Russian Special Military Operation in the Ukraine - Mark IV: The Partitioning of Discussion

[SaidNoOneEver]

Are university students still exempt from conscription? Lowering the age from 27 to 25 still doesn't make much sense. We know people much younger have been pressed to the front.

 

[Doctor Love]

Fucking manlets, when will they learn?

Will the Parkinson's Dwarfs have their own regiments, or be added to existing ones?

Manlet Warfare has a long history to it - when the colonial states joined in the First World War, their first battle alongside British soldiers was alongside the "Devil Dwarfs", one of several battalions made entirely of men under 5'3.

 

[HOMO FOR LIFE RETURNS]

Casualty rate about to spike .....primarily Ukranians....

 

[Strix454]

Are university students still exempt from conscription? Lowering the age from 27 to 25 still doesn't make much sense. We know people much younger have been pressed to the front.

The new law talks about changing the worst aspects of the current system related to education deferments. For example, people would be limited to a deferment covering one bachelors degree rather than an unlimited number of bachelors degrees as it is today.

But in other areas its not clear. One particular current abuse is the ability to get a deferrment based on taking one single class at a given time. Even after the changes, it may be possible to pursue a degree for many, many years or to slow down the process of education such that its an unlimited deferment.
In my opinion, the basic system is so corrupt that no change to the law is going to change how the system operates. The people who are avoiding conscription will still avoid conscription. And if they can't avoid it, they will simply be stationed in garrison units far behind the front lines or they will purchase military positions that are far behind the front lines.

 

[RobotDog]

Will the Parkinson's Dwarfs have their own regiments, or be added to existing ones?

Manlet Warfare has a long history to it - when the colonial states joined in the First World War, their first battle alongside British soldiers was alongside the "Devil Dwarfs", one of several battalions made entirely of men under 5'3.

They will just megazord some sort of super soldier taping together a bunch of dwarfs to brain damaged amputees and use them as game changers on the war against ruZZians (according to Ukraine's intelligence insiders)

 

[Glowing In The Streets]

New cope from the New York Times.
Emphasis mine
Ukraine Doesn’t Need All Its Territory to Defeat Putin

The new report in The New York Times that Russia is quietly signaling a readiness to freeze the war in Ukraine is both suspicious and tantalizing.
The caveats are many: An armistice would leave Vladimir Putin in control of about a fifth of Ukrainian territory. He is not trustworthy; he could use prolonged negotiations to bolster his forces for a renewed push, or to lull Western lawmakers into cutting aid for Ukraine; he may be stalling in the hope that Donald Trump, his preferred choice for president, will return to the White House and stiff Ukraine.
But if Mr. Putin turns out to be serious, Ukraine should not pass up an opportunity to end the bloodshed. Recovered territory is not the only measure of victory in this war.

A painful reality check shows the 600-mile-long Ukrainian-Russian front in a figurative and literal freeze, draining Ukrainian resources and lives without much prospect for change in the foreseeable future. The much-anticipated Ukrainian counteroffensive of the past six months exacted a huge cost in casualties and materiel, but barely nudged the front lines. Ukraine’s top military commander has said the fight is at a “stalemate” — a notion deemed taboo not long ago — and only an unlikely technological breakthrough by one side or the other could break it. As the year draws to an end, lawmakers in the United States and Europe have separately held up critically needed aid packages for Ukraine, and there’s no certainty how they will fare in the new year.

