Russian Special Military Operation in the Ukraine - Mark IV: The Partitioning of Discussion

[pylosurf]

I view this video with a lot of skepticism that its real -- first hurdle is, who uploaded the video and why? These guys are theoretically Ukrainian so why would they steal the camera and upload their fragging incident? I've seen a lot of fabricated stuff in this war, particularly in the early phases so I'm not exactly buying this video fully. The positioning of the camera as he falls getting a perfect view of the guy smoking the second commissar is a bit too perfect.

Also, if the commissars are keeping Ukrainians in line, why aren't they speaking in Ukrainian? Even if you accept the basic premise that it shows a real fragging, it would make more sense that the video shows English speakers fragging Ukrainians rather than the reverse. Still, interesting video.

ETA: And a great example of why "warning shots" are a terrible idea.

 

[clipartfan92]

"Upbeat reporting" is a euphemism for propaganda that I haven't seen used before.

‘I Am Dreaming It Will Stop’: A Deadlocked War Tests Ukrainian Morale
The New York Times (archive.ph)
By Andrew E. Kramer
2023-11-05 09:40:11GMT
Excerpt:

Only 48 percent of Ukrainians say they trust the government-controlled television news channel, called the Telemarafon, which aired upbeat reporting of the military operation in the south, the institute’s survey found. The programming was intended to bolster Ukrainians’ morale as their army fought to push Russian forces from the coast of the Sea of Azov, but its divergence from events on the ground ended up prompting skepticism among Ukrainians.

 

[HOMO FOR LIFE RETURNS]

It will stop when you stop being NATO puppet and start negotiating with Russia in good faith. And then allow for free of mobility for both sides and become satellite state for Russia.

 

[borsabil]

"Upbeat reporting" is a euphemism for propaganda that I haven't seen used before.

‘I Am Dreaming It Will Stop’: A Deadlocked War Tests Ukrainian Morale
The New York Times (archive.ph)
By Andrew E. Kramer
2023-11-05 09:40:11GMT
Excerpt:

In an attritional war, think the American civil war, WW1, the eastern front WW2, when one side collapses it's sudden and "unexpected".

The non retarded neo cons understand that Ukraine's collapse is unavoidable and their hope of extending the human sacrifice ritual past the presidential election cycle is in tatters. I think they're so delusional that they genuinely believe that they can go to the Russians whenever it suits them to cut a deal, that they would have no intention of honoring, to make the whole thing go away while they pivot to Iran or China or whatever other insanity they're planning next.

Russia has won, they won when they decided to withdraw from Kiev and settle behind a defensive line in the south. This is when their invasion stopped being a special military operation and became a no shit war. Russia is 7 times the size of Ukraine in terms of population, has virtually unlimited natural resources and a massive armaments industry. As soon as the war became a slogging attrition Ukraine had no path to victory, none, zero. Now Ukraine is a husk with the majority of their fertile young men either dead or living abroad. There is no Ukraine to save, it's gone. Even if Russia decided to pull out the future Ukraine has to look forward to is being run by ZOG, mandated diversity and having every single custom and belief that made Ukraine Ukrainian being destroyed as they welcome their new nigger countrymen.

 

[prolapsed_cranium]

Also, if the commissars are keeping Ukrainians in line, why aren't they speaking in Ukrainian? Even if you accept the basic premise that it shows a real fragging, it would make more sense that the video shows English speakers fragging Ukrainians rather than the reverse. Still, interesting video.

ETA: And a great example of why "warning shots" are a terrible idea.

A gun pointed in your face says it all "get back to your position, peasant"

The foreigners are valuable because they have the highest ideological loyalty being converts. Some may have an ethnic affinity (not sure I'd brag about being a Kholhol-American) but nearly all believe they are doing God's work and defending "muh heckin democracy"

 

[Susanna]

Now Ukraine is a husk with the majority of their fertile young men either dead or living abroad.

Young men aren’t fertile, they’re productive. Their loss is devastating to the economy, as it drives the average age up, but the fertile population is almost exclusively women under 35, and as long as this population remains intact a nation will demographically recover from losing most of its men in just a generation.
It’s why conscripting men is no big deal, but conscripting women signifies you’re in really big trouble and willing to sacrifice your nation’s future.

 

[Strix454]

The non retarded neo cons understand that Ukraine's collapse is unavoidable and their hope of extending the human sacrifice ritual past the presidential election cycle is in tatters. I think they're so delusional that they genuinely believe that they can go to the Russians whenever it suits them to cut a deal, that they would have no intention of honoring, to make the whole thing go away while they pivot to Iran or China or whatever other insanity they're planning next.

