2023 Israel-Palestine Armed Conflict: Official Mass Debates Edition

Who do you support?

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Ewan McGregor said:
Was it really necessary to lie about atrocities that never happened, bombing innocent civilians and extort the west into support? The way western politicians / press will bend backwards to please Israel is sickening
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You didn't answer my question. At all.
 
Solid Hyrax said:
You didn't answer my question. At all.
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Yes, I did.

Israel was attacked by a bunch of ragheads intent on creating another Yom Kippur war and actually invaded the Israeli territory. Let's pretend that there is no background to this.

You send the military, fight the militia, there's gonna be some casualties yeah.

But completely making up a massacre of jewish babies just to extort the West into supporting you is slimy.

Furthermore, bombing hospitals and refugee camps with no regards to civilians because your enemies are hiding there (And I am not doubting these people will use civilians as a shield) and you believe yourself able to manage to make governments and press to dance in your favour so you need not to care about silly stuff like war crimes is just hubris, when any other country would be forced to think of ways to remove the terrorists without harming innocents. That's a privilege Israel has given itself: the right to commit atrocities and have them all justified.
 
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Solid Hyrax said:
What would you have wanted Israel to do to respond? Without making us look like a bunch of bitches, of course.
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You could start by giving Palestinians their own state and demanding a UN peacekeeping force on the border. You also need to relinquish Golan to Syria and have Jerusalem partitioned according to the UN plan.
 
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AgendaPoster said:
You could start by giving Palestinians their own state and demanding a UN peacekeeping force on the border.
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Not possible. Now especially after the events of October 7th. We will be too vulnerable to attacks from multiple angles. The UN peacekeepers won't do shit to mitigate terror attacks.
AgendaPoster said:
You also need to relinquish Golan to Syria...
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Golan is too strategic and is not (at least to me) relevant to the Palestinian issue.
AgendaPoster said:
...and have Jerusalem partitioned according to the UN plan.
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Same thing as with my first answer.
 
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Solid Hyrax said:
Not possible. Now especially after the events of October 7th. We will be too vulnerable to attacks from multiple angles. The UN peacekeepers won't do shit to mitigate terror attacks.

Golan is too strategic and is not (at least to me) relevant to the Palestinian issue.

Same thing as with my first answer.
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Ok then lemme crystal ball your future.
- you refuse to be better than the sandniggers surrounding you
- you are allowing ethnic hatred and bloodthirst to guide your policies
- you obviously have the vastly superior military vs Hamas and even nearby Arab countries combined so you winning this battle is basically assured, especially with US backing
- if me, some whiteoid yuropoor is so disgusted with your country and how it acts as if above the law, imagine how Arabs feel. Everyone knows they hate you. After the deed is done and Gaza is flattened and you take control of it, displaced whatever people remains alive, the Arab hatred will reach a boiling point
- either frequent terror attacks will become regular, or an actual regional war will start
- the genocidal cycle will not stop because you cannot win against Arabs, who vastly outnumber you, and they cannot win against you, cause you have nukes and the US golem /spits
- you will live your life being hated and hating others, and you will never be safe. You will need Patriot systems to defend you. You will never know if the brown dude with a thicker jacket at the bus stop is fat or actually a shaheed in the making.
 
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AgendaPoster said:
Ok then lemme crystal ball your future.
- you refuse to be better than the sandniggers surrounding you
- you are allowing ethnic hatred and bloodthirst to guide your policies
- you obviously have the vastly superior military vs Hamas and even nearby Arab countries combined so you winning this battle is basically assured, especially with US backing
- if me, some whiteoid yuropoor is so disgusted with your country and how it acts as if above the law, imagine how Arabs feel. Everyone knows they hate you. After the deed is done and Gaza is flattened and you take control of it, displaced whatever people remains alive, the Arab hatred will reach a boiling point
- either frequent terror attacks will become regular, or an actual regional war will start
- the genocidal cycle will not stop because you cannot win against Arabs, who vastly outnumber you, and they cannot win against you, cause you have nukes and the US golem /spits
- you will live your life being hated and hating others, and you will never be safe. You will need Patriot systems to defend you. You will never know if the brown dude with a thicker jacket at the buss stop is fat or actually a shaheed in the making.
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So this boils down to two things, correct me if I'm wrong:
1. The Arabs will want to kill us to death
2. We cause a continued cycle of generational terror.

The Arabs around the world already hate us to death, that's why they've attacked us multiple times during Israel's lifetime. We were already living with random 1-man terror attacks spread out in our life time, I'm willing to pay the price of still having that but getting rid of Hamas and keeping Gazans either contained or out of the Gaza strip. I'd like to have a year were rockets wouldn't be flying over my house for once.
 
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Solid Hyrax said:
So this boils down to two things, correct me if I'm wrong:
1. The Arabs will want to kill us to death
2. We cause a continued cycle of generational terror.

The Arabs around the world already hate us to death, that's why they've attacked us multiple times during Israel's lifetime. We were already living with random 1-man terror attacks spread out in our life time, I'm willing to pay the price of still having that but getting rid of Hamas and keeping Gazans either contained or out of the Gaza strip. I'd like to have a year were rockets wouldn't be flying over my house for once.
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They already were trying to kill you, everyone that knows Arab and Jewish history and has read about the desert monotheisms understands that this rivalry is basically ancient. It deceivingly goes dormant at times, only to return with a vengeance. It's also incredibly complex, as it has ethnic, racial, tribal, religious, politic and nationalist aspects, so the motivations are never easy to discern and very messy. Your military superiority, US support and Arab impotence will frustrate their already impoverished and deeply unhappy citizens. Their elites are afraid of the masses, and they tend to want peace and recognize your statehood, so they can continue living in luxury and enjoy US gibs. But their subjects are at the polar opposite.
It's not you, the Israelis, or Jews, that cause the cycle. It takes two to tango. Both sides are caught into this, are prisoners of this ancient hatred, and each time it tends to stabilize and wounds start to heal, something will happen to ensure instability continues and blood continues to flow. It's literally demonic.
There are very limited long term solutions, and none are perfect or guaranteed to work. The thing is, even if it's not said loudly, the world has much higher expectations from you than from Arabs, which most of the "civilized" world considers a half-savage collection of peoples that refuse to let go of their extreme form of religion and consistently act like children, stomping their feet and burning shit down whenever somebody makes fun of daddy prophet. You on the other hand are a highly civilized rich country that Nvidia and Intel consider the best place to develop new technologies in.
You could look at how Europe dealt with these blood feuds. For example, Hungary and Germany, both countries with imperial ambitions, required international coalitions and world wars, pacification and territorial penalties to be "fixed". And that was largely made easier cause it was Europeans vs Europeans. But you have a different religion, different ethnic group, massively outnumbering you to deal with. They cannot be disappeared, cannot be nuked, cannot be pacified as any attempts to score decisive victories will cause China and Russia to intervene so the balance of power does not shift too much.
What is guaranteed is that what you do now will only increase the hatred, and the noticing of your people has multiplied by a significant factor. For such a tiny group, that holds so much wealth, influence and power, it is never good to be so visible.
All in all, I can't see how this can end positively even if you score a win, which you 99% will.
 
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