The conflict could still take an unexpected turn, as it has before. But the prospect at this juncture is of a long war of attrition, inflicting ever more damage on Ukraine, sacrificing ever more lives and spreading instability over Europe. The way things are going, “Ukraine will for the foreseeable future harbor Europe’s most dangerous geopolitical fault line,” argues Michael Kimmage, author of “Collisions,” a new history of the war. He foresees an endless conflict that deepens Russia’s alienation from the West, enshrines Putinism and delays Ukraine’s integration into Europe.
That, at least, is the bleak prognosis if victory in the war continues to be defined in territorial terms, specifically the goal of driving Russia out of all the Ukrainian lands it occupied in 2014 and over the past 22 months, including Crimea and a thick wedge of southeastern Ukraine, altogether about a fifth of Ukraine’s sovereign territory.
But regaining territory is the wrong way to imagine the best outcome. True victory for Ukraine is to rise from the hell of the war as a strong, independent, prosperous and secure state, firmly planted in the West. It would be exactly what Mr. Putin most feared from a neighboring state with deep historical ties to Russia, and it would be a testament to what Russia promised to become in 1991, when both countries broke free of the Soviet Union, before Mr. Putin entered the Kremlin and succumbed to grievance and the lure of dictatorial power and imperial illusion.

Any talk of armistice is understandably difficult for Volodymyr Zelensky, the intrepid Ukrainian president who has steadfastly sought to project a morale bolstering picture of steady battlefield successes. It would be very painful, and politically very difficult for him, to halt the fighting without punishing Russia and by leaving it in control of so much Ukrainian land. After his senior military commander, Gen. Valery Zaluzhny, described the true state of affairs as a stalemate in an interview with The Economist in November, Mr. Zelensky bristled at what he perceived as defeatism.

But to explore an armistice is not to walk away. On the contrary, the fight must go on, even when talks begin, to maintain the military and economic pressure on Russia. Those people who are resisting continued aid to Ukraine, whether some Republicans in Congress or Viktor Orban in Hungary, must not be allowed to abandon the Ukrainians now. If Mr. Putin is seriously looking for a cease-fire, he is doing so on the presumption that the alternative is a continued slaughter of his soldiers, and that there is nothing more he can achieve through destruction, violence or bluster.

And stopping the fight is not to grant Mr. Putin a victory, however loudly he may claim one. Ukraine and much of the world will not accept his annexation of any Ukrainian territory. Russia’s army has been mauled and humiliated and the country’s economy has been severed from the West. Mr. Putin launched the invasion 22 months ago convinced that it really would be a “special military operation” — that the Ukrainian government would promptly cave, that the West would prove impotent, and that a Moscow-installed quisling would ensure Ukraine never became independent, successful, free or joined to the European Union.

Instead, Russia was forced into a chaotic retreat from Kyiv and plunged into a terribly costly war with a stalwart Ukraine backed by billions of dollars worth of American and European arms and funds. It took Russian forces, led by mercenaries, more than a year and massive casualties to capture one city, Bakhmut; another key town, Avdiivka, is still in Ukrainian hands despite wave after wave of soldiers, many of them ill-prepared reservists and conscripted convicts thrown against it.
Untold thousands of Russian soldiers have been sent to their slaughter and untold thousands more of Russia’s best and brightest have fled the country, whether to avoid the war or imprisonment for opposing it. Mismanagement of the war prompted a short-lived mutiny by the head of the mercenary Wagner Group, Yevgeny Prigozhin, followed by his death in a plane crash almost certainly engineered by the Kremlin.
Crushing sanctions have put an end to nearly all business with the West and have fueled spiraling inflation, although Mr. Putin has found ways for his cronies to profit nonetheless. And while the Russian economy got a short-term boost from feeding the military machine and filling the gaps left by sanctions, long-term prospects are bleak.
In many ways, Mr. Putin has achieved the opposite of what he set out to do. The Ukrainian nation whose existence he pooh-poohed has been steeled in fire, and on Dec. 14, the European Union formally agreed to open accession negotiations with Ukraine — the very westward shift Mr. Putin went to war to block. Finland has joined NATO and Sweden is edging closer to membership. These are not the elements of victory.
They are also no reason for false hopes. After his recent visit to Washington, Mr. Zelensky should have no illusion that the American spigot is wide open, especially if Mr. Trump returns to the White House. At his joint news conference with Mr. Zelensky, President Biden, whose mantra had long been to support Ukraine for “as long as it takes,” rephrased the pledge to read “as long as we can.” In the European Union, Mr. Orban, the Hungarian prime minister and an admirer of Mr. Putin and Mr. Trump, has tied up approval of another 50 billion euros for Ukraine.