In a way, Ukraine is the neocon's second bigger attempt at the same strategy. They tried it out first in Georgia 20 years ago with Mikheil Saakashvili playing the Zelensky role. Saakashvili pushed the same ideas that EU membership and NATO membership were the solution to all Georgia's problems. He launched a policy of military confrontation with the Russians which ended in total disaster.

After the failed war, Saakashvili adopted policies remarkably similar to Zelensky's "Big Israel" ideas. He poured the country's resources into military expansion and weapons production for the inevitable next war. He tried to rule through force but eventually was pushed out of power through an election.

Then his neocon friends brought him to Ukraine in 2015 as an "advisor" to the government. He was given Ukrainian citizenship and engaged in constant political intrigue against the government until he was kicked out of the country in 2018 by the Ukrainian government.

Its worth remembering that very shortly after taking office, Zelensky restored Saakashvili's Ukrainian citizenship and brought him back to Ukraine. Once there, he started actively plotting the overthrow of the Georgian government. His Neocon backers still believed that he was popular and could somehow come back to power. They encouraged his October 2021 insane return to Georgia. He seemed to believe his presence in the country could lead to the overthrow of the government. But it only lead to his arrest.

The point of this is that the neocons are incredibly stupid, never tend to change their policies, and never give up. Saakashvili was a failure in 2008, but almost right up to the start of the current Ukraine conflict, he was still being used by his neocon friends as part of their long-term plans for Georgia which had not changed. No matter how the current conflict in Ukraine ends, the neocons will simply continue to pursue the same policies in whatever postwar Ukrainian state emerges.

 

[MrJokerRager]

 

[Betonhaus]

The point of this is that the neocons are incredibly stupid, never tend to change their policies, and never give up. Saakashvili was a failure in 2008, but almost right up to the start of the current Ukraine conflict, he was still being used by his neocon friends as part of their long-term plans for Georgia which had not changed. No matter how the current conflict in Ukraine ends, the neocons will simply continue to pursue the same policies in whatever postwar Ukrainian state emerges.

I think it's mostly a matter that they are so old that the keep forgetting what year they were in. When they were younger they worked in positions that gave them first hand knowledge of the heart of the situations, but now they are disconnected from those connections and aren't able to recognize that things have changed. So they'll keep trying again and again, thinking that reality is merely a setback and things will eventually fall into place as they imagined it.

A way to liken it, is that there was some company (i don't remember what, maybe a fast food chain) that made it company policy that every employee must spend some time working at the stores making food and taking orders, even the CEO. This helped everyone in the company stay grounded in how the company functioned, and generally avoid making stupid mistakes (and weed out the pretentious fools that refused to learn). That company ran much much better then it's competition, and made far fewer idiotic decisions. American politics is like the exact opposite of that concept.

 

[Iron Jaguar]

enemies of Allah," which, if anyone isn't already paying attention, often includes other Muslims.

Yeah, no-one kills more Muslims than other Muslims. It's pretty much their only good trait.

 

[Strix454]

The journos have absolutely no sense of self awareness or self reflection.

The author of the first piece (Casey Michel) is not a journalist. He is a neocon foreign policy intellectual who is provided constant employment at one of any number of private institutions at which United States foreign policy ideas are formulated. He does not (yet) serve officially in the US government, but testifies on policy issues before the US congress and senate. He serves in what could be in some sense understood as a "shadow" government in the United States where policy is made outside of official government institutions.

He is a graduate of Rice University in Texas (an elite institution) and spent several years in Kazakhstan before being brought home for advanced training at the Harriman Institute at Columbia University.

The Harriman institute was founded as a private american institution for the study of the Soviet Union at the start of the cold war and after the fall of the Soviet Union expanded its role to studying the entire neocon "sphere of influence" in eastern europe.

Casey's piece in the Atlantic is not important in terms of how justifies his ideas because his justifications are just nonsense and mean nothing even to him. But the policy ideas he is advancing have great meaning. Casey sees the American failure in Russian policy in the 1990s as being a failure to fully dismember and dissolve Russia into smaller powerless entities. To not have levered out a sufficient number of resources from the Russian state into powerless micro-states.

His article in the Atlantic (the American neocon journal of record) is suggesting a future American policy of more aggressively supporting ethnic and religious movements inside Russia. That after the failure of their policy in Ukraine, that will be the next direction they move in.

American journalists are generally useless individuals who simply do what they are told. But people like Casey Mitchel are something else entirely.

 

[Iron Jaguar]

 

[SIMIΔN]

Russia is 7 times the size of Ukraine in terms of population

Maybe in terms of young people left in the country.

they have the highest ideological loyalty being converts

The average Ukrainian soldier wants to survive.
The average glowie wants as many Russians to die, he has no loyalty to Ukraine or its people, and might actually see dead Hohols as a bonus.

Remember during the Cold War Kiev was as much a nuclear target as Vladivostok or St Petersburg.

