Ukrainian Defensive War against the Russian Invasion - Mark IV: The Partitioning of Discussion

[Trig.Point]

TBF Putin "disappearing" dissidents and his love of strategic bombing hardly compares to the very public and systematic executions and liberal use of WMDs during the Saddam regime.

It's fucking bizarre when Republicans (and the "right" in general) are echoing Chinese propaganda and Democrats are making visits to Taiwan. It's like everyone switched sides overnight.

I'm still shocked Nancy Pelosi did that. It genuinely was a power move.

There was a bit of muttering in the world media about 'antagonizing' China. Yet at the same time there was an acceptance that Major US politicians can do things, that other world politicians wouldn't dare.

Looks like a heavy machine gun mounted into some sort of armored cockpit thing? Either for close Anti-Air work or Infantry Support.

The engine on an MT-LB is behind the driver and commander, so if they're going to fit a large turret, it has to be way at the back.




In contrast a western APC such as an M113/FV 432 you can mount a turret where the mortar hatch is.

 

[Pocket Dragoon]

Want to know what being in the middle of a Russian WP incendiary attack looks like?

Bakhmut last night:

Beautiful but deadly.

 

[Ghostse]

Looks like a heavy machine gun mounted into some sort of armored cockpit thing? Either for close Anti-Air work or Infantry Support.

Looks like anti-air, gun looks over the 20mm range.
It also might be Anti-Air turrets but destined to be used like the M-42 Duster that was a dual 40mm anti-air tank they discovered was just aces at mowing down Charlie in the open or light/medium cover

 

[Pocket Dragoon]

View attachment 4696856

Look at this beauty.

Whoever will guess what the hell ruzzkies are thinking doing this should win a Noble prize.

Looks like anti-air, gun looks over the 20mm range.
It also might be Anti-Air turrets but destined to be used like the M-42 Duster that was a dual 40mm anti-air tank they discovered was just aces at mowing down Charlie in the open or light/medium cover.

I posted one that got spotted & destroyed by a Ukrainian drone in the old A&N thread, circa November last year; an MT-LB with patrol-boat turret. They were indeed using it for anti-drone work, which is why being destroyed by a drone was so amusing.

The fact that they'd make more illustrates the current state of Russian short-range air-defense, manufacturing capabilities, and material aid from their allies.... or a lack thereof. Ukraine absolutely needed to build technicals like this, especially early on before Gepards, etc showed up, but Russia?

 

[No bullying allowed]

Want to know what being in the middle of a Russian WP incendiary attack looks like?

Bakhmut last night:
View attachment 46970600:24-:-0:251x0%
Beautiful but deadly.

Not WP, magnesium and thermite. But yes, does look spectacular.

 

[CaptainAutism69]

Want to know what being in the middle of a Russian WP incendiary attack looks like?

Bakhmut last night:
View attachment 4697060
Beautiful but deadly.

It's not WP, it's thermite.

Edit: bitch beat me too it

 

[Random Internet Person]

In every case that is something the Russians brought upon themselves through their actions over the last 200 years. Turns out being an imperialist dick tends to make the neighbors you fucked with not too fond of you.

And now all Russia can turn to for support is bunch of online people who project onto them as their desire to fight against the interests of blue check Twitter, the Biden Administration, Congress, and the US State Department. Whatever helps them sleep at night.

 

[Techpriest Mk II]

Does anyone have any idea what battlefield role that thing is supposed to have?
My best guess is mobile anti-air/anti-drone.

it's a SPAAG in the most ghetto way possible, that shit will need to be manually cranked.

Looks like a heavy machine gun mounted into some sort of armored cockpit thing? Either for close Anti-Air work or Infantry Support.

It's a 25mm naval gun originally mounted on patrol boats in like the 50's and 60's.

 

[Jewthulhu]

I posted one that got spotted & destroyed by a Ukrainian drone in the old A&N thread, circa November last year; an MT-LB with patrol-boat turret. They were indeed using it for anti-drone work, which is why being destroyed by a drone was so amusing.

