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- Mar 13, 2022
LessWrong has pedophiles? Next you'll tell me fish swim in the ocean!LessWrong (https://archive.ph/iDVun) (cc: @Markass the Worst, doesn't this bitch just ooze rationality?)
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LessWrong has pedophiles? Next you'll tell me fish swim in the ocean!LessWrong (https://archive.ph/iDVun) (cc: @Markass the Worst, doesn't this bitch just ooze rationality?)
Love how this guy is using scare quotes around the names Terri and Kat. Yes, he does imply further downthread that Terri doesn't even exist, but we'll get to that later.Chie said:A few days ago, there was a story that broke out of Miami, FL in which a woman, “Terri”, claimed that she had found a doll on Amazon which was made using the likeness of her 8-year-old-daughter, referred to as “Kat”.
This is not a moral panic. This is legislators doing their jobs for once.Chie said:This story has made headlines and is re-invigorating public fervor against the controversial dolls, and is igniting what can only be described as a “moral panic”. So much so that US. Rep. Vern Buchanan has released a statement claiming that he will re-introduce the “CREEPER Act” at the start of the next legislative session “assuming he is re-elected”.
Wow, what a fucking QED. So what? This just means her daughter's picture must have been on the Internet before late 2018. Which I don't find hard to believe.Chie said:Though, after conducting research (by which I simply reverse-image-searched the image of the doll provided by the press and looked at listings from websites and retailers advertising or selling the doll), I’ve now come to the conclusion that the doll is NOT a blatant representation of her daughter’s likeness, but a factory-molded standard template that’s been on the doll market since late 2018.
The listings I’ve found all have publication dates from early 2019.
Oh wow. Not come to your own conclusions, but rather, the right conclusions. I.e. anything that would make child sex dolls okay.Chie said:I urge everyone reading this to do your own research on this and come to the right conclusions.
How the fuck is she the one who is "exploiting" her daughter? This is some real DARVO shit going on here.Chie said:And after reviewing the contents of several articles talking about the situation, I’ve come to the conclusion that “Terri” is exploiting her daughter in order to push a false narrative at the deliberate expense of logic, reason, and basic ethics.
So here's the least blurred image I could find:Chie said:In an article published by Daily Mail, she claims that the clothing, pose, haircut, and even “stuffed toy” that her daughter is posed with are identical to what is depicted in the listing photo of the doll. This is patently false, and can easily be verified by simply looking at the two images. You can even see the faces are different, with the doll’s face clearly being that of a standard “doll” face and not that of “Kat”.
Counterpoint: Wikipedia is retarded and the Daily Mail isn't the only outlet reporting on this story. In fact the OP links to an NBC News article too.LoliShadow said:Wikipedia bans Daily Mail as 'unreliable' source
Anything by the Daily Mail should be automatically considered Fake News.
Source? I find it hard to believe that pedophiles don't possess lolicon in Japan.LoliShadow said:I hope there are rebuttals at the ready, because it always follows that pattern. Even Japan pushed to ban lolicon at one time, because one of these people supposedly had some pieces in their possession. The only reason they backed down was because this later turned out to be false.
Good thing I also hate Pornhub and believe it needs to be shut down. I'm not a fan of porn in general. Pornhub is the worst site to defend anyway as they keep having incidents of underage performers being uploaded to the site.LoliShadow said:This is all ridiculous in the same vein as, rapist discovered to have been using Pornhub, Pornhub needs to be shutdown and the owners branded as sex offenders. It isn’t that shocking a rapist would be looking at pornography which they have an interest in. It doesn’t mean the pornography is controlling them.
With this specific scenario on a per-day basis? Very low indeed. But that has nothing to do with the doll looking like her daughter.LoliShadow said:What are the chances of someone just happening upon the section / site with the child sex dolls, just happening upon a doll which looks coincidentially similar, and it just happening to resemble a very specific photograph which just so happens to belong to her daughter? The odds of winning the lottery would be higher.
No, actually, that's even less likely.LoliShadow said:It is more likely she discovered sex dolls in a news articles, decided she hated them, decided she wanted media attention (and perhaps file her own ambulance chasing lawsuit to try to skim the doll manufacturer for cash), really dug for a doll which looked vaguely similar, bought props for the doll, posed the daughter, and snapped a photograph.
Hold the fuck on here. How is Terri going to the news media to report on this story illegal?!Chie said:I don’t know and honestly I don’t care. What this woman is doing is illegal and immoral.
One sentence: Absence of proof is not proof of absence. Not every site on the Internet is indexed and we don't even have the unblurred picture of her daughter to do accurate reverse image searching with.Chie said:It doesn’t take a degree in journalism to know how to use Google and reverse-image-search the images of the doll provided by the NBC affiliate and find listings for it, using that same image, as far back as January 2019. I don’t know when that image of her daughter came about, but I sure as hell couldn’t find it anywhere up on Google, Bing, Yahoo, or any other search engine. So I honestly have no idea how it could have fallen into the hands of people making and marketing love dolls who are based in China.
LOL good fucking luck with that.Chie said:The entire story stunk from the get-go. And the fact that the news media from FL hasn’t corrected their false information is both depressing and infuriating. I implore everyone reading this to do your research on this and reach out to the news team with your findings.
Again, this proves nothing. I can believe there's other ways the picture of the daughter ended up in their hands. Pedos are notorious for sharing pictures of little kids with each other that may not be public.JustLurking said:All photos of this girl that have been found are the photos that have both the girl and the doll. No search engine was able to find the photo of a girl alone, which means, that it’s not publicly available, and the only copies of this photo were made after the discovery of the doll, so no one had the opportunity to base the doll on the girl unless this photo was made by someone in the girl environment and sent to the company directly with that exact purpose.
Ok? I mean yes, the mother gave it to the news outlets. Is that damning in a way that I'm not aware of?JustLurking said:It also means that the news sites didn’t found this photo. Someone has given it to them. Someone who had made this photo, or someone who had access to private places where this photo has been stored. The only person who meets this criterion is the mother of the girl, but only because we don’t know the exact circumstances of how this situation was going on, so for now, she is only a suspect. She was the one that created the story, contacted the media and she has an ability to make such photos of her daughter.
I don't know why you couldn't find an Amazon listing by reverse image searching, but absence of proof is not proof of absence.JustLurking said:I find it curious that nothing from Amazon was found, and instead, the only big platform for selling item was Alibaba. This link doesn’t show the product, but the photo was indexed by the engine. If Amazon were to sell that doll, shouldn’t reverse image search engines also store the information about it even after the product is removed, just like in this case?
(these ones: )JustLurking said:An additional note, I can’t help but notice one inconsistency:
These two photos:
I do agree. It's weird and downright creepy the company posed it the same way as the daughter in the photo.JustLurking said:Has been used by news sites to promote the story. As you can see, both photos look identical, and what is implied, is that this photo of the girl was used to make the doll. And while I could understand the idea of designing a doll on real human beings, like the adult and popular but young-looking Instagram model that is willing to work for money, it’s weird that the company creating the doll positioned it in the same way as the supposed photo of the girl to promote the doll.
I don't fucking know why they did that. But that's what they did. I don't find it hard to believe they did it. "This story is fake because a company wouldn't be retarded like that" is a retarded argument.JustLurking said:What did they want to achieve with that? Ask for trouble? For legal action? Because making a doll based on the photo and then positioning the doll in the same position as the photo they supposedly based the doll on, creates a risk that someone will find out that they used such photo. And in case of using a photo of a real underage girl, it would completely ruin the brand name. That doesn’t make any sense.
Absence of proof is not proof of absence. This shit is exhausting.JustLurking said:And how did they found this photo, if it’s not publically available? If automatic web crawlers, that work all day and night searching through web, have never indexed the photo of this girl, but indexed the news articles and photo od the doll itself then how did a human being supposed to obtain such photo from the internet? Especially considering people would use search engines to do it, and this photo simply isn’t stored by any search engine.
JustLurking said:But you see, there is one important distinction:
This girl has only a single ponytail made because this doll on this photo looks like the doll has only a single ponytail.