It is understandable that the prospect of pumping endless resources into a stalled military operation would incur resistance. It would be harder for the skeptics to question additional aid if there was a prospect of an end to the fighting and a shift to the reconstruction of Ukraine.
An armistice would not be easy to achieve or to police. But conversations and writings about various potential models have been quietly circulating in government and think tank circles. The authors of the most recent one, Samuel Charap of the RAND Corporation and Jeremy Shapiro of the European Council on Foreign Relations, argued that however dim the prospect of peace, the war “will probably end through some sort of negotiation.”

The first stage of talks, they proposed, would be focused on agreeing to stop hostilities, disengaging the forces and installing a third-party monitoring mission. The next hurdle would be to devise a security arrangement that would give Ukraine the assurances it needs while taking account of Russia’s opposition to a full NATO member on its eastern border. Many other issues would enter into the mix — Russian war crimes, reparations, sanctions. And any armistice would be far short of a final settlement.

But the only way to find out if Mr. Putin is serious about a cease-fire, and whether one can be worked out, is to give it a try.
Halting Russia well short of its goals and turning to the reconstruction and modernization of Ukraine would be lasting tributes to the Ukrainians who have made the ultimate sacrifice to preserve the existence of their nation. And no temporary armistice would forever preclude Ukraine from recovering all its land.

https://archive.ph/1EaVh

 

[WonderWino]

So while Ukraine's cheerleaders are distracted by boat peremoga, draft law on mobilization was put up:
View attachment 5593625

https://archive.is/fXlCH

Aside from officially changing the conscription age from 27 to 25 (as if that was really adhered to), it contains 3 month military training for ages 18-25 (after which surely they will not be sent to the frontlines). Some other key points:

View attachment 5593630
Imagine being drafted on gmail.

View attachment 5593631
Remember when they initially walked this back and said they weren't going to do this after initially testing the waters? Estonia already declared they are happy to help. What better for the butthurt belt, get rid of Ukrainian immigrants and make them fight against muh Moskals.

View attachment 5593632
Nothing spells winning like mobilizing the disabled. Category three includes:


Ukrainian reinforcements rolling up in 2024:
View attachment 5593634

So.......they're at least open to the idea of conscripting people with no bladder, with no feet, with fucking parkinsons disease, who can't see or hear properly and who are missing a lung or kidney. Jesus fucking christ. Everything on that list should be automatic disqualification for military service. They shouldn't even need to make a list questioning that. Even the nazis weren't this mental even at the very end of the war

My thoughts exactly. The sheer vitriol I witnessed on Reddit seemed like the boiling hate found an acceptable target at the long last. Replace "Russian" with "Jew" in any news article or a Reddit post, and you will get a propaganda piece that would make Goebbels blush.

Indeed, its getting more fucked by the day. You didn't see this kind of sheer hatred of russians during the height of the cold war, or even against the germans during either world war. They're being dehumanized to a point I won't be surprised if groups start popping up attacking russians living abroad and putting them in the hospital. Even the germans were more conscious of how that kind of thing looks and how it can backfire and toned back the direct public attacks against jews and had the sense to keep the shit they did to them on the DL

I would really like to know what military job a person missing both their feet can do. Let alone someone with a brain abscess or with parkinsons. Is that supposed to be some kind of jem'hadar joke about how they shake and go into convulsions when they run out of white or something? Cause all that shaking made them incapable of fighting very effectively which was a literal plot point multiple times. If 30 year old episodes of DS9 can show why this is a bad idea and have more common sense than some idiot politician coming up with this nonsense something is seriously wrong

Imagine being drafted on gmail.

