement with ideas from LessWrong.

Another postrationalist I forgot is Chaos/Chaosprime. I forgot he existed until I checked Twitter to verify this. His posts are jokes but they're always just mildly funny; my friends call this stuff hehcore.

This is me speculating at this point, but a person who might be on board with this stuff is Grimes. She literally connected with Elon Musk through a Roko's basilisk joke so this is not implausible; it's more or less true to say her children with Elon Musk would not exist but for LessWrong.

I realize that all of this sounds extremely online, but it is also extremely online IRL, insofar as people in the tech industry are afraid to publicly beef with e.g. Aella or Eliezer Yudkowsky — especially Eliezer — because they might lose their job. For example, Aella was invited to Hereticon → Hereticon is funded by Founder's Fund → Founder's Fund was a source of funding for a startup that hired a friend of mine, though he no longer works there. Some dots people might not connect is that ability to influence and get money from Peter Thiel usually also means the ability to influence who does not get money from Peter Thiel.

 

[melty]

They always try, though! Remember Nick Holliday's new wife and her tantrum? Adult men and women keep reading this shitlord hub, and after tens of thousands of pages of shitlording, still act surprised when shitlords make fun of them for caring. Everyone in this thread was counting down the days until Alfred here had his meltdown/flounce, tell me you weren't.

That was pure gold. Her biggest mistake was thinking we cared about "sex worker exclusion", or thought she was anything but a stupid bpd whore.

@Alfred MacDonald can you elaborate on polyamory and open relationships in this community and it's consequences? Seems to be big with these types.

 

[Alfred MacDonald]

@Alfred MacDonald can you elaborate on polyamory and open relationships in this community and it's consequences? Seems to be big with these types.

This is a short one: they talk about a ton and never actually do it. Or, maybe it's more accurate to say that 90% of these people (IME) have normal monogamous relationships and kind of stan polyamory.

Biohacking is similar. I got a ludicrous number of questions about "the optimal diet" and "biohacking" before I knew answers to basic questions like "how much are you moving around".

However, I think the polyamory trend is reversing, but this is my speculation. I can say someone "looks polyamorous" (eg the music video) and a decent amount of people know what I mean.

 

[melty]

OP, can you add a poll on if Aella is a real researcher or a moron? Since internet polls are now research and I can't think of anyone better than the fine people at the Kiwi Institute of Lolcow Research to conduct this very important study

 

[Markass the Worst]

OP, can you add a poll on if Aella is a real researcher or a moron? Since internet polls are now research and I can't think of anyone better than the fine people at the Kiwi Institute of Lolcow Research to conduct this very important study

I'll ask staff because I don't seem to have a button to add a poll.

 

[Dr. Butt]

OP, can you add a poll on if Aella is a real researcher or a moron? Since internet polls are now research and I can't think of anyone better than the fine people at the Kiwi Institute of Lolcow Research to conduct this very important study

"Aella blew me for this vote"

 

[Pentobarbital]

(As an aside, the only person involved in this postrationalist sphere who hasn't been realnamed is Zero HP Lovecraft. He's an influencer of this demographic, though he broke with it and doesn't participate in it.)

I so wish there was more stuff floating online about this mofo. He's such a seether, his attempts at writing fiction are laughable and he certainly likes the smell of his brain farts a little too much. For the past year or two he decided to take on the persona of a semi-serious vengeful incel bent on unleashing sharia law on the West and it would be very interesting to know more about his (probably shitty) personal life.

 

[Dr. Butt]

Finally realized who these people are.

 

[Pentobarbital]

One of the bigger beefs Aella and I had was over Circling — I think it's culty and gives me NXIVM vibes. His ideology is roughly opposite mine, but Curtis Yarvin dunked on it pretty spectacularly; IMO he wimped out toward the end and didn't dig in hard enough, but he's still gone harder than anyone else in this... circle.

Overall very nice text by Yarvin. Kinda made me like him again, a little bit.

Reportedly, Aella and the discord mod and one other person started mocking another local guy — Nikita, whose voice has been ignored or diminished a lot — who said something too woo-ish for their tastes at a Circling event; however, I know this guy, and he's an uber-hippie style thinker who is going to gravitate to woo no matter what. This does not mean he's a bad person; he taught (and encouraged) me how to rollerblade when I fell down so many times I could barely move my wrist the next day. He does more or less everything with innocence and genuineness, so picking on him for woo strikes me like a kind of passive-aggressive bullying. This is especially not good if the environment he experienced this was an environment where he's supposed to lax his vulnerabilities, like Circling.

For all her pretense of being sooo different and autistic, Aella strikes me as the typical catty bitchy girl who needs to the the center of attention, so it's no wonder she's into passive-aggressive bullying. It's par for the course for people with this type of personality.

