What is your opinion on using the services of prostitutes?

[King George III]

All the whores in my area are either on meth or opioids and I would not have sex with them.

 

[rel=alternate]

while it's true you'll never truly eliminate the practice, legalizing it essentially gives social consent to letting others violate your body for money. do you really want that in your society? a cohort of people who produce nothing, who add dubious value to the economy, engaging in a personally degrading business, not to mention the additional mass disease vector that represents since sexual contact is such a great way to spread a wide number of illnesses. you're also signaling that it's valid for sexual desire to trump personal attachment. this type of hedonism undermines social ties and results in a weaker citizenry. and to the laissez-faire argument of "let whoever wants to do it, do it" - have you read about what's happening with the volunteer suicide thing in Canada right now? people with incurable diseases, or even diseases that are curable but expensive to treat, are being encouraged to just fucking kill themselves to curtail the burden on the medical system and to save their families money. many people are already forced into sex work for economic reasons - rest assured that legalization will make that situation much more dire. education, self-improvement, job searching, etc. are all difficult to accomplish. however, if you're reasonably attractive and have a vagina, it's not exactly difficult to find a guy who might be open to a little financial coercion for sex. how many people who could actually contribute positively to society will end up defaulting to sex work because it's easier?

imagine combining this with our current "gig economy" paradigm... download a convenient app to find pussy for rent in your area. corporate pimping, a whole industry of companies built on facilitating access to sex and taking a cut from it. young women being encouraged to fuck a little on the side to help pay the bills or put themselves through college. imagine dating in your 30s or even late 20s, where every available girl has almost certainly had their hole blown out by countless other dicks, far worse than it already is today. being in a devoted relationship is an economic disadvantage, unless you manage to convince your SO to allow themselves to be cucked to ratchet down the financial stress a bit. imagine your family being hit with a sudden debt you have to pay off ASAP - renting out your body is a good way to make some quick money. we can handle it, it's not like we're cheating on each other or anything - these are strangers we don't have any feelings for, and anyway, what's worse: doing a bit of side fucking, or losing the house? think of the kids.

nah, man, you don't want to open that can of worms.

I understand your point, but I am not sure that I agree with the fact that this would somehow lead to general acceptance by the greater public, and thus increase the demographic of people willing to engage in said degrading acts for money.

It might be a difficult argument to make when you look at the legion of tards who are on OnlyFans, and where crazy people are trying to normalize degeneracy. I agree.

However, I also have actual experience in living in countries where prostitution happens to be legal and regulated, and it did not appear to be more morally accepted. It's just something people are aware off, son of a whore is still the worst insult you can muster, and nobody has prostitute friends or anything like that.

 

[Tren Shapiro]

The problem with incels isn't that they haven't had sex. The problem is all their issues that lead to them not being able to have sex.

 

[Pedophobe]

I personally would not and I think most people would be better off pursuing something else, but at the end of the day it's your life and if that's what works for you then so be it.

 

[YE24]

Hot take: Porn should be banned and prostitutes legalized. We'd get less incels and troons if we just banned porn and forced them to interact with real women.

Saint Thomas Aquinas said "Take away prostitutes from the world, and you will fill it with sodomy". St Augustine (not Daddy Jim) argued that prostitution was a necessary evil, to prevent worse vices from taking root. Hard to disagree knowing what we know.

Romanist cult Not-Disrespect-The-Words-Of-Jesus challenge: IMPOSSIBLE.

Participating in whoredom (porneia in Greek, derives from pernaō, "to sell off", so we're perfectly clear what we're talking about) is one of few sexual sins Jesus preaches against directly. (Matt 15:19 among other places)

 

[I'm Retarded?]

I understand your point, but I am not sure that I agree with the fact that this would somehow lead to general acceptance by the greater public, and thus increase the demographic of people willing to engage in said degrading acts for money.

It might be a difficult argument to make when you look at the legion of tards who are on OnlyFans, and where crazy people are trying to normalize degeneracy. I agree.

