Ukrainian Defensive War against the Russian Invasion - Mark IV: The Partitioning of Discussion

[Parasole]

but would like to hear it if anyone knows more.

I can brief you. RVC was founded by Russian nationalist and far-righter White Rex(a.k.a Denis Kapustin). Basically, that's the core of RVC - Russian nationalists and mostly far-righters. How they got in Ukraine? It happened after 2014. After seeing what happend on Maidan in Ukraine and how much of a role Ukrainian nationalists played (and how much Russian nationalists actually supported this and thought that it will be not bad to do the same in Russia), Russian government decided to change their strategy when dealing with nationalists in Russia: before - they were bribing leaders of movements(maybe giving them minor tasks), thinking they could control them; after - they began a campaign of imprisoning and killing leaders and simple members of organizations that were judged of being too big or too uncontrollable. It escalated into prohibition of unsanctioned Russian nationalism for everyone. A lot of members, who were not too stupid, fled to different countries - mostly to Ukraine (similar to Russia in values but more freedom). The most proactive from them even took a part in 2014 (and past this) war on the side of Ukraine (a lot of these people are now in RVC). Motives? Revenge, warrior's spirit (some people just like war), thinking it is the way to crush and change Russian government to reform country, protecting the country in which they and their families live(White Rex's wife is Ukrainian for example). Also a lot of them have a background of being in football ultras.

Now, about their political views. I would not really call them Nazis (according to my classification) - because such guys are usually not thinkers, I'm not even sure they understand all doctrines of Nazism beside the most obvious about races. My description will be - white supremacists, racists, homophobes, traditionalists, Russian ultra-nationalists who like Nazism's aesthetic. It would also be good to mention that not all of them are of the same political doctrine - after all, they take new members not based on if they are far-righters or not. But their core and most famous members are as I described.

Can they be a project of FSB? I doubt it. They have good motives to hate Russian government, a lot of them are fighting for a long time for Ukraine and they did not receive their status ant trust from Ukrainian government for fast. You must also have no doubt that their sorties were sanctioned by Ukraine all this time.

 

[Gian-Luca Caluga]

The guys in these videos, according to Bellingcat, are well established to be Russian nationals, and part of the far right network Russia Volunteer Corps that has been operating from Ukraine and fighting against the the Crimea occupation.

Complex.

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https://twitter.com/arictoler/status/1660772959621873664

Wait, the bloke out of М8Л8ТХ has been leading the whole Belgorod thing? Gosh.

I think I have a lot of catching up to do.

 

[RodgerDodger]

Apparently Putin is charging his Hypersonic Scientists with Treason

For those not familiar Sandboxx and it's Airpower program and Alex Hollings are A-List Techno Military old school journalists. Pretty much a Video version of old school Air and Space Technology Weekly (Leakly as it was known) back in the day.

This is a great piece on Kinzhal. What it is and isn't. And what impact Putin's face saving arrests will have on Russian Military Technology Advancement (ie Kill It Dead).

Sandboxx itself is a great way to kill hours of time diving into cool Planes and shit.

 

[Fuck It We'll Do It Live]

But lost MaxxPro(information needs futher confirmation, but looks like a truth):

Spoiler

View attachment 5133296View attachment 5133297

Things aren't looking too good at the moment; the Free Russians have lost 5 Infantry Mobility Vehicles, 2 Mine-Resistant Ambush Protected (MRAP) Vehicles and a pick-up truck, all visually-confirmed. They haven't done any captures/destructions of enemy vehicles since that BTR-82A fell into their hands.

I hope they have a speedy exit, facilitated by the Ukrainians, once the Russians push back completely, and that it doesn't end like Operation Mersad did for the People's Mojahedin Organization.

 

[Oxyjen]

Apparently Putin is charging his Hypersonic Scientists with Treason

Highly Stalinesque.

Ah well, hopefully their punishment is not as bad as what happened to the scientists who had to test fire Burevestnik…

 

[Ookoo Squad]

Not sure if it's been posted before, but apparently there were two other incursions, in addition to the most publicized one at Grayvoron. My guess is that it's a demoralisation / distraction thing, where they can say "we can pop up anywhere and cause trouble, what are you going to do about it?"

 

[mindlessobserver]

Not sure if it's been posted before, but apparently there were two other incursions, in addition to the most publicized one at Grayvoron. My guess is that it's a demoralisation / distraction thing, where they can say "we can pop up anywhere and cause trouble, what are you going to do about it?"

It's also not a tactic Russia has an easy answer for. Cross border raids are not in the grand scheme of things that significant tactically, but they have enormous political coats associated with them. Russia can't be seen as allowing the Ukrainian Ar...I mean, local Russian Freedom Fighters being seen having Vodka parties at Russian border posts and in border villages.