 

[Major Filth]

This is batshit, and involves a lot of them: https://mcrumps.substack.com/p/my-own-dimes-square-fascist-humiliation

Since you're dumping, do you know of any connection between Aella and the newly-scandalous Effective Altruists Sam "Wankman" Bankman-Fried and Caroline "Methweasel" Ellison?

 

[AirdropShitposts]

Fuck, I keep thinking of things. @AirdropShitposts has a gift for this kind of intuition so I'll just leave this info and defer to Airdrop for a verdict.

One of the bigger beefs Aella and I had was over Circling — I think it's culty and gives me NXIVM vibes. His ideology is roughly opposite mine, but Curtis Yarvin dunked on it pretty spectacularly; IMO he wimped out toward the end and didn't dig in hard enough, but he's still gone harder than anyone else in this... circle.

She got a few of my friends to go to it. Our arguments were usually over whether Circling was culty or not; my counterargument was "this is like $70 for me to do Circling and drive to Austin and back and it will take a whole evening plus that money." (My income then was about 25k/yr.)

Reportedly, Aella and the discord mod and one other person started mocking another local guy — Nikita, whose voice has been ignored or diminished a lot — who said something too woo-ish for their tastes at a Circling event; however, I know this guy, and he's an uber-hippie style thinker who is going to gravitate to woo no matter what. This does not mean he's a bad person; he taught (and encouraged) me how to rollerblade when I fell down so many times I could barely move my wrist the next day. He does more or less everything with innocence and genuineness, so picking on him for woo strikes me like a kind of passive-aggressive bullying. This is especially not good if the environment he experienced this was an environment where he's supposed to lax his vulnerabilities, like Circling.

I don't really understand what this is exactly because I only looked at Yarvin's article and the website for the "Institute" but this is totally a fucking cult just based on the garbage they put on their website.

But also I don't really understand because it's fucking gibberish:


Nonsense new age shit mashed up with corporate speak mashed up with social justice nonsense:

Learn what it is from our page that says "What is Circling?" Fuck you, pay for an authorized coach:


Make sure you don't just call it circling btw it's Circling™ and you better have authorization to use that trademark, buddy.

One thing I immediately think, what a great idea, confession and being vulnerable, what could go wrong by doing this in a group of passive aggressive people looking to destroy each other to achieve social status. Absolutely no way this will ever look like self-criticism and struggle sessions of the Cultural Revolution only even more super passive aggressive than every other elite space like academia or Twitter.

Yarvin's reference to the suppressive person of Scientology is actually apt for a lot of what these types of people do on Twitter, etc. Tell me this doesn't look like "cancel culture" and other "social justice" practice tenets or whatever you want to call it:



In the immortal words of MovieBob: "No Bad Tactics, Only Bad Targets"

This is a short one: they talk about a ton and never actually do it. Or, maybe it's more accurate to say that 90% of these people (IME) have normal monogamous relationships and kind of stan polyamory.

Biohacking is similar. I got a ludicrous number of questions about "the optimal diet" and "biohacking" before I knew answers to basic questions like "how much are you moving around".

However, I think the polyamory trend is reversing, but this is my speculation. I can say someone "looks polyamorous" (eg the music video) and a decent amount of people know what I mean.

The Kiwi Farms philosopher (not me) who pointed out that people who talk about polyamory the most always tend to be people who can't comprehend normal friendships and have weird sexual hangups was ahead of his time. It always seems like some hypothetical ideal state and nothing nobody actually seems to even attempt to practice.

Lots of people here (including me) have pointed out how a lot of actual, I don't know, fetish culture? or legit sex trade type people don't talk about their shit as much as all the sex obsessed weirdos on Twitter do. It's always this kind of theoretical fantasy world they like to discuss publicly but never really experience publicly or privately. I guess Aella is a bit out of the norm in that we have proof she sometimes does what she talks about.

I wouldn't be surprised if that's part of the value of her brand. Her posting porn makes the fantasy of the common friendship but with no strings sex polyamory lifestyle seem more realistic and tangible. Zoe Quinn's problem was that the fad and social status from looking down at the uncultured squares who weren't intellectual enough to grasp the truths hadn't come about yet.

On the plus side, Aella's not fat. (Yet.)

 

[Major Filth]

Lots of people here (including me) have pointed out how a lot of actual, I don't know, fetish culture? or legit sex trade type people don't talk about their shit as much as all the sex obsessed weirdos on Twitter do. It's always this kind of theoretical fantasy world they like to discuss publicly but never really experience publicly or privately.

Not to derail, but ok - extrapolate from that. If you notice many people singing about the virtues of polyamory without actually practicing it, what does that say about other people singing about the virtues of other fetishes/degeneracies/lifestyle choices? "This seems like something that should be destigmatized because there's no logical reason for it to be stigmatized in the first place. Let me be the first to declare myself X on a major Internet site to start the destigmatization process!"

