@Android Raptor Love Thread

[Pomniman]

Yeah, see, I don't give a shit. Perhaps you're a bit slow on the uptake, friend, but I am not religious.

I don't read all the posts in every thread before showing up. You can blame our good buddy Ness here for me seeing this specific post of yours through the random.txt thread. Though either way, if you have strong opinions on this topic you obviously do care in some capacity. I'm not trying to convert you to anything because where you go or what you do is none of my concern, though the broader role of religion in human civilization is completely misunderstood by a lot of people, which leads to very shallow ideas about how and why it functions the way it does.

 

[Billy Bob Dick]

I don't read all the posts in every thread before showing up. You can blame our good buddy Ness here for me seeing this specific post of yours through the random.txt thread.

Ness and Underwear posted my quotes in the random_text thread because they ran out of actual arguments, and clearly they thought what I was saying was funny. That's great, I'm all about people laughing. It's good camouflage.

if you have strong opinions on this topic you obviously do care in some capacity. I'm not trying to convert you to anything because where you go or what you do is none of my concern, though the broader role of religion in human civilization is completely misunderstood by a lot of people, which leads to very shallow ideas about how and why it functions the way it does.

I am a cult survivor. Any day that goes by where people leave me the fuck alone is a good day.

I come to KF to shoot the shit. Occasionally when I'm in a foul mood I will deliberately escalate arguments and get in idiotic slap fights to blow off steam, because some days it's either screech autistically at other 'tards on the internet for a few hours and maybe feel a little bit better afterwards, OR go out into the real world and do something *really* stupid. I think the 'Farms is a good choice given the options, wouldn't you agree?

I don't have any problems with religion as long as people leave me the fuck out of it. I don't give a single solitary flying fuck what other people believe, and you can bank on that.

 

[Pomniman]

Ness and Underwear posted my quotes in the random_text thread because they ran out of actual arguments, and clearly they thought what I was saying was funny. That's great, I'm all about people laughing. It's good camouflage.

I am a cult survivor. Any day that goes by where people leave me the fuck alone is a good day.

I come to KF to shoot the shit. Occasionally when I'm in a foul mood I will deliberately escalate arguments and get in idiotic slap fights to blow off steam, because some days it's either screech autistically at other 'tards on the internet for a few hours and maybe feel a little bit better afterwards, OR go out into the real world and do something *really* stupid. I think the 'Farms is a good choice given the options, wouldn't you agree?

I don't have any problems with religion as long as people leave me the fuck out of it. I don't give a single solitary flying fuck what other people believe, and you can bank on that.

That's perfectly understandable. Humans are a type of animal and all animals are prone to irrational, sometimes impulsive behavior. I find cults to be just as fascinating as mainstream religions because the whole subject resonates with me as a nexus of scientific inquiry into the nature of the human animal and its mind, so you'll have to forgive me if I end up taking the more clinical view and see you as a specimen to be understood rather than a person to empathize with, I'm something of a monster in that way and I'm not shy about admitting it. I'd like to hear more about what you went through and what parts of it are specifically traumatic to you, though if that makes you uncomfortable I understand too and won't pry.

 

[Billy Bob Dick]

That's perfectly understandable. Humans are a type of animal and all animals are prone to irrational, sometimes impulsive behavior. I find cults to be just as fascinating as mainstream religions because the whole subject resonates with me as a nexus of scientific inquiry into the nature of the human animal and its mind, so you'll have to forgive me if I end up taking the more clinical view and see you as a specimen to be understood rather than a person to empathize with, I'm something of a monster in that way and I'm not shy about admitting it. I'd like to hear more about what you went through and what parts of it are specifically traumatic to you, though if that makes you uncomfortable I understand too and won't pry.

Maybe tomorrow fren, right now I'm sleep-surfing on my phone before I drift off. Slainte

 

[Spud]

Yeah, well, Paul can go fuck himself

Better than most female politicians tbh

 

[SSj_Ness (Yiffed)]

Oh bullshit. You don't get to claim authority in this domain. At one point in my indoctrination I memorized the ENTIRE BIBLE, dude.

Authority? I can just read the Bible, I don't need authority.

"But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence." - 1 Timothy 2:12

The context is specifically regarding church here, obviously not to be silent at all times, everywhere.