 

[HOMO FOR LIFE RETURNS]

Yeah, no-one kills more Muslims than other Muslims. It's pretty much their only good trait.

People have to just watch memri compilation videos. Fucking lulz.

And Muslims take killing each other seriously while the rest of the world laughs at them.

Unfortunately they are here too and we have to suffer their autism.

 

[Zbk3VmLfujjzjxBd43tL]

Young men aren’t fertile, they’re productive. Their loss is devastating to the economy, as it drives the average age up, but the fertile population is almost exclusively women under 35, and as long as this population remains intact a nation will demographically recover from losing most of its men in just a generation.
It’s why conscripting men is no big deal, but conscripting women signifies you’re in really big trouble and willing to sacrifice your nation’s future.

Men over 40 make tard babies and autists. If Grandpa Taras reproduces with either the young hoholinas or New Ukrainian women from Africa, he will bring down the average Ukrop IQ more than it already is. At an average IQ of 92, the Ukraine has precious few IQ points to lose before they really start getting into brown people tiers.

His article in the Atlantic (the American neocon journal of record) is suggesting a future American policy of more aggressively supporting ethnic and religious movements inside Russia. That after the failure of their policy in Ukraine, that will be the next direction they move in.

Probably has already happened given the number of Chechens, Ingush, etc. involved in ISIS which always had some links to the CIA/Mossad despite the massive blowback ISIS caused when a bunch of hardcore religious fanatics acted like hardcore religious fanatics and started raping and killing in dozens of countries globally.

I doubt the ethnic ones will go anywhere. The "Free Buryat" group has like zero influence or reach and they write most of their shit in English. All of the ethnic minorities in Russia outside of the Caucasus are either half-extinct like the Karelians, surrounded by ethnic Russians like the Tatars, or really close to China like the Buryats which means it sure isn't some CIAniggers who decide what happen there. It's the same shit that's been tried for 100 years back when they'd do shit like support a "Republic of Cossackia" because some warlord once said "we should have our own country."

 

[The giant penis of doom]

It's pretty much their only good trait.

They also have an unshakeable hatred against the Jews, not even western brainwashing can make a dent in it.

That video about "friendly" fire is most likely fake and gay, but still feels good. Glowniggers getting shot is always a good fantasy.

 

[biozeminadae1]

I view this video with a lot of skepticism that its real -- first hurdle is, who uploaded the video and why? These guys are theoretically Ukrainian so why would they steal the camera and upload their fragging incident? I've seen a lot of fabricated stuff in this war, particularly in the early phases so I'm not exactly buying this video fully. The positioning of the camera as he falls getting a perfect view of the guy smoking the second commissar is a bit too perfect.

It could have been another team that uploaded it.

 

[Susanna]

Men over 40 make tard babies and autists. If Grandpa Taras reproduces with either the young hoholinas or New Ukrainian women from Africa, he will bring down the average Ukrop IQ more than it already is. At an average IQ of 92, the Ukraine has precious few IQ points to lose before they really start getting into brown people tiers.

Risk of autism also rises if the mother is over 35. While men don’t have a sharp cutoff in fertility like women do, that’s not really what I’m talking about, peak reproductive age for both is effectively below 35. It’s when you’re the most able to conceive, and when your children are least likely to suffer birth defects.
History has shown us that if a country loses a large portion of its males, the effect on demographics is small, because the remaining males will tend to have more children. Obviously you’re never losing all the young men, so what happens is a young woman has a child or two with her boyfriend, who then tires of family life and dumps her for another woman, and he has more children with her. If a country loses a large portion of its women, though, it doesn’t recover, because the remaining women won’t have more children to compensate.
Just contrast China’s One Child Policy with any country after a devastating war. The OCP created a population of incels and permanently stunted population growth, because the few girls who were born will have on average between one and two children, and then stay with that family. Men are just a lot more likely to leave and start a new family once children enter the picture than women are.

 

[Useful_Mistake]

Lol, if you go on CNN Ukraine tag, these are the first stories it recommends you

https://archive.ph/uNaIg

They can't even try to spin any of this into a positive anymore.

 

[namelesstacotruck]

I view this video with a lot of skepticism that its real -- first hurdle is, who uploaded the video and why? These guys are theoretically Ukrainian so why would they steal the camera and upload their fragging incident? I've seen a lot of fabricated stuff in this war, particularly in the early phases so I'm not exactly buying this video fully. The positioning of the camera as he falls getting a perfect view of the guy smoking the second commissar is a bit too perfect.

Mercenaries use cameras these days for marketing (look at what our guys did), to prove to the customer they did the job, and to prove they didnt commit warcrimes this time.

Who leaked it? The mercenaries parent company. If they are employed to be barrier troops proof of it being "well known" their mercs get killed doing a "non front line job" (read lower rates) and can demand more.