Chinese Military Operations in Taiwan

[Ghostse]

You’re right, that did happen after the PRC was formed. In fact, how bloody a conflict it was is probably a major factor in Chinese military thinking to date. China devoted literally half its GDP to the army, and one sixth of the whole Korean population were dead at the end of hostilities, both from bombings and from the US-backed south committing pogroms and other atrocities against northern civilians.

Well thank god there were definitely no purges against "counter revolutionaries" and definitely not a bunch of civies getting shoved into reeducation camps by the North & their CCP/USSR minders.


Also forgot about Tibet.
And China putting boots on the ground to prop up Pol Pot.
And involvement in Laos.

 

[SIMIΔN]

Boomer generals are hungry for the big one and war with China. You leave Taiwan for USA that means the possibility of internment and open societal discrimination when things start to go poorly. USA would be quick to take them in but a few wartime rounds of sabotage by CCP agents with Taiwanese credentials and the Han is banned from critical and sensitive industries, with semiconductor being at very top of every list. A great feat of discrimination that the HR diversity hires will vigorously oblige.

Yes, I think recent hostility towards ordinary Russians has shown that socially sanctioned racism can flare up at any time.
America used to be the City on the Hill, but idpol has hurt this.

I highly doubt China will do anything to Taiwan. The Russian fail war in Ukraine has kind of made China rethink their moves towards Tiawan. Taiwan has had nearly 70 years or so to prepare. Ukraine had a decade to prepare to fight Russia. The Chinese military is just about as garbage tier as the Russian military is. Also China would have to cross water to get to Tiawan. All Russia had to do was cross into Ukraine. China would have to cross a super-sized moat.

It's an oversimplification to call it a fail war. Russia's weakness in drones was exposed, but the strength of their rocketry forces was also demonstrated; The PRC is strong in both. Both sides have shown that anti-air can greatly reduce the effectiveness the enemy airforce, so China might be less afraid of confronting America's carrier force.

All that being said, Russia had a disastrous first month of the war, but adapted. China cannot afford a bad month; if they mess up the first day, they lose the war. Blockade Taiwan, and China gets blockaded. Fail a landing and it'll be open season on any CCP naval assets or sea militia.
Somehow supress anti-ship weapons/planes with missiles, take out C3 with rapid helicopter deployed marines and capture Kaohsiung harbour, for deployment of heavy gear? Only then will China will be able to afford mistakes.

 

[Gender: Xenomorph]

I wonder if Taiwan will threaten to sabotage their manufacturing sector if China invades.

Let's face it, that's the only reason China wants Taiwan. And the industry took decades to set up. I don't think China can afford a military war, and has enough resources to remake what was once there.

 

[Susanna]

Well thank god there were definitely no purges against "counter revolutionaries" and definitely not a bunch of civies getting shoved into reeducation camps by the North & their CCP/USSR minders.


Also forgot about Tibet.
And China putting boots on the ground to prop up Pol Pot.
And involvement in Laos.

Look at the facts. The north was enormously less violent towards the south than the other way around.

And no, Tibet doesn’t count as warfare, it was already Chinese and control was simply retaken from a feudal theocracy that was literally practicing slavery. I did count Cambodia. China supported Laos in the civil war, but I don’t count that sort of thing as outright warfare, since that’s what the USA has defined as a rules-based international order.

I wonder if Taiwan will threaten to sabotage their manufacturing sector if China invades.

Let's face it, that's the only reason China wants Taiwan. And the industry took decades to set up. I don't think China can afford a military war, and has enough resources to remake what was once there.

China wants the expert workforce, and they’d get that. Taiwanese engineers aren’t going to be eager to become third class citizens in the west when they can be first class citizens in mainland China.

 

[quackrock]

Look at the facts. The north was enormously less violent towards the south than the other way around.

Except for that whole invading part.

 

[CuzinEd]

@SIMIΔN

It's an oversimplification to call it a fail war. Russia's weakness in drones was exposed, but the strength of their rocketry forces was also demonstrated; The PRC is strong in both. Both sides have shown that anti-air can greatly reduce the effectiveness the enemy airforce, so China might be less afraid of confronting America's carrier force.

All that being said, Russia had a disastrous first month of the war, but adapted. China cannot afford a bad month; if they mess up the first day, they lose the war. Blockade Taiwan, and China gets blockaded. Fail a landing and it'll be open season on any CCP naval assets or sea militia.
Somehow supress anti-ship weapons/planes with missiles, take out C3 with rapid helicopter deployed marines and capture Kaohsiung harbour, for deployment of heavy gear? Only then will China will be able to afford mistakes.

I doubt China will be less afraid of confronting America in anything. At least if they are smart. If they are really stupid to they will find out the hard way. Like Russia they can find out why America doesn't have a universal healthcare system.

It doesn't look like Russia has adapted at all. It wasn't just a 1 bad month. The whole year has been nothing but a huge embarrassment for Russia. From what I heard the Russians launched a lot of missiles at stuff and most of them didn't hit their targets. If that was a demonstration of their rocket forces, it wasn't much. I watched a video somewhere that talked about the low success rate of the Russian missiles. Even the new stuff they were using early on till they ran out of them had low percentages of hitting the targets they were supposed to hit. The newer missiles were using Western tech and the Russians can't get access to that anymore. So they are stucking using old Soviet era stuff.