But here is the thing the doll has 2 ponytails:
Uh, no. This is conspiratard-tier thinking.JustLurking said:So it looks more like the opposite has happened, The mother purposefully made her daughter wear similar clothes, put a similar plush under her arm, told her how to sit, possibly showed her this photo of a doll to make her position herself in a similar situation, and did a photo of her, to later distribute her image, with only blurred eyes, that isn’t enough to make people who know that poor girl not to recognize her, to create a narration, that “evil pedophiles has created a doll in the image of this girl, to imagine raping her”
Ok, this is definitely DARVO at this point. "The mother is the real pedophile here!" is quite a take for sure.JustLurking said:Once again Her mother forced her into posing for a photo, most likely telling her, that she makes it to spread it all over the news telling people, and possibly her own child, that people imagine raping her.
The former. Both are unlikely but the latter is way more unlikely.JustLurking said:Please, ask yourself a question, what is more possible:
- the Chinese company has gone through a lot of effort to obtain a photo of a child, that isn’t anywhere on the internet, with millions of free photos they can access online that look better, and have variants made from different perspectives, which is necessary for 3D modelling, that wouldn’t bring them any legal trouble, alternatively paying am an adult professional and extremely popular model, like Yami Hadaka, for her to take photos of herself for reference, from different positions, which would bring her fans as potential customers due to how similar their product looks to that popular Instagram model?
- or, that the women with narcissistic personality disorder wanted to play a victim, and a hero at the same time, creating this narration, so she can gain her narcissistic supply from her friends on social media, and the congressman uses the story to gain more votes in the next election, by creating false moral panic, participating in the abuse of this little girl.
Oh come the fuck on.JustLurking said:Because this is what it is it’s child abuse on their part, and the Child Rescue Coalition participates in the exploitation of this little kids image for their own agenda as well.
They exploit this girls image, forcing her to do things that she clearly doesn’t want to do, for their own personal benefit. It’s not sexual exploitation, but it is an exploitation of a child nonetheless.
JustLurking said:Seriously, can anyone look at this face:
This is a real reach. With my good conscience, I say that she wasn't posed to look like a sex doll because the sex doll was posed to look like her. I can't believe I'm reading this DARVO shit right now.JustLurking said:And say, with a good conscience, that she wanted at the time for this photo of hers to be made? To be published in news media? That she wanted to pose for this photo, to base her position and look to resemble a sex doll? This isn’t just about misleading the public, it’s about child abuse in plain sight, and people panicked about pedophilia seems to ignore it.
Oh fuck off with this "just asking questions" bullshit. "dOeS tHe MoThEr HaVe A nArCiSsIsTiC pErSoNaLiTy DiSoRdEr" like that's even remotely a possibility or concern here.JustLurking said:Seriously, I think this is the story that Protasia should take under consideration, and an investigation on part of the authorities has to be made about this girl and her mother. It’s important to determine whenever her mother has a narcissistic personality disorder because that would put a lot of spotlight into her potential motivation.
I love how you already have an excuse at the ready in case the child disagrees with you. No matter the result you won't change your mind.JustLurking said:The child needs to tell her story about the circumstances of this situation, and how is she treated by her parents, although knowing from experience, she will most likely tell what her parents will tell her to say.
No.JustLurking said:And the mother has to show proof, of this photo being taken and distributed before the oldest date of this doll being in distribution.
What the fuck is this shit?JustLurking said:I doubt they made the photo and ordered the doll based on it, considering the time span between the story publication and first distribution of this doll, but determining the age of this girl, and asking her how old she was when this photo was taken, could allow for determination of whenever the doll could really be possibly based on her.
I sincerely doubt this.JustLurking said:Seriously, I have no interest in both adult, and definitely not in child sex dolls.
No child abuse on the part of the mother has occurred here.JustLurking said:BUT YOU CANNOT FIGHT AGAINST CHILD SEX DOLLS BY ABUSING CHILDREN, THIS MOTHER, THIS POLITICIAN AND THE ENTIRE CHILD RESCUE COALITION HAS FAILED TO DO THE VERY THING THEY CLAIM TO CARE ABOUT, SHOWING WHAT THEIR PRIORITIES REALLY ARE
Well, that's because it is.anon49547193 said:Most Americans don’t know about the Prostasia Foundation and those that do consider it to be a ‘‘child trafficking ring in disguise’’.
Now that's a new neologism. "Sexphobic". Apparently if you don't want pedophiles molesting children you're a sexphobe.anon49547193 said:Furthermore, western society is so sexphobic that westerners kinda just shut off their brains when discussing sexual crime.
Terri doesn't exist? Based on what fucking evidence?Chie said:Another bump. I believe this issue needs to be looked at further.
There is no “Terri” and the Child Rescue Coalition is committing fraud by allowing this false story to remain and not correcting the record.
So Kat and Terri are likely not in a professional modeling agency...but the story is still fake?Chie said:I tried looking up a portfolio of the girl and the mother just to verify that they’re not crisis actors or a source image of some sort. I even looked up directories of professional modeling agencies based out of Florida, literally nobody had anything on them.
It’s not hard to hire a professional photographer to take a quality photograph of your child. People have portraits like this taken all the time and it wouldn’t be difficult to commission one, especially if it’s being done to further a politically-charged scandal.
Like I’ve said before, it is my belief that they posed the girl to mimic the listing so they could have an outrage story.
Nobody’s going to look at it or question it.
Nobody’s going to be honest about their skepticism.
Nobody who knows anything about sex dolls or child sex dolls who isn’t dissuaded by their fake-ass outrage is going to be questioned or put in the spotlight.
Fuck off faggot and kill yourself nigger.Chie said:The fear about sex dolls and fictional pornography is unfounded. There is no conclusive, scientific consensus to justify any prohibition or censorship.
There is no proof that these dolls are harmful.
Also even if it is just coincidence and it isn't based on this specific girl, it's still a goddamn CHILD SEX DOLL.Again, this proves nothing. I can believe there's other ways the picture of the daughter ended up in their hands. Pedos are notorious for sharing pictures of little kids with each other that may not be public.
He is literally arguing that letting Trump say things on your platform is akin to letting him come into your house and piss all over your floor. Oh, and not only that, CNN doing it in this one case means that they're letting Trump have every single platform in the world and is free to spew his lies 24/7. And oh, it's not just Trump, it's every fascist too.He really hates popular people being allowed to say things he doesn't like publicly, which is ironic for such a pedophile advocate: https://noahberlatsky.substack.com/p/anderson-cooper-wants-trump-to-urinate
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Wait till he hears about Audrey Hale. Oh, that's right, he doesn't ever mention her.Does he complain about anything but free speech? Well, yes, he complains about free speech and the right to keep and bear arms both being fascist: https://noahberlatsky.substack.com/p/guns-dont-kill-people-nazis-kill
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These "people" need to be put against a wall.He really hates popular people being allowed to say things he doesn't like publicly, which is ironic for such a pedophile advocate: https://noahberlatsky.substack.com/p/anderson-cooper-wants-trump-to-urinate
So basically the child molesters on staff want first crack at the grooming victims.
Absolutely fucking based. So how does Jeremy Malcom respond?I don’t condone mass killings generally. But there is indeed a group that absolutely deserves to be culled. Mysopeds CANNOT be rehabilitated. They are far more dangerous than the average contact offender. They lack victim empathy and are essentially subhuman. They are far too dangerous to be allowed to live.
They are an exceedingly rare group, but a group worth investing time in their extermination. They must be exterminated for the protection of children everywhere. My suggestion is this:
Once someone has been convicted of a contact offense against a child, screen them for Mysopedia, if they are mysopedic, they are to be exterminated.
Furthermore, we must institute a mandatory minimum of the death sentence for sexual murder of a child.
We must also institute a mandatory death sentence for sadistic child sexual abuse even if the child survives. An evil “man” who has committed such an act is no man, but a subhuman creature and a mysoped. It must be exterminated.
Do not be fooled by the appearance of a Mysoped. Mysopeds are not human. They are subhuman. They may look like a man, but they are not. Humans have a moral compass. Even many violent criminals and most sex offenders have the capacity to develop a moral compass. Real humans do not get sexual gratification by the inflicting of suffering on children + do not have the intention of ever doing so. These are ESSENTIAL elements to being human. Mysopeds lack those. They are subhuman, they are not worthy of life. As such, I believe my state should institute an extermination policy towards the Mysoped: A goal of wiping them out and culling them for good of the world.
https://1q5krviw73e3rlh854lufacx-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/FST-4.3-Mysopedia-Introduction.pdf 14
Jeremy Malcolm should meet his terminus.Absolutely fucking based. So how does Jeremy Malcom respond?
"Young cis white girls," nigga wut.When most people hear “human trafficking,” they think of kidnapped young cis, mostly white girls sold into enforced sexual slavery by criminal gangs composed mostly of people of color. Lurid depictions of this kind of crime are common in film and television like 2014’s Eden—based on a now debunked “true story”—or 2017’s Trafficked.
Let me break down this part because there is so much wrong about it.How young people end up trading sex
Young people who trade sex are a diverse group; from a quarter to a third of them may be cis boys, according to one study, and they are disproportionately likely to be lesbian, gay, bisexual, and trans. What many of them share in common, though, is that adults and social supports systems have, for one reason or another, failed them. They have been kicked out of their homes or fled their homes to avoid abuse. (Underage people who trade sex are more likely to be queer because queer youth are more likely than their peers to be homeless.) They often start trading sex because that is a way that they can obtain food or shelter for themselves or their loved ones.
This is what happened to Kristin DiAngelo, the Director of the Sex Worker’s Outreach Project, Sacramento, and a survivor of human trafficking. “I entered the sex trade because I was engaged in survival,” she told me. “I needed a place to stay; I needed a roof over my head. I needed food to eat.” DiAngelo was working in a massage parlor and did not have a pimp until she tried to get a fake ID so she could prove she was older. She started to work for the pimp to get the ID, and then was unable to escape him.
Law enforcement did not rescue DiAngelo; they mostly just tried to arrest her. In some states, the laws have changed; people under 18 are no longer supposed to be arrested for prostitution in California, for example. Nineteen states, though, still allow children to be charged with prostitution offenses. Even in states where prostitution laws don’t apply, a young person who trades sex may still be arrested for other charges, like lying to a police officer, or vagrancy. In some localities, police are also empowered to place youth in a detention facility if they deem that the safest option; youth experience this as arrest and imprisonment, even if the law doesn’t see it as such. At best, the police are focused on saving young people from the sex trade, rather than on helping them solve the problems of homelessness, neglect, or abuse which made the sex trade seem like their best option. At worst, police may themselves demand sex from, or assault, underage people.
Here is the study : ARCHIVE , firstly, they never specify "cisgender," it just says boys and secondly the point of the article is to say how men are underrepresented in sexual abuse cases and that it's mainly a women's issue. Here are quotes from the study cited. These numbers are WAY less than 50 percent. It is not a diverse crowd, it's mostly women.Young people who trade sex are a diverse group; from a quarter to a third of them may be cis boys, according to one study,
Back to the article here is this batshit insane quote.Further, the Global Report on Trafficking in Persons estimated that 27 percent of all victims detected globally were children and that of those, one in three victims were boys.
In addition, staff at the National Human Trafficking Resource Center hotline identified more than 24,000 cases of human trafficking in the United States from 2012 to September 2016. Of those, 13 percent—or more than 3,000—were men.
Source? I made it the fuck up. I'm not kidding.and they are disproportionately likely to be lesbian, gay, bisexual, and trans.
This point makes sense on paper, HOWEVER it claims that most trafficked people are trafficked because they leave their house and because more queer people are homeless, that means they're queer. I found a different article which goes against it and gives a better explanation for how less gay people are trafficked. (ARCHIVE)They have been kicked out of their homes or fled their homes to avoid abuse. (Underage people who trade sex are more likely to be queer because queer youth are more likely than their peers to be homeless.) They often start trading sex because that is a way that they can obtain food or shelter for themselves or their loved ones.
But this is exclusive to international sex trafficking. Domestically speaking, the article claims that they are at HIGHER risk compared to HOMELESS STRAIGHT PEOPLE.LGBT individuals are effectively prevented from accessing the outside world. Due to the hidden nature of same-sex prostitution and the stigma associated with being LGBT, LGBT sex trafficking is even less likely than trafficking in heterosexuals to be reported to local authorities. In addition, immigration status and the anti-immigration rhetoric in the local jurisdiction add to public health and legal concerns of victims. As a result, LGBT individuals fall into political and social traps that require focused attention from legal and health professionals.