However, I also have actual experience in leaving in countries where prostitution happens to be legal and regulated, and it did not appear to be more morally accepted. It's just something people are aware off, son of a whore is still the worst insult you can muster, and nobody has prostitute friends or anything like that.

you could say this about porn too. up through the latter third of the 20th century, the distribution of pornography was heavily fought and restricted on multiple fronts, but relaxation of legal standards opened up the floodgates and now you have generations born in a world where access to hardcore pornography is immediate and commonplace. the demand for depictions of sex has fueled the industry up to the titanic status it enjoys today. this demand dictates the material the producers are targeting - you can read testimonials from various recognizable names like Jenna Jamison to see how that worked out for the actors. and as evidence for potential societal ills caused by the widespread use of pornography, hell, I don't know if I could list em all. but take the troons as a particularly revolting example; men who are literally trying to turn themselves into hentai girls because it sexually excites them. before the use of porn exploded, it had some tacit acceptance in France in particular, where there was a much more relaxed social attitude about depictions of sex. and of course there's a long history of pornographic materials before this point i.e. Tijuana bibles etc, but it was the effective legalization in America in particular that created the monstrosity we know today due to the open, ultimately sanctioned marriage of the sex industry with the American obsession with hedonism and wealth accumulation.

 

[DumbDude43]

prostitution is inherently degrading and demeaning to all parties involved. even if they don't see it that way at the time, they 100% will recognize and regret it later down the line.
the whores themselves debase themselves and have their bodies violated for money, the johns have their loneliness and desperation exploited for money.
the only real winners in this 'business' are the pimps, the madams, the brothel owners who basically just skim money off the top and get rich off other peoples misfortune.

it also doesn't do anything about incels. these guys issue is lack of genuine female affection, hiring a hooker to play pretend with them doesn't fix the problem at all. they need girlfriends and wives, not walking fleshlights and organic glory holes.

so it's a pretty ugly and bad thing overall, and that's before even considering all the related issues such as STDs, drugs, crime, human trafficking, etc, all of which still keep happening around it even in areas where it is fully legalized.

 

[rel=alternate]

you could say this about porn too. up through the latter third of the 20th century, the distribution of pornography was heavily fought and restricted on multiple fronts, but relaxation of legal standards opened up the floodgates and now you have generations born in a world where access to hardcore pornography is immediate and commonplace. the demand for depictions of sex has fueled the industry up to the titanic status it enjoys today. this demand dictates the material the producers are targeting - you can read testimonials from various recognizable names like Jenna Jamison to see how that worked out for the actors. and as evidence for potential societal ills caused by the widespread use of pornography,

I think they are different. Pornography is self fulfilling and encourages unhealthy behavior, it takes away from the excitement of sex. It makes it boring, and that's why people go into extremes in my opinion. They want the thrill back, and makes them dig themselves further and further.

Many people who hire prostitutes where it's legal go for the higher end of the market (escorts are prostitutes, just different), and they have to put the effort to make the experience worthwhile.

Even if you're paying for it, you still want to feel desirable, you are still interacting with a real human being. There is stress, there is self consciousness, there is excitation. I don't think they can be compared.

but take the troons as a particularly revolting example; men who are literally trying to turn themselves into hentai girls because it sexually excites them. before the use of porn exploded, it had some tacit acceptance in France in particular, where there was a much more relaxed social attitude about depictions of sex.

Do you have an example?

I lived in France, there are no trannies, nobody gives a fuck about weirdos.

 

[Space Lazer Shark]

while it's true you'll never truly eliminate the practice, legalizing it essentially gives social consent to letting others violate your body for money. do you really want that in your society? a cohort of people who produce nothing, who add dubious value to the economy, engaging in a personally degrading business, not to mention the additional mass disease vector that represents since sexual contact is such a great way to spread a wide number of illnesses. you're also signaling that it's valid for sexual desire to trump personal attachment. this type of hedonism undermines social ties and results in a weaker citizenry. and to the laissez-faire argument of "let whoever wants to do it, do it" - have you read about what's happening with the volunteer suicide thing in Canada right now? people with incurable diseases, or even diseases that are curable but expensive to treat, are being encouraged to just fucking kill themselves to curtail the burden on the medical system and to save their families money. many people are already forced into sex work for economic reasons - rest assured that legalization will make that situation much more dire. education, self-improvement, job searching, etc. are all difficult to accomplish. however, if you're reasonably attractive and have a vagina, it's not exactly difficult to find a guy who might be open to a little financial coercion for sex. how many people who could actually contribute positively to society will end up defaulting to sex work because it's easier?

imagine combining this with our current "gig economy" paradigm... download a convenient app to find pussy for rent in your area. corporate pimping, a whole industry of companies built on facilitating access to sex and taking a cut from it. young women being encouraged to fuck a little on the side to help pay the bills or put themselves through college. imagine dating in your 30s or even late 20s, where every available girl has almost certainly had their hole blown out by countless other dicks, far worse than it already is today. being in a devoted relationship is an economic disadvantage, unless you manage to convince your SO to allow themselves to be cucked to ratchet down the financial stress a bit. imagine your family being hit with a sudden debt you have to pay off ASAP - renting out your body is a good way to make some quick money. we can handle it, it's not like we're cheating on each other or anything - these are strangers we don't have any feelings for, and anyway, what's worse: doing a bit of side fucking, or losing the house? think of the kids.

nah, man, you don't want to open that can of worms.