Fuck that. Draft notice? What draft notice? Gmail must have dumped it into my spam folder. Does that all the time. Only ever used that gmail account as a backup for password resets for some mmo I haven't played in years anyway. No reason I would have seen it

So, they are going to draft one legged dwarves with parkinson and send to the front?

Why do I get the feeling this came about as a result of someone watching tyrion lannister defending kings landing and thought if he cold do it so could ukrainian dwarves

Peter dinklage better watch out if he does any USO shows in ukraine

But the best part must be this:
13. Have suffered from "traumatic castration"

They will be sending the troons to the front line? Lol.

No doubt the spokestroon of kiev started sweating nervously after reading that list

 

[Battlecruiser3000ad]

If you got not legs you can't get them blown off by mines, this is a genius solution to the pesky minefield problem.

 

[ChefKiss]

13. Have suffered from "traumatic castration"
14. Have a brain abscess
15. Have a substantial skull defect

Redditors, get back in there!

 

[cybertoaster]

The sheer thirst for Russian blood in incredibly scary to withness.
Is this the direct result of normies not being allowed to shit talks blacks, asians, muslims and jews under the threat of getting their jobs and bank accounts taken away? Because it seems like slavs is the only group of people leff you can talk all kind of shit freely and get away with it in wider society.

This is from 25 years ago BTW...

They will be sending the troons to the front line? Lol.

Better send the pooners too.

That list can not be fuckign real, dwarfs? People with PARKINSON?!

They are beyond scrapping the bottom of the barrel, they are now scrapping the floor under the barrel.

 

[Strix454]

New cope from the New York Times.

Translation:

1) Further funding for the war has become politically impossible both in the United States and in Europe.
2) There are really no more weapons to give Ukraine out of the western arsenals. They have been depleated.
3) There are enormous potential political consequences in the US elections in 2024 should Ukraine collapse.

Therefore the best thing that can be done is to accomplish a temporary halt to the fighting. This would give the west a chance to get through the 2024 elections and to begin the process of re-arming Ukraine for the next war. A cease-fire can be spun in the west as some great success against evil russia and better yet, we can begin international "negotiations for peace" which we can walk out of at any time and then start the war with Russia again.

I mean it will work. With the war going completely against Ukraine, why wouldn't Russia sign up to a cease-fire that is totally to the advantage of the US and NATO that gives them nothing whatsoever.

The way to read the Times article is that they have finally started to realize that Ukraine is going to lose and that there is going to be a massive political price to pay when Ukraine loses. They can't even fool themselves into believing that Ukraine can maintain a stalemate anymore.

 

[01169]

The funny thing is they're still portrayed as the good guys in the media. For god's sake they're sending cripples to the front. Soon it'll be downies and autists. At this point it really looks like a cleansing of all the undesirables.

 

[Strix454]

At this point it really looks like a cleansing of all the undesirables.

All Ukrainians are undesirables in the "big Israel" to come as far as Zelensky is concerned.

Speaking to reporters this week, Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy described the future he sees for his country in unusual terms: as “a big Israel.”

Gone, he said, are hopes for “an absolutely liberal” state—replaced by the likely reality of armed defense forces patrolling movie theaters and supermarkets. “I’m confident that our security will be the number-one issue over the next ten years,” Zelenskyy added.

With Russian forces having withdrawn from around Kyiv, suggesting that Ukraine successfully repulsed the first phase of the Kremlin’s invasion, the time is right for Zelenskyy to contemplate how to prepare for the next—and potentially much longer—phase of this conflict.

LINK

Not a conspiracy site. That is the Atlantic Council reporting positively on Ukraine's future as illiberal authoritarian "Big Israel".

Win or lose, the future for the Ukrainians has always been their extermination. Either dying on the front lines fighting for nothing or as Zelensky's slaves in the new Ukraine to come. The more dead, the better as far as the people running things are concerned.