No proof of work required. No need to actually follow through. "I get off to the idea of getting railed by three dudes in a row but only if they stick a little meth up my ass first as a permission slip." Never happened, never going to happen, and you just posted that so you don't actually have to do it.

I guess Aella is a bit out of the norm in that we have proof she sometimes does what she talks about.

Do we? Has she posted up anything that did anything but validate her as Escort to the Stars? Or some reddit /r/gonewild shit?

 

[Alfred MacDonald]

Aella strikes me as the typical catty bitchy girl who needs to the the center of attention, so it's no wonder she's into passive-aggressive bullying. It's par for the course for people with this type of personality.

She can be, I think because she has something equivalent to Former Fat Kid syndrome: if you used to be fat and lost a lot of weight, it's easy to fall into a mindset where you think it's impossible for you to be the bully.

So, when she is, I don't think she knows she's being that way; I think it's one of those "I used to be a target of the Mean Girls so I can't be the Regina George here" situations.

Since you're dumping, do you know of any connection between Aella and the newly-scandalous Effective Altruists Sam "Wankman" Bankman-Fried and Caroline "Methweasel" Ellison?

A lot of people are curious about this. I never connected much with EA; I was turned off ever since a higher up in the main group dismissed my thread on effective ways to help the homeless as "first world poverty" and not their focus. A group that allows highly speculative posts about AI but rejects up-front a post about helping homelessness isn't a group I'm very interested in.

With that said, I should probably weigh in on something. I know a lot of people are speculating that Aella & Co. are child predators. I can't speak to the other ones — only Aella.

I'm confident Aella is not any sort of risk to children. I'm extremely confident that her obsession with polls about weird childhood stuff is due to her interest in being edgy. When she's controversial she gets way more followers than when she's not controversial. This is what's happened ever since I knew her; she collects literally edgy (as in edge case) questions because it drives her engagement numbers up.

She also believes she's doing real research. This isn't a ploy to trick people or something. Her ego has been incurably inflated by the various credentialed people — and very wealthy people — telling her that college is a waste of time and so on.

Doing research on your own is very hard. Hell, *learning a new field* on your own is very hard. I self-taught myself enough exercise science to be capable of getting certifications, but it took an eternity; it would have been way more efficient to get a second BA/BS in kinesiology.

Aella is taking the hard road, but she wants shortcuts at the same time. This leads to stuff like her posts about not listening to doctors and being her own doctor, which is the sort of thing I'm hoping to prevent by posting here in the first place.

There is a point when a lot of us learn things when we feel we can say "ok, I have this right." This is probably different for a lot of different fields and jobs. My point here is that Aella has no "ok I think I have this right" discipline. She wants more or less instant results.

Just to name one example: in a Twitter thread where Aella asked for help learning Python, she was overwhelmed with resources and people handholding her through the process and she was still entitled about it.

There is literally nothing I could say at this point that would make her realize that if research is what she wants to do for real she's going to need to buckle down and spend a lot of time with real experts.

So, to tie this back, this is why you're going to keep getting weird polls about children and why she seems fixated on children. They're attention-grabbing because they're an edgy subject that causes controversy, which in turn boosts her audience numbers, and with a larger audience comes more validation that she's doing Research.

I dread the day she is coauthor on a paper that she barely did any work for, where she can then say that she has a record of academic publications, but the unfortunate and annoying truth is it'll probably happen — likewise with her search for an extremely rich tech guy in an influential position.

 

[Markass the Worst]

Totally normal human behavior:

source (a)

I didn't have to hunt for this reply it was literally the first one that showed up:


She also published a new Substack article with a big brain midwit take on trauma:

source (a)

The rest of the post doesn't get better, she openly admits to just letting ChatGPT write the conclusion (no I am not making this shit up). Assuming she isn't lying about her sexual assault not being traumatizing (and even if it wasn't she still doesn't seem fine), the analogy to touching a stove and not getting burned when others do is telling. She's either ignorant or openly aware of the fact she's implicitly advocating for more people to touch the stove no matter the consequences.

"I touched the stove and I didn't get burnt, I'm fine!" No, bitch, touching the stove is a bad thing to do, period.

 

[Crawlspace Spelunker]

A lot of people are curious about this. I never connected much with EA; I was turned off ever since a higher up in the main group dismissed my thread on effective ways to help the homeless as "first world poverty" and not their focus. A group that allows highly speculative posts about AI but rejects up-front a post about helping homelessness isn't a group I'm very interested in.

My limited experience with EA shit has convinced me that regardless of what it started as, it's basically become prosperity gospel for autistic engineers.

 

[Lord Quackers]

This woman makes sense if you assume she has no soul and is not technically human