Don't be obtuse. Anybody with a developed frontal lobe knows that being in a position of leadership places you above others, if not in a hierarchical context then just because of the amount of skill it requires to do it right.

I'm not being obtuse, I'm being precise.

Is your boss superior to you just because he's your "superior" at work? Do you actually believe he's better than you, worth more, or anything of the sort? Fuck no you don't, because he isn't, you both have the same intrinsic value. All men are created equal by God, it's what the Bible teaches and what our Founding Fathers believed. Semantics and linguistic games won't change that.

Implying that women aren't meant to occupy places of leadership implies that they're neither intelligent or charismatic.

There's much philosophy on the attributes of men and women, and what makes an optimal leader. Without delving into it, the conclusion is men are better suited to it. Men are more intelligent than women on average, but there's more than that to consider.

Some women would be better leaders than some men, but the best leaders are men. That's just how it is. It doesn't detracts from women at all, no more than men not being the best nurturers from men at all. If you value something like leadership over nurturing then I'd argue that's the attitude which is genuinely sexist.

Why not a doctor or a principal? I know it's something of a progressive cliche, urging little girls to become doctors when they grow up, and it's not as if nurses aren't important in the medical profession (Florence Nightingale anyone?) but it's strange that these are the first examples that came to your head.

Why not? And why would that be strange?

Yeah, no offense, but you don't know what the utter fuck you're talking about.

It's worked just fine until our pussified society decided it didn't, and how'd that turn out? Things looking better?

Look, I realize that Android Raptor isn't exactly the paragon of likability but telling somebody who's broken to "look within themselves" is peak retard.

You divorced what I said from the rest of my post. The point was if she was spanked then that's not what fucked her up, and it must be an internal issue. Or, she was beaten, not merely spanked.

Forcing everyone to abide by conservative Christian beliefs is a problem. The US is not supposed to be a theocracy, and theocracies are always oppressive shitholes.

Nobody's forcing anyone to abide by anything, what you do in the privacy of your own home is your business. However, society has a right to maintain norms and standards, and those will obviously skew Christian in a Christian majority country. You're free to leave if you don't like it (or do as liberals have done and subvert that fact and try to reshape America, fucking slimeball commies).

I will concede that while a social structure based on Christianity is flawed, it generally beats the alternative.

I don't agree it's flawed, but it can be poorly implemented. I certainly agree it's better than the rising religion of Wokeism though, yes.

The issue isn't really Christianity, it's people who lay claim to "Christianity" while doing fucked up shit and then hiding behind garbage interpretations of their belief system.

Fair enough, but there will always be bad actors operating under the banner of something good though, it shouldn't reflect on the subject itself, especially when their actions contradict it.

People leaving the church often is due to abuse.

You really live in your own reality.

Ness and Underwear posted my quotes in the random_text thread because they ran out of actual arguments, and clearly they thought what I was saying was funny.

I never run out of arguments

I don't have any problems with religion as long as people leave me the fuck out of it.

That's pretty fair.

 

[Ealen]

The issue isn't really Christianity, it's people who lay claim to "Christianity" while doing fucked up shit and then hiding behind garbage interpretations of their belief system.

A perfect example of this is Islam. Those burqas the women wear over their are often viewed as a symbol of how subdued women are, in that they are forced to wear this garb, but looking at how their men behave when they arrive in Western countries, I honestly think that they wear those robes because the men there cannot control themselves in the presence of a woman wearing anything less.

Religion is a manifestation of the patterns of behavior present in the general populace, and that's where different sects and denominations come from. Different kinds of people who want to live different kinds of lives and adhere to different customs.

 

[Tablet County]

Is your boss superior to you just because he's your "superior" at work? Do you actually believe he's better than you, worth more, or anything of the sort? Fuck no you don't, because he isn't, you both have the same intrinsic value. All men are created equal by God, it's what the Bible teaches and what our Founding Fathers believed. Semantics and linguistic games won't change that.

Of course I don't believe that, but I'm an absurdist weirdo, and not a good representative of the average joe. Besides, I think when most people think about a leader they don't think about someone who was appointed to manage them. I guess this falls under semantics but "leader" tends to conjure up images of people considered worthy of respect, like the Founding Fathers or Abraham Lincoln or something, while your boss likely evokes the word "manager".

There's much philosophy on the attributes of men and women, and what makes an optimal leader. Without delving into it, the conclusion is men are better suited to it. Men are more intelligent than women on average, but there's more than that to consider.