You're right, i didn't quite look at it from that perspective yet, a very convincing argument!
While i have no problem with the concept of casual sex and a more laid back attitude about intimacy the idea of commercializing it might bring on horrors we have yet to fully envision.
I support the outlawing of prostitution not because i want to throw people who are desperate for money in jail, but rather because the potential for social degeneration would be too high.
Sex should be done out of passion, whether that be making love with your significant other or just a fling to have fun, bringing money into the equation just fucks with incentives too much.
Perhaps it's for the better it remains shunned and criminalized, it'd just save our society as a whole a lot of headaches.

Also not having pussy available on demand with payment might just keep the incentive for most people to at least take care of themselves to be appealing to others, just a thought.
Not saying all people would suddenly stop taking care of themselves when they can buy themselves into some box but i imagine there'd be less of a motivation.

 

[I'm Retarded?]

I think they are different. Pornography is self fulfilling and encourages unhealthy behavior, it takes away from the excitement of sex. It makes it boring, and that's why people go into extremes in my opinion. They want the thrill back, and makes them dig themselves further and further.

Many people who hire prostitutes where it's legal go for the higher end of the market (escorts are prostitutes, just different), and they have to put the effort to make the experience worthwhile.

Even if you're paying for it, you still want to feel desirable, you are still interacting with a real human being. There is stress, there is self consciousness, there is excitation. I don't think they can be compared.

it's true that they're not identical, but I think they're more similar than not. in fact I would argue prostitution is more pernicious as it usually involves the reduction of a human interaction to something more like pornography, i.e., an apersonal fulfillment of desire, whereas porn starts and ends there. hiring an escort is certainly something different and something that I imagine represents a minority of sex work cases.

Do you have an example?

I lived in France, there are no trannies, nobody gives a fuck about weirdos.

sorry, I meant depictions of sex in particular, like around the early to mid 20th century. something like this film, which is not exactly hardcore pornography to be sure; it was generally well-received in France, but caused a minor moral panic when it was brought here

 

[rel=alternate]

it's true that they're not identical, but I think they're more similar than not. in fact I would argue prostitution is more pernicious as it usually involves the reduction of a human interaction to something more like pornography, i.e., an apersonal fulfillment of desire, whereas porn starts and ends there. hiring an escort is certainly something different and something that I imagine represents a minority of sex work cases.

I personally think that, by legalizing AND regulating, you actually foster the higher end market. Because they actually make more money, you don't eliminate the pimps, but you control them, and when girls have made enough money, they start their own thing. If it was illegal, they would not be lawyers, they would just be crack whores.

This does not eliminate the low end of Chinese or East European trafficked girl issue. But it makes them stand out a lot more.

I don't think we will agree. But I do respect your opinion on the subject.

I think most incels are just scared. And that porn is so confortable. The more they ruminate, the more scared they are of women. Even if their dream scenario was to happen, most would just run away because they would be scared.

sorry, I meant depictions of sex in particular, like around the early to mid 20th century. something like this film, which is not exactly hardcore pornography to be sure; it was generally well-received in France, but caused a minor moral panic when it was brought here

This is true. French people don't really have a problem with sex or graphic representation. US is also very prude, even by general EU standards, so I can see how that would be a little bit shocking. Not anywhere near as degenerate though.

 

[Caesare]

Look at the wonderful company you keep biblically as a whoremonger, ie. someone who frequents prostitutes.

Whoremonger is someone who sells the services of prostitutes, also known as a pimp. Someone who frequents prostitutes is a john.

STDs don't feel good and paying for them would probably feel worse.

You don't have to risk stds. You can wear a rubber or just go to get some head.

 

[Nick Gars]

I don't particularly care what two consenting adults do.

That being said, casual sex is degenerate and degrading to both parties. I'd rather not have sex ever again in my life than encourage that self-destructive behavior. As stated earlier as well in the thread, Incel's issue isn't that they can't get laid. More often then not, their shitty personality and myriad of complexes is why the vast majority of people want nothing to do with them. You don't deserve a mate if you can't even address the issues with yourself.

I'm aware not all Incel's fall into this classification, some are legitimately just down on their luck uggo's or autists getting shafted by society, but more often than not, they're exactly what I outlined above.