If China makes a move on Tiawan, they will come under the same sanctions as Russia. They will get blockaded and cut off from the rest of the world. Their economy will collapse in 6 months to a year. There will be food shortages. China depends on imports. If they can't get those imports, they will fall pretty quickly. China could be taken down with minimum shots fired in no time. Even better if the US would just stop doing business with the commie chinks and let them fall. Something we should never have done in the first place.

 

[Cat Stew]

I wonder if Taiwan will threaten to sabotage their manufacturing sector if China invades.

Let's face it, that's the only reason China wants Taiwan. And the industry took decades to set up. I don't think China can afford a military war, and has enough resources to remake what was once there.

no, china wants taiwan so it can finally escape the american military blockade from japan to south korea to taiwan and to the philipines.

it will allow china to break out into the rest of the pacific and have access to deep-water ports among its pacific islander allies to launch nuclear submarines.

 

[WelperHelper99]

Somehow supress anti-ship weapons/planes with missiles, take out C3 with rapid helicopter deployed marines and capture Kaohsiung harbour, for deployment of heavy gear? Only then will China will be able to afford mistakes.

Quite a ask really. Taiwan has plenty of Anti-Ship Missiles and plenty of SAMs to keep the skies clear. What Taiwan needs to do is be the spikiest porcupine it can, shooting at a massive fleet with a massive arsenal of missiles it's been building up for decades. China needs to survive that while supplying its fleet and somehow keeping its aircraft alive against a massive SAM network and Air Force

 

[draggs]

A wild tankie has appeared!

It used AWKSHOOLLY THE COMMIES WERE WAY LESS VIOLENT! LOOK AT THE FACTS!

But it was retarded, and ineffective

Anyway, confirmed North Korean and South Korean civilian deaths are almost even, while the majority of civilian casualties on both sides are "missing," ie fled. Most North Korean civilian "casualties" fled to the South and most of them remained there and didn't want to return. This was one reasons why repatriation was such a thorny issue at the negotiations, as the communists were super assmad that so many of their soldiers and civilians did not want to return to the socialist paradise

 

[Male Idiot]

Commies are less violent....

.... than mutts. But that is not a high bar to clear.

 

[mindlessobserver]

You’re right, that did happen after the PRC was formed. In fact, how bloody a conflict it was is probably a major factor in Chinese military thinking to date. China devoted literally half its GDP to the army, and one sixth of the whole Korean population were dead at the end of hostilities, both from bombings and from the US-backed south committing pogroms and other atrocities against northern civilians.

The PLA only did as well as it did in the opening weeks of the intervention in Korea because they caught the US Army with their pants down, spread out all across North Korea mopping up what remained of the North Korean Army. After the US got its act together the PLA was absolute dogshit, and only managed to hold on by sending tens of thousands of troops to get slaughtered. There were some engagements where the only reason the PLA came out on top was because the US Army units fighting them ran out of Ammo there were so many bug people zerg rushing the position.

I would like to say they learned their lesson from this, but they tried the exact same thing against the North Vietnamese a few decades later, so I doubt it.

its also important to note like most Great Powers, the PRC has trained its military to deal with any number of threats and operational requirements. From a Russian invasion from the North, to dealing with India in the South. This requires generalization. Taiwan for its part has geared its military solely for one mission. Making it specialized. It would be incredibly naïve on the part of the Chinese to assume Taiwan has been sleeping on its Bayonets for the last half century.

 

[cybertoaster]

and a lot of them know friends or family who went to boomtown China to make a quick buck or establish a pioneering enterprise and then lost it all when Chinese gov seized their company or locked everything down for the coof but refused to let them liquidate assets and get their money out.

Should I say karma? after the tiannamen massacre most countries told china to fuck off and the ccp were looking at the prospect of going back to being like north korea, but taiwanese businessmen wanted some easy money and basically saved the day for the chicoms. It was like the old quote "capitalists will sell us the rope with which to hang them" which is often attributed to lenin but its not.

in favor of an utterly alien country on a steep decline with diversity hiring, inclusion and random troon mass shootings? I could see fleeing to the 1980s and 1990s idea of America but not present day.

Shit is so bad I even miss the 00's with the war on terror and that shithead dubya.

and the West isn't exactly the bet it once was.

People forget that during the cold war you really had to be a braindead tankie (like hoxha) or wannabe oligarch dictator (like castro) to go to the soviet side, since the commie economy was a fraction of the capitalist one.

But china is already the #2 economy, far ahead of japan or the rest of europe which back in the 80's they alone dwarfed the soviet economy. And recent studies show in terms of real economic output, that is actually production and exports rather than imaginary stuff like financial schemes and speculative tech startups the chinese economy its already ahead of ours, meaning that the moment the music stops at wall st. we're gonna be the new #2, or maybe even worse.

Notice that these claims of China winning require everything going spectacularly right for China and spectacularly wrong for the US-Japan-Taiwan.