Some women would be better leaders than some men, but the best leaders are men. That's just how it is. It doesn't detracts from women at all, no more than men not being the best nurturers from men at all. If you value something like leadership over nurturing then I'd argue that's the attitude which is genuinely sexist.

I can't speak to the psychological makeup of men and women so I can't really refute or affirm that men make objectively the best leaders, I would think we're more predisposed toward anything that requires endurance and strength, violence being the first thing that comes to mind. By that same token, women are predisposed toward nuturing, so I'll give you that.

Why not? And why would that be strange?

You answered a "why not?" with a "why not?" so I'm going to assume that you agree with me. As for why it's strange is because schoolteacher and nurse are considered stereotypical roles for women, and this combined with the purity spiel from earlier creates the image of someone who sees women as the property of men.
Granted, that's an overly simple way of looking at things and those quotes are taken out of context anyway. You've given pretty nuanced answers on the subject and from what I've seen of you in other parts of the forum it's not a fair assessment to just say that you're a bible-thumping woman-hater. I'm just a little autistic about the things people choose to say because it can serve as a window into how they think.

You divorced what I said from the rest of my post. The point was if she was spanked then that's not what fucked her up, and it must be an internal issue. Or, she was beaten, not merely spanked.

That's fair. It was just weirdly worded and I think I misinterpreted what you said because of that.

 

[Bargain Bin Laden]

Of course I don't believe that, but I'm an absurdist weirdo, and not a good representative of the average joe.

Yeah you should leave representing the average Joe to me.

 

[Stan]

I like Android Raptor because she is a nice person who likes to be kind to animals

 

[Billy Bob Dick]

It's worked just fine until our pussified society decided it didn't, and how'd that turn out? Things looking better?

Clearly in this context I'm not talking about the traditional well-applied conservative notion of a corrective "spanking."

Or, she was beaten, not merely spanked.

Beatings are in fact what we are discussing here.

This is the problem with corrupted religious fundamentalists hiding under the banner of "Christianity" - they pervert the interpretation of the Proverbial "rod of correction" to mean an actual 1"x3' dowel rod (or crowbar, wrench, broom handle, any other harmful blunt instrument, you name it), and they will beat the living shit out of you with it.

I was subjected to this, and I witnessed others subjected to it including people outside my immediate family. Furthermore I witnessed personally - and have been related anecdotes by other survivors of - Guantanamo-style punishments used against kids in the Gothard cult. I'm talking shit like being sprayed down with a hose and then locked in a freezing basement for hours, being punched, kicked, strangled, welts, burns, broken bones, thrown objects like lamps plates etc. You name it - it was done to us.

I'm not being obtuse, I'm being precise.

Yeah, the bothersome thing about debating with you dude is you take any lack of clarity as license to start flinging rhetorical shit at other people. Fucking stop it. If you're a "Christian" I don't know how you justify that shit in your head.

 

[Bargain Bin Laden]

Clearly in this context I'm not talking about the traditional well-applied conservative notion of a corrective "spanking."

Beatings are in fact what we are discussing here.

This is the problem with corrupted religious fundamentalists hiding under the banner of "Christianity" - they pervert the interpretation of the Proverbial "rod of correction" to mean an actual 1"x3' dowel rod (or crowbar, wrench, broom handle, any other harmful blunt instrument, you name it), and they will beat the living shit out of you with it.

I was subjected to this, and I witnessed others subjected to it including people outside my immediate family. Furthermore I witnessed personally - and have been related anecdotes by other survivors of - Guantanamo-style punishments used against kids in the Gothard cult. I'm talking shit like being sprayed down with a hose and then locked in a freezing basement for hours, being punched, kicked, strangled, welts, burns, broken bones, thrown objects like lamps plates etc. You name it - it was done to us.



Yeah, the bothersome thing about debating with you dude is you take any lack of clarity as license to start flinging rhetorical shit at other people. Fucking stop it. If you're a "Christian" I don't know how you justify that shit in your head.

@SSj_Ness is a little bit of a tard but we love him all the same.