The fact that they'd make more illustrates the current state of Russian short-range air-defense, manufacturing capabilities, and material aid from their allies.... or a lack thereof. Ukraine absolutely needed to build technicals like this, especially early on before Gepards, etc showed up, but Russia?

Eh. Light offensive drones are a new threat I don't think anyone expected. They're much cheaper to use and replace than they are to shoot down with modern systems, so pulling out old AA or turret systems is all you can really do at the moment. Ghettoizing an APC with a patrol-boat turret for anti-drone work actually kind of makes sense here, as ugly as it looks.

 

[MG-34]

View attachment 4696856

Look at this beauty.

Whoever will guess what the hell ruzzkies are thinking doing this should win a Noble prize.

Did they give this Wakandan tier upgrade an official destination or is this the child of too much korkodil and a welders touch?

 

[AgendaPoster]

Want to know what being in the middle of a Russian WP incendiary attack looks like?

Bakhmut last night:
View attachment 4697060
Beautiful but deadly.

Sir, it looks like 2 respectable gentlemen from the infestation topic have corrected you.
I hope you understand that huwhite phosphorus deaths are horrific and there are good reasons it is forbidden. Probably only Nazis would use such a thing!
Meanwhile, it is widely recognized by multiple experts that thermite burning is comfy and cute, and causes no distress whatsoever to the alleged victims.

 

[Snekposter]

Oh they do, we're just lulling them into a false sense of security. Then, when they least expect it, our entire army will get on the Eurostar and ride to conquer Paris.

Considering the state of Europe these days you don't need an army. Just send what few hooligans you have left into Paris and the French will be raising the white flag in no time.

I will say that the Chunnel makes it easy to launch a sneak attack. No need to worry about the CDG blowing up your landing forces. Everyone from Nelson to Jellicoe has to be spinning in their graves at what's become of the Royal Navy, especially compared to the French Navy.

Eh. Light offensive drones are a new threat I don't think anyone expected. They're much cheaper to use and replace than they are to shoot down with modern systems, so pulling out old AA or turret systems is all you can really do at the moment. Ghettoizing an APC with a patrol-boat turret for anti-drone work actually kind of makes sense here, as ugly as it looks.

Except it doesn't really work all that well since trying to manually target a tiny thing like a drone and land a direct hit with a shell is almost impossible. I don't think the SHORAD-M the USA is deploying has VT shells, but it does have automatic target tracking and Stinger missiles for if the gun won't work. The Russians would have had better luck handing out Iglas to guys and having them ride around in pickup trucks than converting MT-LB tanks to this. Random note, but anyone want to take a guess if/when Gaijin adds it to the Russian lineup and at what battle rating?

 

[BaldAndMorallyBankrupt]

So who's winning?

 

[Elämällä on väliä]

My best guess is mobile anti-air/anti-drone.

When they ordered this turret (both Hitler and Stalin was stillalive and WW2 in Europe still was on role) this was invented as light gun for extreme light ships (more like patrol bords for border guards or so). I don't think MT-LB with this will be good to shoot a drone from air.

Looks like a heavy machine gun mounted into some sort of armored cockpit/turret thing?

And it is called 2M-3. I try to find any historic uses of this (like 'is this capadle to do anything' rather than 'on which they mounted this', because they produced a fuckton of this turrets), but... well.

 

[Snekposter]

So who's winning?

Nobody. Russia has been unable to capitalize on its initial gains at the start, and has even been pushed back on its flanks. Losses have forced it to resort to manpower and materiel reserves of low quality that have no business being anywhere near active combat, however they have enough of both Ukraine has been unable to make any serious advances past their initial very successful counterattack. But Bakhmut has finally fallen and a thousand Ukrainian divisions were encircled and wiped out Ukraine managed to evacuate everyone from it in good order, same as they did with Soledar. Oops.