No, in fact while the chinese might be worried about how good their russian-derived weapons will be IRL combat they are also encouraged by how nobody wants to actually be actively and officially involved in ukraine because of the russian nuclear deterrent, so they probably expect that when shit gets real the same will happen with taiwan, which will get showered with materiel and intel but there wont be USN and JMSDF task groups moving in.

but idpol has hurt this.

Idpol was the final nail in the coffin, I seen chinese comparing woke bullshit to the cultural revolution which is mainly seen as negative over there, even worse than the great leap forward because its consequences are still noticeable today.

and China gets blockaded

If China makes a move on Tiawan, they will come under the same sanctions as Russia

There ZERO possibility that china will get blockaded, the world economy could barely handle russian gas and fertilizers going out of the market and you people think the second economy in the world can just be told to go away? look at this map:

You're gonna tell most of the planet to just not do business with china? and you think they'll agree to have their economies obliterated? in exchange for what?

We killed the F-22 because Lockheed Martin had wanted a massive F-15 tier export program.

I know, and it was fucking stupid to not let them make a nerfed export variant specially since the cold war was already over.

 

[quackrock]

The F-35 has Y shaped ducting. The two front ducts make an S turn to come together to the single centerline engine. The J-20 ducts each go in a straight line to one of the 2 engines. \/

Why are you negraters booing? He's right.

F-35:

J-20 (cutaway view not available, but can be inferred from inlet, engine, and weapons bay position):

 

[Male Idiot]

Chine best in trade, numbah wan!

Can you imagine the fiery and peaceful protests that would erupt of China stopped exporting? China would hurt like a bitch, but Muttland would go down in flames like its all Chicongo.

The people of the 1950s US could mayhaps weathered that, even if we say they had the rust belt like today. Tight belt, wait until domestic production is set up, yeeehaaaaw, ten years without a phone to own commies!

But can you imagine the current population? The seething masses of nigdom, and the soyboys cheering them from the sides and slurping each other's cum (soy supply limited!) to see the US of Colouredness emerge from the revolt, where China and Russia just cease to exist from Tyrone's melanin rays and Iphones grow on trees?

 

[Rei is Shit.]

The J20 has the same diverterless intake the F35 has, they straight up copied it see:

"straight copy" = completely different lofts

Look at these fucking screws, its Mig21/F4 era quality at best.

Look at this fucking screw lmao

Oh wait thats an F-15 sheeit.

That, and the top brass in the Pentagon were old Korea veterans, and they still thought dogfighting was as important as BVR. The F23 (IIRC) has worse numbers in dogfighting, such as turn radius, climb rate. But for it's fans (like me) it looks like it's shape will make a comeback in the future with the leaked pictures from Nevada

Spoiler: It's mounted upsdie down

View attachment 5067944

The F-23 had significantly better supercruise than the F-22. At the time the USAAF thinking was "who needs range lmao we have tankers for that". Now they are looking at combat in the pacific against an enemy who can hit its tankers and forward airbases. For a country that is obsessed with comparing every conflict to WW2 its like they learned nothing from it.

 

[AgendaPoster]

Well, 12 pages in, how many China inside Taiwan "special military ops" occurrences have we documented?

 

[The Ghost of Kviv]

Anyway, got more on that? its a wingman drone?

All we have is the picture. Since it's been effectively memory-holed, I assume it's a real test frame.

Mysterious Stealthy Shape That Resembles Future Fighter Concepts Spotted At Radar Test Range (Updated)

The apparent low-observable aircraft test shape appeared in broad daylight at Lockheed Martin’s Helendale radar cross-section measurement range.

www.thedrive.com

 

[draggs]

@cybertoaster

The United States and Japan will go to war if China attacks Taiwan. Everybody understands that, especially the Chinese

 

[Eggplant Wizard]

It's not like this is arcane knowledge or something, it will take years but eventually that process will be replicated and improved by China and others. Look at nuclear weapons, it's a complex process as well, but even Pakistan has them now.

Besides, wouldn't blowing up the chip plants harm the West a lot more than China, who can't buy any of that stuff anyway? To China it will just create a vacuum for their homegrown companies to fill.

Also, it will encourage the West to do its own development and bring industry back, rather than relying on Taiwan. Sure, the average American, let's call him Jose Six-Pack, he won't be able to get a new iPhone for a few years, but at least he'll have a job making early 2000's-tier dumbphones now and proudly stamp "Made in the USA" on them. Can still shitpost on those, so I'm all good.

But hey, great idea consolidating the West's main source of computer chips to a tiny island halfway across the world that China has territorial claims on. Genius move.

I just wanna point out that China has been stealing every bit of tech they can for decades now. China is a leader in nothing but “spying on our own citizens” technology. They have had decades to build a stolen economy that dwarfs the US. China won’t be able to figure shit out, partly because of lack of expertise and partly because of their over-bureaucratic processes when it comes to these things.

 

[Betonhaus]

Well, 12 pages in, how many China inside Taiwan "special military ops" occurrences have we documented?

The Russian navy is doing some training operations in the area, but so far that seems to be it. It could be they are working with China to prepare for something, but nobody seems to be concerned about that.