 

[Billy Bob Dick]

That's perfectly understandable. Humans are a type of animal and all animals are prone to irrational, sometimes impulsive behavior. I find cults to be just as fascinating as mainstream religions because the whole subject resonates with me as a nexus of scientific inquiry into the nature of the human animal and its mind, so you'll have to forgive me if I end up taking the more clinical view and see you as a specimen to be understood rather than a person to empathize with, I'm something of a monster in that way and I'm not shy about admitting it. I'd like to hear more about what you went through and what parts of it are specifically traumatic to you, though if that makes you uncomfortable I understand too and won't pry.

start here:

Clearly in this context I'm not talking about the traditional well-applied conservative notion of a corrective "spanking."

Beatings are in fact what we are discussing here.

This is the problem with corrupted religious fundamentalists hiding under the banner of "Christianity" - they pervert the interpretation of the Proverbial "rod of correction" to mean an actual 1"x3' dowel rod (or crowbar, wrench, broom handle, any other harmful blunt instrument, you name it), and they will beat the living shit out of you with it.

I was subjected to this, and I witnessed others subjected to it including people outside my immediate family. Furthermore I witnessed personally - and have been related anecdotes by other survivors of - Guantanamo-style punishments used against kids in the Gothard cult. I'm talking shit like being sprayed down with a hose and then locked in a freezing basement for hours, being punched, kicked, strangled, welts, burns, broken bones, thrown objects like lamps plates etc. You name it - it was done to us.

I have work shit to do but later today or over the weekend I will post some links about the Gothard cult for you

 

[Friend of Dorothy Parker]

"But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence." - 1 Timothy 2:12

Speaking of takings out of context!

First of all, Paul was human and an admitted sinner who received mercy, and I Timothy is phrased as his hope and preference as he struggled to form ideas of a good and godly society, NOT the direct Word of God.

Second, context: Timothy 2:8-10:

"I desire then that in every place the men should pray, lifting holy hands without anger or quarreling; also that women adorn themselves modestly and sensibly in seemly apparel, not with braided hair or gold or pearls or costly attire 10but by good deed..."

- this is human, mortal man's "desire" and idea of what is right and holy. What follows are also his human ideas of the order of things.
- "without anger or quarreling." Just saying.

Third, in Timothy Chapter 3, Paul goes on about men who would be leaders in the church:

"The saying is sure: If any one aspires to the office of bishop, he desires a noble task. Now a bishop must be above reproach, the husband of one wife, temperate, sensible, dignified, hospitable, an apt teacher, no drunkard, not violent but gentle, not quarrelsome, and no lover of money. "

"He must not be a recent convert, or he may be puffed up with conceit and fall into the condemnation of the devil; moreover he must be well thought of by outsiders, or he may fall into reproach and the snare of the devil."

Those sound like a set of ideal qualifications in a job description written by HR, not God's Word, but if you think Paul's words are as immutably good as God's own [wow, completely anti-Christianity], I hope you demand from leaders/exemplify the same if you are one, formally or informally.

Anything not strictly following the man Paul's "desires" is absolutely wrong and against the natural and godly order, yes?


And even if you're not aiming for leadership, Paul says later in Timothy, "treat younger men like brothers, older women like mothers, younger women like sisters, in all purity."

Can you honestly say you follow these prescriptions absolute requirements straight from God? I encourage a review of your comments here.

Or do Paul's admonishments and historically bound concepts only apply in the abstract, when convenient, and/or when it serves to give a personal preference the veneer of divine decree?

 

[SSj_Ness (Yiffed)]

Paul was human and an admitted sinner who received mercy, and I Timothy is phrased as his hope and preference as he struggled to form ideas of a good and godly society, NOT the direct Word of God.

"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:" - 2 Timothy 3:16

Second, context: Timothy 2:8-10

Rather convenient to leave out 1 Timothy 2:7, "Speaking of takings out of context!" indeed:

"Whereunto I am ordained a preacher, and an apostle, (I speak the truth in Christ, and lie not a teacher of the Gentiles in faith and verity."

this is human, mortal man's "desire" and idea of what is right and holy.

Downplaying him as just some random dude, as if this was just his opinions pulled out of his ass, is sacrilegious.

if you think Paul's words are as immutably good as God's own [wow, completely anti-Christianity]

Arbitrarily cherry picking from the Holy Bible seems much more anti-Christian to me. Regardless, even if we diminish these scriptures' importance, most non-feminist (aka, real) Christians still value them above the average person's opinion; so, Karen, I'm afraid you're still not really in a position to teach in the church.