Other articles do stats that more gay kids claim they were trafficked than straight kids claim. But then again, this was my own research vs the article Prostasia wrote which did NO research. Back to the article.For instance, only 20 percent of homeless youth are LGBT in the United States, and 58.7 percent of them are exploited through sexual prostitution. This is a much higher rate than the 33.4 percent of heterosexual homeless youth that are at risk of sexual exploitation on the street.
This did not happen to Kristin DiAnglelo. Kristin is a straight white female.This is what happened to Kristin DiAngelo, the Director of the Sex Worker’s Outreach Project, Sacramento, and a survivor of human trafficking
Thomas Arthur raped a 5 year old FYI. Thomas should've 100% been arrested because anyone who hosts that much CP, should be arrested.Law enforcement agencies report a large backlog of unprocessed reports of images of real children being sexually abused. In this context is difficult to comprehend the expansion of child pornography law to include non-abusive images and even text content. (Note that although “child pornography” is no longer a favored term for abuse images, it is still the name used in U.S. law, and we use it in that context only.)
The best recent example of this expansion is the conviction last month of Thomas Arthur, the administrator of an erotic fiction archive, for hosting stories that described fictional acts of child sexual abuse. The charges were brought under obscenity law, an unfocused doctrine that differs from child pornography law in that it doesn’t require that any actual children were depicted or harmed. Another example is New Jersey’s 2018 expansion of its law to criminalize the possession of child erotica—a vague concept that includes clothed photos of children that prosecutors claim are sexually suggestive.
Given our failure to contain the explosion of more serious forms of abuse imagery over the last several years despite severe penalties, does it make sense for our state legislatures and congress to expand the law to include non-abusive and legal images and stories?
That's right! Arresting pedos before they offend won't work cause people will still commit crimes! By that logic, why fucking arrest anyone. His solution?Mass incarceration is not the answer
Often, the Butner Federal Prison studies are quoted as evidence that child pornography possession offenders do, in fact, have real life victims, as Hessick notes. From my and others’ observations, the Butner studies are unethical and biased. The studies are seen as outliers among leading experts. Many inmates use self-reporting, and they are only able to stay in the program and receive preferential treatment in prison if they confess to additional crimes, so inmates report making up and sharing fictional stories as real ones to stay in the program. They also report being coerced by staff to give the answers the staff wanted.
So, what does all of this have to do with protecting children? Locking people up over non-abusive images does not prevent crime. There will always be mentally ill people. There will be people, millions, that are attracted to kids. And there will be some that are malevolent, and malevolent people do not listen to laws; it’s the nature of those anti-social or with other personality disorders. Lawmakers and our police need to focus on the most harmful and dangerous acts against children. Focusing on production and distribution of explicit and clearly exploitative images of children should be the focus, not fictional images, toys, and legal images of kids. More effort needs to be put in helping those before they offend, offering support to those child-attracted and offering them safer alternatives, not taking what little protective factors they have away from them.
Its about destigmatizing pedophiles. He suggests teaching kids this is wrong, but legalizing those images are okay? So idk seems like a mixed bag.If we want to protect children, we need to take science seriously and do as the scientists do: focus, not over-generalize. As we expand the child pornography law, we will get more and more offenses. If we make cartoons, fiction, and child-like sex dolls illegal, and our child competitive dancers illegal, the incarceration rates will explode. How is this approach reducing child abuse, when the focus shifts from explicit and harmful sexual images to that of non-existent characters or non-pornographic content?
Child pornography law is critically important to reducing the sexual, emotional, physical, and psychological abuse of children. Instead of taking a laundromat approach to child pornography where we create more and more dirty laundry instead of less, we need to focus on providing compassionate and mental health assistance to those attracted to kids and to those with other comorbid risk factors. We have to look at science, not our personal moralities or even what we presume is our community’s “morals” and take a more sex-education positive approach to child and family wellness. Child pornography laws are very necessary, but we don’t need to expand them to non-existent or legal images. What we need is to target the most harmful content in this order: those producing, distributing, and, then, those possessing explicit or clearly exploitative images.
Except this is public info. So the better question is "why does your school and local law enforcement allow a pedophile activists to be near children at all?"when people bleat about "why does KF dox people", ask yourself: would you want to know if a pedophile activist was driving your children to school every day?