The only way I would be fine with legal prostitution is if it was done with a concerted effort to regulate things (no pimps, they should be beheaded to begin with) and to mitigate human trafficking. Given the track record of the governments of the world at large, however, I have zero faith in such an endeavor actually coming to bear fruit, let alone not devolving in to a corrupt dumpster fire of utter bullshit.

 

[Shitted Scaredless]

Make that money, it's not my business.

 

[The Luigi Player]

reddit moment

 

[WelperHelper99]

It's like gambling, a fool and his money will soon be parted, just now with a side of aids and regret. Only winners are the pimps.

 

[Caesare]

It's like gambling, a fool and his money will soon be parted, just now with a side of aids and regret. Only winners are the pimps.

I can't speak for overseas, but most American prostitutes aren't beholden to pimps like it's the 1950s/1960s. With the internet/cellphones, they can screen customers and work alone for the most part, and that's how they keep in touch with their well paying, repeat customers. Some of them might have a driver or drivers they use, but that's about it. The massage parlor girls work by themselves, but they're an entire business, so they're protected in that way. But yeah, pimps in America are a thing of the past.

As stated earlier as well in the thread, Incel's issue isn't that they can't get laid. More often then not, their shitty personality and myriad of complexes is why the vast majority of people want nothing to do with them. You don't deserve a mate if you can't even address the issues with yourself.

I'm aware not all Incel's fall into this classification, some are legitimately just down on their luck uggo's or autists getting shafted by society, but more often than not, they're exactly what I outlined above.

When I first learned about the concept of "incels" I wondered that as well. Why don't they just pay a girl to get off if that's all they're looking for? But the more I learned about them, it seems like a lot of them aren't totally fixated on the sex part, rather they're into the whole "having a relationship" part. It seems like more extreme loneliness for them rather than just the urge to get off with another human being. But they're damaged people, so they can't form those connections and have a relationship for whatever reasons.

Then they find these communities online where they can fester in their misery, just like every other online echo chamber full of weirdos.

 

[Shamefur Dispray]

What people really want is to feel close to another person. And that will cause a lot of people to engage in something casual or pointless just to drive away the empty feelings of life even if it is just temporarily.
Sex has just become an instant gratification shortcut to that. It makes me feel a lot of disgust by seeing a person waste their potential pursuing meaningless and hollow carnal pursuits over more fulfilling options.

I don't know maybe I'm a prude, maybe I'm too optimistic or maybe I was just born in the wrong century. It's all so tiresome.

 

[I'm Retarded?]

I personally think that, by legalizing AND regulating, you actually foster the higher end market. Because they actually make more money, you don't eliminate the pimps, but you control them, and when girls have made enough money, they start their own thing. If it was illegal, they would not be lawyers, they would just be crack whores.

This does not eliminate the low end of Chinese or East European trafficked girl issue. But it makes them stand out a lot more.

I don't think we will agree. But I do respect your opinion on the subject.

I'm not sure... I think it depends on the nature of demand. I don't have any hard data that establishes the ratio to which the Average Paid Sex Enjoyer prefers high-end or low-end prostitution. perhaps I'm being cynical, but my gut says a very strong number of them, likely the majority, would engage in low-end prostitution, and all the degeneracy it brings with it. because although having something like a rent-a-girlfriend escort service is nice for somebody who's looking for the social aspect and validation, I think a lot of people, especially in our age of isolation and depersonalization, would prefer the simpler physical transaction. additionally, once you open that door to find out, I think it will very quickly become impossible to close even if the results are undesirable. but if it ever comes to pass, I hope you're right.

I think most incels are just scared. And that porn is so confortable. The more they ruminate, the more scared they are of women. Even if their dream scenario was to happen, most would just run away because they would be scared.

lol, I agree. like somebody else in this thread said, incels are incels because of their own retarded brain problems; access to sex likely has very little to do with it.

This is true. French people don't really have a problem with sex or graphic representation. US is also very prude, even by general EU standards, so I can see how that would be a little bit shocking. Not anywhere near as degenerate though.

yeah, I think this is a particularly American problem. for sure other cultures have some weird sex culture problems (like India lol) but in America, consumption culture is toxic as hell and infects absolutely everything. everything in this country ultimately becomes a commodity for somebody to profit off of regardless of the social consequences.

 

[Shadfan666xxx000]

I've used prostitutes before and I'm pretty much sworn off of it. It helped me in its own way to get over my own complexes about women that I picked up. That said, I was lucky to get some decent ones and I'd still keep it illegal. Not to get rid of it, but to keep the stigma where it is. Getting normal people into that kind of thing in current year would probably spell disaster.