But it's a funny coincidence that the rise in female pastors directly coincides with the pushing of the LGBT agenda in church, huh? Almost like...as if...maybe...perhaps...these teachings were there for a good reason. Just a guess, a hunch, a transient thought.

Can you honestly say you follow these prescriptions absolute requirements straight from God?

Irrelevant:

"For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;" - Roman's 3:23

Begone.

 

[Pomniman]

start here:

I see. That actually sounds somewhat similar to accounts I've read about Scientology's infamous "Sea Org" from those who managed to escape it.

Though on the separate subject of whether clergy should be male or female I think the primary point of contention is that inserting women into these roles if they were traditionally male in their specific cultural context is that it's almost always done for purely secular, often political reasons. That's not to say there isn't a long history of corruption in all such institutions even before any of this became a contemporary hot button issue, but that the ideology of progressivism in its current form is used as a blanket excuse for radical and often incoherent doctrinal changes.

To me it seems like if anyone (not you, necessarily) wants a matriarchal religion because men make them uncomfortable for whatever reason, those do already exist in other more legitimate forms which aren't politicking with loosely religious window dressing. Though like everything else in life they obviously come with their own downsides, and some would consider them cult-like in their own right on account of them anthropologically stemming from prehistoric goddess worship as a root.

 

[Billy Bob Dick]

I see. That actually sounds somewhat similar to accounts I've read about Scientology's infamous "Sea Org" from those who managed to escape it.

Though on the separate subject of whether clergy should be male or female I think the primary point of contention is that inserting women into these roles if they were traditionally male in their specific cultural context is that it's almost always done for purely secular, often political reasons. That's not to say there isn't a long history of corruption in all such institutions even before any of this became a contemporary hot button issue, but that the ideology of progressivism in its current form is used as a blanket excuse for radical and often incoherent doctrinal changes.

To me it seems like if anyone (not you, necessarily) wants a matriarchal religion because men make them uncomfortable for whatever reason, those do already exist in other more legitimate forms which aren't politicking with loosely religious window dressing. Though like everything else in life they obviously come with their own downsides, and some would consider them cult-like in their own right on account of them anthropologically stemming from prehistoric goddess worship as a root.

As far as I'm concerned, any religious interpretation which has negative outcomes is a bad one.

The interpretation of Paul's writings as the absolute underpinning of modern "Christianity" has led to a bunch of self-righteous, sanctimonious, pompous, sociopathic assholes running the contemporary church, perpetuating all manner of abuses.

@SSj_Ness is doing a great job of modelling the Paul-based "Christian" approach: Can't be reasoned with, can't see his own errors, no goddamn empathy whatsoever, pompous, insufferable, fanatically convinced of his own absolute righteousness, self-appointed license to dominionism, "I got mine, sucks to be you", doesn't give a flying fuck about showing Christ's compassion, presumes his own salvation at the expense of other people, etc.

Basically, all the same personality traits as a serial killer. Fuck's sake.

So fuck that shit. If that's Real True "Christianity" then everyone involved can go fuck themselves with it.

 

[SSj_Ness (Yiffed)]

@SSj_Ness is doing a great job of modelling the Paul-based "Christian" approach: Can't be reasoned with, can't see his own errors, no goddamn empathy whatsoever, pompous, insufferable, fanatically convinced of his own absolute righteousness, self-appointed license to dominionism, "I got mine, sucks to be you", doesn't give a flying fuck about showing Christ's compassion, presumes his own salvation at the expense of other people, etc.

Basically, all the same personality traits as a serial killer. Fuck's sake.

Okay, I'm like a serial killer, but where am I wrong? You said a lot, but not a bit was articulated about exactly what I'm wrong about. Get your emotions in check.

 

[Billy Bob Dick]

Okay, I'm like a serial killer, but where am I wrong? You said a lot, but not a bit was articulated about exactly what I'm wrong about. Get your emotions in check.

I'm not interested in debating your interpretations of "Christianity" with you, dude. You're as fanatical as a Muslim Imam with a suicide bomb strapped to his ribcage. Fuck off.

 

[SSj_Ness (Yiffed)]

I'm not interested in debating your interpretations of "Christianity" with you, dude. You're as fanatical as a Muslim Imam with a suicide bomb strapped to his ribcage. Fuck off.

Cry more you emotionally unstable simp, and stay wrong. Best part is you know you're wrong, enjoy your fit.