And now, from a moral instead of purely military perspective, when you look at the sheer size difference between Russia and Ukraine, every day Ukraine holds their ground is a day they can call a win.

 

[Elämällä on väliä]

But Bakhmut has finally fallen and a thousand Ukrainian divisions were encircled and wiped out Ukraine managed to evacuate everyone from it in good order, same as they did with Soledar. Oops.

...and Bakhmut is still not secured by ruzzkies. Piggozhin is already crying for more monke to his private army to just take abandoned territory.

Now it looks like even rear guard of AFU will be evacuated without big fighting.

So who's winning?

AFU iis proceding evacuation from Bakhmut and in the same time they breached (only in quick raiding) border with ruzzia in Bryansk and Belgorod Oblasts in few points.

Both sides are bombing each other, but photoevidence suggest that ruzzia is losing important instalations (like reffinery in Tuapse few days ago) when. Faggots from Moscow are bombing civilian objects like residental buildings like all faggots do always.

Probably they will be no major moves before middle of April.

 

[mindlessobserver]

View attachment 4696856

Look at this beauty.

Whoever will guess what the hell ruzzkies are thinking doing this should win a Noble prize.

Probably some sort of Anti-Drone thing. But its real use is probably going to be for target practice. There is a REASON Battlefield Taxis like that have a low profile.

 

[Pocket Dragoon]

I try to find any historic uses of this (like 'is this capadle to do anything' rather than 'on which they mounted this', because they produced a fuckton of this turrets), but... well.

So I went back and found the first one


My bad, later than Nov. & captured in the vicinity of Vulhedar; not destroyed.

Edit: upon further digging, they're definitely using these for anti-drone work; or at least spraying Ukrainian treelines from afar.

Here are more examples:

Spoiler: Russian YT channel talking about them

Addendum: VPK-7829 "Bumerang" IFVs ( ) seen on their way to the front.

Spoiler: Video in Russian. Translated subtitles work.

Evidently these things are Armata-adjacent unicorns, being completely new designs with none officially in service; unlike being a new remote-operated turret on an older hull, i.e. BMPT or BTR-82.

In mid-2011, the Russian Ministry of Defense issued a requirement for a new modular wheeled family of armored vehicles instead of buying the BTR-90. Development of a new wheeled APC is being done alongside the new and similarly armed and armored but tracked Kurganets-25 infantry fighting vehicle and heavy T-15 Armata IFV.

In November 2011, media reports said the new project had been approved. On 21 February 2012, Colonel General Alexander Postnikov said that the Russian Army would be taking the first deliveries of the Bumerang prototype in 2013. Large-scale deliveries are to begin in 2015. At least 2,000 Bumerang vehicles are to replace the BTR-80 and BTR-82/A in Russian service.

The Bumerang was first seen in public (initially with its turret and cannon shrouded) during rehearsals for the 2015 Moscow Victory Day Parade.

The vehicle faced several delays, and in 2020 it was stated that tests of the platform will be finished in 2021, with production starting afterwards. The reason for the delay was that after preliminary trials in 2019, it was decided to make changes to the main body, as a result of which the conditions for soldiers in the troop compartment would be improved, as well as the vehicle's buoyancy.

Hopefully the Russians will try to hunt Bradleys with them, but I doubt it.

 

[Elämällä on väliä]

There is a REASON Battlefield Taxis like though have a low profile.

MT-LB has one thing good: it is rather flat and low profile (for his time, this shit isn't new).

Now it isn't low profile anymore, they all this upgrade.

 

[namai337]

One notable exception: Mongolia
Because the Mongols fucked with Russia so hard they gave the Russkies the idea of a unified state for the Rus to defend themselves against external invasion in the first place.

Btw our bad since LDK had to bail them out and save their asses in return all of Moscow dukes had to bow before grand duke Algirdas in Poklonnaja gora (bow down hill) so that he whould not conquer them when he come back after he beaten the Mongols