But if Russia pulls troops off the Front in Zaporzhia and Donbass to deal with its western border then that weakens the front at a critical point. Something Ukraine clearly wants them to do. But if they don't do it, well, then Putin is seen as not being able to defend Russian towns along the border from the perfidous nazi hohols.

The cope thread is still huffing the propaganda facts about Kinzal. Just look at my profile page.

 

[RodgerDodger]

Highly Stalinesque.

Ah well, hopefully their punishment is not as bad as what happened to the scientists who had to test fire Burevestnik…

But it does offer confirmation that yes Patriot has been nailing Putties Wunderwaffen Kinzhal's.

 

[CuzinEd]

I watched some YouTube videos about the Russians invading Russia and some seem to think since they used Western vehicles to do it this could jeopardize the support Ukraine gets from the West. It's an interesting take but I guess we will just have to wait and see what happens. I would say it's not completely unlikely. But not a very good chance of happening.

Apparently Putin is charging his Hypersonic Scientists with Treason

For those not familiar Sandboxx and it's Airpower program and Alex Hollings are A-List Techno Military old school journalists. Pretty much a Video version of old school Air and Space Technology Weekly (Leakly as it was known) back in the day.

This is a great piece on Kinzhal. What it is and isn't. And what impact Putin's face saving arrests will have on Russian Military Technology Advancement (ie Kill It Dead).

Sandboxx itself is a great way to kill hours of time diving into cool Planes and shit.

This guy doesn't know much about Soviet and Russian corruption and how they lie and falsify things all the time. Like the time one Russian submarine was positioned next to another and launched missiles to make it look the other sub was launching the missiles. The Russians did all kinds of stuff to get through military trials without getting in trouble.

Also this video here.

Russians will do all kinds of stuff to keep themselves out of trouble.

The cope thread is still huffing the propaganda facts about Kinzal. Just look at my profile page.

The vatniggers are retards and don't know what they talking about. That's why.

 

[Astro Galactic Megalul]

Things aren't looking too good at the moment; the Free Russians have lost 5 Infantry Mobility Vehicles, 2 Mine-Resistant Ambush Protected (MRAP) Vehicles and a pick-up truck, all visually-confirmed. They haven't done any captures/destructions of enemy vehicles since that BTR-82A fell into their hands.

I hope they have a speedy exit, facilitated by the Ukrainians, once the Russians push back completely, and that it doesn't end like Operation Mersad did for the People's Mojahedin Organization.

Don't like resorting to posting this guy, but he points out some interesting bits about Russian photoshoots:

I wouldn't outright trust what Russia puts out, considering they've been caught staging shit before (like that downed Ukrainian drone they moved from place to place for photo ops).

Even so, I doubt these guys were given anything Ukraine wasn't prepared to write off, the whole thing seems like a suicide mission. I don't see the point here outside from humiliating Russian military and sending a message, it's essentially a psy op the way I see it. Unless someone actually expected them to annex Belgorod?

This guy doesn't know much about Soviet and Russian corruption and how they lie and falsify things all the time. Like the time one Russian submarine was positioned next to another and launched missiles to make it look the other sub was launching the missiles. The Russians did all kinds of stuff to get through military trials without getting in trouble.

I find it funny when people act like false flags is like a bigfoot when you mention it to them, as if we don't have countless historical examples of this tactic being employed. That's what makes a lot of these situations so fucking messy and hard to figure out, because people are willing to do anything to win.

 

[Not At All A Lizard]

I feel like the whole Belgorod lads' road trip is being blown out of proportion on both sides. All of it just sounds to me like a bunch of dudes with their own little crusade getting some gear and getting overeager (and probably drunk and/or high). I'm sure they had fun fucking shit up until they died. The propaganda machines make of it what they can.

 

[khaine]

What's amusing is that for all intents and purposes it was supposed to be a meatgrinder for Russians to grind down Ukrainians, to inflict disproportional losses. But it seems retarded because Russians were on the offensive here, which usually results in higher losses... which it did. Ukraine made use of their desire to take the town and grinded down a lot of Russian forces in turn.

Also known as the Verdun manoeuvre

 

[Coffee Mugshot]

I don't see the point here outside from humiliating Russian military and sending a message, it's essentially a psy op the way I see it.

"A high-level Ukrainian intelligence source, speaking on the condition of anonymity, offers a more realistic assessment. Two ideas underpinned the operation in Belgorod, he says. The first was to undermine Mr Putin’s domestic authority: if a strongman can’t guarantee security, what is the point of him? The second was to pull Russian military reserves away from critical sections of the front lines, in the run-up to a long-planned Ukrainian counter-offensive. It is too early to tell if the operation was successful, the source adds."