 

[There Is Light At The End]

The funny thing is they're still portrayed as the good guys in the media. For god's sake they're sending cripples to the front. Soon it'll be downies and autists. At this point it really looks like a cleansing of all the undesirables.

I'd say, send entirety of higher strata of every western politician to the Ukrainian frontline with their corporate backers. Problem solved, world peace achieved.

 

[Halmaz]

The funny thing is they're still portrayed as the good guys in the media. For god's sake they're sending cripples to the front. Soon it'll be downies and autists. At this point it really looks like a cleansing of all the undesirables.

I really, really hope they do not openly resort to child soldiers, although I wonder how liberals would try to sugarcoat that one.

New cope from the New York Times.

Oh, another American publication fell victim of Putin's propaganda and vast spy network. I believe it is high time to cut their funding and deplatform these traitorous outlets.

 

[Corn Syrup Connoisseur]

https://archive.is/d6DA3

Children's version when?

 

[Ealen]

View attachment 5594577

https://archive.is/d6DA3

Children's version when?

Just equip them with a chug jug and they'll be jumping off the battle bus and straight into the meat grinder

 

[kuuu]

View attachment 5594577

https://archive.is/d6DA3

Children's version when?

>curved breastplate
>narrow shoulders
>wider hips
IRL boob armour, wooo!

 

[Sister Miriam Godwinson]

But to explore an armistice is not to walk away. On the contrary, the fight must go on, even when talks begin, to maintain the military and economic pressure on Russia.

You absolute numbskulls, do you really think he is so dumb as not to understand this? It could have worked in Istanbul two years ago. It could have worked back when Russia was forced to withdraw from Kherson. But you expect him to freeze the conflict now when the pressure on Ukraine is at all time high?

If Mr. Putin is seriously looking for a cease-fire, he is doing so on the presumption that the alternative is a continued slaughter of his soldiers

Remind me again which side is reduced to conscripting legless cripples?

Crushing sanctions have put an end to nearly all business with the West and have fueled spiraling inflation, although Mr. Putin has found ways for his cronies to profit nonetheless. And while the Russian economy got a short-term boost from feeding the military machine and filling the gaps left by sanctions, long-term prospects are bleak.

And have you retards in any way, shape or form indicated that the cessation of hostilities will reverse this trend? No, you dumb fucks, you are in fact claiming the opposite and call for doubling down on applying the pressure in this very article.

Why on Earth do you still expect Putin to play ball after all of the above?

The first stage of talks, they proposed, would be focused on agreeing to stop hostilities, disengaging the forces and installing a third-party monitoring mission.

Again, why? What does Putin stand to gain from any of this?

The next hurdle would be to devise a security arrangement that would give Ukraine the assurances it needs while taking account of Russia’s opposition to a full NATO member on its eastern border.

And Putin will allow this because why?

Many other issues would enter into the mix — Russian war crimes, reparations, sanctions.

And again, you are still accusing Russia of war crimes and expect it to plead guilty and pay reparations because?..

This article is unbelieveably, immesurably dumb because NOWHERE in it, NOT IN A SINGLE PARAGRAPH it stoops down to acknowlege what Russia wants, It is always Ukraine needs this and Ukraine has to be given that.

With you, it is all stick and no carrot. If you want to negotiate peace, start thinking about what you can offer Russia and not Ukraine. DUH.

 

[Ancient Pioneer]

If you want to negotiate peace, start thinking about what you can offer Russia and not Ukraine.

There is literally nothing the West can offer Russia that would assuage them at this point. The US has overturned or ignored way too many diplomatic treaties, obligations, assurances and unwritten rules, not just against Russia, but globally. I made sure to point out that the US shouldn't even have been in Afghanistan in the OP for the Taliban offensive in 2021, Biden just unilaterally ignored the terms of the written agreement in Doha so the assholes in D.C. couldn't even use the usual "tee hee you didn't get it on paper!" stunt they did with the Soviets/Russia regarding NATO expansion.