Economist article
[A]

This take seemed reasonable to me. Russians get poverty and corruption in exchange for security, and now they don't even get security because Putin and the Russian army are incompetent thieves. Plus it forces Russia to stretch desperately needed resources along a much longer front.

 

[Astro Galactic Megalul]

Word from Ukrainian propaganda on the Belgorod situation:

The point regarding camo makes sense, can anyone confirm? There's apparently photos circulating of what's supposedly bodies of the guys who went into Belgorod wearing digital camo, but they apparently don't wear digital.
Although that said, I doubt they have standardized uniform, so that doesn't necessarily say much even if all their footage shows guys wearing something different. But that aside, dudes participating in the raid are still posting shit, so there go claims about them being destroyed.

 

[Coffee Mugshot]

Word from Ukrainian propaganda on the Belgorod situation:

The point regarding camo makes sense, can anyone confirm? There's apparently photos circulating of what's supposedly bodies of the guys who went into Belgorod wearing digital camo, but they apparently don't wear digital.
Although that said, I doubt they have standardized uniform, so that doesn't necessarily say much even if all their footage shows guys wearing something different. But that aside, dudes participating in the raid are still posting shit, so there go claims about them being destroyed.

The clip he shows at 2:08 is from the ~12 second video showing the alleged dead. The dead are wearing Ukrainian MM14 camo. However, every clip I've seen from the RVC/FOR people has them wearing some kind of multicam. Haven't seen a single instance where someone was wearing MM14, let alone half a dozen guys like in the video. Probably from somewhere else on the frontlines.

 

[mindlessobserver]

The position of the Humvees does not look like any humvee hit by a bomb I've ever seen

 

[draggs]

The position of the Humvees does not look like any humvee hit by a bomb I've ever seen

They look like they were carefully pushed or driven into those craters

 

[Scout Trooper]

The position of the Humvees does not look like any humvee hit by a bomb I've ever seen

Same traffic. I see what appears to be SAF damage to the window and that one on the left looks pristine other than some damage to the front.

Ironically the damage all appears to have come from the opposite direction from what I'm assuming they're trying to say is a bomb crater?

The dark camo humvees even look drivable, this is what I would expect to see if maybe they were trying to maneuver, got stuck and abandoned the vehicles.

Those M1151s are way overweight and will easily get stuck in soft ground.

 

[Ghostse]

"A high-level Ukrainian intelligence source, speaking on the condition of anonymity, offers a more realistic assessment. Two ideas underpinned the operation in Belgorod, he says. The first was to undermine Mr Putin’s domestic authority: if a strongman can’t guarantee security, what is the point of him? The second was to pull Russian military reserves away from critical sections of the front lines, in the run-up to a long-planned Ukrainian counter-offensive. It is too early to tell if the operation was successful, the source adds."

Economist article
[A]

This take seemed reasonable to me. Russians get poverty and corruption in exchange for security, and now they don't even get security because Putin and the Russian army are incompetent thieves. Plus it forces Russia to stretch desperately needed resources along a much longer front.

I know never to trust the official mouthpieces from any side, but I also think that sounds reasonable. You have a bunch of Miltiamen types who want to hit russia, so give them some spare vehicles, and by sending them to hit the quiet Northern Border you not only make Putin look weak but now Russia has to devote more troops (and supply those troops) to the northern border or run the risk you'll do it again.

There's been no UKA or logistics following these guys, so while they are probably doing a good job of foraging, they aren't going to be able to hold forever to keep any gains, but in the mean time they can run around smashing things.

But man, hilarious seeing Russia be on the other side of "disgruntled citizens getting supplied with weapons by a foreign power and turned loose inside" coin.

 

[WhiteNight]

The Belgorod incursion is brilliant. Russia has gotten away with leaving most of their border undefended while starting a war against a neighbor because Ukraine has been told by western partners to not attack Russia. So, they get some Russian citizens to do the actual invasion using Ukrainian gear and say it's an internal conflict. Now Russia has to worry about protecting the entire border by redeploying forces, or look incredibly weak. In meme form:

I assume the Legion does not have a death wish and will leave if there is a massive response. If they stay and all die I will revise my assessment.

So it could only be a raid disguised as a rebellion. On the other hand, Russia may have trouble sparing the weaponry, and the Legion may be able to dig in. The memes about the Bilhorod People's Republic could become reality. Either way, it's a morale win and an egg on Russia's face, as Russia can no longer assure the integrity of its territory, and it will require moving important reserves away from key areas in Ukraine.

One more meme: